OH OH - Brian Shaffer, 27, Columbus, 1 April 2006 - #3

[Brainy]

So is that area perpetually a construction area? Interesting isn't it?

Neesaki, yes, very interesting. Feels like a place stuck in time one could step into...

 

[dotr]

Amazing pics, thanks so much 614Buckeye!

 

[PaulR]

@ 614Buckeye- you're amazing for that! I see the construction area says "hard hat area"- so it's under construction yet again? How often does that building undergo work?

It could also be renovations or a new store coming in - any type of construction needs the hard hat sign.

 

[DLMac22]

First post here. I think this is one of those cases where it's easy to get caught up in what seems like an important detail, but in the end doesn't have much relevance. In this case I'd say that detail is the security footage not showing him leaving. Obviously we know he exited the bar, whether he was alive or dead can't be known for certain. After seeing the pictures of the area outside the bar I find it hard to believe he exited that way without being seen or caught on camera. So he had to have left via an exit in the bar that led to an area other than the main escalators.
I find it more than a little unlikely that he could've been injured or killed in the construction area and then covered up either knowingly or unknowingly. I also don't find it likely that anything happened to him in the bar itself. This leaves two important questions. First, who did he leave the bar with? I am assuming he left with someone else because of the way he just ditched his friends. That isn't something people tend to do unless they've met someone else, either a different friend, a girl, the band, an employee, etc. And second, what happened once he left the bar?

It it seems to me that he was the victim of fouls play or an accident prettt shortly after leaving the bar via an alternative exit. If he was intoxicated and it wasn't the greatest neighborhood either could've been equally likely. Id also have to add find the theories of witnessing or participating in a drug deal gone bad seem a bit far fetched.

Two things about the friend Clint. Firstly, it doesn't strike me as particularly weird that he lawyerd up and what not. My uncle is a judge and another is a lawyer, having been raised in this type of environment there are very very few instances where I would allow myself to be questioned by police without a lawyer, even with nothing to hide. I can see how this might seem weird to many, but it was just one of those things that was ingrained in my head from an early age. And the second thing is regarding him being at the apartment for 6 hours. This also doesn't necessarily strike me as that odd. The next day i would imagine he very much still believed that Brian ended up with someone else after leaving the bar and would return. Nevertheless I can imagine a close friend would be concerned or annoyed enough over the circumstances that he'd be waiting for him the next day. I can think of one or two close friends that would've had a key to my residence in college, or who I'd have left the door unlocked for or knew where a spare key was. I also wouldn't have found it unusual for a friend that close to be waiting for me the next day if I'd seemingly disappeared from them the previous night and couldn't be reached on my cell phone.

 

[dotr]

First post here. I think this is one of those cases where it's easy to get caught up in what seems like an important detail, but in the end doesn't have much relevance. In this case I'd say that detail is the security footage not showing him leaving. Obviously we know he exited the bar, whether he was alive or dead can't be known for certain. After seeing the pictures of the area outside the bar I find it hard to believe he exited that way without being seen or caught on camera. So he had to have left via an exit in the bar that led to an area other than the main escalators.
I find it more than a little unlikely that he could've been injured or killed in the construction area and then covered up either knowingly or unknowingly. I also don't find it likely that anything happened to him in the bar itself. This leaves two important questions. First, who did he leave the bar with? I am assuming he left with someone else because of the way he just ditched his friends. That isn't something people tend to do unless they've met someone else, either a different friend, a girl, the band, an employee, etc. And second, what happened once he left the bar?

It it seems to me that he was the victim of fouls play or an accident prettt shortly after leaving the bar via an alternative exit. If he was intoxicated and it wasn't the greatest neighborhood either could've been equally likely. Id also have to add find the theories of witnessing or participating in a drug deal gone bad seem a bit far fetched.

Two things about the friend Clint. Firstly, it doesn't strike me as particularly weird that he lawyerd up and what not. My uncle is a judge and another is a lawyer, having been raised in this type of environment there are very very few instances where I would allow myself to be questioned by police without a lawyer, even with nothing to hide. I can see how this might seem weird to many, but it was just one of those things that was ingrained in my head from an early age. And the second thing is regarding him being at the apartment for 6 hours. This also doesn't necessarily strike me as that odd. The next day i would imagine he very much still believed that Brian ended up with someone else after leaving the bar and would return. Nevertheless I can imagine a close friend would be concerned or annoyed enough over the circumstances that he'd be waiting for him the next day. I can think of one or two close friends that would've had a key to my residence in college, or who I'd have left the door unlocked for or knew where a spare key was. I also wouldn't have found it unusual for a friend that close to be waiting for me the next day if I'd seemingly disappeared from them the previous night and couldn't be reached on my cell phone.

Welcome to Ws DLMac22, thanks for your great and very sensible first post !

 

[psych-nurse]

I also live and work very close to this scene and remember when Brian disappeared. One thing I have always wondered is if the dogs were taken to his apartment and car. Were those locations searched and processed thoroughly or only the Tuna? I'm asking because I can imagine a scenario in which Brian and friends are in a disagreement of some sort, Brian leaves through the employee exit to avoid conflict and walks home. His friends wait briefly and try to call him. He sends them to VM and keeps walking. Something either happens on his way home or once he reaches home.

 

[Brainy]

Odd dreams...

Ok, so I have dreams sometimes that show me certain things or take my mind somewhere visually. 99% of the time, it take a certain course... I have had dreams where I am following Brian in the bar. The music is absolutely deafening. I yell his name but I can't even hear myself. The ear-spitting loudness distracts very easily. I see Brian, not his face but the back of his head and his shoulders. I didn't know him personally but I know it's him. Everything is so stark. I can see all the faces around him, all the people, colors, smells and sounds. So I keep following Brian not to lose track of him and where he's headed. I move more towards the middle of the crowd but I can't see him no more. Every time I have this dream it never ends... it doesn't have a resolution, it just ends. I don't know what it means. I have had dreams in the past that I thought were interesting. I am not superstitious at all, but once I saw one of my distant relatives in my dream (whom I had never met) commit suicide. I was scared and tearful in my dream and it truly evoked a lot of emotion even though we didn't have a personal connection. When I woke up, my family got a call informing them that she committed suicide. I was absolutely shocked.

I don't know why my dream of Brian never ends... he vanishes in my sleep like he did that day.

 

[Deleted member 155000]

Thanks everyone for the recent posts. It’s good to have new voices here.

A couple thoughts: there are quite a few men in my family and circles of friends and I can’t see any of them waiting around for a friend at his house for SIX HOURS...unless they well KNEW something might be wrong.

I could see them stopping by and knocking before taking off or calling a few times. But they would just assume a male friend was likely sleeping off a hangover or slept over at a girl’s and assume they would get in touch later. I don’t think they would be alarmed the first day of no contact...unless, again, they were aware of other risky behavior.

I also read articles about this extensively and never saw a mention of the dogs at his apartment or car. Granted, Brian’s house would have a lot of confusing smells due to his own scent everywhere, but if a dead body has been present at any point the dogs might have alerted on it. Wonder if they tried that in time before the crime scene was contaminated by others.

 

[Brainy]

Thanks everyone for the recent posts. It’s good to have new voices here.

A couple thoughts: there are quite a few men in my family and circles of friends and I can’t see any of them waiting around for a friend at his house for SIX HOURS...unless they well KNEW something might be wrong.

I could see them stopping by and knocking before taking off or calling a few times. But they would just assume a male friend was likely sleeping off a hangover or slept over at a girl’s and assume they would get in touch later. I don’t think they would be alarmed the first day of no contact...unless, again, they were aware of other risky behavior.

I also read articles about this extensively and never saw a mention of the dogs at his apartment or car. Granted, Brian’s house would have a lot of confusing smells due to his own scent everywhere, but if a dead body has been present at any point the dogs might have alerted on it. Wonder if they tried that in time before the crime scene was contaminated by others.

All valid points. Clint is a red herring with too many oddities about him and his behavior... none of them make sense to me. It's so frustrating to think that he may know something and has chosen to move forward, shut his mouth like nothing happened. It's so easy to feel hopeless. Brian is gone. It hurts to know that there are so thoughtless, evil and shallow people in this world who are so self-absorbed that are just willing to let it go like nothing happened.

 

[neesaki]

I also live and work very close to this scene and remember when Brian disappeared. One thing I have always wondered is if the dogs were taken to his apartment and car. Were those locations searched and processed thoroughly or only the Tuna? I'm asking because I can imagine a scenario in which Brian and friends are in a disagreement of some sort, Brian leaves through the employee exit to avoid conflict and walks home. His friends wait briefly and try to call him. He sends them to VM and keeps walking. Something either happens on his way home or once he reaches home.

This was one of my theories as well, that Brian and possibly Clint maybe had a disagreement, so Brian was deliberately avoiding him, thus leaving on his own and turning off his cell phone. Then possibly an altercation at his apartment, or, something happened between the bar and home.

And thank you for weighing in! .

 

[Deleted member 155000]

This was one of my theories as well, that Brian and possibly Clint maybe had a disagreement, so Brian was deliberately avoiding him, thus leaving on his own and turning off his cell phone. Then possibly an altercation at his apartment, or, something happened between the bar and home.

And thank you for weighing in! .

If he is innocent of any wrong doing, I wish Clint would share what he knows and take a polygraph to clarify his role.

I can think of a couple scenarios.

One possibility: Clint may have actually known Brian was leaving the bar separately or even through a back exit. But he’s covering that up because he believes he is protecting his own or Brian’s reputation. Because maybe Brian was doing something risky, illegal or at least not reputable: like cheating on his girlfriend or buying drugs.

But maybe Brian was supposed to meet Clint back at his apartment with drugs, but never came. And Clint then had an idea something bad might have happened and stayed waiting for him.

Or what if Brian came to the apartment and Brian and a friend (Clint or other) used them together. Brian od’d or had an accident as a result of being impaired. Calling 911 would have also implicated the friend (and if it was Clint, he was in med school). So maybe the friend, knowing Brian was dead, panicked and disposed of Brian’s body to try to save any legal or career trouble.

But, if the act that killed Brian was not planned (accidental), it’s odd to me that impaired friends would’ve been able to dispose of the body so cleanly in such a quick amount of time...in a way that would avoid detection and conceal the body for this long.

(If they some day find Brian’s body in some cellar storage unit in the basement of his own apartment building...it would be frustrating it wasn’t thoroughly checked earlier.)

Also, I can see the possibility of Brian getting in a conflict with Clint (we have heard they had a brush of conflict at an earlier party once). He, as you said, purposefully ditches Clint which makes Clint mad. Clint goes to Brian’s apartment and confronts him. Brian somehow dies...likely more by accident than an intention to kill, but who knows?

 

[Deleted member 155000]

This also makes me wonder if they checked any cameras in the neighborhood of Brian’s apartment for any sign of him. Does anyone know if there were businesses in that area who might have had cameras? I know they checked the footage around the bar and saw no sign of him, but in today’s world (this many years later), police would probably have looked for Clint’s vehicle or Brian or Clint in this area as well. I have read about many cases where police found suspect vehicles en route to or from various crime scenes.

 

[Brainy]

This also makes me wonder if they checked any cameras in the neighborhood of Brian’s apartment for any sign of him. Does anyone know if there were businesses in that area who might have had cameras? I know they checked the footage around the bar and saw no sign of him, but in today’s world (this many years later), police would probably have looked for Clint’s vehicle or Brian or Clint in this area as well. I have read about many cases where police found suspect vehicles en route to or from various crime scenes.

BessDrew,

There are a lot of businesses in that area. There is no information if the LE has ever checked non-immediate areas where Brian could have been seen.


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[neesaki]

Happy Thanksgiving and sincere Blessings to everyone! :thanksgiving:

 

[ekardh]

People are saying it would've been impossible for Brian's body to have been cemented over in the construction site. Supposedly, all the gases and bacteria in the body would crack the foundations. I'm having a hard time believing this.

Can someone with some actual expertise give their two cents?

 

[neesaki]

I have no expertise, but in this article it talks about how the integrity of the concrete would be compromised. Something about how air pockets would form as a result of the decomposition.

http://professorbuzzkill.com/construction-workers-entombed-concrete-myth/

 

[ekardh]

I have no expertise, but in this article it talks about how the integrity of the concrete would be compromised. Something about how air pockets would form as a result of the decomposition.

http://professorbuzzkill.com/construction-workers-entombed-concrete-myth/

Thanks for the link.

Would it not depend on the size of the structure and the amount of cement? The author of that post asserts that the Hoover Dam would’ve crumbled had a person or even a shoe been trapped in concrete. That sounds completely untenable.

All we know is that Brian was last seen heading back to the bar. Everyone who entered the bar was accounted for apart from him. I just don’t think it’s a coincidence that construction was going on in the building and Brian didn’t leave through the main exit. That means he either left through the staff exit and disappeared into the night or he ended up in the construction site and something happened to him there. But with no alleged sightings of Brian after that night and no evidence of what could’ve happened to him, I still believe he’s buried in the building somewhere.

 

[Ozoner]

One possibility: Clint may have actually known Brian was leaving the bar separately or even through a back exit. But he’s covering that up because he believes he is protecting his own or Brian’s reputation. Because maybe Brian was doing something risky, illegal or at least not reputable: like cheating on his girlfriend or buying drugs.

But maybe Brian was supposed to meet Clint back at his apartment with drugs, but never came. And Clint then had an idea something bad might have happened and stayed waiting for him.

Or what if Brian came to the apartment and Brian and a friend (Clint or other) used them together. Brian od’d or had an accident as a result of being impaired. Calling 911 would have also implicated the friend (and if it was Clint, he was in med school). So maybe the friend, knowing Brian was dead, panicked and disposed of Brian’s body to try to save any legal or career trouble.

We know that Brian was exhausred yet went out and partied. Maybe Clint had supplied him with cocaine or uppers earlier in the evening and that's why Brian was able to keep going.
Does anyone else find it odd that Brian and Clint started and ended their night at the Ugly Tuna Saloona? Maybe they knew someone there, i.e a bartender who was also their dealer.
I think it's possible that Brian received and used drugs in the bar, possibly in a bathroom or out-of-the way storage room or behind the bar, and OD'd in the presence of whomever had supplied the drugs to him. I think that person may have hidden Brian's body until after closing time. The death may have occurred out back, but if not, then the postulated dealer could have gotten the body out through a back entrance, possibly in the type of large trash can that most restaurant kitchens have. It could have been concealed at the costruction site or behind a dumpster, to be retrieved later with a vehicle.

All we know is that Brian was last seen heading back to the bar. Everyone who entered the bar was accounted for apart from him. I just don’t think it’s a coincidence that construction was going on in the building and Brian didn’t leave through the main exit. That means he either left through the staff exit and disappeared into the night or he ended up in the construction site and something happened to him there. But with no alleged sightings of Brian after that night and no evidence of what could’ve happened to him, I still believe he’s buried in the building somewhere.

BBM
If he stopped and changed direction before actually entering the bar, for instance if someone he knew beckoned him from a short distance away, how likely is it that he could have stayed in the nearby cameras' blind spots?

 

[Deleted member 155000]

Thanks for the link.

Would it not depend on the size of the structure and the amount of cement? The author of that post asserts that the Hoover Dam would’ve crumbled had a person or even a shoe been trapped in concrete. That sounds completely untenable.

All we know is that Brian was last seen heading back to the bar. Everyone who entered the bar was accounted for apart from him. I just don’t think it’s a coincidence that construction was going on in the building and Brian didn’t leave through the main exit. That means he either left through the staff exit and disappeared into the night or he ended up in the construction site and something happened to him there. But with no alleged sightings of Brian after that night and no evidence of what could’ve happened to him, I still believe he’s buried in the building somewhere.

The detectives who searched the construction area did not believe it was in a stage that could have concealed Brian’s body. They took dogs through there as well and they did not hit on the area.

 

[neesaki]

The detectives who searched the construction area did not believe it was in a stage that could have concealed Brian’s body. They took dogs through there as well and they did not hit on the area.

Thank you, Bess. I also don't believe that whatever happened to Brian ended up with him in the construction area. For one thing, how likely was it that they were actually pouring concrete within 24 - 48 hours or so after he disappeared, or for that matter, even 72 hours after. Just because construction was going on doesn't mean they were in the process of pouring concrete. But, I would really like to know. Any one know? TIA !