Peru - Stephany Flores, 21, murdered in Lima hotel room, 30 May 2010 #18

[Sanny]

attached ...

I saw that when I googled the bottle that was in the photo....

bottle was blue and had more printing on the front......

I wonder what it was?

 

[hollyblue]

I am beginning to see van der Sloot as a loner and complete fraud who
may not know what happened to Natalie! But he would use it as long as
he could because in reality he has nothing else. I think 99.9% of everything that comes out of his head is a lie and worse. He is a very disturbed fellow who has been WITHOUT ANY TANGIBLE SUPPORT for years. He's bad at poker. (Would you pay to get advice from him about
gambling?) I cant see friends or criminals supporting him in any way who would expect an actual return-in-kind. Sure has had lots of transient friends but so do fish in the sea. Its amazing to me he chose "my private life" as his trigger for killing Stephanie .... he has no private life, he has no LIFE! He's a joke. He just happens to be big and could kill or maime you
if you are half his size .... that's his one claim to fame. He's a monster.
And he knows 'he's full of s____.'

I think his father and his father's buddies disposed of Natalie and nobody
told him where or how - they knew Joran was incapable of dealing with
anything. His psychological evaluation says he has only an average IQ
with 'hints' of anything better but unsustainable due to his emotional
overlay.

That's Joran.

What I find disturbing--or rather mind boggling, is when he started on his rampage of telling stories regarding NH's demise(s) and being paid...why didn't the parents reel him in then? Totally incorrigible and uncontrollable?

 

[Sanny]

Greats Van Sustren

]

Thanks, where the heck was my brain? It's been working overtime here so I just couldn't think of Greta at all.

Now I can rest easy. LOL

 

[Unreals]

"Coincidence" is an inappropriate term for media, hotel or LE underling speculation prior to the release of forensic evidence. It wasn't forensics changing the story. And even if it was forensics changing their opinion, the idea that changing "evidence" (speculation) is proof of a conspiracy is a non-sequitur. One does not evince the other.

Last year I spent a week at a Port A mega condo complex on the beach that had maid service. I asked not to have maid service and it was honored. No mystery at all, not to mention the hotel reviews that say this is common at that hotel without asking. Not all countries have the same hotel service Americans do, and even when they do, you can waive the services.

Nor does lack of hotel service evince a conspiracy. It's just lack of service or bad service, or bad business, but none of these point to a conspiracy. It's like saying that because the air conditioner in the hotel wasn't working, the murder was obviously a conspiracy.

That is, it may have been a conspiracy, but so far, nothing presented points to a conspiracy. It just points to human error, cultural differences or bad customer service. In fact, there is a mountain of evidence to the contrary, not the least of which is JVS's recent implications that it was a conspiracy. If JVS says something, that alone is extremely strong evidence against the proposition in and of itself.

Also, it's a very presumptuous statement to say that most people think conspiracies are illogical. Every parent becomes a master conspirator while raising kids, starting with the Tooth Fairy & Santa. It's not that we cannot "think outside the box" as you believe you can, it's just that there's no evidence inside or outside the box that points to conspiracy. And "no evidence" of a conspiracy does not point to a conspiracy either ;-).

Good point about the conspiracy we all engage in regarding the Tooth Fairy and Santa Claus (not to mention the Easter Bunny). I do think, however, that even more people are predisposed to poo-poo "conspiracy theories" automatically as there are those, like myself, who are predisposed to believe in them. I believe this is because those same mainstream journalists I've been criticizing all dismiss them out of hand, as do academics and all the most "respectable" people.

As I've noted, I understand that Joran has no credibility, so it is unlikely very many people are going to accept a conspiracy theory emanating from him. We'll just have to disagree for now, and wait and see what happens. Whatever else, we should all acknowledge that this case just keeps getting more interesting.

 

[Kimmer]

IIRC the only papers that we saw JVS sign were when he was first being checked in to Peru and officially charged with Murder, this is when he asked about his rights, also during that video you can see him counting out the money that he had along with a few other items...The booklet of business cards etc...This is also when they showed him his laptop...They had him sign what I think is his booking papers and then did a health check on him....I would imagine that once the Judge rules on the confession that will then be released to the public, I can't wait to see that video as well and him having an attorney and an interpreter I don't think there is anyway he can weasel of of this, They have tape recorders all over Peru, so to even say the FBI planted the cameras outside his room is just bull to me....If you can prove those are true statements with evidence to back it up I will be willing to look at it, but I truly do not believe that such evidence even exists.

 

[LinasK]

I am really glad for you that you didn't experience the level pain that I witnessed in the passer-by that I mentioned in my post. Her foot was at a most ''unnatural angle to her ankle'' (makes me feel uccky thinking of it). She was talking and then very much unable to speak and went totally white. I am glad that you were ok.

I will say that my ankle was at an unnatural angle at first (foot in extension position, i.e. hanging down). The paramedics put it into a temporary splint until I got to the E.R. It was still 3 days before I received my first cast at my Orthopedist's visit. He slowly changed the angle back to normal over the course of 8 weeks with re-casting it.

 

[Sanny]

What I find disturbing--or rather mind boggling, is when he started on his rampage of telling stories regarding NH's demise(s) and being paid...why didn't the parents reel him in then? Totally incorrigible and uncontrollable?

Why didn't they reel him in? Because of his violent, uncontrollable temper.

I'm sure they've experienced it many times over.....his wrath must've come down on their heads often. Just look at the abuse he did to his younger brother?

They should've checked him into a facility then but they moved him to his own private quarters. That was their way of dealing with him.

Out of sight out of mind, but that only gave him time to do just what he wanted to do with no one censoring his actions.
IMO

 

[FLNY]

I am thinking that picture 15, might be the blood in the hallway.

http://www.cbsnews.com/2300-504083_162-10003848-15.html?tag=page;previous

Crime Scen Pic #16 shows the hallway as being uncarpeted. I thought the evidence marker 'U' in this drawing perhaps indicated the blood in the hallway.

 

[georger]

Seems like there was a lot of blood in the room and therefore, I suppose it could have been on his bag which maybe brushed against a wall. Wouldn't matter which hallway it was then.

Another poster thought shoes spread it ... judging from sheets and the large floor stain, the major bleedout appears to be in the cranial area ...

Im looking for a direction of travel for the blood drops on the shoes - attached.

 

[Sanny]

Calling it a night WS'ers.....

Will check in tomorrow, same time same station......

 

[Unreals]

What I find disturbing--or rather mind boggling, is when he started on his rampage of telling stories regarding NH's demise(s) and being paid...why didn't the parents reel him in then? Totally incorrigible and uncontrollable?

I've been told that there is no evidence of conspiracy. Now we have you posting that Paulus and his "buddies" disposed of Natalee's body. What possible evidence do you have in this regard?

Others are now postulating a very Hollywoodesque motive for Joran- he despises women. This is, of course, in contrast to the numerous snide references in the media to him as the "Dutch playboy." It also is in contradiction to the many media reports at the time of Natalee's disappearance, which tended to portray Joran as a popular kid who easily attracted females.

I don't think any conspiracy theory that has been postulated is more absurd than these pseudo-Dr. Phil-like, pop psychological assessments that are proferred every day on this forum (and others), but more imporantly on national "news" programs, by allegedly ethical professionals. We're all speculating, and my speculation leads towards conspiracy.

 

[Kimmer]

I've been told that there is no evidence of conspiracy

. Now we have you posting that Paulus and his "buddies" disposed of Natalee's body. What possible evidence do you have in this regard?

Others are now postulating a very Hollywoodesque motive for Joran- he despises women. This is, of course, in contrast to the numerous snide references in the media to him as the "Dutch playboy." It also is in contradiction to the many media reports at the time of Natalee's disappearance, which tended to portray Joran as a popular kid who easily attracted females.

I don't think any conspiracy theory that has been postulated is more absurd than these pseudo-Dr. Phil-like, pop psychological assessments that are proferred every day on this forum (and others), but more imporantly on national "news" programs, by allegedly ethical professionals. We're all speculating, and my speculation leads towards conspiracy.

You first sentence says it all there is no evidence therefore there is no conspiracy.

 

[marikesh]

So when she never left the room for three days, no one thought to check on the room, and the status of this well known woman?

I think it would be easily enough forgotten especially when the staff have many rooms, many patrons and several floors to think of, and that they may not have been conspiracy theorists just thinking of room 309 continuously. jmho.

 

[newone]

Does anyone know if JVDS and his lawyer have to attend the Jurist's decision regarding the HC writ on Wednesday?

 

[georger]

So when she never left the room for three days, no one thought to check on the room, and the status of this well known woman?

very shortly they or somebody would have (as we know).

 

[FLNY]

Don't we have video (the only video that shows him saying anything during this, to my knowledge) of Joran looking confused and asking the authorities, "I'm only saying that I understand my rights, correct?"

If so, that seems to be a pretty strong indication that he was being misled about what he was signing.

That video is of when he was being official transferred to the Peruvian LE....NOT when he was signing his confession!

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Why didn't they reel him in? Because of his violent, uncontrollable temper.

I'm sure they've experienced it many times over.....his wrath must've come down on their heads often. Just look at the abuse he did to his younger brother?

They should've checked him into a facility then but they moved him to his own private quarters. That was their way of dealing with him.

Out of sight out of mind, but that only gave him time to do just what he wanted to do with no one censoring his actions.
IMO

Exactly. Look at who he victimised in the household - the family dog, and his youngest brother... i.e. the most loved, and the most vulnerable. They all must have been devastated when these two incidents occurred..well, everyone except Joran of course. I'm sure they were afraid of him, of what would happen if they pushed him / confronted him. Who else would he harm? (Well, sadly, I guess we know don't we?)

So this is how they dealt with Joran, first they banished him to the 'guest house' in the garden. After Natalee, he was sent to the Netherlands for school, then (after he was asked to leave), they sent him to Thailand.

Far, far away.

I definitely have issue with the fact that more wasn't done to deal with his violence. I also think the officials in Aruba should have been informed by his parents of his violent past.

Let his story be a lesson.

 

[georger]

I saw that when I googled the bottle that was in the photo....

bottle was blue and had more printing on the front......

I wonder what it was?

I have no idea except it has a lot of printing on it - looks medicinal
maybe ??? I tried to bring out the printing with software I have at home
and I can't - the noise to information ratio is just too high..

 

[Unreals]

That video is of when he was being official transferred to the Peruvian LE....NOT when he was signing his confession!

If I'm mistaken about that, I apologize. However, I saw it aired on ABC yesterday morning, during their story about Joran retracting his confession. If they didn't outright say it, the implication certainly was that this statement was made at the time of his alleged "confession."

As noted, I could be wrong. However, it certainly would be uncharacteristc for an American television network to misrepresent something like that, creating a false public perception that actually worked in Joran's favor.

 

[georger]

What I find disturbing--or rather mind boggling, is when he started on his rampage of telling stories regarding NH's demise(s) and being paid...why didn't the parents reel him in then? Totally incorrigible and uncontrollable?

If I had to guess, I think they were caught between the fear of him being
guilty (losing him) and the fear of him turning on them (losing themselves)
so they bought into the gamble hoping it wouldnt get out of control, and
their gamble paid off in the short term. Can you image the arguments Paulus and Anita must have had but up until now I think Anita has seen
this as a family affair with denial living on hope.