OR - Kyron Horman, 7 yo Second grader, Portland, 4 June 2010 - Part #3

[trigger]

Kyron's classroom is on the second floor.

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/06/search_for_missing_portland_bo.html

Thank you. Just catching up here..

Also thanx for the presser!

Prayers for his safe return

 

[believe09]

I read today that the FBI are processing all videos and photos from the School Science Fair, and that the LK photo of Kyron is in front of his project.

Now in our school, there is one way into/out of the building that does not trigger an alarm. You sign in at the office if you are visiting for the science fair. That means one way in, one way out and you sign in and out. If you are not wearing a visitor badge, you are stopped by any staff member.

There has to be a finite number of people that the FBI are looking at who might have come into contact with the science fair. If it was a stranger who took the opportunity to grab Kyron, then Kyron must have been targeted or stalked some how. And that seems beyond the realm of possibility unless they missed a CORI check of someone inside the school system.

Now, a parent could certainly leave with a child in the middle of that kind of chaos. That I can see. Assuming that each teacher takes attendance and keeps track of the students, I have to believe that the teachers know whether or not Kyron returned to the class room from the science fair. The kids in his class know, because even in my son's kindergarten class they can all tell you who is missing at any given moment, and these are 5 year olds.

So I am really really puzzled. Is bio mom in the picture at all? I will go back through these fast moving threads....

 

[believe09]

One more question, I know that investigators are being closed mouthed but has the school been completely cleared? I mean every locker every nook and cranny?

 

[Pensfan]

I wish we had an inside map. Maybe after he said goodbye to his mom he decided to go the bathroom.

On the comment's section for an abc report, one mother, supposedly from this area, wrote that the bathrooms were near an unsecured door that opened out to a park. She had told her daughter to never leave class and go to the bathroom and to never go alone to those bathrooms.
http://abcnews.go.com/US/Media/kyro...entary-school/comments?type=story&id=10836677

 

[freefallzzzz]

The local news is on scene at the school, where they are saying school will be held today and searchers will be searching. You can watch it live at the link.

They usually have the top story at beginning of the hour, and usually every 15 minutes.

The reporter is on scene live so they are showing him in front of the school

The news is on until 9am PST..

http://www.kptv.com/video/15359817/index.html

 

[STEADFAST]

I read today that the FBI are processing all videos and photos from the School Science Fair, and that the LK photo of Kyron is in front of his project.

Now in our school, there is one way into/out of the building that does not trigger an alarm. You sign in at the office if you are visiting for the science fair. That means one way in, one way out and you sign in and out. If you are not wearing a visitor badge, you are stopped by any staff member.

There has to be a finite number of people that the FBI are looking at who might have come into contact with the science fair. If it was a stranger who took the opportunity to grab Kyron, then Kyron must have been targeted or stalked some how. And that seems beyond the realm of possibility unless they missed a CORI check of someone inside the school system.

Now, a parent could certainly leave with a child in the middle of that kind of chaos. That I can see. Assuming that each teacher takes attendance and keeps track of the students, I have to believe that the teachers know whether or not Kyron returned to the class room from the science fair. The kids in his class know, because even in my son's kindergarten class they can all tell you who is missing at any given moment, and these are 5 year olds.

So I am really really puzzled. Is bio mom in the picture at all? I will go back through these fast moving threads....

Kyron's teacher marked him absent. The picture his stepmom took of him, though, proves that he was in the classroom at some point before roll was taken.

 

[angelmom]

A few thoughts after reading all of the threads:

The school looks like it is built into a hillside. So it could be that a 2nd floor room actually does open onto a back parking lot. Or it could be bad reporting (as we've seen a LOT so far).

The 2nd floor classroom could be why TH didn't walk all the way to the classroom. If she had Baby K in a stroller, she might have just said goodbye to him at the stairs instead of going back up among the crowd. Not to mention, despite what some commenters on Topix think, I wouldn't hesitate to let my 2nd grader walk to class alone. I have dropped my kids at the curb (as requested by the school) since they were in kindergarten. Also, does the "dood" think the bus driver walks those kids to class every day, or do they manage to get there on their own?

Baby K's nap schedule might be why TH didn't go to talent show. I know that when my own DD was about that age it was a nightmare if she was off her schedule. She was too old to sleep in her carseat and too young to miss a nap one day. There were times I reluctantly missed an event b/c I knew she would cry through the whole thing and I'd have to walk out anyway.

Baby K and her schedule may also be why TH is sometimes on fb when others apparently think she should be beating the bushes for Kyron. She may be "trapped" in the house taking care of her DD, feeling helpless and unable to do anything, and going online is her only outlet. If her DH and LE are at the command center, she may literally be home alone while the baby naps with nothing but the computer. I would be unable to resist the temptation of reading what people are saying, looking for updates, etc. And I might also get angry and frustrated enough that I would lash out and make a comment when I really wasn't supposed to.

At school, clearly there is the policy and what happened. I can't blame them as I have had the same experience of the sign in/out procedure being tossed out when 100 people are standing at the window. They just open the door, no badges or sign in. It has never concerned me because I think someone would have to know that to take advantage of it.

I am also very familiar with kids coming for just part of a special day at the end of the year when there are no other academics really going on. As a teacher, this wouldn't faze me. And while Kyron may have been in the talent show, I don't know that everyone would know or remember that. Like the person who does attendance, for example.

Also, I can totally see TH mentioning to the teacher (in the middle of the crazy gym!) that Kyron would be late on Monday or whatever b/c of an appointment, and the teacher not really paying attention (justifiably - trying to watch the other kids) and only remembering later "Did she say something about an appointment?" ~shrug~ She may have even said to TH, "email me so I don't forget" and TH did.

As for being called if the child leaves something...I have never. My kids have left lunchboxes, homework, PE bags (with their only tennis shoes!), etc. I would not expect a call, nor would I have called when I was teaching. It may not have been noticed until all of the other bags, etc. were taken home, and then just assumed that they forgot.

It is easy to armchair QB the situation, but seriously, like everyone keeps saying, when has a child been taken from a school? That cuts both ways - makes it seem unlikely, but also makes the school's lack of panic and TH's trust very reasonable.

 

[believe09]

Now, stepmom was last to see him. Let's speculate for a moment that she disappeared him-it was a given that she would have been seen taking him. School was in session regardless of the science fair. Let's step back and say that she took the photo of him next to the project and then she took him home or somewhere; the same can be said. It feels to me like he has to be inside of the school. Inside a closet, inside ceiling tiles...inside a locker. Somewhere inside of the school.

Has anyone sleuthed CSI episodes to see if there was a similar one? JUST speculating....mind you.

 

[believe09]

I agree with angelmom that there seems to be something lacking here in the school's system. I would love to know if the doors are alarmed the way ours are-a child choosing to leave the school would trigger the alarms at my school here. What about there?

 

[Reality Orlando]

Hiya Tara to you. No, I do not recall where the appointment thing was except in that Drood report. Then someone referred to a question asked of LE about the appointment , and LE refused to comment on it.

That's all I know.

But, does it make sense that SM would do something to the child after saying that he has an appt ? Then he turns up missing and she calls the school to ask where he is? Now that makes no sense at all.

But no family member going to the talent show makes no sense at all either.

None of it makes any sense from the school not wondering where he was, to the north, the south, the second floor,maybe more. IDK

I've seen nothing about the 18 month old daughter being with SM when she visited the school that morning, so maybe she had someone watch her while she went, but didn't have anyone to watch her during the time of the talent show. A child that age can be very disruptive during performances and maybe she thought it best not to attend for that reason.

 

[Chili Fries]

Terrific post angelmom.

The school looks like it is built into a hillside. So it could be that a 2nd floor room actually does open onto a back parking lot.

That is a very astute observation. I just took another look at the Bing Maps aerial view and the second floor is the ground floor in the back. So he could have been on the second floor and still near an exit.

 

[Pensfan]

The mom stated that she dropped him off at 8:45 am, but the school day didn’t start until 10:00 am. That leaves 1 hour and 15 minutes for something awful to happen to an unsupervised child. Did the school not explain to the parents that there would not be school until 10:00 am? (This is disturbing!)

"The school day didn't start till 10:00 a.m. that day because of the science fair."

http://www.examiner.com/x-46795-Mis...econd-grader-Kyron-Horman-missing-from-school

 

[Angel4u2Whisper2]

Now, stepmom was last to see him. Let's speculate for a moment that she disappeared him-it was a given that she would have been seen taking him. School was in session regardless of the science fair. Let's step back and say that she took the photo of him next to the project and then she took him home or somewhere; the same can be said. It feels to me like he has to be inside of the school. Inside a closet, inside ceiling tiles...inside a locker. Somewhere inside of the school.

Has anyone sleuthed CSI episodes to see if there was a similar one? JUST speculating....mind you.

The question about CSI, you must of read my mind. I asked that question a few posts back. I would sleuth it if I knew how.

 

[believe09]

So, let's say he walked straight out of the building for some reason-why? He seemed pretty happy in the science fair picture....his friends seem to describe him as happy.

 

[believe09]

The mom stated that she dropped him off at 8:45 am, but the school day didn’t start until 10:00 am. That leaves 1 hour and 15 minutes for something awful to happen to an unsupervised child. Did the school not explain to the parents that there would not be school until 10:00 am? (This is disturbing!)

"The school day didn't start till 10:00 a.m. that day because of the science fair."
http://www.examiner.com/x-46795-Mis...econd-grader-Kyron-Horman-missing-from-school

The question about CSI, you must of read my mind. I asked that question a few posts back. I would sleuth it if I knew how.

It is really disturbing to read that the school day was delayed until 10AM. That changes the picture a little for me because then perhaps the hallways would not have been teaming with people, which is what I imagined. Why was he headed to the classroom at all if all of the activity was in the science fair? Just wonderin.

I have been sleuthing CSI episodes-I am finding a few that generally fit but not well enough to post. there is a crossover CSI/Without a Trace episode that interests me but I have to head out and cant sleuth it right now...I will be back in a few hours and will dig into it then.

FWIW, prayers for Kyron. This story is really disturbing to me....

 

[Chili Fries]

Here is a view of what looks to be a second floor exit onto the parking lot.

I wonder if he ran outside trying to catch his mom but she had left already. Maybe someone offered to give him a ride to catch up with her. Really though, we could probably come up with all kinds of scenarios that led him out of the building.

 

[Calliope]

I said this before, you couldn't pay me enough to send my child to that school tomorrow. My biggest fear is that he is still in that school somewhere. I hope they have searched it with a fine tooth comb.

My fear is he wandered into that thick brush/forest next to the school... maybe looking for a frog

 

[STEADFAST]

So, let's say he walked straight out of the building for some reason-why? He seemed pretty happy in the science fair picture....his friends seem to describe him as happy.

Behind the school are vast woods. I think he's either lost in the woods or, as you suggested, somewhere inside the school. I don't think it's as likely that someone snatched him and took him to a car and even less likely that a family member murdered him in cold blood. But LE isn't ruling anyone out. At the presser, the sheriff said everyone is a POI at this point.

 

[Pensfan]

Here is a view of what looks to be a second floor exit onto the parking lot.

I wonder if he ran outside trying to catch his mom but she had left already. Maybe someone offered to give him a ride to catch up with her. Really though, we could probably come up with all kinds of scenarios that led him out of the building.

I bet this is the park that the mom on the abc comment's section stated was near the bathroom and an unsecured door. She told her daughter to never go to this bathroom alone. (Lord have mercy!)
http://abcnews.go.com/US/Media/kyro...entary-school/comments?type=story&id=10836677

Homeless people frequently sleep in the parks in my city. How about here?

 

[STEADFAST]

It is really disturbing to read that the school day was delayed until 10AM. That changes the picture a little for me because then perhaps the hallways would not have been teaming with people, which is what I imagined. Why was he headed to the classroom at all if all of the activity was in the science fair? Just wonderin.

I have been sleuthing CSI episodes-I am finding a few that generally fit but not well enough to post. there is a crossover CSI/Without a Trace episode that interests me but I have to head out and cant sleuth it right now...I will be back in a few hours and will dig into it then.

FWIW, prayers for Kyron. This story is really disturbing to me....

The school day didn't start until 10, which was also the time that roll was taken, but before that the children were put into small groups and taken by adults around the classes to look at the science fair projects. I haven't seen any clarification about whether Kyron was ever put into one of those groups.