OK OK - Jamison Family; Truck, IDs and Dog Found Abandoned, 8 Oct 2009 - #11

[mtrooper]

Don't take this in a bashing way...But IF LE tries to say murder suicide then they have been duped. I guess its easier that getting down to the truth. I always go back to motive. If you were going to kill yourself would you be contacting real estate companies and asking them to show you properties? Would you spend all day walking around the property, take an odd photo of your daughter and then get back in your truck, plug in your phone (why would you care if your battery was dead if you were doing the murder suicide thing?) only to walk almost three miles to do the murder suicide thing? Really? NO foul play? I am patiently waiting. Oh yea, I forgot to mention the purchases made on ebay that were made shortly before they went missing. I could go on all night. I will hold my tongue for now.

 

[Pensfan]

Starlet Jamison (Bobby's mom) has already stated that SHE was the one who had the cameras installed on the house!

Yes, but did she really have the cameras installed at the suggestion of her son and DIL?

 

[Pensfan]

Do you think the statement of Bobby's uncle is somehow not appropriate or something?

I'm wondering if they possibly found items at the spot that led them to believe it wasn't foul play. But what could those items be and why would they not release that information?

Sherilyn's pistol was missing (not found at their home or in their truck).

 

[mtrooper]

Do you think the statement of Bobby's uncle is somehow not appropriate or something?

I'm wondering if they possibly found items at the spot that led them to believe it wasn't foul play. But what could those items be and why would they not release that information?

We are family friendly here at websleuths. I shall refrain from further comment on that matter.

 

[Pensfan]

Don't take this in a bashing way...But IF LE tries to say murder suicide then they have been duped. I guess its easier that getting down to the truth. I always go back to motive. If you were going to kill yourself would you be contacting real estate companies and asking them to show you properties? Would you spend all day walking around the property, take an odd photo of your daughter and then get back in your truck, plug in your phone (why would you care if your battery was dead if you were doing the murder suicide thing?) only to walk almost three miles to do the murder suicide thing? Really? NO foul play? I am patiently waiting. Oh yea, I forgot to mention the purchases made on ebay that were made shortly before they went missing. I could go on all night. I will hold my tongue for now.

If you have a delusional disorder, you might want to sell your property one day, but the next day decide that the planet Earth is about to be destroyed by demons and that the only chance for your family to survive is to leave it immediately through suicide. (I've heard far more illogical statements from delusional patients.)

Pensfan
verified psychiatric mental health nurse

 

[Pensfan]

I really hope they don't just blow this off because they "looked like meth addicts" or something.

People who are depressed (Major Depressive Disorder) can lose a lot of weight. Unmedicated bipolars can also lose weight. People with persecutory delusions are very often afraid to eat as their "enemies" have poisoned the food or put microchips inside it.

 

[little726]

*Family Speaks Out After Remains Found In Oklahoma*

http://www.koco.com/news/oklahomane...ma/-/11777584/23038950/-/aqy0wsz/-/index.html

 

[MsFacetious]

"no foul play suspected" = "we don't want to spend the money to investigate this"

I wish I had more faith in Oklahoma LE.
One day maybe I will. lease:

 

[mck16]

Don't take this in a bashing way...But IF LE tries to say murder suicide then they have been duped. I guess its easier that getting down to the truth. I always go back to motive. If you were going to kill yourself would you be contacting real estate companies and asking them to show you properties? Would you spend all day walking around the property, take an odd photo of your daughter and then get back in your truck, plug in your phone (why would you care if your battery was dead if you were doing the murder suicide thing?) only to walk almost three miles to do the murder suicide thing? Really? NO foul play? I am patiently waiting. Oh yea, I forgot to mention the purchases made on ebay that were made shortly before they went missing. I could go on all night. I will hold my tongue for now.

I agree with the above and also would you walk to the base of a mountain miles from where you are when you could have done the suicide and double murder right in your own home or in the truck. jmo

 

[little726]

Yes, but did she really have the cameras installed at the suggestion of her son and DIL?

Not according to Starlet.

You may want to take a look back at the threads from 2009-2010. It's all there!

 

[Pensfan]

I believe the Bobby was depressed from his chronic pain. Sherilyn had been diagnosed as bipolar (had depressive episodes). Both were delusional. Both believed they were under attack and were fighting a war (with spirits and witches). Being attacked and involved in war is very stressful to the human body. Stress leads to elevated cortisol levels, reduced serotonin, reduced dopamine and reduced other neurotransmitters which have been proven to cause depression and intensify depression.

It was stated by those who knew this couple that they were preoccupied with death. Preoccupation with death is an unhealthy mental health symptom which is a red flag for suicidal behavior.

A person who feels dead, wants to be dead, or continually thinks about his/her death exhibits the following symptoms:
-Despair/hopelessness
-Indifference
-Loss of interest in pleasurable activities including eating
-Lethargy
-Social withdrawal

IMO, the trance-like state of the Jamisons (on their surveillance camera) was not a drug-induced state, but rather it was the well known symptoms of severe depression.

Pensfan
verified psychiatric mental health nurse

 

[eya]

Don't take this in a bashing way...But IF LE tries to say murder suicide then they have been duped. I guess its easier that getting down to the truth. I always go back to motive. If you were going to kill yourself would you be contacting real estate companies and asking them to show you properties? Would you spend all day walking around the property, take an odd photo of your daughter and then get back in your truck, plug in your phone (why would you care if your battery was dead if you were doing the murder suicide thing?) only to walk almost three miles to do the murder suicide thing? Really? NO foul play? I am patiently waiting. Oh yea, I forgot to mention the purchases made on ebay that were made shortly before they went missing. I could go on all night. I will hold my tongue for now.

I'm wondering if one parent could have lead the planning for the more "future-oriented" activities (e.g., real estate appointments, ebay) while the other was secretly planning something else. But I agree with you, it may point to someone else being involved, especially in light of the three mile trek.

 

[eya]

I believe the Bobby was depressed from his chronic pain. Sherilyn had been diagnosed as bipolar (had depressive episodes). Both were delusional. Both believed they were under attack and were fighting a war (with spirits and witches). Being attacked and involved in war is very stressful to the human body. Stress leads to elevated cortisol levels, reduced serotonin, reduced dopamine and reduced other neurotransmitters which have been proven to cause depression and intensify depression.

It was stated by those who knew this couple that they were preoccupied with death. Preoccupation with death is an unhealthy mental health symptom which can progress to suicide.

A person who feels dead, wants to be dead, or continually thinks about his/her death exhibits the following symptoms.
-Despair/hopelessness
-Indifference
-Loss of interest in pleasurable activities including eating
-Lethargy
-Social withdrawal

IMO, the trance-like state of the Jamisons (on their surveillance camera) was not a drug-induced state, but rather it was the well known symptoms of severe depression.

I'm also in the mental health field and I agree with you that all signs point to some very serious mental illness. It is very sad that someone was not able to intervene here, esp for the sake of the daughter.

 

[Pensfan]

I agree with the above and also would you walk to the base of a mountain miles from where you are when you could have done the suicide and double murder right in your own home or in the truck. jmo

You are thinking logically. This couple was not thinking logically. They were delusional. Perhaps they believed they needed to travel to the other side of the mountain for their souls to board a UFO space craft to Heaven? The delusional cult leader from Heaven's Gate had this illogical belief before initiating a mass suicide involving 40+ people.

 

[Dixie811]

I know that before they went missing the Jamison's pulled Madyson out of school in order to homeschool her. If they completed their move to the rural and mountainous land they were looking at when they disappeared then she probably would have needed to be homeschooled out of necessity-- no school bus coming up that mountain..

But I wonder if they went ahead and pulled her out of school before the move was happening because a school official (a teacher or counselor) was concerned about the mental health of the Bobby and Sherilyn and/or Madyson's home environment? Don't get me wrong, I think they loved their daughter very much!! But some of the odd behavior of Bobby and Sherilyn such as: moving into the storage container on the driveway rather than living in the house they owned, the threats of the creepy boarder who lived with them prior to being kicked out, making strange/erratic statements that may suggest paranoia or delusions, and symptoms of major depression may have concerned a school official and led someone to want to meet with or question Bobby and Sherilyn (which of course would make anyone uncomfortable and put them on the defensive).

It may not really matter.

But if someone is depressed or feeling paranoid (I think Bobby and Sherilyn were both), they can sometimes feel as if the whole world is turning against them. Any attempt by the school to intervene or show concern for Madyson's home life may have added to feelings of hopelessness/alienation.

 

[McSpy]

Sadly it sounds like maybe they got lost and died of exposure. I mean a murder suicide would still be foul play right?

This was my first thought. I haven't followed the case closely, but I can see them getting turned around and hopelessly lost. I could be wrong though.

 

[Backwoods]

I believe the Bobby was depressed from his chronic pain. Sherilyn had been diagnosed as bipolar (had depressive episodes). Both were delusional. Both believed they were under attack and were fighting a war (with spirits and witches). Being attacked and involved in war is very stressful to the human body. Stress leads to elevated cortisol levels, reduced serotonin, reduced dopamine and reduced other neurotransmitters which have been proven to cause depression and intensify depression.

It was stated by those who knew this couple that they were preoccupied with death. Preoccupation with death is an unhealthy mental health symptom which is a red flag for suicidal behavior.

A person who feels dead, wants to be dead, or continually thinks about his/her death exhibits the following symptoms:
-Despair/hopelessness
-Indifference
-Loss of interest in pleasurable activities including eating
-Lethargy
-Social withdrawal

IMO, the trance-like state of the Jamisons (on their surveillance camera) was not a drug-induced state, but rather it was the well known symptoms of severe depression.

Pensfan
verified psychiatric mental health nurse

I agree that severe mental health issues seem to have been present and so murder-suicide, or even a suicide pact, could be a possibility -- and yes, it could have been decided on on the spur of the moment, if the issues were severe enough or spiked suddenly. Maybe a note or delusional writings of some kind were found with the bodies.

BUT -- murder-suicide is still foul play; and it seems that a suicide pact would be as well, since a child was involved.

It could be, in a severe mental state, that the two adults were disoriented and did wander and get lost -- but how would that be known this soon after the discovery of the remains? Unless, again, they left behind some kind of message...

 

[Equinista]

Sigh. I do not know what to think but I am sticking to whay I feel. I feel it was foul-play, not murder-suicide and not drug related. I just hope for answers soon, I do not think I will ever believe there was no foul play. I'm afraid LE is just going to dismiss this as such and tell the public they were delusional and just got lost and call is case closed.

 

[Pensfan]

I agree that severe mental health issues seem to have been present and so murder-suicide, or even a suicide pact, could be a possibility -- and yes, it could have been decided on on the spur of the moment, if the issues were severe enough or spiked suddenly. Maybe a note or delusional writings of some kind were found with the bodies.

BUT -- murder-suicide is still foul play; and it seems that a suicide pact would be as well, since a child was involved.

It could be, in a severe mental state, that the two adults were disoriented and did wander and get lost -- but how would that be known this soon after the discovery of the remains? Unless, again, they left behind some kind of message...

I'm not certain a suicide pact or murder-suicide of spouse and child is considered to be foul play. It is possible that the words foul play were misused and only meant to imply that LE found something which pointed towards self-inflicted deaths. (Yes, the precious child didn't take her own life.)

The medical examiner considers the likelihood of foul play and natural or accidental death by reviewing the deceased person's medical background. Sherilyn’s medical background was bipolar (high rate of suicide). Her husbands was chronic pain and disability (a common precursor to depression and suicide).

Another possibility could be that they were found in an area known to have been a river or flash flood area, but the bodies likely wouldn't have been found together if they were washed away in a river or flash flood.

 

[Ann-Tx]

http://oudaily.com/news/2013/nov/18/ap_missingfamily/
The Oklahoma Daily -- 11/18/13

Found remains could belong to missing Oklahoma family

The Associated Press 10:00 p.m. November 18, 2013

Snipped:

The Latimer County Sheriff's Office, Haskell County Sheriff's Office, Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation, FBI and the State Medical Examiner's Office searched the area, but turned up no evidence that helped identify the remains, according to a statement from the OSBI.

Snipped:

A spokeswoman for the Office of the Chief Medical Examiner said Monday that the office has received skeletal remains of two adults and one child. The office will use anthropological and, if necessary, forensic pathological methods to determine if the remains belong to Bobby Jamison, who was 44 when he went missing, and his wife, Sherilyn Jamison, who was 40 at the time of the disappearance, and their 6-year-old daughter, Madyson.

"Depending on the features of these remains and their state of preservation, identification can take anywhere from days to years," spokeswoman Amy Elliott said in a statement.