OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#40

[Myland]

DEWine said it played a part. It was a factor. It’s an easy conclusion that there were other motives.

I think the acrimony simmered for years. The Waggies played the part of being friendly well. Then after SW was born and post breakup all of what was bothering the Waggies about the Rhodens began to boil.

One Waggie or maybe two had been thinking about retributiontion for a long time. Before 2016, long before. It was carefully shared, maybe at first as a joke, to get rid of maybe Hanna. The joke soon turned into “I wish they all would die”, after they realized that if Hanna was dead, Dana or CRSR would step in and get custody.

Somewhere about the time the custody talks got serious along with the dream of moving to Alaska, Hanna dug in. She would never give her daughter up onlyvto have her 4,500 miles away.

Dana was the first to support her choice, and the rest of the family lined up behind her.

Fist Fights started and 16 yo CRJR was a fiesty 16 yo who didn’t take _____ from anybody. Especially when it involved Sister Hanna and SW. CRJR was usually bloodied up, but among the ones left standing.

ONE of the insults AW threw out during an argument was the filthy living conditions in the ramshackle trailers the Rhodens called home. Eventually And somewhere in the midst of Dana and CRSR falling in love again and the less than pristine living conditions the Waggies kept bring up, CRSR bought Dana the trailer she moved into. Life was good. And no one could accuse them of being poor trailer trash ever again.

AW WAS THE FIRST to hear of the new home as Dana thanked friends for helping paint and decorate while CRSR spent his extra time remodeling.

AW was livid. On the way from her job at the farm, she looked at the speedometer. She had her Excursion going 3200 RPMS just over 100 mph. She took her foot off the gas and hit the brakes hard. It’s a smart thing she did as over the next set of hills was Readers car coming at her. By the time she stopped sweating she was turning into the driveway, her shirt soaked from the near miss of a conversation with the sheriff. She couldn’t have faked calm that day, she could feel her heart beat, and flashes of red in her eyes. Be Cool Angela, be cool.

As she fixed supper for her boys that night she obsessively though about how much she wanted a little girl.

At 45 she was too old even though movie stars were still getting pregnant at her age. She just read all about it in the National Enquirer. Stallone’s ex wife, the blonde giant told the story of every thing she tried to have a baby with her much younger . Finally having a baby at 50.

IVF AND DOCTORS cost money they didn’t have, and even more if you wanted the magical medical miracle if you opted to choose the sex of your baby. Angela snapped back to reality, she didn’t have to deal with any of that. There was already a little girl in her life, SW. the family had to just come up with an extremely well thought out plan to get custody of her.

Every advantage the Waggies thought they had if they went to court to get SW was fixed at lightening speed by the Rhodens. The odds were in Hanna’s favor of winning when they sat down at their dining room table and the thoughts of something happening to the Rhodens wasn’t funny any more.

The custody issue alone was enough, but there were bad feelings relating to a couple of deals the Waggies were 90% sure they were paid less than they expected. A LOT LESS.

That afternoon the Waggies put ideas on the table. Within a couple of weeks had a loosely framed plan to drag in drugs and the grows it soon turned to the plan it became. AW carefully place any paper they used in a shoebox in the old desk she had gotten at a garage sale.

She soon realized the plan was much to big for one person. The Waggies would have to break it up with eAch taking a piece. Until then
The shoebox came out every time the plan was discussed along with the pens they used to write with. One of the boys suggested they put it on a thumb drive to make it easier to move parts of the plan around and to modify it as necessary.

The week before she had gone into the storage barn at the farm rummaged around in the dirt, dust and cobwebs and found her Air Force Training Manuals. She spent her free time over the next few days rereading all she had learned about strategic planning and organizational skills for specialized field ops. She remembered it all.

George4 and Jake spent 2 days entering the constantly altering plan. Neither were skilled typists and both used the single fingered hunt and peck method.

Finally late one afternoon they declared it all on the thumb drive and every paper they had written on was walked out to the burn barrel soaked with gas burned and stirred to ashes. No one would get their hand on that or ever be able to read it. The thumb drive was put in the shoebox in the back of the bottom drawer of the old desk AW bought at a garage sale.
The Waggies still used paper until the boys transferred it all to the thumb drive then the paper went straight to the burn barrel soaked with gas and forever destroyed.


ALL MY OPINION GUESS and fiction AS TO HOW THIS BEGAN. MOTIVES?

SW

money/drugs debts

Jealousy

I am sorry but I haven’t seen any evidence to support this story. The desk, shoebox and etc. Jmo

 

[Trudie]

I am sorry but I haven’t seen any evidence to support this story. The desk, shoebox and etc. Jmo

She said it’s a guess, fiction, etc.
I, too, was most perplexed.

 

[Sleuthinsleuther]

Thanks. You seem to be spot on w/ the holding pattern. My selfishness wants access to the evidence yesterday.

You won’t be seeing photos of the victims at the crime scenes, if that’s what you’re wanting.

 

[Trudie]

Thanks. You seem to be spot on w/ the holding pattern. My selfishness wants access to the evidence yesterday.

All action is behind scenes, IMO, of course.
Like JWs pretrial. They had addressed things in the chamber (per MSM) but had to reiterate in court for the record. Remember the delay before Pt started?
We have months of bickering about discovery & meaningless motions. Motions that must be on the record.

 

[rsd1200]

I agree with this. We know the W’s appeared to be struggling financially after the murders, as they couldn’t and didn’t pay the contracter for the new barn that was built on Peterson road, just weeks after the murders. That contractor slapped a lien on the property that had to be paid upon sale of the house. Combine that with AW’s vigorous sm activity beginning in mid to late summer 2016 where she was selling everything she possibly could-cars, pigs, household items...everything but the kitchen sink, and the picture seems quite clear, at least to me, that the W’s were BROKE. That’s all JMO.

ETA-let us not forget JW’s . I don’t recall how much he raised in that campaign but it was a chunk of change. The goal was set at $20k when he started it.

The urge to move and start selling off like wildfire, was also around the time of the first interviews w/JW, which was May, 2016. July 20,2016 she posted on the DefFarm FB page, it's still up, that family took preference over her herd, and as bad as she hated to, she was selling them. They moved to AK around a year later. I think she knew they were onto them, or at least suspected them, and was trying to get out of town in hopes that if they were out of site, they'd be out of mind.

 

[Cool Cats]

Custody and fear. That's where the "Hatfields & McCoys" theme comes in. The others were killed because they would identify the killers to LE. They knew CR1, FR, KR, etc. would hunt them down and kill them in return.
In understanding
And, yeah, it's possible some of the Rhodens knew things that could have put the W's in jail for a very long time.

Custody and fear. That's where the "Hatfields & McCoys" theme comes in. The others were killed because they would identify the killers to LE. They knew CR1, FR, KR, etc. would hunt them down and kill them in return.

And, yeah, it's possible some of the Rhodens knew things that could have put the W's in jail for a very long time.

To help understand the motive for killing the 8, think back to when there was actually NO motive to kill them. If we go back far enough we will come to the point when there was no motive for the murders. There was a point in time when all this changed.

What were the changes that occurred in the life circumstances of the Wagners and Rhodens, and what changed in their relationships with each other in the several months pear by up to April 22, 2016? I will have to go back and look for exact dates.

1. Hannah and Jake live together and are
engaged and have a baby.
2. Hannah breaks off the engagement and wants to still live with Jake but also see others.
3. Hannah has a relationship with CG and tells
she doesn't want to live with him anymore.

DEWine said it played a part. It was a factor. It’s an easy conclusion that there were other motives.

I think the acrimony simmered for years. The Waggies played the part of being friendly well. Then after SW was born and post breakup all of what was bothering the Waggies about the Rhodens began to boil.

One Waggie or maybe two had been thinking about retributiontion for a long time. Before 2016, long before. It was carefully shared, maybe at first as a joke, to get rid of maybe Hanna. The joke soon turned into “I wish they all would die”, after they realized that if Hanna was dead, Dana or CRSR would step in and get custody.

Somewhere about the time the custody talks got serious along with the dream of moving to Alaska, Hanna dug in. She would never give her daughter up onlyvto have her 4,500 miles away.

Dana was the first to support her choice, and the rest of the family lined up behind her.

Fights started and 16 yo CRJR was a fiesty 16 yo who didn’t take _____ from anybody. Especially when it involved Sister Hanna and SW.

ONE of the insults AW threw out during an argument was the filthy living conditions in the ramshackle trailers the Rhodens called home. Eventually And somewhere in the midst of Dana and CRSR falling in love again and the less than pristine living conditions the Waggies kept bring up, CRSR bought Dana the trailer she moved into. Life was good. And no one could accuse them of being poor trailer trash ever again.

AW WAS THE FIRST to hear of the new home as Dana thanked friends for helping paint and decorate while CRSR spent his extra time remodeling.

Every advantage the Waggies thought they had if they went to court was fixed at lightening speed by the Rhodens. The odds were in Hanna’s favor of winning when they sat down at their dining room table and the thoughts of something happening to the Rhodens wasn’t funny any more.

The custody issue alone was enough, but there were bad feelings relating to a couple of deals the Waggies were 90% sure they were paid less than they expected. A LOT LESS.

That afternoon the Waggies put ideas on the table and in a couple of weeks had a loosely framed plan to drag in drugs and the grows it soon turned to the plan it became. AW carefully place any paper they used in a shoebox in the old desk she had gotten at a garage sale.

The shoebox came out every time the plan was discussed along with the pens they used to write with. One of the boys suggested they put it on a thumb drive to make it easier to move parts of the plan around and to modify it as necessary.

George4 and Jake spent 2 days entering the constantly altered plan. Neither were skilled typists and both used the single fingered hunt and peck method.

Finally late one afternoon they declared it all on the thumb drive and every paper they had written on was walked out to the burn barrel soaked with gas burned and stirred to ashes. No one would get their hand on that or ever be able to read it. The thumb drive was put in the shoebox in the back of the bottom drawer of the old desk AW bought at a garage sale.
The Waggies still used paper until the boys transferred it all to the thumb drive then the paper went straight to the burn barrel soaked with gas and forever destroyed.


ALL MY OPINION OR GUESS AS TO HOW THIS BEGAN. MOTIVES?

SW

money/drugs debts

Jealousy

One reason I like these thoughts is because it shows an escalation of events. To help understand the motive you must go all the way back to when there was NO motive for the murders. If we go back far enough we can see the time when the Wagners were not plotting murder.

So what changed? If you look through the months running up to the murders you will see an escalation of life events occurring.

JW is living with his fiancee and having a baby and planning his wedding, then his world is crushed because he gets dumped. He still lives with HR and sleeps with her but they are not a couple anymore and she gets with CG. Then she finally kicks JW out altogether but allows him to have SW every other week. Still he won't let go and sleeps with her, but then she tells him she's pregnant and it could be another man's baby.

It was around August that she likely discovered she was pregnant and then JW had all that fall of 2015 to realize the woman he loves is having another man's baby and she won't be coming home with him to Peterson Rd with the new baby ( according to a reporter he wanted nothing more then for this to happen.)

So we're now getting to the winter of 2015 and with a second baby on the way CSR would have realized that his granddaughters need more room so he makes plans to put down $30,000 cash on a new place and he gets approved for a $30,000 loan from OH Adams County Bank, using his land as collateral.

So while this big change is in the making, and I'm sure heavily discussed by all, you have another big change with HR falling very hard for Corey and she says she wants him to be the father. JW now knows he will always be on the outside of HR's life, not a main player.

Then the new year approaches and LE can see that surveillance and a murder plot were then being hatched by Jake and his family.

Lots of extreme changes in JW's life in the year leading up to the murders.

 

[Trudie]

Unlawful debt I believe one of the families owed the other some money (for drugs IMO)
Pattern of corrupt activity could be participating in the grow op

Any action repeated more than once establishes a pattern, I believe.
Pattern might pertain to covering up the crime (as most criminals do). But, per indictments, the pattern continued right up to the day prior to arrests.

 

[Trudie]

The urge to move and start selling off like wildfire, was also around the time of the first interviews w/JW, which was May, 2016. July 20,2016 she posted on the DefFarm FB page, it's still up, that family took preference over her herd, and as bad as she hated to, she was selling them. They moved to AK around a year later. I think she knew they were onto them, or at least suspected them, and was trying to get out of town in hopes that if they were out of site, they'd be out of mind.

Yes, I agree. They had to know LE was onto them.

 

[Trudie]

In layman's terms CRSR possibly owed BW3 a dope debt? Its cliche, but I cant think of anything else that would fit the bill. I wonder if LE uncovered evidence of the Rs owing the Ws? Am I way off base here?

Hard to say but if anyone owed the other, I’d think it’d be as you suggest.

 

[Charliegizmo49]

DEWine said it played a part. It was a factor. It’s an easy conclusion that there were other motives.

I think the acrimony simmered for years. The Waggies played the part of being friendly well. Then after SW was born and post breakup all of what was bothering the Waggies about the Rhodens began to boil.

One Waggie or maybe two had been thinking about retributiontion for a long time. Before 2016, long before. It was carefully shared, maybe at first as a joke, to get rid of maybe Hanna. The joke soon turned into “I wish they all would die”, after they realized that if Hanna was dead, Dana or CRSR would step in and get custody.

Somewhere about the time the custody talks got serious along with the dream of moving to Alaska, Hanna dug in. She would never give her daughter up onlyvto have her 4,500 miles away.

Dana was the first to support her choice, and the rest of the family lined up behind her.

Fist Fights started and 16 yo CRJR was a fiesty 16 yo who didn’t take _____ from anybody. Especially when it involved Sister Hanna and SW. CRJR was usually bloodied up, but among the ones left standing.

ONE of the insults AW threw out during an argument was the filthy living conditions in the ramshackle trailers the Rhodens called home. Eventually And somewhere in the midst of Dana and CRSR falling in love again and the less than pristine living conditions the Waggies kept bring up, CRSR bought Dana the trailer she moved into. Life was good. And no one could accuse them of being poor trailer trash ever again.

AW WAS THE FIRST to hear of the new home as Dana thanked friends for helping paint and decorate while CRSR spent his extra time remodeling.

AW was livid. On the way from her job at the farm, she looked at the speedometer. She had her Excursion going 3200 RPMS just over 100 mph. She took her foot off the gas and hit the brakes hard. It’s a smart thing she did as over the next set of hills was Readers car coming at her. By the time she stopped sweating she was turning into the driveway, her shirt soaked from the near miss of a conversation with the sheriff. She couldn’t have faked calm that day, she could feel her heart beat, and flashes of red in her eyes. Be Cool Angela, be cool.

As she fixed supper for her boys that night she obsessively though about how much she wanted a little girl.

At 45 she was too old even though movie stars were still getting pregnant at her age. She just read all about it in the National Enquirer. Stallone’s ex wife, the blonde giant told the story of every thing she tried to have a baby with her much younger . Finally having a baby at 50.

IVF AND DOCTORS cost money they didn’t have, and even more if you wanted the magical medical miracle if you opted to choose the sex of your baby. Angela snapped back to reality, she didn’t have to deal with any of that. There was already a little girl in her life, SW. the family had to just come up with an extremely well thought out plan to get custody of her.

Every advantage the Waggies thought they had if they went to court to get SW was fixed at lightening speed by the Rhodens. The odds were in Hanna’s favor of winning when they sat down at their dining room table and the thoughts of something happening to the Rhodens wasn’t funny any more.

The custody issue alone was enough, but there were bad feelings relating to a couple of deals the Waggies were 90% sure they were paid less than they expected. A LOT LESS.

That afternoon the Waggies put ideas on the table. Within a couple of weeks had a loosely framed plan to drag in drugs and the grows it soon turned to the plan it became. AW carefully place any paper they used in a shoebox in the old desk she had gotten at a garage sale.

She soon realized the plan was much to big for one person. The Waggies would have to break it up with eAch taking a piece. Until then
The shoebox came out every time the plan was discussed along with the pens they used to write with. One of the boys suggested they put it on a thumb drive to make it easier to move parts of the plan around and to modify it as necessary.

The week before she had gone into the storage barn at the farm rummaged around in the dirt, dust and cobwebs and found her Air Force Training Manuals. She spent her free time over the next few days rereading all she had learned about strategic planning and organizational skills for specialized field ops. She remembered it all.

George4 and Jake spent 2 days entering the constantly altering plan. Neither were skilled typists and both used the single fingered hunt and peck method.

Finally late one afternoon they declared it all on the thumb drive and every paper they had written on was walked out to the burn barrel soaked with gas burned and stirred to ashes. No one would get their hand on that or ever be able to read it. The thumb drive was put in the shoebox in the back of the bottom drawer of the old desk AW bought at a garage sale.
The Waggies still used paper until the boys transferred it all to the thumb drive then the paper went straight to the burn barrel soaked with gas and forever destroyed.


ALL MY OPINION GUESS and fiction AS TO HOW THIS BEGAN. MOTIVES?

SW

money/drugs debts

Jealousy

 

[rsd1200]

Well, I THINK this is factual: Ohio would get first chance due to the murder charges. If someone is serving a LWOP, feds wouldn’t bring charges for an illegal biz venture, it’d be a moot point.

Feds might still want to talk to them. Might mean the difference in where they serve their time... if they talk.

 

[Charliegizmo49]

Ran out of time to edit. Rough in spots because I took to long to correct errors. My apologies.

 

[Trudie]

To help understand the motive for killing the 8, think back to when there was actually NO motive to kill them. If we go back far enough we will come to the point when there was no motive for the murders. There was a point in time when all this changed.

What were the changes that occurred in the life circumstances of the Wagners and Rhodens, and what changed in their relationships with each other in the several months pear by up to April 22, 2016? I will have to go back and look for exact dates.

1. Hannah and Jake live together and are
engaged and have a baby.
2. Hannah breaks off the engagement and wants to still live with Jake but also see others.
3. Hannah has a relationship with CG and tells
she doesn't want to live with him anymore.

One reason I like these thoughts is because it shows an escalation of events. To help understand the motive you must go all the way back to when there was NO motive for the murders. If we go back far enough we can see the time when the Wagners were not plotting murder.

So what changed? If you look through the months running up to the murders you will see an escalation of life events occurring.

JW is living with his fiancee and having a baby and planning his wedding, then his world is crushed because he gets dumped. He still lives with HR and sleeps with her but they are not a couple anymore and she gets with CG. Then she finally kicks JW out altogether but allows him to have SW every other week. Still he won't let go and sleeps with her, but then she tells him she's pregnant and it could be another man's baby.

It was around August that she likely discovered she was pregnant and then JW had all that fall of 2015 to realize the woman he loves is having another man's baby and she won't be coming home with him to Peterson Rd with the new baby ( according to a reporter he wanted nothing more then for this to happen.)

So we're now getting to the winter of 2015 and with a second baby on the way CSR would have realized that his granddaughters need more room so he makes plans to put down $30,000 cash on a new place and he gets approved for a $30,000 loan from OH Adams County Bank, using his land as collateral.

So while this big change is in the making, and I'm sure heavily discussed by all, you have another big change with HR falling very hard for Corey and she says she wants him to be the father. JW now knows he will always be on the outside of HR's life, not a main player.

Then the new year approaches and LE can see that surveillance and a murder plot were then being hatched by Jake and his family.

Lots of extreme changes in JW's life in the year leading up to the murders.

Great post. We know custody played a “role”, DeWine stated as much. In what I think was a long thought out statement. He felt he HAD to say something, IMO.
What we don’t know is exactly what else was going on. When the W men gathered in the shop with R men. What did they talk about? Did they argue? What was the relationship between the men?

 

[Trudie]

Feds might still want to talk to them. Might mean the difference in where they serve their time... if they talk.

True. I think if feds are interested, they will lose interest if there’s convictions.

 

[Cool Cats]

HELP How can I edit my post? I'm sorry I was putting in a post then thought I did it wrong so I stopped and then wrote it over again and now I have 2 posts instead of one. So I need to know how can I edit it? I want to delete the first post. Everyone will think I'm crazy.

 

[Trudie]

HELP How can I edit my post? I'm sorry I was putting in a post then thought I did it wrong so I stopped and then wrote it over again and now I have 2 posts instead of one. So I need to know how can I edit it? I want to delete the first post. Everyone will think I'm crazy.

Don’t worry about it. But, you hit the blue edit tab, then edit away. Before time expires. We don’t worry abt punctuation, spelling, etc. everyone makes mistakes.

However, IQ always has impeccably composed posts, shaming the rest of us, IMO.

 

[Canaille]

AW joined an Alaska jobs or housing FB group just days before the baby was born.

 

[Trudie]

AW joined an Alaska jobs or housing FB group just days before the baby was born.

It seems her family had a long standing fascination with Alaska.

 

[rsd1200]

It could be money owed for drugs too.

JMO

Agree. They may have been in business together. There could have been a falling out, (custody and/or fronted money come to mind), and if that was the case, and the business dissolved, it may have left the Ws without an income. They lived pretty large, and I don't see FW funding their every want and desire. If threats couldn't work, b/c the Rs had as much info on the Ws, as the Ws had on the Rs, then the plan may have began to firm up, from mere talk, to buying supplies, at Walmart. Killing them became an option at that point. That way, they can never out what they have on the Ws, plus, they get S. I think they came to both hate the Rs, and were afraid of them.

 

[Cool Cats]

Great post.
What we don’t know is exactly what else was going on. When the W men gathered in the shop with R men. What did they talk about? Did they argue? What was the relationship between the men?

Sorry, in my post I accidentally made mistakes and had posted 2 times instead of just once. Yes, what was going on big time in the lives of the others? We do know there was that confrontation in April with BW and JW going to the R's over the custody. As they plotted the murders through 2016, they were also strong arming for custody. When the strong arming wasn't working, they knew they were going to their plan B.

That is when I think they realized that they should not have shown everyone that they had an obvious motive to want to eliminate HR, and that they need to get rid of that motive at all costs. I'm guessing the forged document was to clear them of having a motive for murder. I think the document was forged to look like HR had signed over a significant amount of custody to JW so of course he would have no motive now for wanting her out of the way.

Get rid of the motive at all costs even if it means roping AW's mother into it. I believe she was familiar with being a notary. If the murders were only for custody then they probably would have waited and made it look like JW was very happy with the way the custody was going. They were in a hurry. But WHY?