PA PA - Kortne Ciera Stouffer, 21, Palmyra, 29 July 2012 - #4

[Chanler]

I think that there is a working assumption here and elsewhere that unless law enforcement releases all its leads, they are not doing their job.

Furthermore, I think that we assume that homicide cases, like CSI cases, are solved in relatively brief periods and if they aren't, the police are at fault.

Actually, thousands and thousands and thousands of murders remain unsolved year after year. (Since 1980, that toll is more than 200,000.)

In this case, with the convergence of local and state investigators, I think that it is reasonable to assume that forensics were done in the apartment building that have not opened that possibility of a crime scene there.

On the other hand, I think that the absence of a body and, as far as we know, of sightings of Kortne outside the house, leave the investigation at a relative impasse in terms of leads that would benefit from public appeals.

 

[Meems]

Kortne .. I think about you every day .. I check your moms facebook every day for news .. so far .. nothing but frustration and heartache. I wonder about so many things. I wonder why there have been no public searches to look for you .. I wonder why your parents attorney is not issuing any media updates .. I wonder why the police are not issuing updates .. I wonder why the media is not all over your disappearance trying to keep the pot stirred. I wonder why everything is so hush hush about you being gone .. I have been to several events in your honor and nothing is ever spoken about the investigation .. by no one .. are people afraid to ask as I am .. or .. is it just not open for discussion..period? I wonder why local businesses are so hesitant to get involved with promoting fundraiser type awareness events to keep your face fresh .. I've been asking .. Are they afraid of LE? Do they think it'd be bad for business? Do they just not want to get "involved" .. if so .. why? (I never seem to get a straight answer from any of them) I wonder why they majority of Central Pennsylvania just seems to be ok with you being gone? I know your parents are frantic but why are they not screaming to every news source to please give you a mention? (or are they and are being denied .. If so .. why?) I wonder why your employers/former employers have not come forward and done anything in your honor .. at the very least it would be some sort of advertising for them (in a disturbing way to say the least). I wonder why your friends are not pulling together and searching on weekends or putting together some fundraisers .. most seem to be orchestrated by your family and they are already so overwhelmed with you being gone. So many things just seem so out of place with your case .. I can't pinpoint just one .. but things just don't seem right .. It's too quiet .. The "day" you went missing was filled with so many weird events, so many players .. yet no one knows anything? My mind can't comprehend you had a "chance meeting with a stranger" after all that drama. After learning some things .. I still hold out hope that you just got so frustrated with life in general and walked away not realizing the pain everyone is feeling back home .. Perhaps thinking they are so involved in their lives .. they might not notice you are gone .. Boy are you in for a surprise when you come back .. You are missed .. You are loved.

I hold on to this hope .. because it doesn't seem like just you being gone is enough for anyone to provide any answers to these things I wonder about. No one is talking .. No one ..

 

[cluciano63]

I know Kortne is an adult, but LE in Colorado is putting on a clinic on how to deal with a missing child, (Jessica Ridgeway) and talk to the public and media, keeping them as informed as possible about progress, etc...and making actual progress, as well as asking for help from the public.

I don't expect any LE agency to tell me their evidence or POI's etc. but I do expect them to surface once in a while to tell the public that Kortne has not been forgotten. Same with Holly Bobo, Katelyn Markham, etc. etc.

 

[scorekeeper]

Kortne .. I think about you every day .. I check your moms facebook every day for news .. so far .. nothing but frustration and heartache. I wonder about so many things. I wonder why there have been no public searches to look for you .. I wonder why your parents attorney is not issuing any media updates .. I wonder why the police are not issuing updates .. I wonder why the media is not all over your disappearance trying to keep the pot stirred. I wonder why everything is so hush hush about you being gone .. I have been to several events in your honor and nothing is ever spoken about the investigation .. by no one .. are people afraid to ask as I am .. or .. is it just not open for discussion..period? I wonder why local businesses are so hesitant to get involved with promoting fundraiser type awareness events to keep your face fresh .. I've been asking .. Are they afraid of LE? Do they think it'd be bad for business? Do they just not want to get "involved" .. if so .. why? (I never seem to get a straight answer from any of them) I wonder why they majority of Central Pennsylvania just seems to be ok with you being gone? I know your parents are frantic but why are they not screaming to every news source to please give you a mention? (or are they and are being denied .. If so .. why?) I wonder why your employers/former employers have not come forward and done anything in your honor .. at the very least it would be some sort of advertising for them (in a disturbing way to say the least). I wonder why your friends are not pulling together and searching on weekends or putting together some fundraisers .. most seem to be orchestrated by your family and they are already so overwhelmed with you being gone. So many things just seem so out of place with your case .. I can't pinpoint just one .. but things just don't seem right .. It's too quiet .. The "day" you went missing was filled with so many weird events, so many players .. yet no one knows anything? My mind can't comprehend you had a "chance meeting with a stranger" after all that drama. After learning some things .. I still hold out hope that you just got so frustrated with life in general and walked away not realizing the pain everyone is feeling back home .. Perhaps thinking they are so involved in their lives .. they might not notice you are gone .. Boy are you in for a surprise when you come back .. You are missed .. You are loved.

I hold on to this hope .. because it doesn't seem like just you being gone is enough for anyone to provide any answers to these things I wonder about. No one is talking .. No one ..

Meems,

You are a true friend to Kortne and one she is lucky to have. I don't know if you know her personally, but you care about her now and that matters a lot. Please continue to hound local news and police and show your yard sign and bumper sticker proud - you never know, someone may remember seeing her!

For some reason this world today is so fast paced and if you aren't around your friends all the time, they seem to forget you in a couple of weeks. It seems we have become "the move onto something else society".

(((Meems)))

Kortne, there are people who care about you!! Please let someone know you are okay.

 

[Chanler]

I know Kortne is an adult, but LE in Colorado is putting on a clinic on how to deal with a missing child, (Jessica Ridgeway) and talk to the public and media, keeping them as informed as possible about progress, etc...and making actual progress, as well as asking for help from the public.

I don't expect any LE agency to tell me their evidence or POI's etc. but I do expect them to surface once in a while to tell the public that Kortne has not been forgotten. Same with Holly Bobo, Katelyn Markham, etc. etc.

Hi, CLuciano63. As you note, Kortne is an adult, not a young child. A kidnapped child raises different possibilities than a missing woman.

In addition, the most significant breakthroughs in the case so far have been made thanks to the help of people not connected to law enforcement. The backpack was found by someone who had heard about the girl because of the Amber Alert, which almost always generate high media coverage. The body itself was found by sanitation men in the routine act of collecting refuse. Even the search parties which turned up nothing consisted of hundreds of non-LE men and women.

 

[cluciano63]

Hi, CLuciano63. As you note, Kortne is an adult, not a young child. A kidnapped child raises different possibilities than a missing woman.

In addition, the most significant breakthroughs in the case so far have been made thanks to the help of people not connected to law enforcement. The backpack was found by someone who had heard about the girl because of the Amber Alert, which almost always generate high media coverage. The body itself was found by sanitation men in the routine act of collecting refuse. Even the search parties which turned up nothing consisted of hundreds of non-LE men and women.

Yes, I understand all of the differences. But LE did allude to a "kidnapping" on an initial report re:Kortne. If their thoughts have changed, I wish they would say so, and if not, then a crime has been committed and it just seems as though very few people are concerned.

 

[ktgirl]

Where are you, Kortne?

 

[Chanler]

Yes, I understand all of the differences. But LE did allude to a "kidnapping" on an initial report re:Kortne. If their thoughts have changed, I wish they would say so, and if not, then a crime has been committed and it just seems as though very few people are concerned.

Hi, CLuciano63. Police alluded to a possible kidnapping in the warrant that was unsealed. This was the legal justification for the search warrant.

I don't understand what announcement of change of "their thoughts" would advance the case now. Statistically, it highly probable that she has been killed, but it is very marginally possible that she is still alive, held captive or even (much, much more improbably) hiding out somewhere.

 

[cluciano63]

Hi, CLuciano63. Police alluded to a possible kidnapping in the warrant that was unsealed. This was the legal justification for the search warrant.

I don't understand what announcement of change of "their thoughts" would advance the case now. Statistically, it highly probable that she has been killed, but it is very marginally possible that she is still alive, held captive or even (much, much more improbably) hiding out somewhere.

It is starting to look as though nothing will advance this case. An acknowledgement from LE every month or two that they are working on it, that is all I am wishing for...

 

[Chanler]

It is starting to look as though nothing will advance this case. An acknowledgement from LE every month or two that they are working on it, that is all I am wishing for...

Hi, CLuciano63. Thanks for your quick response. I think that you are are right: Several law enforcement agencies are working on it, but the case will not be advanced without a body, new forensic evidence, or a confession. (It's possible, of course, that LE is focusing on one or several people, but announcing that would almost certainly do more harm than good.)

The most likely advance will be achieved with the discovery of the body, something that doesn't require the finder to know anything about the case. In the Jessica Ridgeway case, which was previously alluded to, more than 800 volunteers in just a single search for her body. I don't know the area, but I can imagine that such a search would attract both print or TV media.

 

[StacyMarie83]

I don't understand how they are supposed to get new evidence or a confession when the perp is out there and it seems like no one even cares, including LE. I'm w/ CLuciano63 on this one! There could be a murderer on the streets and EVERY woman (and man frankly) should be scared that they could be next! I'm hoping the silence is an investigation in progress (since the fam. attorney is quiet as well), but I'm starting to doubt that. I honestly think it has to do w/ the last person that was supposed to be checking on Kortne, the officer!

Mickey Shunick was an adult and while the police didn't know much, if anything (at the beginning) and they may have been underinformed--they were there and they were telling the public what they could. That town had a murderer walking free on the streets for a long time, I would hate to live in PA right now b/c they are in the same situation, w/ lackluster LE IMO

 

[looks like rain]

I don't understand this wall of silence that is surrounding Kortne's disappearance. This family needs help from a PI or someone other than who is supposed to be investigating her disappearance. It doesn't seem like anyone is at this point. This is not right.

I wish I could help!

 

[Money Girl]

Maybe the Westminster CO police department will come to Palmyra and show them how to do their job.

 

[Chanler]

Maybe the Westminster CO police department will come to Palmyra and show them how to do their job.

Palmyra is in Lebanon County, not Westminster County. This case is being investigated by the Palmyra Police Department, the Lebanon County Detective Bureau, the Lebanon County District Attorney's Office, and the Pennsylvania State Police.

Not making public announcements or enabling leaks about an ongoing investigation is not the equivalent of not investigating.

To me, claiming that there is a "wall of silence" assumes that residents of that community can be activated only by local enforcement. This is simply not true.

 

[Chanler]

I don't understand how they are supposed to get new evidence or a confession when the perp is out there and it seems like no one even cares, including LE. I'm w/ CLuciano63 on this one! There could be a murderer on the streets and EVERY woman (and man frankly) should be scared that they could be next! I'm hoping the silence is an investigation in progress (since the fam. attorney is quiet as well), but I'm starting to doubt that. I honestly think it has to do w/ the last person that was supposed to be checking on Kortne, the officer!

Mickey Shunick was an adult and while the police didn't know much, if anything (at the beginning) and they may have been underinformed--they were there and they were telling the public what they could. That town had a murderer walking free on the streets for a long time, I would hate to live in PA right now b/c they are in the same situation, w/ lackluster LE IMO

The parallel with Mickey Shunick doesn't really fit. Her bike was known to be missing and was found soon after her disappearance. A video of Shunick on that bike the day she was killed showed a vehicle that police were able to link with her killer, a registered sex offender.

In this case, there is no bike and there seems to be no witnesses, electronic or otherwise.

 

[reedus23]

Palmyra is in Lebanon County, not Westminster County. This case is being investigated by the Palmyra Police Department, the Lebanon County Detective Bureau, the Lebanon County District Attorney's Office, and the Pennsylvania State Police.

Not making public announcements or enabling leaks about an ongoing investigation is not the equivalent of not investigating.

To me, claiming that there is a "wall of silence" assumes that residents of that community can be activated only by local enforcement. This is simply not true.

Chanler, do you think it is the most effective manner to handle a case such as this? I know LE is under no obligation to pass any information along, but sometimes I wonder if playing it so "close to the vest" is always the best approach. Just curious to hear your thoughts not so much on whether or not silence means nothing is being done, but if silence is the best approach. TIA

 

[cluciano63]

The reason I do not like the silence in this particular case has to do with an LEO being one of the very last people to see her. The complete silence is troubling.

 

[jcinquisitive]

I don't understand this wall of silence that is surrounding Kortne's disappearance. This family needs help from a PI or someone other than who is supposed to be investigating her disappearance. It doesn't seem like anyone is at this point. This is not right.

I wish I could help!

The parents had enough time pass that they should be considering courses of action with a clear head now. They are being as closed mouth as LE, very very tight lipped. Yet Wendy expresses discouragement. Apparently the parents themselves dont feel they need help from a PI or someone else. Maybe they DO have a PI and the public doesnt know. Strangest small town case of a missing person ive ever heard of.

 

[Money Girl]

Palmyra is in Lebanon County, not Westminster County. This case is being investigated by the Palmyra Police Department, the Lebanon County Detective Bureau, the Lebanon County District Attorney's Office, and the Pennsylvania State Police.

Not making public announcements or enabling leaks about an ongoing investigation is not the equivalent of not investigating.

To me, claiming that there is a "wall of silence" assumes that residents of that community can be activated only by local enforcement. This is simply not true.

I was referring to the Westminster, Colorado, police department.

 

[bessie]

The parallel with Mickey Shunick doesn't really fit. Her bike was known to be missing and was found soon after her disappearance. A video of Shunick on that bike the day she was killed showed a vehicle that police were able to link with her killer, a registered sex offender.

In this case, there is no bike and there seems to be no witnesses, electronic or otherwise.

That's true, and other than asking the public for help to ID the driver of the truck, LE had little else to say. It was the community, led by Mickey's family and friends, who kept her case in the spotlight. But the entire time, LE and PI's were working in the background.