OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) - #31

[Betty P]

Another little tidbit I found was this Melissa Ann Weisel was the daughter of Ll**d Stone and the late Kath**ine Penwell Stone of Piketon Ohio. RW's ex-wife Mel**ssa M Penwell Waddell. Is everyone in Pike Co. related somehow?

Who is RW? Is there any reason to think these people were involved in the murders?

 

[Betty P]

BBM

Her father, (deceased 2014), is a brother to GRS, and I'm almost positive that you are correct, they all lived in that one trailer, til DR got the new one, one month, almost to the day, before they were murdered.

The two you speak of were married in '90 and, it shows they lived at 4199 UHR (FR's trailer), in the early years of their marriage. I'm also pretty sure it was his brother who was turned down, for the loss of wages, from the victim's fund (the brother is married to a R, and they had a child who passed in 2007). I know we've beat this poor horse before, but, now that they've done a new flyover update of Pike County, for the pva, it truly appears that FR's trailer wasn't on R land.

I saw that RW and his wife transferred property, on 4/21/14, solely to RW (not unusual since their divorce was final in Jan, 2014). The folks who bought it from RW, in 10/2016, still own the property. This is the same property that CR1 had registered as that Adams Health... I forgot the name. Odd that a lot of things with the case seem to center around April. Probably a fluke, but it's still odd.

So, you're referring to the property across the road from 4199 UHR? Can you clarify? TIA

Are you also saying that this property (across from 4199 UHR - is there an address for it?) is where Dana Rhoden was living with her kids before moving to the home down UHR, where her murder took place? If she were living there when CR1 and DR registered the Adams Health business, would that explain why that address is listed on the documents - because she was living there at that time?

Any links for this information? Thanks!

 

[Betty P]

More of the same.

Everyone seems to be trying to keep media coverage of the 2nd Anniversary of the Rhoden Murders to a minimum.

http://www.wlwt.com/article/sheriff...f-2-years-after-pike-county-slayings/19849057

At least, they should inform the public how much investigating they're doing these days. There's no indication anyone is even working on the case full time anymore. In an interview last March, DeWine indicated he only sent people out there now and then. Does that mean BCI is no longer working on the case full time? How about PCSO?

A little more information from WCPO in Cincinnati. Mostly a recap of the case in the last year with a few quotes.

I-Team: Still no arrests two years after Pike County massacre

https://www.wcpo.com/news/local-new...-arrests-two-years-after-pike-county-massacre

Two retired FBI agents, Robert Friedman and Keith Tolhurst, also declined to talk about the strategy or technique for investigating the case, saying they didn't want to jeopardize it. They did say that solving a case like this is like completing a puzzle; figuring out who did it and developing a solid case takes precision and patience. They said they believe state and local investigators are close to making the pieces fit.

Umm, ok, sure. Puzzle pieces,etc.

A BCI spokesperson said there is no timetable for solving the case. Currently, the BCI superintendent receives daily briefings from agents assigned to it, and he's in regular communication with the attorney general about any developments. They still have a dedicated team that works on the Pike County case every day.

Ok, so BCI says they're working on it every day, which doesn't exactly fit what DeWine alluded to last month. Maybe DeWine doesn't really discuss the case with them much these days, or something.

https://www.wcpo.com/news/local-new...aid-opioid-crisis-in-cincinnati-campaign-stop

I wish there was someone local who could let us know if the case is still being worked on a regular basis.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

A little better article, but still redundant and disappointing like the rest published this week.

https://www.wcpo.com/news/local-new...-arrests-two-years-after-pike-county-massacre

 

[MittenScarpetta]

A little better article, but still redundant and disappointing like the rest published this week.

https://www.wcpo.com/news/local-new...-arrests-two-years-after-pike-county-massacre

Sorry Betty, just noticed you posted this one in your last post—oops!

 

[Betty P]

Sorry Betty, just noticed you posted this one in your last post—oops!

No problem. It looks like many of the news outlets just re-wrote the Press Release issued by Sheriff Reader, so they all look the same.

Kind of get the feeling they don't want any reporters and news camera crews coming to Piketon or Union Hill Road for the 2nd Anniversary. It's an election year and they probably don't want anyone reminded of the still unsolved Rhoden family murders.

 

[wlb22]

Did anyone see the article in People magazine...it's about Brentley...maybe it will bring some much needed publicity

 

[rsd1200]

So, you're referring to the property across the road from 4199 UHR? Can you clarify? TIA

Are you also saying that this property (across from 4199 UHR - is there an address for it?) is where Dana Rhoden was living with her kids before moving to the home down UHR, where her murder took place? If she were living there when CR1 and DR registered the Adams Health business, would that explain why that address is listed on the documents - because she was living there at that time?

Any links for this information? Thanks!

No, 4199, I'm almost, positive, is FR's trailer's address. Check out this article from when they re-opened the road. You won't find "4199 UHR" in the pva, and such. It's an address that I think that they gave FR, since he lived on land he didn't own, kinda like I own a piece of land with x address, where I live and receive mail, but I allow someone else to put a trailer on me, and live. That other person would need a separate address. I think the post office just assigned them that 4199. Again, I think...

At DR’s property at 3122 Union Hill Rd., a wooden front deck is visible from the road — a sturdy threshold to a home that’s no longer there. The mailbox is knocked over, lying next to a large stone bearing the name of family who no longer lives there.


About a mile away at 4077 and 4199 Union Hill, strands of yellow crime scene tape blend in with a barn, old cars, picnic tables and animal pens that dot the neighboring properties where CR1 and GR were killed, next door to FR and HG.

Edit: Not in particular FR, but that trailer.

http://www.dispatch.com/news/20160517/pike-county-road-reopens-but-normalcy-slow-to-return/1

 

[Betty P]

No, 4199, I'm almost, positive, is FR's trailer's address. Check out this article from when they re-opened the road. You won't find "4199 UHR" in the pva, and such. It's an address that I think that they gave FR, since he lived on land he didn't own, kinda like I own a piece of land with x address, where I live and receive mail, but I allow someone else to put a trailer on me, and live. That other person would need a separate address. I think the post office just assigned them that 4199. Again, I think...



http://www.dispatch.com/news/20160517/pike-county-road-reopens-but-normalcy-slow-to-return/1

Thanks for explaining. I was getting it wrong, thinking it was another home nearby you were referring to. :facepalm: Nevermind. :blushing1:

So, you all think there may be some connection between the people who used to own the property and the killers?

 

[rsd1200]

More of the same.

Everyone seems to be trying to keep media coverage of the 2nd Anniversary of the Rhoden Murders to a minimum.

http://www.wlwt.com/article/sheriff...f-2-years-after-pike-county-slayings/19849057

At least, they should inform the public how much investigating they're doing these days. There's no indication anyone is even working on the case full time anymore. In an interview last March, DeWine indicated he only sent people out there now and then. Does that mean BCI is no longer working on the case full time? How about PCSO?

A little more information from WCPO in Cincinnati. Mostly a recap of the case in the last year with a few quotes.

I-Team: Still no arrests two years after Pike County massacre

https://www.wcpo.com/news/local-new...-arrests-two-years-after-pike-county-massacre



Umm, ok, sure. Puzzle pieces,etc.



Ok, so BCI says they're working on it every day, which doesn't exactly fit what DeWine alluded to last month. Maybe DeWine doesn't really discuss the case with them much these days, or something.

https://www.wcpo.com/news/local-new...aid-opioid-crisis-in-cincinnati-campaign-stop

I wish there was someone local who could let us know if the case is still being worked on a regular basis.

I do think that they're working on it, and I think they have some idea, of the why, and don't want to compromise anything. As far as the AG, I don't take much that he says at face value.

 

[rsd1200]

Thanks for explaining. I was getting it wrong, thinking it was another home nearby you were referring to. :facepalm: Nevermind. :blushing1:

So, you all think there may be some connection between the people who used to own the property and the killers?

I jumped off to another topic at the end there and it did sound confusing after I re-read. I'm kinda finding the connections interesting.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

Did anyone see the article in People magazine...it's about Brentley...maybe it will bring some much needed publicity

Looks like they just rewrote the enquirer article, BUT it’s still good to see a highly read media source like People magazine keeping the victims’ names out there for the public to see and read.

https://www.google.com/amp/people.com/crime/ohio-piketon-murders-surviving-boy-has-nightmares/amp/

 

[MittenScarpetta]

“Pike County Prosecutor Rob Junk will only say that investigators remain focused on a former Peebles family of four who had ties to the Rhoden family but moved last year to Alaska.”

“He said authorities are not looking at anyone else in the April 22, 2016 slayings. Two agents from the state’s Bureau of Criminal Investigation and a member of the Pike County Sheriff’s office remain assigned to the case full-time and work out of an office in the county,”Junk said.

https://www.cincinnati.com/story/ne...investigation-stands-after-2-years/531686002/

 

[rsd1200]

“Pike County Prosecutor Rob Junk will only say that investigators remain focused on a former Peebles family of four who had ties to the Rhoden family but moved last year to Alaska.”

“He said authorities are not looking at anyone else in the April 22, 2016 slayings. Two agents from the state’s Bureau of Criminal Investigation and a member of the Pike County Sheriff’s office remain assigned to the case full-time and work out of an office in the county,”Junk said.

https://www.cincinnati.com/story/ne...investigation-stands-after-2-years/531686002/

Had it not been for a couple three things, I'd not really even think about the Ws. The custody issue, in and of itself, I cannot see causing this. I do not see the Ws as big drug players either.

The main thing that puts them on my radar, is;

JW's conflicting statements. Which statement is true? Did he pick her up at 10:30 p.m., the evening before, and miss the murders by hours? or Did HMR drop her off, and he was to bring her home, that Friday? In no way are his statements similar, other than S wasn't at the scene of the murders that night. The former, at the very least, puts him as the last person who saw HMR alive.

The two statements are so different, that I can't see how there could be a mistake, on the part of JW, or even on the part of the newspaper(s) that ran his story.

 

[Betty P]

“Pike County Prosecutor Rob Junk will only say that investigators remain focused on a former Peebles family of four who had ties to the Rhoden family but moved last year to Alaska.”

“He said authorities are not looking at anyone else in the April 22, 2016 slayings. Two agents from the state’s Bureau of Criminal Investigation and a member of the Pike County Sheriff’s office remain assigned to the case full-time and work out of an office in the county,”Junk said.

https://www.cincinnati.com/story/ne...investigation-stands-after-2-years/531686002/

That's interesting. We don't often hear from Rob Junk, but he's the one who is in charge of the Pike Co Grand Jury. They went through all the hoopla last year of arresting James Manley for taking the GPS tracker off his truck. Charges were dropped in lieu of him testifying before the JG. If Prosecutor Junk has been convening a GJ on this case since then, he must be discovering more information about the murders. If everyone in the area is afraid to talk about these murders, the GJ is the best way to find out what's going on as their testimony will remain secret unless charges are brought.

"One of these days, if and when somebody is charged, there's a lot of things that would be public that can't be made public now. There are some things that could clear this up for you in about two seconds but I really can't say anything because the investigation is still going on," Junk said.

To solve a case, Junk said he would like to see at least two of three things: Good forensic evidence, a confession or an eyewitness.

“At this point, nobody has seen any of those, nothing like that has ever been (publicly) released," Junk said.

BBM

That's an interesting statement. What does he mean that information and/or evidence hasn't been publicly released? Is he saying someone in LE has that kind of information, but can't release it? Also unsettling is the remarks about "if and when someone is charged".

Just a hunch, but they may have more information than they're letting on, but they just won't act on it.

Interesting also that, of the two prosecutors working on the case, Junk is now willing to say something about it, but DeWine is staying silent. JMO, that means Junk is wanting to resolve the case more than DeWine. Just theorizing, but if Junk wants to bring charges and DeWine doesn't, what does that mean?

Remember, from reading the transcripts of the depositions in the Rhoden autopsy court case at the Supreme Court of Ohio, it was DeWine and BCI who were working the hardest, putting the most time and money into keeping the Rhoden massacre case zipped up and out of public view.

Given all that happened in the last year, I do think the Wagner family could be involved. I also think their extended family has more power and political pull to keep themselves from being arrested, JMO. (Wags grandparents are from Cincinnati "old money" and likely have powerful old friends; also connections through their religion, which counts A LOT in Ohio politics) The odd thing is that their connection to the case (custody issue, JW possibly being the last person to see HR before she died) should have brought them under scrutiny very quickly. Instead, investigators waited for over a year to make a move on them.

“The Wagners are sorry for the Rhoden’s loss but they are innocent and they simply want to be left alone,’’ he said through his assistant. “They want to express their compassion for the Rhodens.”

Jake Wagner is engaged to be married to a woman in Alaska. He retains sole custody of Sophia and is working as a mechanic there.

Sounds like Jake Wagner has moved on, with a new fiancee and all.

I wonder if BCI has been sharing all their evidence and information with PCSO & Junk? This has been DeWine's show all along. For better or worse, he owns this case now.

A paternity test established Kylie’s father as Charlie Gilley. He is the brother of Hannah Gilley, thus making Kylie, who turned 2 this week, and Ruger cousins.

A Pike County judge awarded custody of Ruger and Kylie to a family member in the summer of 2017. The children are being raised together.

The remarks about moving the trailers twice are interesting. Junk seems to intimate that, even if any evidence found in them was not admissible, it wouldn't matter because they already have removed the evidence they need. Good grief. Who has faith that they got all the evidence they need when they can't solve the case after 2 years?

Some experts have said moving the crime scene two times may prove problematic for prosecutors at the time of a trial because of chain of evidence issues.

However, prosecutor Junk scoffed at that notion: "The only way it would impact chain of custody, hypothetically, is if someone goes back into those trailers and find some magic piece of evidence that nobody found before."

He added he would fully expect a defense attorney to raise the chain-of-evidence issue.

“However it would probably be fair to say that those trailers, the mobile home and that camping trailer, are probably the most processed, photographed, videoed and analyzed crime scenes in Ohio history,’’ he said. “It would be fair to say the criminalists from BCI have been all through those probably every square inch of those has been mapped. It's nothing I really worry about.”

Ok. For better or worse, Junk is stuck with whatever quality work the BCI did on collecting evidence. Thank goodness they didn't ask the FBI to process (or even visit) the crime scenes. /s

JMO, this case is a major CF right now. The only way they're going to solve it is if the killer goes to the news media and confesses.
With this article, I'm beginning to sense some conflict between Pike County and DeWine's office.

:facepalm:

I feel even less optimistic than before that there will be justice for the Rhoden & Gilley families.

 

[Betty P]

Had it not been for a couple three things, I'd not really even think about the Ws. The custody issue, in and of itself, I cannot see causing this. I do not see the Ws as big drug players either.

The main thing that puts them on my radar, is;

JW's conflicting statements. Which statement is true? Did he pick her up at 10:30 p.m., the evening before, and miss the murders by hours? or Did HMR drop her off, and he was to bring her home, that Friday? In no way are his statements similar, other than S wasn't at the scene of the murders that night. The former, at the very least, puts him as the last person who saw HMR alive.

The two statements are so different, that I can't see how there could be a mistake, on the part of JW, or even on the part of the newspaper(s) that ran his story.

I think the Wags were involved because of the custody issue, but also because they were involved in drug activity. Hard not to assume that considering so many of the tenants living on their substantial real estate holdings in the area have been busted for drug dealing, meth manufacturing, etc. JMO, the Wags family may have been growing weed on the grandparents properties, too. Even in recent years, they were still buying up land in remote areas.

When you go to the trouble to plan and execute the murders of 8 members of a family in a single night, it's about more than custody. It's about money and fear of someone going to jail or your own family getting killed. JMO

 

[Betty P]

On the second anniversary of the Rhoden Family Massacre 3 things stand out:

• It took LE 1 year to begin investigating the people they now claim are their main focus, even though one was in a custody battle and was among the last people to see the victim

• The Ohio AG spent over a year and hundreds of thousands of dollars to go all the way to the Ohio Supreme Court to prevent details of the autopsy reports from being released to the news media

• LE were willing to break chain of custody on potential evidence in the case in order to lock up the 4 homes of the victims in various area warehouses, putting future prosecution of killers at risk

JMO

 

[MittenScarpetta]

Had it not been for a couple three things, I'd not really even think about the Ws. The custody issue, in and of itself, I cannot see causing this. I do not see the Ws as big drug players either.

The main thing that puts them on my radar, is;

JW's conflicting statements. Which statement is true? Did he pick her up at 10:30 p.m., the evening before, and miss the murders by hours? or Did HMR drop her off, and he was to bring her home, that Friday? In no way are his statements similar, other than S wasn't at the scene of the murders that night. The former, at the very least, puts him as the last person who saw HMR alive.

The two statements are so different, that I can't see how there could be a mistake, on the part of JW, or even on the part of the newspaper(s) that ran his story.

IMO, JW picked her up, JMO. Could be why there is an issue with having 2 of 3 things needed to bring charges as Junk said. JMO but if JW picked S up, he could have went out of his way to make sure his DNA was all over that house so if/when it was found, he could explain why. If they have his DNA, say in Hanna’s bed or on her door, his excuse could be “well when I was picking Sophia up, I asked to see the new baby. The baby was asleep in Hanna’s room so I went in there, where I sat on the bed and held her”


That could be the farthest thing from the truth, but it’s just a thought. I do think the DA is needing 2 of 3 things because they HAVE the forensic evidence needed BUT the killer(s) has/had reason to be in those homes and in close contact with the victims so the forensic evidence is easily explained away and validated by a DEFENSE attorney.

In other words, they have 1 of the 3 things they need for an indictment and trial. But further information is needed from the remaining 2 items to secure a conviction.

My ears perked up when the statement was made saying that the Wagner’s remain a focus of the investigation and are the only suspects thus far (paraphrasing). It’s been months and months since their names popped up in the media with their homes being searched...if the DA didn’t have anything on them, they’d have been cleared by now.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

“Pike County Prosecutor Rob Junk will only say that investigators remain focused on a former Peebles family of four who had ties to the Rhoden family but moved last year to Alaska.”

“He said authorities are not looking at anyone else in the April 22, 2016 slayings. Two agents from the state’s Bureau of Criminal Investigation and a member of the Pike County Sheriff’s office remain assigned to the case full-time and work out of an office in the county,”Junk said.

https://www.cincinnati.com/story/ne...investigation-stands-after-2-years/531686002/

"One of these days, if and when somebody is charged, there's a lot of things that would be public that can't be made public now. There are some things that could clear this up for you in about two seconds but I really can't say anything because the investigation is still going on," Junk said.


There are some things that could clear this up for you in about 2 seconds, but I really can’t say anything because the investigation is still going on.

Again, another statement that speaks volumes, at least to me. In other words, they know who murdered the family BUT cannot speak on that info because more info is needed for a conviction.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

RSBM

Just a hunch, but they may have more information than they're letting on, but they just won't act on it.

I agree 100%. Im confident they have forensics, but they need that eyewitness or a confession because the forensics has became circumstantial considering the close relationships the killer(s) had with the victims.

Given all that happened in the last year, I do think the Wagner family could be involved. I also think their extended family has more power and political pull to keep themselves from being arrested, JMO. (Wags grandparents are from Cincinnati "old money" and likely have powerful old friends; also connections through their religion, which counts A LOT in Ohio politics) The odd thing is that their connection to the case (custody issue, JW possibly being the last person to see HR before she died) should have brought them under scrutiny very quickly. Instead, investigators waited for over a year to make a move on them.

It is very ODD that it took so long to execute searches of their property. Way too long. We can assume that any evidence that could have potentially been at the W property early on had since been disposed of or destroyed by the time their property was searched. Did we ever find out what that 5th search warrant was for early on?

Sounds like Jake Wagner has moved on, with a new fiancee and all.

I kind of expected that. Since him and Hanna weren’t romantically involved at the time of the murders combined with his young age, I was pretty sure he would be involved with someone romantically pretty quick.

I wonder if BCI has been sharing all their evidence and information with PCSO & Junk? This has been DeWine's show all along. For better or worse, he owns this case now.

After watching the Sierah Joaghin trial, I learned a little more about how BCI operates. From my understanding, their evidence and findings are fluid between other investigating agencies involved.

The remarks about moving the trailers twice are interesting. Junk seems to intimate that, even if any evidence found in them was not admissible, it wouldn't matter because they already have removed the evidence they need. Good grief. Who has faith that they got all the evidence they need when they can't solve the case after 2 years?

Some experts have said moving the crime scene two times may prove problematic for prosecutors at the time of a trial because of chain of evidence issues.

However, prosecutor Junk scoffed at that notion: "The only way it would impact chain of custody, hypothetically, is if someone goes back into those trailers and find some magic piece of evidence that nobody found before."

He added he would fully expect a defense attorney to raise the chain-of-evidence issue.

“However it would probably be fair to say that those trailers, the mobile home and that camping trailer, are probably the most processed, photographed, videoed and analyzed crime scenes in Ohio history,’’ he said. “It would be fair to say the criminalists from BCI have been all through those probably every square inch of those has been mapped. It's nothing I really worry about.”

I feel like he’s saying it would be a miracle to find any remaining evidence in the trailers so basically the question of chain of custody will be irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.

Ok. For better or worse, Junk is stuck with whatever quality work the BCI did on collecting evidence. Thank goodness they didn't ask the FBI to process (or even visit) the crime scenes. /s

JMO, this case is a major CF right now. The only way they're going to solve it is if the killer goes to the news media and confesses.
With this article, I'm beginning to sense some conflict between Pike County and DeWine's office.

Took me a solid 20 minutes to figure out what CF meant LOL. I agree there’s conflict between the two counties and I blame DeWine.

I feel even less optimistic than before that there will be justice for the Rhoden & Gilley families.

Someone’s conscious will get the best of them. Or someone will brag about their heinous actions to the wrong person. What’s done in the dark always comes to light.