OR - Kyron Horman, 7 yo Second grader, Portland, 4 June 2010 - #17

[tehcloser]

While the white truck may or may not have anything to do with this case, it DOES show people are contacting LE with tips. I'm grateful for that.

 

[BeanE]

BeanE,

I see what you mean about the Hormans possibly not knowing that Kyron was not found at the school until they reached there.

As for the 911 call being placed, the way the wording is in Kaine's message, I have to say it reads like he is trying to cover for not making a call himself. "In concert" with is too ambiguous, in my opinion, and I think that was the point. In reality, if the Hormans were told 911 was called when they arrived at the school they wouldn't have to call themselves. As you say, maybe the 911 call was placed by the school (secretary?) with the Hormans standing right there.

As for a Time Line, do you create a separate, enduring thread for this? I haven't been around here long enough to know how you guys do this. It sounds like a wonderful way to gather information and then find all the verification possible.

Thank you for continuing to respond to my posts and for answering my questions.

I would agree that 'in concert' is an unusual way to put it, but I don't think it's necessarily to cover up. It may have been his way to give a nod to the school, to indicate that they were helpful to the family in this time of crisis.

We now have our new Media and Timeline subforum for Missing/Located, wherein each case can have a thread. Kyron's thread is already in there.

Typically, people create a timeline for all or just part of a case, post it for discussion and feedback (may be several iterations), and then when you feel it's solid, you can just post it in the Media/Timeline thread.

Before posting one in the Media/Timeline thread, it should have all the links for the source references. Some people include them on each line, others make a list at the bottom. We avoid putting speculation in them, because they are typically widely used as a 'go-to' reference source.

Jules has a timeline or two or the Media thread, and there is also a link to a timeline on Oregonlive in there, you might want to look at.

Anyone and everyone is welcome to create a timeline. They can be time-consuming and difficult. They are always appreciated.

Hmmmm trying to think what else I can tell you lol.

Sometimes there will be a conflict - one source says one thing happened, another source says another happened at the same time. In those instances I note both, so neither is lost, and people can decide which they feel is more likely to have occurred. Eventually those things tend to get resolved as new information is released.

Hope this helps!
BeanE

 

[BeanE]

I didn't see anything in any article about the white truck about the driver being blond.

That was a rumor.

 

[jessunlil]

(Snipped for space)

It involves crossing a one lane bridge and making several turns; it's hard to believe someone would go that far accidentally. The road is unimproved (I thought I had read 'private road' initially, but the oregonlive story says 'dead end) and heavily wooded. When you reach his property, you can see why he and his neighbor would be suspicious of any unknown vehicle being down there.

Just throwing this out there, I have no information related to the siting & this isn't even an opinion on it.

I have a GPS, it's not built into my car & it's a few years old. Sometimes, even if I update the maps, it's completely clueless. I have driven in circles and all over a location I wasn't familiar with because I was following the GPS directions. Sometimes it picks up on unnamed dirt roads and tries to incorporate them into the directions. Sometimes, if I'm on an overpass on a major road it will suddenly be unable to "see" the overpass and start throwing out directions for the surface streets under and around the overpass.
This hasn't happened often enough for me to throw the GPS out of the car window but it's happened more than once.

Maybe the driver of the white truck was led astray by a GPS?
Though having it happen twice & hours apart makes that less likely.

 

[BeanE]

- If I'm not mistaken, white is the most popular color for both cars and trucks. I'm not going to research it though

- Perhaps the driver/owner of the white truck did indeed see all this on the news, along with LE's plea for tips, called LE, told them what they were doing there, and LE asked them to refrain from talking with the media...

 

[Pensfan]

Eyewitness reports are inherently unreliable in any event. They may have both said white but completely different makes or models, we just don't know. Once, my girlfriend and I walked in on burglars in my home--they ran out, jumped in a car and drove away. I told police it was a white 4 door sedan; she claimed it was a dark green SUV. Go figure.

Eyewitness accuracy is affected by many factors. Participants in a research study, who witnessed a computerized crime, responded correctly only 52% of the time when questioned when they had no previous knowledge about the crime. When participant were provided with some information about the crime, their accuracy dropped. This occurs because of the effects of the participants' personal background (cultural experiences/biases, and etc...) . Accuracy is also affected by the interrogators' questioning methods (positive, neutral or negative questions).

http://groups.colgate.edu/cjs/student_papers/2002/JScheer.pdf

So, according to this research, any eyewitness report r/t this crime will be less than 52% accurate because the eyewitness may be biased from information they have heard about Kyron's case. (It is highly publicized.)

 

[Pensfan]

Are Jane VM or Nancy going to discuss Kyron tonight?

 

[bernie40]

This can NOT be the same white truck seen around 3p the day he went missing & again around 2a (by Mr. Kelly) cos neither parent would've been able to get away
at that later time with LE around..I assume they were still present at their home for obvious reasons..It still does not change my opinion tho that possibly the perp scouted out that area for a later 'dump' site..It does, however, change whatever opinion I may have re: WHO the perp is cos I'm not ready yet to believe the suspicious actions of this white truck are meaningless to the case.

I thought I heard that LE stayed at the Horman house all day and night, but went home to sleep...did they have another officer come for the graveyard shift?

 

[cluciano63]

I believe NG is planning to devote more coverage than last night to Kyron tonight, but not sure...

 

[believe09]

So there is nothing new. I hope it is because there is a good lead being followed-Kyron, I am praying for you buddy...

 

[SoCalSleuth]

Eyewitness accuracy is affected by many factors. Participants in a research study, who witnessed a computerized crime, responded correctly only 52% of the time when questioned when they had no previous knowledge about the crime. When participant were provided with some information about the crime, their accuracy dropped. This occurs because of the effects of the participants' personal background (cultural experiences/biases, and etc...) . Accuracy is also affected by the interrogators' questioning methods (positive, neutral or negative questions).

http://groups.colgate.edu/cjs/student_papers/2002/JScheer.pdf

So, according to this research, any eyewitness report r/t this crime will be less than 52% accurate because the eyewitness may be biased from information they have heard about Kyron's case. (It is highly publicized.)

Numerous studies have been conducted over the years on this very subject and the stats are pretty much the same as quoted in your post. That is the reason I believe the police aren't releasing any info--they do not want to color anyone's perception or recollection.

OT--I stand corrected on the blond thing, was pretty sure I read that--thanks for the correction!

 

[BOZGAL]

Are Jane VM or Nancy going to discuss Kyron tonight?

IDK Pensfan but I hope so.
I am watching MG now on HLN and no coverage yet.


jmho

 

[Cheewawa007]

See what no new info is doing? Same questions and debates making the rounds, about the time last seen, the "substitute", the 911 call, the white truck...enough to make you nuts or me anyway...

ol' wise black cat, your post made me ROTFLMAO!! :biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:
(and oh how true)

 

[mrsc72]

Praying for you Kyron!!

 

[impatientredhead]

Eyewitness reports are inherently unreliable in any event. They may have both said white but completely different makes or models, we just don't know. Once, my girlfriend and I walked in on burglars in my home--they ran out, jumped in a car and drove away. I told police it was a white 4 door sedan; she claimed it was a dark green SUV. Go figure.

I have posted this story before but I had a high school teacher who wanted to illustrate the point about eye witness testimony. He and a student had set up a scenario no one else was in on.

The student was the first student in the class, after the rest of the class filtered in and sat down, chatting amongst themselves, the student in on the act started flipping out, tossed his desk over on its side, told the teacher to go F himself and stormed out the door.

Dead silence fell over the class and then went to murmuring. The teacher had us all write down what had just happened. Most everyone got the description of the flipout and what was said (The moment everyone focused for a moment) but EVERYTHING surrounding and leading up to the events were wrong.

The vast majority said he was late to class and the teacher confronted him about it (in fact he was there, by the door when every student in the class walked in). Some people had an ongoing and escalating arguement between the two, some said he was crying.

It was a great real life example of how much you cannot rely on that kind of testimony. Had it involved a crime we would all be wondering how he could be reported both as the first student in the room and reported as arriving late by multiple sources.

The teacher said if he asked us to recall what happened 48 hours later (minus the classroom discussion) we would see how much morphing happens just with the passage of time.

 

[Cheewawa007]

Mrsc72, that is the most precious picture!! Thanks for sharing it with us..... anyone care to join me in an internet prayer for Kyron & his family at this time?

 

[Calliope]

This is my first post here. I have been lurking for a few days and have joined just today.

I am an elementary school principal and I have been drawn to this case because of the involvement of the school. I am here just out of my need to make sure we do everything we can to protect our students from harm when we are in charge of them.



We have 350 students at our small, rural school. At least weekly we have a student that doesn't get on the bus, fails to show up on time while walking, etc. We investigate these by calling the bus drivers on radios, calling teachers to the office or phone, calling friends of the students. Most times the child is found in a matter of minutes. Sometimes they are missing for 30 minutes or more but we usually have reports of who saw them last and are just waiting to get a hold of someone.

Our buses are equipped with radios. The radios did not come with the buses we had them installed after purchase. The radios cannot contact the police- they can only contact other radios in the district. All bus drivers, school secretaries, custodians, and administration have radios.

Often when we call the police we call on the non-emergency number so that it is not recorded and we ask they send a car to the school and we don't say why so that it does not go across the scanners and spread panic. Of course LE can reach us in a couple of minutes.

If we had a true emergency we would of course call 911 right away.

Rexy

Excellent point. Welcome!

 

[Calliope]

That's the thing.. I know I remember reading something about it. Raeann replied that the school confirmed there were no subs in that day so it could have been a quote from a confused child.

Perhaps it was a substitute teacher who came in as a volunteer to walk the kids around. Then again, maybe at that age, any school staff acting in that capacity would be considered a sub.

 

[heartfortruth]

I thought I heard that LE stayed at the Horman house all day and night, but went home to sleep...did they have another officer come for the graveyard shift?

Hi, I try to keep my fingers to myself because I have discovered that I am just not good at Sleuthing.....just a "cheerleader" for the real 'Seuthers on here.......but I was wondering if maybe LE is waiting for a call at the Horman's house.....from a possible kidnapper.....
I hate to even ask this and I'm blushing as I write because
.I betcha' this has been mentioned 1000 times and I didn't see it even though I try to read as many posts as I can. I did a search but I'm not even good at that! LOL
If anyone can point me to the info I would appreciate it so I can get that idea out of my mind. TIA

 

[CarmelEyesD]

I am miles behind here, so this may have been posted already. Most small schools, when they have a science fair or similar event happening,- put a little notice in the local paper, internet, and even church bulletins. They also have the same security levels as this small school-no cameras, no sign-in or visitor passes. If you were a pedophile, looking for a child-where would you look and where would you go? I am assuming if you saw (or searched for) small school notices, then 'you' can casually walk in, pick your child and slip away...