OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #57

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I missed that part, what was the evidence on that?
Canepa:

"We haven't even touched on many other pieces of evidence such as tattoos or videos they watched that night before they went and committed these homicides regarding brothers that commit crimes together with guns with silencers.

......killing 8 people who lay sleeping in their beds for the most part - all but 2."
 
Did these rednecks really think that they would get away with this?

Yes, they did. Their family is one of the most wealthy and powerful ones in a mostly low income area. They're accustomed to getting their way, bullying people with no repercussions. They're still "pulling strings" to influence the process.

They also thought they were brilliant masterminds but didn't count on technology tripping them up.

They almost got away with it. LE was told immediately of the threats Jake and his family made about custody of Hanna Mae Rhoden's daughter and attempts to make her sign custody documents. LE knew of the fights among family members in the weeks before the murders. Jake should have been their focus from day 1.
 
See George Wagner's Bond Hearing with BCI Special Agent Scheiderer being cross examined on the stand - entire hearing here:

George Wagner is asking a judge to set... - LOCAL 12, WKRC-TV | Facebook

The 2 Wagner brothers watched Boon Dock Saints the night of the murders....
A movie about brothers committing multiple murders using silencers....

Probably to "psych" themselves up.

Not surprising

I had to LOL at Scheiderer's answer to the defense attorney when asked why he "believed" the shells were fired from the same gun at both the murder scene and the 260 Peterson Rd property. Nash asked Scheiderer "you believe this just because someone told you?" and Scheiderer replied "yes, a scientist."

Nash has been saying that ballistics aren't real science.

ETA: For those wanting to watch video of the hearing yesterday, it's still at the link above, also here:

George Wagner request for bail denied after hearing reveals new details

It's about 2 hours long, but worth watching if you have the time. When I get a chance, I'm going to watch it again to update my notes.
 
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Not surprising

I had to LOL at Scheiderer's answer to the defense attorney when asked why he "believed" the shells were fired from the same gun at both the murder scene and the 260 Peterson Rd property. Nash asked Scheiderer "you believe this just because someone told you?" and Scheiderer replied "yes, a scientist."

Nash has been saying that ballistics aren't real science.

ETA: For those wanting to watch video of the hearing yesterday, it's still at the link above, also here:

George Wagner request for bail denied after hearing reveals new details

It's about 2 hours long, but worth watching if you have the time. When I get a chance, I'm going to watch it again to update my notes.

The video is must see.
On the subject of the forged custody papers... Angela was listed as the benefactor, so to speak. Upon Jake and George's death Angela would have custody of the little ones. So, in case they died while trying to murder eight people. Does this mean that Angela didn't do any shooting but stayed with the children instead? At her house, or in a vehicle. Doesn't seem to me that they thought her life would be in danger.
Thank you for the info on the Colt19, seems it's a very rare gun indeed.
 
With them using the 22 long bullet Gun, 30 caliber SKS and the 40 caliber glock pistol, I can see why Charles Reader cried at the news announcement of how bad the crime scene burnt an everlasting impression in his mind, the Wagners are Monsters. Those Defense Attorneys better keep one eye on their client’s and the other on the judge for their safety. I wonder if part of the reason CN turned evidence because this bunch is psycho that he feared for his and his mother’s safety, JMO
 
Wonder why AW kept the Wallmart receipt for the shoes. Was she leaving herself the option to return them for a refund if the plan got scrubbed? Their house on Peterson road had a wood stove, she could have burned it easily.
Tax deduction, remember this family is crooks, JMO
 
Yes, they did. Their family is one of the most wealthy and powerful ones in a mostly low income area. They're accustomed to getting their way, bullying people with no repercussions. They're still "pulling strings" to influence the process.

They also thought they were brilliant masterminds but didn't count on technology tripping them up.

They almost got away with it. LE was told immediately of the threats Jake and his family made about custody of Hanna Mae Rhoden's daughter and attempts to make her sign custody documents. LE knew of the fights among family members in the weeks before the murders. Jake should have been their focus from day 1.
Sorry Betty I take offense to you stating powerful ones in mostly low income area. Lived within miles of Wagner’s property before and still after they moved to area and have never seen the power you seem to reference a lot. People I know in the area never feared the Wagner’s. Yes everyone knew Fw and her husband was loaded, but didn’t fear them and was not controlled by a Wagner.
 
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Sorry Betty I take offense to you stating powerful ones in mostly low income area. Lived within miles of Wagner’s property before and still after they moved to area and have never seen the power you seem to reference a lot. People I know in the area never feared the Wagner’s. Yes everyone knew Fw and her husband was loaded, but didn’t fear them and was not controlled by a Wagner.
I wonder if FW ever threatened to kill Angela like AW told Tabby she would do to her???? JMO
 
So Sluthers, how many of you all still thinks FW is still saying my family is Innocent? Remember know one will teach that old dog any new tricks, I hope that the prosecution brings charges back up on FW, JMO
What the heck are you talking about? She absolutely thinks her family is innocent why do you think she bought billy those bullet proof vests after the murders?

They can say those bullet casings found on the W property is them being framed too.
 
The M-1911 is not rare, as there were 2.7 million of them produced for the US military.
The Walther 1911.22 is a M-1911 lookalike but chambered in .22. When the Special Agent mentioned
Twenty-Two Long Rifle, that is specific type of .22 bullet. In fact, It is the most common variant of .22 ammunition. It is not a rifle or anything like that. It is a bullet that may be loaded in a .22 rifle or a .22 handgun.
 
AC is answering to a motion, but can't tell which one. Volume is too low to hear the judge.

They agree to something by the end of this year December 2020.

Defense is still wanting transcripts by Dec 31.

AC says they have already provided a summary of those calls they will use.

Providing 2 new lab reports today to defense, some other items will provide in next 30 days.

Some expert reports certified given to defense.

Motion re bond hearing. State will provide no evidence. Will have Agent Scheider testify about recordings?

Defense calling Ryan Scheider to stand, he's sworn in. Defense asked he remove his mask. Asking if he was special agent at time of murder, what he did. He took over as lead. Mike someone was lead for first 6 months or so, then he took over as lead.

All evidence did not go through him, only info about it. Said child custody was motive, Wagners were suspects. Ballistic, shoeprint evidence, recorded conversations, text messages, forged documents.

They're just fishing for evidence info before the trial.

Three caliber firearms 22 40 and 30? cal. Defendant fond of Glock firearms, had one 40 cal rifle linked to evidence at murder scene. Heard from his uncle. There's a Glock on GW4's list. List extracted from Jake's telephone. Didn't find the actual Glock firearm.

22 cal shell casings matched crime scene and those found property of GW. Same firearm, scientist at BCI told him, also an independent firearms examiner.
GW owned the property where the shell casings were found. Didn't find the weapon.

Shoe prints, scientist identified brand. Found video of GW's mother buying them. Match verified by outside lab and BCI. Have palm print evidence against Jake Wagner on photo of him holding the murder weapon. Photo of the 22 used in murders. No DNA evidence against George 4.

Forged document - defendant signed a forged document for custody of his son.
It was signed just prior to the murders. Document was forged for custody of Bulvine.

Three documents forged signed, but forged as if earlier than 2016, in 2014 and 2015. Grandmother said she did not notarize those documents, had not seen them, but was asked to lie.

Device of Google search evidence belonged to Jake, but Angela used it most. Laptop produced document that George signed that were forged.

Text messages - sometimes Facebook Messenger (I was right on this). Agents were trying to make contact with Jake while they were at Peterson Rd. George was on the property and texted his father telling him not to come down to the property.

Recorded statements - 8,000 recordings, also interviews. Several interviews - Jake interviewed with officers, he has interviewed Angela, two other agents interviewed George in AK. George states there were child custody issues with Rhodens, admits he lives in property. Family says they were all at Peterson Rd property that night. He would have heard if anyone left. Denies shoes were purchased for him, but Angela said they were bought for her sons.

Collected cell phones, didn't collect one from George. Any GPS, etc. They know where his phone was. It was on Peterson Rd. during murders (of course). George did make statements to third parties. She was present when family were together formulating a retaliation plan. About Dec 2018.

More to follow
Wow, Wow, WOW!! Thank you Betty P, I missed all this yesterday. I'm in shock at all that came out through RS's testimony. I bolded the things that made my spirits lift.
 
For a cult or clan like family a few things surprise me:
-Differing religions
-Billy not living with them before or after

Things I wonder:
Who was the leader of this family? Angela or Billy???
What size shoes Angela and Billy wear
What is the relevance of having a Captain America Mask? Was it seen on video footage somewhere?
Why hack the former Mother in Laws Facebook? Wouldn't it make more sense if HR's was hacked.

I have an opinion that the defense will really be tough on George's ex wife. (Bringing to mind the narrative on a go fund me)

It's a bit unfair to believe only the defense would stretch some facts with select wording. JMO

I think the shoes and the photo of Jake holding the gun are what will seal the case though. They seem to be the items most directly connected to the crime scene itself.

(Edited by me)
 
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AC redirect of Scheiderer (cont.)

A witness who resided there for a time said they all made decisions together. They would take votes on what they did. George was married with Tabitha. Still lived with family when married.

Tabitha left the relationship, was forced to give up all control of her son to George. Fled the residence, she got into an argument, Angela said she was going to kill Tabitha. She ran out, hid on the property and eventually got away.

Wagners co-mingled their money. Shared accounts, credit cards, etc. Hanna Mae was underage when she conceived. Jake was 19. Why did Hanna Mae leave - Jake was violent. She made people aware of it. Made a comment about the Wagner family. After she left Jake, started seeing someone else, conceived second child - Charlie Gilley. Did Hanna tell Jake she was pregnant - told him and Angela and said it was Charlie's child. Jake wanted Hanna to put his (Jake's) name on the birth certificate, not tell Charlie. Wanted her to go to AK with the family.

In months leading up to homicide, she made it clear to Jake they were not getting back together. Jake met with attorney to get custody. Hanna didn't want that. Seized a computer from the Wags at the MT border, was analyzed. Discovered documents google-searched for Texas probate docs, printed out, April 2016. April 3, 2016, printed on bottom of page of document. Recovered physical documents, they were the originals. One of them was a declaration reportedly made by Hanna Mae with her signature. Tested and found it was not her signature, was forged. Notarized allegedly by Rita Newcomb, but in this case she did not sign or notarize the documents.

Documents were back dated. Did not exist on those previous dates, as if signed by Hanna Mae in Christmas day of 2013. Last time she would have been there. But it was forged and back dated. Docs stated if either brother met an untimely death, their children would go to Angela, not to their birth mothers.

AC hands him a copy of the documents, declarations of guardianship. Printed April 3, 2016.
Holy Moly, girls running for their lives, I say girls plural because I believe there's another who got away, Thank God. All this may be mostly circumstantial but it's the really good kind that builds a kick butt case.

Thanks again Betty P.
 
Wonder if they'll still try to get bond for GW 3? That hearing will be really interesting, if his defense attorneys still pursue it. JMO, we only heard some of the case info today, focused mostly on Jake and George. Billy's story probably has a lot more to it.

Agree, Jake comes off as a very disturbing sociopath. Angela doesn't seem much better, though we didn't hear as much about her. Not that there isn't more to tell, they just didn't go into detail about her today. We already know how brazen she was to spend hours talking about the case and strategy to her mom and others on phone calls from jail. She's something else, too.
I wonder if the bond hearing was the defense's tactic to get G4 to understand how much evidence the state has and the benefit to take a plea deal.
 
I wonder if the bond hearing was the defense's tactic to get G4 to understand how much evidence the state has and the benefit to take a plea deal.
Jmo but I don’t know I could get to death penalty on George based on just what was told yesterday. There has to be more to get to that for me Jmo for myself it sounded more like Jake and Angela from yesterday’s testimony. But that is still only hearing a bit of one side.
 
Probably.. UH, WHAT GUNS
I loved the part where RS says he txted GW4 a picture of the style gun used and he proceeded to text the other 3 with a family emergency. THEN they all began texting and calling each other back and forth. They did all that even after expressing concerns about be tapped, taped and watched by LE. What a bunch of morons they are, Thank the Lord!
 
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