OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) - #29

[Obiwankenobi]

So, I've looked back through these articles regarding BJM's account of events. Maybe I've missed it, but I'm not seeing an arrival time of 7:15. Where have we gotten that time from? Is it possible that she arrived later than 7:15?

Someone mentioned the couple with her maybe being elderly, that would make sense if that were the case. The questions I have regarding the 911 call, did she come running and screaming out of the house? Why didn't the couple with her call 911? I think I'd been too hysterical to even speak but that's just me. I definitely don't think she purposely stalled the time between finding them and making that call. But I could be wrong.

 

[rsd1200]

If BJM had not discovered the families, who would have been next in line to find them? Would we think it odd if she said she was supposed to feed the animals that morning, but decided to go on and do what she had planned with "her friend and his wife" ? It just seems as LM stated "why kill the people who gave you a golden egg every time you needed it", that BJM had nothing to gain by the murders...

Who had the most to gain by the murders?

I do find the wording of the article "her friend and his wife" strange. I would expect maybe her friend and her husband ? Then again maybe this was an elderly couple she was helping to take to a doctor appointment or something? That's just me though.

The big barn is quite curious to me too. I watched the helicopter view again thinking I had seen a very nice concrete floor, but just watched it again and it is not clear what type of flooring to me that it had.

OT sort of: Just watched this: American Monster The Green Monster

Season 2 • Episode 1
In Ohio, an intruder brutally guns down Jack and Linda Myers in their sleep. The only witness is their sleepy 4-year-old grandson. But their extensive home movies - aired here for the first time - may have captured a monster lurking in their midst.

https://www.investigationdiscovery.com/tv-shows/american-monster/full-episodes/the-green-monster

Their 4 y/o grandson ran to his daycare to report that his grandparents were "melting." Turns out it was Jack Myers' youngest son. He tried to blame the older estranged son (his brother), but his story fell through when tapes surfaced at Walmart of him purchasing the ammo. It stood out to me because the guilty son never denied he killed his father and step-mother. He just asked for a lawyer. Passed up a plea deal for life without parole. Ugh! He would have inherited the entire farm. Greedy!

BBM
I pondered this for a long time today while catching up on some stuff around here. I wonder if the land obtained from his brother's mil may have been in part b/c of delinquent taxes? That would be painful, unless it was something agreed upon by the two, and not a sale on the courthouse steps kinda thing.

I've also wondered more than once about the ordeal w/ole man R. Could someone, who's life didn't turn out so well, who had written a letter asking for their abuser to be released, but was still shunned by part of the family, kept mum on this for a very long time, while their hatred built, til they decided to wipe out the ones who shunned them, and their family? They decided after thinking about it for years, that they're going to tear that part of the tree out, root and branch, only leave the babies b/c they'd be innocent of how this person had been treated, and be raised in non-R families. Just thinking b/c that kind of stuff, that the ole man was convicted of doing, leaves deep scars on folks.

 

[rsd1200]

So, I've looked back through these articles regarding BJM's account of events. Maybe I've missed it, but I'm not seeing an arrival time of 7:15. Where have we gotten that time from? Is it possible that she arrived later than 7:15?

Someone mentioned the couple with her maybe being elderly, that would make sense if that were the case. The questions I have regarding the 911 call, did she come running and screaming out of the house? Why didn't the couple with her call 911? I think I'd been too hysterical to even speak but that's just me. I definitely don't think she purposely stalled the time between finding them and making that call. But I could be wrong.

“If they tell me she was mixed up in this,” he said, “I would call them a liar and escort them off.”


BBM

She said she ran out of the trailer, crying. Manley thinks she was screaming: “Get me my phone, get my phone.”

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/2016/05/11/pike-county-not-leaving-those-babies-there/84194756/

'I think they should all just leave us alone'

Dana was the third of his four children. His youngest, Bobby Jo Manley, 36, found several of the victims when she went to feed the family’s dogs and chickens around 7 a.m. Friday. Bobby Jo, who stood by her father during much of the interview, is having the toughest time with the deaths: "She don't sleep, she don't eat. She's pretty busted up," he said.

"The Pike County Sheriff's wanted to ask me the same questions the BCI did,'' she said, adding that investigators seem to be fixated on when she found the bodies. They said it was earlier, Bobby Jo says. But she said, she went there around 7 a.m.

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...enge-our-hearts-pike-co-family-says/83517330/

 

[Dudly]

The building has an approx. 9' side bay, then a 10' door, then on the opposite side of the door it's approx 16' wide.


The 9' side bay is approx 8' tall. The peek of the roof with the opening is approx 22'.


30'w x 85'L overall. They may very well have built that building themselves. They had quite a bit of equipment. We didn't do anything anywhere near the same scale but went and bought, and hauled, our own metal siding, snagged some replaced telephone poles for free, got some lumber that was considered imperfect from the local sawmill (in other words it wasn't purty), and had some folks around who were handy with the right equipment, and got our horse shed put up super cheap. If they did their own labor, they could have probably gotten that built for around $20k give or take a couple-three K, based on what the siding was going for at the time, what the interior looks like, if they have dirt, or concrete floors, if they wired it themselves, etc... I'd not rule out getting the Amish to build it either.


As far back as 2009 there was something, if only a shed, or other trailer, at FR's location. So, I think FR may have either been renting, or the plot lines are just "off" (not uncommon for the latter). FR and KR were really the ones into Derbies w/CR2 getting ready to get into them too from what I've understood.


When FR moved in up the road, and was old enough to drive (He turned 16 in 08/2011), and work, I think he followed in KR's footsteps with the derby cars, the car clutter began to come about and the whole family got into it the fun.


In 2010 the car clutter was pretty much non existent, w/the exception of some around the yellow house, which it is said that KR lived there for awhile. Same for 2012, and up to mid 2013 (based on map data I've found). Then, in 2014 up until the murders, the junked cars started to show up.

I think this is about the time they started to get more into the idea of buying other cars that they were running across, and could fix and turn over for a fast profit under STC. Since nearly all of the males in the family worked for BBL I could see this coming together as a business propostion. DR also wrote about going to the car wash to clean up the cars, and not seeing BH there, and missing him.




Side Note on Properties:
The Camp Creek property was purchased for $8k in 2008 from the man who's property butts up to the UHR properties. Could have been a land contract. 2014 shows a trailer but it is not a new trailer


A sister was Et Al over some of the properties for a period of time, then in April, 2011, all that she was et al over, was then changed over to CR1. The properties have a rather cluttered chain of transfer on some of the pieces. We don't get to see the all of the why's and what ifs though. The property that has the garage on it, to the right of where CR1's trailer is located, was sold to CR1 by TR's M.i.l. (just found that interesting). Not all of the land has been in the Rhoden family for generations. More like just since ole man Rhoden acquired it, and then other land has been acquired throughout time.

I've had a feeling that most of the land acquired by CR1 was done so very inexpensively except where he moved DR into. Small tracts in areas like that can go real cheap at times. The owner can't afford the payments after losing a job. Elderly people want to move sometimes or downsize....

 

[Dudly]

BBM
I pondered this for a long time today while catching up on some stuff around here. I wonder if the land obtained from his brother's mil may have been in part b/c of delinquent taxes? That would be painful, unless it was something agreed upon by the two, and not a sale on the courthouse steps kinda thing.

I've also wondered more than once about the ordeal w/ole man R. Could someone, who's life didn't turn out so well, who had written a letter asking for their abuser to be released, but was still shunned by part of the family, kept mum on this for a very long time, while their hatred built, til they decided to wipe out the ones who shunned them, and their family? They decided after thinking about it for years, that they're going to tear that part of the tree out, root and branch, only leave the babies b/c they'd be innocent of how this person had been treated, and be raised in non-R families. Just thinking b/c that kind of stuff, that the ole man was convicted of doing, leaves deep scars on folks.

Do the sisters have children that may have got upset about their mother turning the land over to CR1 instead of them? Or because they got nothing for that land?

 

[superbee]

BBM
I pondered this for a long time today while catching up on some stuff around here. I wonder if the land obtained from his brother's mil may have been in part b/c of delinquent taxes? That would be painful, unless it was something agreed upon by the two, and not a sale on the courthouse steps kinda thing.

I've also wondered more than once about the ordeal w/ole man R. Could someone, who's life didn't turn out so well, who had written a letter asking for their abuser to be released, but was still shunned by part of the family, kept mum on this for a very long time, while their hatred built, til they decided to wipe out the ones who shunned them, and their family? They decided after thinking about it for years, that they're going to tear that part of the tree out, root and branch, only leave the babies b/c they'd be innocent of how this person had been treated, and be raised in non-R families. Just thinking b/c that kind of stuff, that the ole man was convicted of doing, leaves deep scars on folks.

My wise old granny told me that 3 things can cause a lot of problems. 1. money 2. land 3. sex

 

[rsd1200]

Do the sisters have children that may have got upset about their mother turning the land over to CR1 instead of them? Or because they got nothing for that land?

I think that the one who turned over et al has three. The female R siblings have a total of ten children combined (I may have missed a couple or so though). The family is so large, that each sibling, if the female siblings had not turned theirs over, would have only gotten an 1/8 of the entire et al properties handed down from their father, however, sometimes it's the "principle" when it comes to things like this.

 

[Dudly]

A case in Ohio where two people were killed in their sleep and a four year old saw the perp that night. What he remembered helped convict the murderer.

https://www.investigationdiscoverygo.com/american-monster/the-green-monster/

 

[Dudly]

Someone who does a lot of repair/resale of cars would also be in a good position to pick up the odd stolen vehicle, or vehicle that had been involved in a crime. We know that there are a lot of drugs flowing through Pike County. This involves a lot of people having a need to change vehicles often. Risky business, but one that likely pays.

If they were scrapping them out, then it is more plausible. Commit a crime, scrap the car, have it hauled in and shredded the next morning.

 

[Dudly]

The building has an approx. 9' side bay, then a 10' door, then on the opposite side of the door it's approx 16' wide.


The 9' side bay is approx 8' tall. The peek of the roof with the opening is approx 22'.


30'w x 85'L overall. They may very well have built that building themselves. They had quite a bit of equipment. We didn't do anything anywhere near the same scale but went and bought, and hauled, our own metal siding, snagged some replaced telephone poles for free, got some lumber that was considered imperfect from the local sawmill (in other words it wasn't purty), and had some folks around who were handy with the right equipment, and got our horse shed put up super cheap. If they did their own labor, they could have probably gotten that built for around $20k give or take a couple-three K, based on what the siding was going for at the time, what the interior looks like, if they have dirt, or concrete floors, if they wired it themselves, etc... I'd not rule out getting the Amish to build it either.


As far back as 2009 there was something, if only a shed, or other trailer, at FR's location. So, I think FR may have either been renting, or the plot lines are just "off" (not uncommon for the latter). FR and KR were really the ones into Derbies w/CR2 getting ready to get into them too from what I've understood.


When FR moved in up the road, and was old enough to drive (He turned 16 in 08/2011), and work, I think he followed in KR's footsteps with the derby cars, the car clutter began to come about and the whole family got into it the fun.


In 2010 the car clutter was pretty much non existent, w/the exception of some around the yellow house, which it is said that KR lived there for awhile. Same for 2012, and up to mid 2013 (based on map data I've found). Then, in 2014 up until the murders, the junked cars started to show up.

I think this is about the time they started to get more into the idea of buying other cars that they were running across, and could fix and turn over for a fast profit under STC. Since nearly all of the males in the family worked for BBL I could see this coming together as a business propostion. DR also wrote about going to the car wash to clean up the cars, and not seeing BH there, and missing him.




Side Note on Properties:
The Camp Creek property was purchased for $8k in 2008 from the man who's property butts up to the UHR properties. Could have been a land contract. 2014 shows a trailer but it is not a new trailer


A sister was Et Al over some of the properties for a period of time, then in April, 2011, all that she was et al over, was then changed over to CR1. The properties have a rather cluttered chain of transfer on some of the pieces. We don't get to see the all of the why's and what ifs though. The property that has the garage on it, to the right of where CR1's trailer is located, was sold to CR1 by TR's M.i.l. (just found that interesting). Not all of the land has been in the Rhoden family for generations. More like just since ole man Rhoden acquired it, and then other land has been acquired throughout time.

I saw two people build a pole barn with a tractor and front loader and post hole digger. They used used siding. I wondered what it would look like when it was finished with the equipment they used. The sides are as straight as can be. If it were new siding it would look professionally built. So it is possible that the Rhodens put it up themselves.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

The building has an approx. 9' side bay, then a 10' door, then on the opposite side of the door it's approx 16' wide.


The 9' side bay is approx 8' tall. The peek of the roof with the opening is approx 22'.


30'w x 85'L overall. They may very well have built that building themselves. They had quite a bit of equipment. We didn't do anything anywhere near the same scale but went and bought, and hauled, our own metal siding, snagged some replaced telephone poles for free, got some lumber that was considered imperfect from the local sawmill (in other words it wasn't purty), and had some folks around who were handy with the right equipment, and got our horse shed put up super cheap. If they did their own labor, they could have probably gotten that built for around $20k give or take a couple-three K, based on what the siding was going for at the time, what the interior looks like, if they have dirt, or concrete floors, if they wired it themselves, etc... I'd not rule out getting the Amish to build it either.


As far back as 2009 there was something, if only a shed, or other trailer, at FR's location. So, I think FR may have either been renting, or the plot lines are just "off" (not uncommon for the latter). FR and KR were really the ones into Derbies w/CR2 getting ready to get into them too from what I've understood.


When FR moved in up the road, and was old enough to drive (He turned 16 in 08/2011), and work, I think he followed in KR's footsteps with the derby cars, the car clutter began to come about and the whole family got into it the fun.


In 2010 the car clutter was pretty much non existent, w/the exception of some around the yellow house, which it is said that KR lived there for awhile. Same for 2012, and up to mid 2013 (based on map data I've found). Then, in 2014 up until the murders, the junked cars started to show up.

I think this is about the time they started to get more into the idea of buying other cars that they were running across, and could fix and turn over for a fast profit under STC. Since nearly all of the males in the family worked for BBL I could see this coming together as a business propostion. DR also wrote about going to the car wash to clean up the cars, and not seeing BH there, and missing him.




Side Note on Properties:
The Camp Creek property was purchased for $8k in 2008 from the man who's property butts up to the UHR properties. Could have been a land contract. 2014 shows a trailer but it is not a new trailer


A sister was Et Al over some of the properties for a period of time, then in April, 2011, all that she was et al over, was then changed over to CR1. The properties have a rather cluttered chain of transfer on some of the pieces. We don't get to see the all of the why's and what ifs though. The property that has the garage on it, to the right of where CR1's trailer is located, was sold to CR1 by TR's M.i.l. (just found that interesting). Not all of the land has been in the Rhoden family for generations. More like just since ole man Rhoden acquired it, and then other land has been acquired throughout time.

BBM

So where did the money come from to buy all this?

CR1 was making maybe a few thousand per job at BBL. DR was working as a nurse aide at a nursing home at probably close to minimum wage. CR1 may have been making a thousand on each car he sold and that is high balling it. He wasn't making the same on every car and it isn't likely that he was selling a car a week or even a month. After you take out cost of living, food, utilities, gasoline ect there wouldn't be much left to buy at least 40K and maybe more worth of real estate, build a 20k plus building, buy heavy equipment and 150 plus cars all in two years.

Think about it in relation to your own finances. How many of you on here would be able to invest that much money plus raise two children (HR would have been around 16-17 in 2014) in two years?
There was outside money coming in from somewhere. And where ever that was KR wasn't a part of it because he shows no such signs of sudden affluence. So I don't think it was from the MJ operation.


Same with the W's. They came up with enough money to buy a 175K house, trucks, trailers ect from 2014 to 2016. Same period of time as the R's. As RSD1200 pointed out the W's could have gotten help from wealthy relatives (but I don't think so since most of the locals on here agree the elder W's were estranged from GW3). But the R's had no wealthy relatives.


Both the R's and the W's started showing signs of sudden affluence around the same time period, 2014-2016.


So where did the money come from?


I think the R's and the W's both got into drug trafficking around 2014 through JM's in-laws AM's family. This is JMO.

 

[Venom]

BBM

So where did the money come from to buy all this?

CR1 was making maybe a few thousand per job at BBL. DR was working as a nurse aide at a nursing home at probably close to minimum wage. CR1 may have been making a thousand on each car he sold and that is high balling it. He wasn't making the same on every car and it isn't likely that he was selling a car a week or even a month. After you take out cost of living, food, utilities, gasoline ect there wouldn't be much left to buy at least 40K and maybe more worth of real estate, build a 20k plus building, buy heavy equipment and 150 plus cars all in two years.

Think about it in relation to your own finances. How many of you on here would be able to invest that much money plus raise two children (HR would have been around 16-17 in 2014) in two years?
There was outside money coming in from somewhere. And where ever that was KR wasn't a part of it because he shows no such signs of sudden affluence. So I don't think it was from the MJ operation.


Same with the W's. They came up with enough money to buy a 175K house, trucks, trailers ect from 2014 to 2016. Same period of time as the R's. As RSD1200 pointed out the W's could have gotten help from wealthy relatives (but I don't think so since most of the locals on here agree the elder W's were estranged from GW3). But the R's had no wealthy relatives.


Both the R's and the W's started showing signs of sudden affluence around the same time period, 2014-2016.


So where did the money come from?


I think the R's and the W's both got into drug trafficking around 2014 through JM's in-laws AM's family. This is JMO.

Isn't it in this time period that HR was pregnant/would have had SW? Add in the expense of a newborn possibly falling on DR/CRS to support.

 

[rsd1200]

BBM

So where did the money come from to buy all this?

CR1 was making maybe a few thousand per job at BBL. DR was working as a nurse aide at a nursing home at probably close to minimum wage. CR1 may have been making a thousand on each car he sold and that is high balling it. He wasn't making the same on every car and it isn't likely that he was selling a car a week or even a month. After you take out cost of living, food, utilities, gasoline ect there wouldn't be much left to buy at least 40K and maybe more worth of real estate, build a 20k plus building, buy heavy equipment and 150 plus cars all in two years.

Think about it in relation to your own finances. How many of you on here would be able to invest that much money plus raise two children (HR would have been around 16-17 in 2014) in two years?
There was outside money coming in from somewhere. And where ever that was KR wasn't a part of it because he shows no such signs of sudden affluence. So I don't think it was from the MJ operation.


Same with the W's. They came up with enough money to buy a 175K house, trucks, trailers ect from 2014 to 2016. Same period of time as the R's. As RSD1200 pointed out the W's could have gotten help from wealthy relatives (but I don't think so since most of the locals on here agree the elder W's were estranged from GW3). But the R's had no wealthy relatives.


Both the R's and the W's started showing signs of sudden affluence around the same time period, 2014-2016.


So where did the money come from?


I think the R's and the W's both got into drug trafficking around 2014 through JM's in-laws AM's family. This is JMO.

If CR1 had gotten pretty good at growing, and let's say the big garage had an upstairs in it, (kind of like a barn w/ a hay loft), with, for the sake of easy figuring, 16 indoor pot plants with 600 watt grow lamps over them.


One plant with a 600 watt grow lamp, can yield up to 20 ounces for an experienced grower, with the right grow room, nutrients, no disease, etc. Let's say 16 ounces for the sake of keeping it simple.


That is 16 pounds of weed. Just for CR1. (For arguments sake, let's say he and KR hand their own seperate grows seeing as how KR had his own tray at his location and may have been getting ready to transplant outside. A plant grown and tended outdoors can definitey yield a pound of usable weed.)


16 pounds of weed, at the low end of the price spectrum, could have grossed around $40,000 - 48+ k, per grow depending on how he sold, quality, etc... He could have easily grown two cycles per year indoors. (I'm sure that money was not going into the bank either.)


These are men who were raised by a father who gardened, and raised fruit trees, as a means to feed his family. A very large family. I'm sure CR1 helped in tending that garden, and may have developed a green thumb.

 

[rsd1200]

Isn't it in this time period that HR was pregnant/would have had SW? Add in the expense of a newborn possibly falling on DR/CRS to support.

I've a gut feeling that since HMR was young, and not working at the time, probably still in school, that she'd have qualified for assistance with formula and such. I also think that JW would have probably provided some assistance too only b/c he was working, older, and very involved with S.

 

[Dudly]

I've a gut feeling that since HMR was young, and not working at the time, probably still in school, that she'd have qualified for assistance with formula and such. I also think that JW would have probably provided some assistance too only b/c he was working, older, and very involved with S.

I'm pretty sure JW was helping financially but no idea how much....

 

[rsd1200]

A case in Ohio where two people were killed in their sleep and a four year old saw the perp that night. What he remembered helped convict the murderer.

https://www.investigationdiscoverygo.com/american-monster/the-green-monster/

Just got a chance to watch this. Very interesting. The little boy was very wise to pretend to be sleeping. Family, killing family, over greed, money, land. Cold blooded. I have wondered, in the R/G case, if they've searched the local creeks and rivers for dumped firearms/clothing.

 

[Dudly]

Just got a chance to watch this. Very interesting. The little boy was very wise to pretend to be sleeping. Family, killing family, over greed, money, land. Cold blooded. I have wondered, in the R/G case, if they've searched the local creeks and rivers for dumped firearms/clothing.

He was getting evicted and would be homeless so he decided killing his mother and step father to inherit the house was a good idea....Pure greed and no remorse...

 

[Betty P]

So, I've looked back through these articles regarding BJM's account of events. Maybe I've missed it, but I'm not seeing an arrival time of 7:15. Where have we gotten that time from? Is it possible that she arrived later than 7:15?

Someone mentioned the couple with her maybe being elderly, that would make sense if that were the case. The questions I have regarding the 911 call, did she come running and screaming out of the house? Why didn't the couple with her call 911? I think I'd been too hysterical to even speak but that's just me. I definitely don't think she purposely stalled the time between finding them and making that call. But I could be wrong.

Her time of arrival is an estimate based on her interview with Chris Graves of Cincinnati Enquirer. The reference is below the entry on the timeline.

 

[Bootsctr]

Just got a chance to watch this. Very interesting. The little boy was very wise to pretend to be sleeping. Family, killing family, over greed, money, land. Cold blooded. I have wondered, in the R/G case, if they've searched the local creeks and rivers for dumped firearms/clothing.

Yes as equally cold blooded as the G/R murders IMO, but not as well planned as the R/G murders. They had more time to get rid of the weapons and clothing. I was shocked to see the shotgun tossed in such shallow and clear water. I wonder if the weapons are even in Pike county any more. So many more possible suspects in the R/G murders. Muddied water for sure.

I keep going back to the Dewine quote from April 25, 2016: "“It was a sophisticated operation. And those who carried it out were trying to do everything that they could do to hinder the investigation and their prosecution,” DeWine said as quoted by the NBC News."

To me that sounds like Dewine knows who the killers are. I also read that he wants the case ready to prosecute as soon as arrests are made.

Did anything come of the 2 security cameras on the property? I only read BJM's statement regarding letting investigators know about the cameras.

https://www.morningnewsusa.com/ohio...y-to-hinder-investigation-kasich-2373228.html

 

[Iron city]

Even if you make a bunch of cash illegally (30-40k for property ect.) you can't just spend it. Even laundering with cars from auction there is a paper trail with sale prices. Go to your own bank withdraw 5k twice and go back 2 days later and deposit it. There are questions and you have to sign papers, they may even call for more information after the fact. This much spent in that short of time would throw red flags all over.

It's really odd we never found out who the people with BJM were that morning. Wonder if it was a W or relation.

Even if there is ever a arrest I don't think we will get the full story unless someone in the family or the killers themselves start talking.

I do not believe this is liberty and justice at all. In fact this investigation is a disgrace to our nation, constitution and most importantly this family.

Jmo about 10% chance an arrest is ever made in this case at this point