OH OH - Jane Gault, 17, Barberton, 14 March 1982

[upallnite]

upallnite, I hope your pm box is clear now, LOL. I sent you a pm

It is, I only saved one e-mail. That was the one I spoke of today. I still just cannot get over that the chief said that.

 

[mysteriew]

It is, I only saved one e-mail. That was the one I spoke of today. I still just cannot get over that the chief said that.

Who did he tell that to, a friend or a relative, or someone from this board, or elsewhere?

 

[upallnite]

Who did he tell that to, a friend or a relative, or someone from this board, or elsewhere?

You still up?

 

[mysteriew]

LOL, email edited and sent.

One other source to check out is the life squad. If they were called, they have a squad report where they are supposed to record what they saw. Check your phone book and find the direct number for that dept. and tell them you would like to get a copy of the squad run report. Many people forget to check sources like the hospital and squad reports- but they are trained observers and they record a lot of what they see about a patient. Esp if the patient is deceased.

 

[upallnite]

LOL, email edited and sent.

One other source to check out is the life squad. If they were called, they have a squad report where they are supposed to record what they saw. Check your phone book and find the direct number for that dept. and tell them you would like to get a copy of the squad run report. Many people forget to check sources like the hospital and squad reports- but they are trained observers and they record a lot of what they see about a patient. Esp if the patient is deceased.

Who are the Squad affiliated with, police?

 

[mysteriew]

Who are the Squad affiliated with, police?

No, they may stand alone or they may be affiliated with the fire dept. They are friendly with LE and usually know many of them because they see them a lot, but they don't work with them directly. Just be casual about it, don't express a lot of curiosity about it. But if the person you talk with should happen to say they were there that night- don't ask direct questions- just ask their impressions and what they saw when she was found. BTW the EMT's who were on the run should be named in the report. Usually.

 

[upallnite]

No, they may stand alone or they may be affiliated with the fire dept. They are friendly with LE and usually know many of them because they see them a lot, but they don't work with them directly. Just be casual about it, don't express a lot of curiosity about it. But if the person you talk with should happen to say they were there that night- don't ask direct questions- just ask their impressions and what they saw when she was found. BTW the EMT's who were on the run should be named in the report. Usually.

I'm hoping I can get a statement from those paramedics and I hope their names are listed. That would be useful later on.

 

[mysteriew]

I'm hoping I can get a statement from those paramedics and I hope their names are listed. That would be useful later on.

First get all the paperwork you need together. Then ask questions. People who are involved may throw up more road blocks if they think an investigation is coming.

 

[upallnite]

Mysteriew wanted me to post this on the thread. I wanted to say that my family was not poor, we were pretty well off, yet we all find it odd that the city of Barberton footed the bill for Jane's funeral, casket, gravesite, sevices, everything. Just another oddity in this. I wish my parents were still with us, because I would ask them how this came about.

 

[Shadow205]

Mysteriew wanted me to post this on the thread. I wanted to say that my family was not poor, we were pretty well off, yet we all find it odd that the city of Barberton footed the bill for Jane's funeral, casket, gravesite, sevices, everything. Just another oddity in this. I wish my parents were still with us, because I would ask them how this came about.

I find this very odd too.

 

[shadowangel]

You might think of speaking to the director of the funeral home. They generally keep excellent records, and since they are private businesses are more likely to give you the straight story without the ol' "red tape". On that subject, I've been digging since late last night (the baby's sick, no sleep here) and can't find anything on her burial. ?

 

[Becba]

You might think of speaking to the director of the funeral home. They generally keep excellent records, and since they are private businesses are more likely to give you the straight story without the ol' "red tape". On that subject, I've been digging since late last night (the baby's sick, no sleep here) and can't find anything on her burial. ?

I would think since she obviously wasn't a "pauper" without family or money that someone had to have donated funds for a funeral. It might be a good clue as a guilty conscience could be behind the donation.
Of course documentation is needed before any conclusions are jumped too. It may turn out to be a decision made by community members as a gesture of sympathy.

 

[Richard]

You might think of speaking to the director of the funeral home. They generally keep excellent records, and since they are private businesses are more likely to give you the straight story without the ol' "red tape". ...

This is true. And cemeteries sometimes have interesting records as well. They can certainly tell you which funeral home made the arrangements. On two separate occasions, I have been able to obtain autopsey reports in this manner. First by contacting the Cemetery and then by going through the funeral home.

 

[vanillasky]

Some first hand knowledge about the records that cemeteries have... I am a former cemetery registrar of a cemetery that has over 70,000 burials. I never once came across a record in the time I worked there that had an autopsy report. If the funeral home who took care of the arrangements is a part of the cemetery like where I worked -then there will be an embalming report, and if no embalming was done for an immediate burial or cremation, there is a report in there stating the condition of the body when it was received by the funeral home. Also, cemeteries will have a copy of a death certificate, however, where I worked, we were not allowed to release these - ever. Not even to family. In Texas, a death certificate can be released by the vital statistics office to anyone 25 years after the death, but before then, it must be an immediate family member.

You might run across a funeral home or cemetery employee willing to help and go against the rules, so it's always worth asking. The worst they could say is no.

Cemeteries do have interesting things in the files though if it's a cemetery that keeps good records. Where I worked, we scanned the newspaper daily for any article mentioning the deceased, and cut it out, enlarged it on the copier, and placed both the original & copy in the file along with the obituary if one was printed. This is something I could release to anyone who inquired since it was public information.

In the case of upallnite's sister - it would be good to see if they (funeral home) would release the report showing the condition of her body when they received it - it may note any unusual marks where she was bound. I don't know how long they're required to keep this information - at the place I was at - they had these records dating back for many years. I was able to find reports dating back to the 40's.

Disclaimer.... not all cemeteries are created equal - but this is my personal experience from working at one.

 

[upallnite]

Some first hand knowledge about the records that cemeteries have... I am a former cemetery registrar of a cemetery that has over 70,000 burials. I never once came across a record in the time I worked there that had an autopsy report. If the funeral home who took care of the arrangements is a part of the cemetery like where I worked -then there will be an embalming report, and if no embalming was done for an immediate burial or cremation, there is a report in there stating the condition of the body when it was received by the funeral home. Also, cemeteries will have a copy of a death certificate, however, where I worked, we were not allowed to release these - ever. Not even to family. In Texas, a death certificate can be released by the vital statistics office to anyone 25 years after the death, but before then, it must be an immediate family member.

You might run across a funeral home or cemetery employee willing to help and go against the rules, so it's always worth asking. The worst they could say is no.

Cemeteries do have interesting things in the files though if it's a cemetery that keeps good records. Where I worked, we scanned the newspaper daily for any article mentioning the deceased, and cut it out, enlarged it on the copier, and placed both the original & copy in the file along with the obituary if one was printed. This is something I could release to anyone who inquired since it was public information.

In the case of upallnite's sister - it would be good to see if they (funeral home) would release the report showing the condition of her body when they received it - it may note any unusual marks where she was bound. I don't know how long they're required to keep this information - at the place I was at - they had these records dating back for many years. I was able to find reports dating back to the 40's.

Disclaimer.... not all cemeteries are created equal - but this is my personal experience from working at one.

I plan Monday morning to pay a visit to the cemetary and the funeral home to see what records I can get. I also plan on inquiring about the death certificate. The autopsy report is already in the works. I don't know where I have to pick up the police report, but will figure it out eventually. Also Monday I'm going to check at the library and see if I can find copies of the articles from the news paper, if I can, I'll scan them and put them on here.

 

[upallnite]

Does anyone else think that if her hands and legs had been tied, wouldn't there be signs of this from being in the water and decomposition with the bindings on? I do.

 

[concernedperson]

Does anyone else think that if her hands and legs had been tied, wouldn't there be signs of this from being in the water and decomposition with the bindings on? I do.

Absolutely.

 

[vanillasky]

Definitely.

 

[shadowangel]

Does anyone else think that if her hands and legs had been tied, wouldn't there be signs of this from being in the water and decomposition with the bindings on? I do.

Oh, yeah. There would be bruising, abrasions, and, most likely, some pooling of blood at the ligature locations due to the lack of circulation (I am assuming she was bound while alive). The bloating a body undergoes while in water (regardless of temperature) would only make the binding more pronounced.
I know this is your sister...prepare yourself when you read the reports.
The whole "undetermined death" thing is just beyond bizarre. And the circumstances of her discovery sound about like ten pounds of cow poop comin' out a five pound bag...don't fit and smells bad to boot. For one, you've said the canal generally holds only a couple of feet of water...Anyway, she's in the canal completely under the ice (thrown in while there was no ice?) She had to be under the ice, or the little boys would have seen her. Then they throw in some rocks (like what? Cinderblocks?) and your sister floats up through the hole they create. Okay...was she already floating just under the ice? For these little boys to break it, the ice had to be mighty thin, making me think they should have seen something strange before they starting throwing the rocks. And, they must have made one heck of a hole. Or....she waited until just that moment to float up from the bottom of the canal, in that exact location?
Yeah. Right. Something here smells, and it ain't just my socks. No one Chiefy gave the story he did on the phone.

 

[upallnite]

Oh, yeah. There would be bruising, abrasions, and, most likely, some pooling of blood at the ligature locations due to the lack of circulation (I am assuming she was bound while alive). The bloating a body undergoes while in water (regardless of temperature) would only make the binding more pronounced.
I know this is your sister...prepare yourself when you read the reports.
The whole "undetermined death" thing is just beyond bizarre. And the circumstances of her discovery sound about like ten pounds of cow poop comin' out a five pound bag...don't fit and smells bad to boot. For one, you've said the canal generally holds only a couple of feet of water...Anyway, she's in the canal completely under the ice (thrown in while there was no ice?) She had to be under the ice, or the little boys would have seen her. Then they throw in some rocks (like what? Cinderblocks?) and your sister floats up through the hole they create. Okay...was she already floating just under the ice? For these little boys to break it, the ice had to be mighty thin, making me think they should have seen something strange before they starting throwing the rocks. And, they must have made one heck of a hole. Or....she waited until just that moment to float up from the bottom of the canal, in that exact location?
Yeah. Right. Something here smells, and it ain't just my socks. No one Chiefy gave the story he did on the phone.

I do believe the story about the kids throwing rocks in, I went to school with those boys and though I don't know who they are, I heard about the same story constantly at school and the people telling it didn't know it was my sister. I just stayed quiet and didn't enlighten them.