Possible Victim: Shannan Gilbert, 24, missing May 2010, found Oak Beach Dec 2011 #3

[Ruminations]

And he almost certainly perjured himself when he said he was not paid to drive these escorts?

He didn't deny driving escorts for money.

To Pak's credit, he usually referred to them as women or used their names.

He contradicted himself a bit regarding if he ever drove Shannon across state lines which is a whole new ball of wax legally. He denied it, but admitted crossing state lines when Ray buried it in the question.

MOO

 

[Podstan]

He didn't deny driving escorts for money.

To Pak's credit, he usually referred to them as women or used their names.

He contradicted himself a bit regarding if he ever drove Shannon across state lines which is a whole new ball of wax legally. He denied it, but admitted crossing state lines when Ray buried it in the question.

MOO

Maybe i am misunderstanding the depo. On page 32 Rays asks him if he was paid by Prestige ever and he said no. They ask him if the “lady from Miami” (another escort) paid him and he said no. But maybe he just didn’t get paid for that one job.

 

[Ruminations]

Maybe i am misunderstanding the depo. On page 32 Rays asks him if he was paid by Prestige ever and he said no. They ask him if the “lady from Miami” (another escort) paid him and he said no. But maybe he just didn’t get paid for that one job.

That sounds familiar; I don't recall the purported payment arrangements with the Miami person. Nor do I recall if she was brought across state lines.

I do recall that Pak admitted to splitting money with Shannan. He assumed he'd get about 60.00 additional dollars when Brewer supposedly extended an hour.

MOO

 

[kittythehare]

That begs the question, is Portello dead?

Full audio of Shannan Gilbert 911 call

Full audio of Shannan Gilbert's 911 call, released by the Suffolk County Police Department. Gilbert was found dead near Gilgo Beach in 2010.

www.nydailynews.com

Google came up empty so seance time?
anybody else want to have a shot at it/?
Have we his first name and is this correct spelling/

 

[fred&edna]

That begs the question, is Portello dead?

Full audio of Shannan Gilbert 911 call

Full audio of Shannan Gilbert's 911 call, released by the Suffolk County Police Department. Gilbert was found dead near Gilgo Beach in 2010.

www.nydailynews.com

I think I said/asked something similar way back when (on SG's thread).

Discussion linked below. (I accidentally called him Porthole )

Will the Long Island Serial Killer ever be caught?

I voted yes, being I have a renewed vigor now that EAR/ONS was caught. I never thought this day would come. But with more and more technology and tools, I think it's going to be harder to keep these devious secrets. LISK's time in the light will come, too! Likewise, now that the EAR was caught...

www.websleuths.com

 

[kittythehare]

While we're at it, it is not the same as Pak's account in his deposition with Ray. Or with other media. That is also worth repeating.

Pak tried to ask Ray for 100.00, which he said would help him remember the truth.

MOO

Right.

 

[dotr]

Have not been following Shannon's case too closely, but after listening to the 911 call, what occurred to me is that Shannon may have been having difficulty with her hearing for some reason or another, imo, speculation, fwiw

Which drugs cause hearing loss?

Hearing loss can be a side effect of ototoxic medication and drugs. Find out which drugs can cause temporary or permanent hearing loss.

www.healthyhearing.com

 

[Warwick7]

Have not been following Shannon's case too closely, but after listening to the 911 call, what occurred to me is that Shannon may have been having difficulty with her hearing for some reason or another, imo, speculation, fwiw

Which drugs cause hearing loss?

Hearing loss can be a side effect of ototoxic medication and drugs. Find out which drugs can cause temporary or permanent hearing loss.

www.healthyhearing.com

View attachment 439737

I hear fear....

Hearing loss or deafness in the ear can precede, accompany, or follow an episode of nervousness, anxiety, fear..

Knowing people were trying to kill you would cause extreme fear.

Reduced Hearing, Deafness, Diminished Hearing - Anxiety Symptoms

Descriptions. Causes. How To Stop.

www.anxietycentre.com

 

[dotr]

I hear fear....

Hearing loss or deafness in the ear can precede, accompany, or follow an episode of nervousness, anxiety, fear..

Knowing people were trying to kill you would cause extreme fear.

Reduced Hearing, Deafness, Diminished Hearing - Anxiety Symptoms

Descriptions. Causes. How To Stop.

www.anxietycentre.com

Well that is a very interesting tidbit, always learning something new here on Ws!

 

[Diddian]

Except for occasionally coming across reports in national news over the years, I hadn't been following this (of any of the LISK cases), but with the arrest of RH began to do so. So, I am familiar with next to nothing about the cases. Since RH's arrest, I've read "Lost Girls" and watched the related Netflix show and I've listened to SG's 911 call, which hooked me.

What haunts me about SG's 23-minute 911 call is this: Throughout the course of the call, as SG can be heard walking and later running, SG repeatedly pleads out loud, "No, please" (or "please, no").

WHO would SG have been pleading with in such a manner? I would expect such pleading either with someone she knows, but who has power over her (a boyfriend, pimp, or drug dealer upon whom she is dependent who uses threats of violence or worse), or someone she doesn't know, but who is in a position of authority which she cannot challenge (such as a member of LE or a political leader who abuses his power in relation to SW's or drug users, but who might possibly be cowed by a call to 911 which could expose that abuse of power).

It's like she knows she is trapped and dependent upon whomever she is pleading with to respond to her pleas (and their awareness of her call to 911) to shift the balance of power which has her trapped.

All the shiftiness of various involved parties afterward - and my own awareness that those involved in illicit activities tend to conspire and lie to evade accountability - muddles things considerably. It motivates me to place LOW reliance on any part of the story told by them, unless their claims can be independently corroborated and by someone reliable (i.e., not protecting their own part in wrongdoing).

• Why would MP - his ONE job late that night was to get SG out there and back - leave SG miles away from NYC in the dark of early morning AND when she was so obviously distraught? Seems like the motivation to get out of there before LE arrived in response to the 911 calls exceeded his motivation to do the job he was hired to do and that SG was depending upon. Surely, if everyone is merely who they say there are - MP is driver and AD is boyfriend - then MP would have expected that AD wouldn't be too pleased about MP leaving SG to fend for herself under those circumstances.
• AD called SG's mother the next day to report SG was missing. Was he aware SG was supposed to visit her family next day, so he knew he better get ahead of SG's mother asking questions and make it appear he was on top of the search for her? In the analysis of "is he a good guy or a bad guy," one must certainly consider that he hit SG so hard that he once broke her jaw, requiring installation of a titanium plate.
• Why did CPH call SG's mother with such a weird claim (that he harbored "wayward girls") and then deny making that call until evidence proved he had in fact made a call to SG's mother that morning? Did he hope to delay her search for her daughter or her report that her daughter was missing - thus buying time (and for who)? People who lie tend to be hiding things which implicate themselves in wrongdoing.
  

I know I'm likely just asking the same questions that have been asked by many others to date. But, I don't for a second believe that SG had some kind of delusional episode that led to her wandering the marsh and suffering exposure. Her belongings (including her pants) were not found that far from where she first must have entered the marsh and they were found close together. If she hoped to catch a ride after making her way to Ocean Parkway, how likely is it that SG would shed her pants before the walk toward it. Someone dumped SG's belongings where they were found and I doubt it was SG.

I put SG's phone call to 911 that night in the same place that I put Libby German's cellphone video of the man who approached her and Abby the afternoon they died: When these beautiful and deserving-of-their-lives human beings realized they were subject to extreme danger, they reached for their phone to communicate as best they could in those extremely powerless circumstances everything possible to expose who was presenting that danger.

IMO, those pleas from SG and the manner in which she spoke them to the person who she felt threatened by are very important in telling LE something about who SG was addressing. It was someone she knew and she was subordinate to OR it was a person who otherwise occupied an unquestionable position of authority. In either case, SG thought a call to 911 (and that person's awareness SG was making that call) might shift the balance of power enough to eliminate the danger. Why would she think that? I also think her suspicions about her own driver and his possible complicity in whatever she felt threatened by should be taken seriously.

 

[sds71]

Detective Portela is still alive working as a commentator:

Killer of Idaho college students still at large: Retired detective says answers lie in phone records​

Retired Suffolk County, N.Y. homicide detective Pat Portela on the murder of four Idaho college students



Sini said his attempts to remove Patrick Portela came to a head in 2021, when he was informed by Suffolk police brass that the FBI “was not going to invest more resources into the case if Patrick Portela remained on”.

Law enforcement officials said a homicide supervisor finally removed Portela after the supervisor was threatened with demotion by his own higher-ups.

The Post

www.thepost.co.nz

The release “would compromise confidential information and interfere with and frustrate the SCPD’s efforts with respect to that investigation,” Det. Patrick Portela, the lead investigator, said in a court filing…

Vesselin Mitev, said after a court hearing last week that Suffolk police had just sought the public’s help with an open case by releasing a video showing the 2014 shooting of Oheka Castle owner Gary Melius.

“And this case has been pending for six years,” Mitev said of Gilbert’s unsolved disappearance and death

https://www.newsday.com/long-island/crime/shannon-gilbert-911-calls-sought-in-suit-suffolk-fights-release-p53647

 

[Warwick7]

Except for occasionally coming across reports in national news over the years, I hadn't been following this (of any of the LISK cases), but with the arrest of RH began to do so. So, I am familiar with next to nothing about the cases. Since RH's arrest, I've read "Lost Girls" and watched the related Netflix show and I've listened to SG's 911 call, which hooked me.

What haunts me about SG's 23-minute 911 call is this: Throughout the course of the call, as SG can be heard walking and later running, SG repeatedly pleads out loud, "No, please" (or "please, no").

WHO would SG have been pleading with in such a manner? I would expect such pleading either with someone she knows, but who has power over her (a boyfriend, pimp, or drug dealer upon whom she is dependent who uses threats of violence or worse), or someone she doesn't know, but who is in a position of authority which she cannot challenge (such as a member of LE or a political leader who abuses his power in relation to SW's or drug users, but who might possibly be cowed by a call to 911 which could expose that abuse of power).

It's like she knows she is trapped and dependent upon whomever she is pleading with to respond to her pleas (and their awareness of her call to 911) to shift the balance of power which has her trapped.

All the shiftiness of various involved parties afterward - and my own awareness that those involved in illicit activities tend to conspire and lie to evade accountability - muddles things considerably. It motivates me to place LOW reliance on any part of the story told by them, unless their claims can be independently corroborated and by someone reliable (i.e., not protecting their own part in wrongdoing).

• Why would MP - his ONE job late that night was to get SG out there and back - leave SG miles away from NYC in the dark of early morning AND when she was so obviously distraught? Seems like the motivation to get out of there before LE arrived in response to the 911 calls exceeded his motivation to do the job he was hired to do and that SG was depending upon. Surely, if everyone is merely who they say there are - MP is driver and AD is boyfriend - then MP would have expected that AD wouldn't be too pleased about MP leaving SG to fend for herself under those circumstances.
• AD called SG's mother the next day to report SG was missing. Was he aware SG was supposed to visit her family next day, so he knew he better get ahead of SG's mother asking questions and make it appear he was on top of the search for her? In the analysis of "is he a good guy or a bad guy," one must certainly consider that he hit SG so hard that he once broke her jaw, requiring installation of a titanium plate.
• Why did CPH call SG's mother with such a weird claim (that he harbored "wayward girls") and then deny making that call until evidence proved he had in fact made a call to SG's mother that morning? Did he hope to delay her search for her daughter or her report that her daughter was missing - thus buying time (and for who)? People who lie tend to be hiding things which implicate themselves in wrongdoing.

I know I'm likely just asking the same questions that have been asked by many others to date. But, I don't for a second believe that SG had some kind of delusional episode that led to her wandering the marsh and suffering exposure. Her belongings (including her pants) were not found that far from where she first must have entered the marsh and they were found close together. If she hoped to catch a ride after making her way to Ocean Parkway, how likely is it that SG would shed her pants before the walk toward it. Someone dumped SG's belongings where they were found and I doubt it was SG.

I put SG's phone call to 911 that night in the same place that I put Libby German's cellphone video of the man who approached her and Abby the afternoon they died: When these beautiful and deserving-of-their-lives human beings realized they were subject to extreme danger, they reached for their phone to communicate as best they could in those extremely powerless circumstances everything possible to expose who was presenting that danger.

IMO, those pleas from SG and the manner in which she spoke them to the person who she felt threatened by are very important in telling LE something about who SG was addressing. It was someone she knew and she was subordinate to OR it was a person who otherwise occupied an unquestionable position of authority. In either case, SG thought a call to 911 (and that person's awareness SG was making that call) might shift the balance of power enough to eliminate the danger. Why would she think that? I also think her suspicions about her own driver and his possible complicity in whatever she felt threatened by should be taken seriously.

Bam!!!!

@Diddian have you had an opportunity to read the depositions??
They are incredibly enlightening.

 

[Diddian]

Bam!!!!

@Diddian have you had an opportunity to read the depositions??
They are incredibly enlightening.

So far, I have only read the comments of others relating to the depositions, but will read them. Thank you for the suggestion.

 

[Warwick7]

That 911 call continues for over 20 minutes. It is intermittently heard in the background a man.

Gilbert is frequently heard saying, "Please stop." Banging on doors, possibly door knocks, and heavy breathing are later heard on the line, along with the voice of a man or men.

We are talking about 22 minutes and 42 seconds of shear evidence. Thus why it was suppressedand denied access to for so long.

Was Rex involved? MOO no...

 

[fred&edna]

I just noticed John Ray will be a guest on a lawyer's YT channel (a lawyer who graduated from Harvard ) on Wed 7pm (eastern)... might be interesting.

 

[Warwick7]

I just noticed John Ray will be a guest on a lawyer's YT channel (a lawyer who graduated from Harvard ) on Wed 7pm (eastern)... might be interesting.

Thank you!!!!!

 

[Ruminations]

Except for occasionally coming across reports in national news over the years, I hadn't been following this (of any of the LISK cases), but with the arrest of RH began to do so. So, I am familiar with next to nothing about the cases. Since RH's arrest, I've read "Lost Girls" and watched the related Netflix show and I've listened to SG's 911 call, which hooked me.

What haunts me about SG's 23-minute 911 call is this: Throughout the course of the call, as SG can be heard walking and later running, SG repeatedly pleads out loud, "No, please" (or "please, no").

WHO would SG have been pleading with in such a manner? I would expect such pleading either with someone she knows, but who has power over her (a boyfriend, pimp, or drug dealer upon whom she is dependent who uses threats of violence or worse), or someone she doesn't know, but who is in a position of authority which she cannot challenge (such as a member of LE or a political leader who abuses his power in relation to SW's or drug users, but who might possibly be cowed by a call to 911 which could expose that abuse of power).

It's like she knows she is trapped and dependent upon whomever she is pleading with to respond to her pleas (and their awareness of her call to 911) to shift the balance of power which has her trapped.

All the shiftiness of various involved parties afterward - and my own awareness that those involved in illicit activities tend to conspire and lie to evade accountability - muddles things considerably. It motivates me to place LOW reliance on any part of the story told by them, unless their claims can be independently corroborated and by someone reliable (i.e., not protecting their own part in wrongdoing).

• Why would MP - his ONE job late that night was to get SG out there and back - leave SG miles away from NYC in the dark of early morning AND when she was so obviously distraught? Seems like the motivation to get out of there before LE arrived in response to the 911 calls exceeded his motivation to do the job he was hired to do and that SG was depending upon. Surely, if everyone is merely who they say there are - MP is driver and AD is boyfriend - then MP would have expected that AD wouldn't be too pleased about MP leaving SG to fend for herself under those circumstances.
• AD called SG's mother the next day to report SG was missing. Was he aware SG was supposed to visit her family next day, so he knew he better get ahead of SG's mother asking questions and make it appear he was on top of the search for her? In the analysis of "is he a good guy or a bad guy," one must certainly consider that he hit SG so hard that he once broke her jaw, requiring installation of a titanium plate.
• Why did CPH call SG's mother with such a weird claim (that he harbored "wayward girls") and then deny making that call until evidence proved he had in fact made a call to SG's mother that morning? Did he hope to delay her search for her daughter or her report that her daughter was missing - thus buying time (and for who)? People who lie tend to be hiding things which implicate themselves in wrongdoing.

I know I'm likely just asking the same questions that have been asked by many others to date. But, I don't for a second believe that SG had some kind of delusional episode that led to her wandering the marsh and suffering exposure. Her belongings (including her pants) were not found that far from where she first must have entered the marsh and they were found close together. If she hoped to catch a ride after making her way to Ocean Parkway, how likely is it that SG would shed her pants before the walk toward it. Someone dumped SG's belongings where they were found and I doubt it was SG.

I put SG's phone call to 911 that night in the same place that I put Libby German's cellphone video of the man who approached her and Abby the afternoon they died: When these beautiful and deserving-of-their-lives human beings realized they were subject to extreme danger, they reached for their phone to communicate as best they could in those extremely powerless circumstances everything possible to expose who was presenting that danger.

IMO, those pleas from SG and the manner in which she spoke them to the person who she felt threatened by are very important in telling LE something about who SG was addressing. It was someone she knew and she was subordinate to OR it was a person who otherwise occupied an unquestionable position of authority. In either case, SG thought a call to 911 (and that person's awareness SG was making that call) might shift the balance of power enough to eliminate the danger. Why would she think that? I also think her suspicions about her own driver and his possible complicity in whatever she felt threatened by should be taken seriously.

Yeah, the pleading stood out to me too.

I see it as evidence she was not paranoid or loosing it.

With 911, she rather matter of factly requests that they trace her call.

With people who gave the ability to harm her, she is submissive and pleading.

She also notices Pak is not using her stage name. "Why are you calling me by my real name?" That is not a paranoid frenzy. That is surprisingly clear thinking by a woman who sees she is in grave danger.

MOO

 

[Snail-Overlord]

https://gilgonews.com/reports/drbadenreport.pdf

Just wanted to share some thoughts on Shannan’s 2nd autopsy performed by Dr. Baden.

1) No traces of any drugs were detected in Shannan’s remains. (Nor were they in the 1st autopsy) I am not well versed in any of this stuff, but does anyone know if toxicology is typically accurate when performed on mostly skeletonized remains? In this article from 2014, Dr. Kobilinski (who appears to have no relation to the case) opines that the tissue could be compromised and that they should expect to find evidence of cocaine use because Shannan was a known user. I’m wary of going down that line of thinking, because even if the tissue was compromised, that still leaves us with no actual evidence of recent drug use. As far as I’m aware, we don’t know when the last time Shannan used cocaine was. I’m curious if anyone knows about the science behind this.

2) Due to the lack of any evidence of drug use, combined with Brewer’s statement to the cops that there was no drug use that night, (they apparently find him credible) it seems odd for police to still be speculating that Shannan’s death was drug-related. Even if Shannan was in a drug induced stupor and wandered into the marsh somehow, why did she die? The same question applies for if she was suffering from a mental illness-related episode.

3) According to this article, on the initial autopsy, the medical examiner noted a dent in Shannan’s hyoid bone that Baden noted as an actual hole. The 1st medical examiner seems to have been negligent to me; the hole didn’t suddenly appear. But in regards to the hole, what on earth would actually cause that? Is it possible to actually puncture the hyoid bone without completely shattering it? What sort of instrument would have to be used to do that?

4) Is there an explanation other than strangulation as to how the hyoid bone could become damaged? The only other one I can think of is severe trauma to the neck, but that also seems unlikely to happen on accident

5) Shannan’s body was found lying face up on a bush. I can’t conceive of how she possibly could have drowned if this is how she was found. I know that “dry drowning” is a thing, but that also seems unlikely given the shallowness of the water and its relative rarity. AFAIK, Shannan did not appear physically disoriented to any of the people she encountered before disappearing. She was able to walk, run, etc… Another note: in the article, Ray says that when he walked into the marsh to try and see what it was like to navigate, that he could actually see nearby houses while walking through the marsh.

I still feel unsure of how Shannan died, but it doesn’t seem like LE has taken the investigation into Shannan’s death very seriously. They’ve suggested that she may have overdosed on drugs, got lost and died of exposure, or drowned. It seems bizarre to suggest so many different potential causes of death for a person who has actually been found. Like they’re just throwing things at the wall to see what sticks and ignoring the elephant in the room. Shannan’s death can’t be rightfully called accidental without LE first having a logical explanation for why her hyoid bone was damaged.

MOO

 

[Snail-Overlord]

Yeah, the pleading stood out to me too.

I see it as evidence she was not paranoid or loosing it.

With 911, she rather matter of factly requests that they trace her call.

With people who gave the ability to harm her, she is submissive and pleading.

She also notices Pak is not using her stage name. "Why are you calling me by my real name?" That is not a paranoid frenzy. That is surprisingly clear thinking by a woman who sees she is in grave danger.

MOO

What really strikes me is Pak’s apparent lack of concern for the fact that Shannan is obviously terrified. He doesn’t make any attempt to actually ask her why she’s scared and he’s laughing at her while she’s calling 911. At best, he is a huge jerk.

MOO

 

[Ruminations]

https://gilgonews.com/reports/drbadenreport.pdf

Just wanted to share some thoughts on Shannan’s 2nd autopsy performed by Dr. Baden.

1) No traces of any drugs were detected in Shannan’s remains. (Nor were they in the 1st autopsy) I am not well versed in any of this stuff, but does anyone know if toxicology is typically accurate when performed on mostly skeletonized remains? In this article from 2014, Dr. Kobilinski (who appears to have no relation to the case) opines that the tissue could be compromised and that they should expect to find evidence of cocaine use because Shannan was a known user. I’m wary of going down that line of thinking, because even if the tissue was compromised, that still leaves us with no actual evidence of recent drug use. As far as I’m aware, we don’t know when the last time Shannan used cocaine was. I’m curious if anyone knows about the science behind this.

2) Due to the lack of any evidence of drug use, combined with Brewer’s statement to the cops that there was no drug use that night, (they apparently find him credible) it seems odd for police to still be speculating that Shannan’s death was drug-related. Even if Shannan was in a drug induced stupor and wandered into the marsh somehow, why did she die? The same question applies for if she was suffering from a mental illness-related episode.

3) According to this article, on the initial autopsy, the medical examiner noted a dent in Shannan’s hyoid bone that Baden noted as an actual hole. The 1st medical examiner seems to have been negligent to me; the hole didn’t suddenly appear. But in regards to the hole, what on earth would actually cause that? Is it possible to actually puncture the hyoid bone without completely shattering it? What sort of instrument would have to be used to do that?

4) Is there an explanation other than strangulation as to how the hyoid bone could become damaged? The only other one I can think of is severe trauma to the neck, but that also seems unlikely to happen on accident

5) Shannan’s body was found lying face up on a bush. I can’t conceive of how she possibly could have drowned if this is how she was found. I know that “dry drowning” is a thing, but that also seems unlikely given the shallowness of the water and its relative rarity. AFAIK, Shannan did not appear physically disoriented to any of the people she encountered before disappearing. She was able to walk, run, etc… Another note: in the article, Ray says that when he walked into the marsh to try and see what it was like to navigate, that he could actually see nearby houses while walking through the marsh.

I still feel unsure of how Shannan died, but it doesn’t seem like LE has taken the investigation into Shannan’s death very seriously. They’ve suggested that she may have overdosed on drugs, got lost and died of exposure, or drowned. It seems bizarre to suggest so many different potential causes of death for a person who has actually been found. Like they’re just throwing things at the wall to see what sticks and ignoring the elephant in the room. Shannan’s death can’t be rightfully called accidental without LE first having a logical explanation for why her hyoid bone was damaged.

MOO

Wow! Great post.

I think your number 2 is really two separate points. One of which is original AFAIK.

I've never heard anyone mention 2a.

2a. It is very inconsistent for police to publicly cast no suspicion towards Brewer and praise his alleged candor. But then ignore Brewers reports of Shannan's (non) drug use.

Great, original point-

and I agree with point 2b: that any kind of mental incapacity (for which there is no evidence) still would not explain away the evidence that someone was trying to harm Shannan.

MOO