OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) #12

[gngr~snap]

The explanation is provided at the link two posts above yours. Per AG DeWine, it's easier to protect the properties if they move them to a more secure location. No need to have deputies providing round-the-clock security at the original sites. Not sure it's any more enigmatic than that.

You are probably correct.
They aren't releasing these crime scenes anytime soon that's for sure!

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[InspectaX]

That's my theory about the Newsome, Rhoden and Kentucky murders. Either there are master Assassins running loose in Ohio or high level corruption & cover ups.

I have held two theories ... unsurprisingly ... either an inside job (family) or an outside job (competitors) ... An inside job is still compelling and may have been enacted as a copy-cat operation of the prior Eapmon (Elsmere) and Newsome (Lucasville) killings. Although we don't have comprehensive info, it appears that there are many similarities in timing, method, sparing young children and all were involved, or said to be involved, with the selling of drugs. I have a feeling that the Rhodens were also into pills although this has not been said or intimated by any reputable source. An inside job would probably have motivations such as greed, envy and grudge ... an outside job would most likely revolve around eliminating competition and laying hands on dollar stashes and pill supplies on hand at the various murder scenes. CRsnr appears to have been tortured to produce something or to get information. All family adults and teens close to the principal targets had to go too because they could either identify or point to the killer/s. The longer this investigation continues to run without arrests, the more I lean to an outside job ... but who knows, maybe nailing down enough evidence to secure a conviction is proving difficult. And just to complicate matters .... maybe it was a combination of inside / outside as the line of questioning of B-J may suggest... Who paid you to kill them ... ??? Only wish we had more to go on !!

 

[rsd1200]

One thing about the open windows. We don't know for sure when they were opened or who opened them. You pick up on the weirdest details when you're in shock. So, I'm thinking just because BJM noticed the open windows, they may or may not have been opened by the perps. Those windows aren't easy to use as entrance/exits. As much as someone ( or plural someone) paid attention to not leaving any evidence behind, per the press conferences, you'd think they'd have more sense than to drag themselves all over a window. JMO.

Exactly! They are on average about 30" wide, (and the frames are pretty narrow),so for an average size adult to get through one, it would be difficult, especially w/o making all kinds of noise. Now a petite person could slide through, with someone giving them a boost, but w/o a boost, they'd have to jump up there and scramble in, again, making noise.

 

[Margo/Mom]

They would indeed and would be working closely with BCI if any racketeering/conspiracy/organized crime elements are present in this case.

My experience (and my opinion) is that FBI/DEA/ATF/HSI are rarely "loud" as to their levels of involvement in investigations.

They tend to understate their involvement until arrests/indictments (whether they be state or federal) start happening. Sometimes not even then if there are any other related investigations that are ongoing.

I've been looking at federal cases in Ohio and Kentucky over a couple of years span and I haven't seen anything to indicate that BCI has anything but a productive working relationship with federal agencies.

Some in the public might feel better about investigations if the FBI stepped up in all their Efram Zimbalist, Jr./Elliott Ness glory, but it rarely looks that way in the real world. MOO.

Agreed. The kind of investigation that leads to convictions can take a long time. And it consists of a good bit more than analyzing crime scenes. Following the money is a good way to go--with the problem being that in a good many criminal endeavors the transactions are all in cash. Meaning that there are no bank records to trace and so forth.

This case has complexity written all over it. One certainly hopes that many red flags had already been raised and investigated prior to the murders. I continue to think that this one's going to take awhile before we SEE anything. But that doesn't mean nothing's happening.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

They don't step in for child endangering and I disagree with "clearly" child abuse. I think that is making a big assumption. You don't know the care they were given or how they were treated. You only know that 3 of the homes were growing pot.

They step in for cases involving *advertiser censored*; sexual exploitation; kidnapping and violent attacks.

In state murder cases the FBI is an assisting agency. They must be asked to assist by the local police who has jurisdiction over the case. I imagine they were asked to assist right away due to the enormity of the case involving 8 murder victims. In most cases the State investigating agency will also assist along with the help of the FBI. Usually the FBI's role is gathering the forensic evidence from each scene to be forensically tested either by their lab or sending it to the state lab.

I don't think the FBI is involved because of the three surviving small children.

 

[Dudly]

Exactly! They are on average about 30" wide, (and the frames are pretty narrow),so for an average size adult to get through one, it would be difficult, especially w/o making all kinds of noise. Now a petite person could slide through, with someone giving them a boost, but w/o a boost, they'd have to jump up there and scramble in, again, making noise.

Plenty of stuff around to move under a window to get in and out and move away again...

 

[oceanblueeyes]

The explanation is provided at the link two posts above yours. Per AG DeWine, it's easier to protect the properties if they move them to a more secure location. No need to have deputies providing round-the-clock security at the original sites. Not sure it's any more enigmatic than that.

It sounds like they were worried if they left them in their present location there would be looky-lou's coming into the trailers, and others may vandalize the /homes/properties.

 

[Margo/Mom]

They were in danger. It's only a miracle one of them wasn't killed. The parents may or may not have purposely put them in danger but they were. If this isn't a crime against a child an argument could be made easily imo. https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/investigate/vc_majorthefts/cac

I think that the "case" would be against the parents then, who are dead. Victim-blaming. But also typically a state/local issue.

However, the way that the FBI gets pulled into cases involving child *advertiser censored* is that it is disseminated via the internet--effectively crossing state lines, covered as "interstate commerce."

A valid role for the FBI in this case, as I see it, would involve the sale of illegal drugs across state lines. Possibly income tax evasion if illegal gains are undeclared (and therefore untaxed) income. Racketeering (Webster defines a racketeer as "one who obtains money by an illegal enterprise usually involving intimidation"). And I would imagine that should there be a federal case to be made against someone in connection with recent events in Piketon, there will be reliance on evidence gathered by multiple agencies, each covering their own areas of expertise.

 

[Dudly]

I have held two theories ... unsurprisingly ... either an inside job (family) or an outside job (competitors) ... An inside job is still compelling and may have been enacted as a copy-cat operation of the prior Eapmon (Elsmere) and Newsome (Lucasville) killings. Although we don't have comprehensive info, it appears that there are many similarities in timing, method, sparing young children and all were involved, or said to be involved, with the selling of drugs. I have a feeling that the Rhodens were also into pills although this has not been said or intimated by any reputable source. An inside job would probably have motivations such as greed, envy and grudge ... an outside job would most likely revolve around eliminating competition and laying hands on dollar stashes and pill supplies on hand at the various murder scenes. CRsnr appears to have been tortured to produce something or to get information. All family adults and teens close to the principal targets had to go too because they could either identify or point to the killer/s. The longer this investigation continues to run without arrests, the more I lean to an outside job ... but who knows, maybe nailing down enough evidence to secure a conviction is proving difficult. And just to complicate matters .... maybe it was a combination of inside / outside as the line of questioning of B-J may suggest... Who paid you to kill them ... ??? Only wish we had more to go on !!

Don't know how one could deduce that Chris Sr. was tortured. The extent of any bruising was not disclosed. Being shot in the head and lots of blood could look like being beat up. I doubt BJM stayed to
look long enough to know...

 

[Hatfield]

http://www.11alive.com/mb/news/nation-now/scenes-of-death-roll-slowly-down-ohio-highways_/190116451

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Wow. This case keeps getting more and more bizarre to me. I have never heard of such a thing.

LE does explain why they are doing it but it seems a little extreme to me. Shouldn't LE be done getting all the pictures they need and any investigation like prints forensics whatever from the places. It seems LE should just release it from being a crime scene and let family either sell it or do whatever with it.

Why would LE need to stay involved with the actual places?

Its things like this that make me think this crime could be tied to some people that have prestige or authority in the community. Just seems really bizarre to me.

They are going to grab the 4th one too soon according to article. I don't necessarily buy what they are telling us.


""This is a little different. I've never seen it done before, but the nature of these homes is that we can do it. Because we can do, we are going to do it," DeWine said. "The whole idea is so that we all can know they are secure and don't have to worry about that and so the sheriff doesn't have to have people out there all the time. So we just felt it was better to have them inside."

Another mobile home is anticipated to join the others within "a few days," DeWine said.
"

 

[sumzero]

Don't know how one could deduce that Chris Sr. was tortured. The extent of any bruising was not disclosed. Being shot in the head and lots of blood could look like being beat up. I doubt BJM stayed to
look long enough to know...

Agreed. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe both men were found lying on their stomachs, according Bobby. I doubt she did a thorough examination. She didn't even realize they'd been shot.

 

[InspectaX]

Still confused as to why the homes have been removed - It sure looks like they have seized all the assets. Maybe it is for additional investigation, but all the homes are boarded up like I would expect to see if seized. I can't imagine what more they would expect or hope to find after 3 weeks. I am counting the back hoe and all the vehicles as well.
Doesn't LE seize all assets in big drug busts?
MOO

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I would say that preserving the crime scenes intact is important and may prove to be a sound option for securing a prosecution. But there is clearly, in my opinion, a desire to secure all movable assets should they feel that such may be considered as having been acquired by / through the proceeds of a criminal activity.

 

[rsd1200]

You must be someone who is young. Men in their fifties are not really considered old or impotent. And consider his wife would have been about the same age as him. If he was stronger than her when he was young, it follows he was stronger than her when he was (sigh) in his late fifties. Not saying it was his wife, you understand, just saying it could have been.

Out of curiosity, I went back and looked at the code. It's a 2907.03 (3) Which is Sexual Battery; (3)The offender knows that the other person submits because the other person is unaware that the act is being committed. Either way, whoever it was, he got busted w/10 years for it. I'd probably not be really keen on being around him after that. But that's just me, I can't hardly eat at a Subway anymore just b/c it makes me think of Jared. . .

 

[sumzero]

It sounds like they were worried if they left them in their present location there would be looky-lou's coming into the trailers, and others may vandalize the /homes/properties.

Exactly. He needs to preserve the homes for his own needs but also to ensure the survivors get their possessions back intact. It is more cost-effective to move the trailers than to have deputies assigned to secure the scenes (possibly) for several months.

 

[sumzero]

Wow. This case keeps getting more and more bizarre to me. I have never heard of such a thing.

LE does explain why they are doing it but it seems a little extreme to me. Shouldn't LE be done getting all the pictures they need and any investigation like prints forensics whatever from the places. It seems LE should just release it from being a crime scene and let family either sell it or do whatever with it.

Why would LE need to stay involved with the actual places?

Its things like this that make me think this crime could be tied to some people that have prestige or authority in the community. Just seems really bizarre to me.

They are going to grab the 4th one too soon according to article. I don't necessarily buy what they are telling us.


""This is a little different. I've never seen it done before, but the nature of these homes is that we can do it. Because we can do, we are going to do it," DeWine said. "The whole idea is so that we all can know they are secure and don't have to worry about that and so the sheriff doesn't have to have people out there all the time. So we just felt it was better to have them inside."

Another mobile home is anticipated to join the others within "a few days," DeWine said.
"

Unusual but not unprecedented, as per the examples given earlier in this thread.

 

[InspectaX]

If I am correct in believing that he was the one shot 9 times it seems to me that there are grounds to suggest that he was tortured ... à

 

[InspectaX]

Don't know how one could deduce that Chris Sr. was tortured. The extent of any bruising was not disclosed. Being shot in the head and lots of blood could look like being beat up. I doubt BJM stayed to
look long enough to know...

If I am correct in believing that CRsnr was the one shot 9 times it seems to me that there are grounds to suggest that he was tortured ...

 

[rsd1200]

Wow. This case keeps getting more and more bizarre to me. I have never heard of such a thing.

LE does explain why they are doing it but it seems a little extreme to me. Shouldn't LE be done getting all the pictures they need and any investigation like prints forensics whatever from the places. It seems LE should just release it from being a crime scene and let family either sell it or do whatever with it.

Why would LE need to stay involved with the actual places?

Its things like this that make me think this crime could be tied to some people that have prestige or authority in the community. Just seems really bizarre to me.

They are going to grab the 4th one too soon according to article. I don't necessarily buy what they are telling us.


""This is a little different. I've never seen it done before, but the nature of these homes is that we can do it. Because we can do, we are going to do it," DeWine said. "The whole idea is so that we all can know they are secure and don't have to worry about that and so the sheriff doesn't have to have people out there all the time. So we just felt it was better to have them inside."

Another mobile home is anticipated to join the others within "a few days," DeWine said.
"

Actually, because they can do it, is a pretty good reason. They reassemble airline crashes in hangers, to preserve, and walk through, the evidence to determine what went wrong, so they can determine if it was foul play, human error, or mechanical failure. If they can do it, I say go for it. This reduces the possibility that those homes could go up in smoke. We don't know what all's in them.

 

[sumzero]

If I am correct in believing that CRsnr was the one shot 9 times it seems to me that there are grounds to suggest that he was tortured ...

Do we know he was shot 9 times? If so, he could have lunged at the gunmen. Both -- assuming there were two -- could have then shot him 4 or 5 times in a matter of seconds.

 

[dayna769]

In state murder cases the FBI is an assisting agency. They must be asked to assist by the local police who has jurisdiction over the case. I imagine they were asked to assist right away due to the enormity of the case involving 8 murder victims. In most cases the State investigating agency will also assist along with the help of the FBI. Usually the FBI's role is gathering the forensic evidence from each scene to be forensically tested either by their lab or sending it to the state lab.

I don't think the FBI is involved because of the three surviving small children.

The FBI offered assistance from day 1 (see article below). It is up to the local agency if they want that assistance if it isn't in FBI jurisdiction. Local authorities have said that DEA and FBI are assisting.

The FBI tells ABC 6/FOX 28 they are aware of the situation. “We have offered assistance and are monitoring the situation in Pike County,” said Todd Lindgren, public information officer for FBI office in Cincinnati

http://livevote.com/developing-several-people-reportedly-shot-and-killed-in-southern-ohio/


Numerous other sites mention the FBI offering assistance and that they are monitoring it. Including FBI Cincinnati twitter.