OR - Nine killed in Umpqua Community College shooting, Roseburg, 1 Oct 2015 - #1

[Dogface]

Oh, lovely girl:

Rebecka Carnes, 18, has been identified by her stepfather as a victim in the Oregon college massacre. Carnes was studying to become a dental hygienist at the school

Carnes was a star softball player in high school. She had just began classes at UCC on September 28

In the first chaotic hours after the shooting, Rebecka's mother, Jessica Chandler, spoke to ABC News, saying she was worried for her daughter because she didn't know where she was. She later learned from Carnes’ friend that that student was taken to a hospital.

When asked what she would say to her daughter, Chandler said, ‘I would tell her that I love her, and I want her in my arms.’

​

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ead-nine-victims-confirmed.html#ixzz3nROCJG7g

​

​

Oh my gosh, this breaks my heart. THIS is what makes it "real". I don't think anyone can read those words from her mama without tearing up.

Heartbreaking, and so senseless.

I truly hope one day that the stigmas attached to each side on this can be cast aside and somehow these things can stop. I think it's so multifaceted it will be very hard, but, usually things worth achieving are never easy. As a mom myself, it hurts my heart to think of any parent dealing with the loss of their child in such a manner. As someone who owns guns, it boggles my mind that someone could use them against someone out of will and not necessity.

 

[Isabelle]

Forget the 26-year-old zero who murdered 10 innocents at Umpqua Community College on Thursday morning.jn
The one to remember is 30-year-old Chris Mintz, the student and Army vet who was shot at least five times while charging straight at the gunman in an effort to save others.
Mintz did so on the sixth birthday of his son, Tyrik.
“It’s my son’s birthday, it’s my son’s birthday,” he was heard saying as he lay wounded.
When word of Mintz’s heroism reached his kin in his native North Carolina, his cousin Derek Bourgeois was hardly surprised.
“It sounds like something he would do,” Bourgeois said.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...ber-the-hero-who-charged-straight-at-him.html

Yes, that is Chris Mintz. I found it confusing to read of him in the first sentence, then of the monster in the next paragraph without specifying which "he" that part of the post was about.

 

[Hatfield]

I have NOTHING against citizens owning guns. We own 40 plus years of collecting, Birthdays, Christmases, anniversaries and so forth. But I do think, that everyone who owns a gun, should be required to own a large metal safe. We own two. No one knows the combinations but hubby and I.

I have a large gun safe bolted to the floor and I love it.

Most all new handguns now come with its own safety lock which I think is great and helps people keep their guns locked if they cannot afford a gun safe.

 

[kalekona]

Chris Mintz???

He was the Army Vet who charged the shooter to protect others- he was shot 7 times and had both legs broken- yet pictures of him in the hospital show a big smile. A ******** page set up for him had 70,000 in only 3 hours...

 

[JLSChook]

Chris Mintz is trending on Twitter. The killer isn't.

 

[Foxfire]

<BBM & RS for Focus

BBM. Those are very horrible statistics. Wow.

Who says no one is connecting the dots? Who says the dots can't be collected without the media splashing the names and photos of these monsters everywhere? Plenty of dots are being collected and connected by actual professionals, not a morbid public. See below:

Wait. We are very concerned as a society and there has been an incredible boatload of discussions and assmeblage of data through actual research into the issue. "Dots" being connected. Is it easier to wring our hands and say we don;t understand what's happening or what the profile is or that no one cares, than to actually read the research?:

Withholding the name of the shooter in the media may win the Sheriff a few votes come election time but will do little in preventing the next mass school, mall, or highway shooting, imo. There are at least 3 active highway/interstate shooters in the US at present; CO, AZ, & MI. Copycats of serial killers and mass murderers have been around since before the 19th century in the USA. The FBI estimates between 50 & 75 serial killers active at any one time in the US. Imo, this estimate is very conservative.

RE: horrible mass murder statistics.. 'One is too many, but tragically there will be more'.. The only way to stop an evil killer with a gun is to insure that there is well trained competent armed security on campuses and other soft targets, imo. "Times they are a changin"..

Fox News' Bill O'Reilly Calls Out President Obama: Stop 'Politicizing' Oregon Shooting
http://insider.foxnews.com/2015/10/...bama-stop-politicizing-oregon-campus-shooting

 

[nomoresorrow]

BBM. Those are very horrible statistics. Wow.

To report what?:

"Uh, yes, officer? I have a cousin. He's very odd. I think he has [FILL IN THE BLANK WITH A MENTAL HEALTH OR NEUROLOGICAL ISSUE]. And he has guns!"
"Okay. has he threatened you?"
"Well, no, but he could end up being a mass shooter!"
"Did he threaten anything like that?"
"Not that I know of but, uh, he's weird!"
"In what way?"
"Well, he wears black! And he is on the internet all the time! And he's crazy. And he like guns! Also, I don't think he has any friends!"
"Yeah that describes about 500 students at MIT, and about a quarter of the on-line gaming community. What do you know about actual threats? Has he threatened to commit suicide? Or kill anyone?"
"Listen, I'm just telling you I have a bad feeling. He's weird. Do you understand? Can't you just go through his computer and see what's on there? I'm sure he has made threats on there."
"No ma'am. That's against the law."
"Can't you take away his guns?"
"No ma'am, we can't. Unless he is a felon or has threatened to do harm to himself or others, he has a right to possess weapons. There are millions of people with mental illness in the nation who are odd and have weapons and most don't hurt anyone. Just keep an eye out and if he threatens harm to himself or others, let us know."

To be clear, I wasn't suggesting that someone who has little-to-know personal or intimate knowledge of an individual contact LE, out of concern, based on any of the following:
Personality oddities or quirkiness
Style of clothing
Lack of socialization/socialization skills
Amount of internet usage

 

[SCHMAE]

Sorry I do not have a link for this but several places today I saw the term " 40th school shooting in 2015 '' and '' 141st since Sandy Hook'' . I found those numbers unbelievable so I did some research. It will be no surprise to any of you that the media is tainting this headline . First off , here is the link to the 141 ' school shootings' since Sandy Hook.
http://everytown.org/article/schoolshootings/
I went through this list and pulled out just a very few random events and googled them to learn more about these' school shooting ' events since I had no recollection of hearing on the news about a school shooting every FIVE DAYS ( which is how frequently there would have to be one for 141 in less than 2 yrs ) . Did anyone else remember hearing about a school shooting every 5 days? We're all news junkies so we hear a lot of news others do not. You'd think we would have caught at least some of those.

Here is what I found ( again random selection off the list at above link )

10. 2/13/2013 San Leandro, CA Hillside Elementary School link http://abc7news.com/archive/8992648/
''Investigators in the East Bay say they have leads, but no suspects, yet in the murder of a 19-year-old Laney College student. Travion Foster was shot and killed just before 9 p.m. Wednesday in the field behind Hillside Elementary School.'' Why is this classified as a ' school shooting' ?

20. 8/15/2013 Clarksville, TN Northwest High School link http://clarksvillenow.com/local/police-investigation-at-northwest-high-school/
''A body was discovered on school property early Thursday and police investigators were on the scene since around 6 a.m. after receiving a call of shots being fired in the area. Clarksville Police Sgt. Charles Gill stated, “It appears that this has no involvement with any high school staff or students.”

46. 1/31/2014 Phoenix, AZ Cesar Chavez High School link http://www.azcentral.com/story/news...sts-chavez-high-school-shooting-abrk/7264833/
''An argument over turf and respect between two rival gangs escalated to what police now describe as a "gun battle" in January at Cesar Chavez High School in Phoenix.''' ( in the video, reporter says NONE of the gunmen were students or staff at the school )

65. 5/3/2014 Everett, WA Horizon Elementary School link http://myeverettnews.com/2014/05/03...mentary-basketball-court-casino-road-everett/
''Major Crimes detectives are investigating a weekend shooting at a local elementary which injured a teen.''' "" Officers were told a small group of teenagers were playing basketball when a group of 15-20 males in their late-teens came to the court. A verbal argument turned physical and a teen from the original group playing basketball was shot. """


Anyway, I implore you before repeating the 141 number to google just a random handful of these cases to see how absolutely distorted the number is. Yes, there is a very real problem with gun violence and schools. Inflating the numbers makes the media look silly and us, the citizens, look like barbarians.

 

[human]

I think it is possible America can change. Look at gay rights? Who would have ever predicted that?

Someday Americans will say living in fear is not living at all and we will deal with this issue. How many more will die? Who knows.

I wish people would be willing to invest in smaller class sizes and have parnting classes and lots of other things to work on these issues of people and their need for connection and validation . It is possible. We just have to want to do it. You know, like put people on the moon. We focused and did it.

 

[bluesneakers]

Sorry I do not have a link for this but several places today I saw the term " 40th school shooting in 2015 '' and '' 141st since Sandy Hook'' . I found those numbers unbelievable so I did some research. It will be no surprise to any of you that the media is tainting this headline . First off , here is the link to the 141 ' school shootings' since Sandy Hook.
http://everytown.org/article/schoolshootings/
I went through this list and pulled out just a very few random events and googled them to learn more about these' school shooting ' events since I had no recollection of hearing on the news about a school shooting every FIVE DAYS ( which is how frequently there would have to be one for 141 in less than 2 yrs ) . Did anyone else remember hearing about a school shooting every 5 days? We're all news junkies so we hear a lot of news others do not. You'd think we would have caught at least some of those.

Here is what I found ( again random selection off the list at above link )

10. 2/13/2013 San Leandro, CA Hillside Elementary School link http://abc7news.com/archive/8992648/
''Investigators in the East Bay say they have leads, but no suspects, yet in the murder of a 19-year-old Laney College student. Travion Foster was shot and killed just before 9 p.m. Wednesday in the field behind Hillside Elementary School.'' Why is this classified as a ' school shooting' ?

20. 8/15/2013 Clarksville, TN Northwest High School link http://clarksvillenow.com/local/police-investigation-at-northwest-high-school/
''A body was discovered on school property early Thursday and police investigators were on the scene since around 6 a.m. after receiving a call of shots being fired in the area. Clarksville Police Sgt. Charles Gill stated, “It appears that this has no involvement with any high school staff or students.”

46. 1/31/2014 Phoenix, AZ Cesar Chavez High School link http://www.azcentral.com/story/news...sts-chavez-high-school-shooting-abrk/7264833/
''An argument over turf and respect between two rival gangs escalated to what police now describe as a "gun battle" in January at Cesar Chavez High School in Phoenix.''' ( in the video, reporter says NONE of the gunmen were students or staff at the school )

65. 5/3/2014 Everett, WA Horizon Elementary School link http://myeverettnews.com/2014/05/03...mentary-basketball-court-casino-road-everett/
''Major Crimes detectives are investigating a weekend shooting at a local elementary which injured a teen.''' "" Officers were told a small group of teenagers were playing basketball when a group of 15-20 males in their late-teens came to the court. A verbal argument turned physical and a teen from the original group playing basketball was shot. """


Anyway, I implore you before repeating the 141 number to google just a random handful of these cases to see how absolutely distorted the number is. Yes, there is a very real problem with gun violence and schools. Inflating the numbers makes the media look silly and us, the citizens, look like barbarians.

I agree with this definition and think 142 is the accurate count:

"Data: Incidents were classified as school shootings when a firearm was discharged inside a school building or on school or campus grounds, as documented by the press or confirmed through further inquiries with law enforcement. Incidents in which guns were brought into schools but not fired, or were fired off school grounds after having been possessed in schools, were not included."

1. 1/08/2013 Fort Myers, FL Apostolic Revival Center Christian School K-12

...... all the way to .....

142. 10/1/2015 Roseburg, OR Umpqua Community College College

http://everytown.org/article/schoolshootings/

No sense in denying it.

 

[human]

Sorry I do not have a link for this but several places today I saw the term " 40th school shooting in 2015 '' and '' 141st since Sandy Hook'' . I found those numbers unbelievable so I did some research. It will be no surprise to any of you that the media is tainting this headline . First off , here is the link to the 141 ' school shootings' since Sandy Hook.
http://everytown.org/article/schoolshootings/
I went through this list and pulled out just a very few random events and googled them to learn more about these' school shooting ' events since I had no recollection of hearing on the news about a school shooting every FIVE DAYS ( which is how frequently there would have to be one for 141 in less than 2 yrs ) . Did anyone else remember hearing about a school shooting every 5 days? We're all news junkies so we hear a lot of news others do not. You'd think we would have caught at least some of those.

Here is what I found ( again random selection off the list at above link )

10. 2/13/2013 San Leandro, CA Hillside Elementary School link http://abc7news.com/archive/8992648/
''Investigators in the East Bay say they have leads, but no suspects, yet in the murder of a 19-year-old Laney College student. Travion Foster was shot and killed just before 9 p.m. Wednesday in the field behind Hillside Elementary School.'' Why is this classified as a ' school shooting' ?

20. 8/15/2013 Clarksville, TN Northwest High School link http://clarksvillenow.com/local/police-investigation-at-northwest-high-school/
''A body was discovered on school property early Thursday and police investigators were on the scene since around 6 a.m. after receiving a call of shots being fired in the area. Clarksville Police Sgt. Charles Gill stated, &#8220;It appears that this has no involvement with any high school staff or students.&#8221;

46. 1/31/2014 Phoenix, AZ Cesar Chavez High School link http://www.azcentral.com/story/news...sts-chavez-high-school-shooting-abrk/7264833/
''An argument over turf and respect between two rival gangs escalated to what police now describe as a "gun battle" in January at Cesar Chavez High School in Phoenix.''' ( in the video, reporter says NONE of the gunmen were students or staff at the school )

65. 5/3/2014 Everett, WA Horizon Elementary School link http://myeverettnews.com/2014/05/03...mentary-basketball-court-casino-road-everett/
''Major Crimes detectives are investigating a weekend shooting at a local elementary which injured a teen.''' "" Officers were told a small group of teenagers were playing basketball when a group of 15-20 males in their late-teens came to the court. A verbal argument turned physical and a teen from the original group playing basketball was shot. """


Anyway, I implore you before repeating the 141 number to google just a random handful of these cases to see how absolutely distorted the number is. Yes, there is a very real problem with gun violence and schools. Inflating the numbers makes the media look silly and us, the citizens, look like barbarians.

If my child was there, I would be freaked out. Just because it is not a student that is dead, it is right at the school. When I travel, people ask me what is wrong with America?

 

[SCHMAE]

I agree with this definition and think 142 is the accurate count:

"Data: Incidents were classified as school shootings when a firearm was discharged inside a school building or on school or campus grounds, as documented by the press or confirmed through further inquiries with law enforcement. Incidents in which guns were brought into schools but not fired, or were fired off school grounds after having been possessed in schools, were not included."

1. 1/08/2013 Fort Myers, FL Apostolic Revival Center Christian School K-12

...... all the way to .....

142. 10/1/2015 Roseburg, OR Umpqua Community College College

http://everytown.org/article/schoolshootings/

No sense in denying it.

In one of those cases in the list of 141 there was a hit and run driver that LE chased , he crashed and a footchase followed that ended up on school grounds. The term school shooting sounds like what happened yesterday, a gunman goes into school to shoot students and a huge majority of the ones listed are random criminals who happened to be on school grounds outside in parking lots, playground areas, etc.

 

[bluesneakers]

In one of those cases in the list of 141 there was a hit and run driver that LE chased , he crashed and a footchase followed that ended up on school grounds. The term school shooting sounds like what happened yesterday, a gunman goes into school to shoot students and a huge majority of the ones listed are random criminals who happened to be on school grounds outside in parking lots, playground areas, etc.

I bolded what I believe the definition they used is. It works for me.

Maybe we need subcategories? Which is just another sad comment on life in America. So many types of school shootings we need special labels to distinguish.

 

[SCHMAE]

I bolded what I believe the definition they used is. It works for me.

Maybe we need subcategories? Which is just another sad comment on life in America. So many types of school shootings we need special labels to distinguish.

'' as documented by the press'' is where things get murky. The press knows if they throw the word ' school ' into the report, it will get a lot more attention. Sad day...

 

[human]

I bolded what I believe the definition they used is. It works for me.

Maybe we need subcategories? Which is just another sad comment on life in America. So many types of school shootings we need special labels to distinguish.

And we are happy that the shooting was on school grounds and people died but at least they weren't students.

That frog is boiling away in the pot

 

[Fairy1]

I have NOTHING against citizens owning guns. We own 40 plus years of collecting, Birthdays, Christmases, anniversaries and so forth. But I do think, that everyone who owns a gun, should be required to own a large metal safe. We own two. No one knows the combinations but hubby and I.

I'm not a gun owner so I'm hoping you or other gun owners can help me to understand this. If your guns are locked up, how are you going to get to them in a split second should you ever need to?

Also, the suggestion that teachers/professors be armed in the classroom always seems to come up after these horrific incidents. I have to wonder how that would have prevented this latest tragedy. If you're teaching your class and some murderous madman bursts into your classroom with his weapon at the ready and intent on killing you, how is your own weapon going to stop him? Teaching a class and attending school are behaviors not normally viewed as dangerous, so the majority of us would never begin our days thinking that something like this is going to happen and we better have our weapons ready.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I'm not a gun owner so I'm hoping you or other gun owners can help me to understand this. If your guns are locked up, how are you going to get to them in a split second should you ever need to?

Also, the suggestion that teachers/professors be armed in the classroom always seems to come up after these horrific incidents. I have to wonder how that would have prevented this latest tragedy. If you're teaching your class and some murderous madman bursts into your classroom with his weapon at the ready and intent on killing you, how is your own weapon going to stop him? Teaching a class and attending school are behaviors not normally viewed as dangerous, so the majority of us would never begin our days thinking that something like this is going to happen and we better have our weapons ready.

Because you only need a split second when he is not focused on you and he is gone.
I don't know if I believe in teachers being armed to be armed, But I don't have an issue with a teacher with a license carrying at school. I wish that colleges were eligible to be declared a small city and have a true police force of their own.

 

[Fairy1]

Because you only need a split second when he is not focused on you and he is gone.
I don't know if I believe in teachers being armed to be armed, But I don't have an issue with a teacher with a license carrying at school. I wish that colleges were eligible to be declared a small city and have a true police force of their own.

So, how much time will you have when he kicks in your door and shoots you dead?

 

[Dogface]

I'm not a gun owner so I'm hoping you or other gun owners can help me to understand this. If your guns are locked up, how are you going to get to them in a split second should you ever need to?

Also, the suggestion that teachers/professors be armed in the classroom always seems to come up after these horrific incidents. I have to wonder how that would have prevented this latest tragedy. If you're teaching your class and some murderous madman bursts into your classroom with his weapon at the ready and intent on killing you, how is your own weapon going to stop him? Teaching a class and attending school are behaviors not normally viewed as dangerous, so the majority of us would never begin our days thinking that something like this is going to happen and we better have our weapons ready.

Well for me, we have four biometric safes throughout our house. I put my hand on it and it opens within seconds. I also have a highly trained 100lb Doberman to buy me time.

I think for schools it's a bit more complicated, but I think securing campuses and having more security, possibly having trained members of faculty who are armed and permitting college students to carry could help.

 

[KaaBoom]

Homeland Security and CIA claim they stop attacks all the time.

"gun roaming hoardes" ? Seriously?

It seems to me it is always just a single mentally unstable idiot OR a terrorist that does this sort of thing.

Those single mentally unstable terrorists are mass murdering people sever times a day in the US. Students can't go to school without having to worry about homicidal maniacs, armed with semiautomatic weapons busting into their classrooms and murdering them. Yes, I call them gun roaming hoards. It doesn't happen anywhere else in the world except maybe a few third world banana republics.