Retrial for Sentencing of Jodi Arias - Day 17

[Kamille]

Brief OT, me and my husband are pretty sure he was summoned for this jury but he had to get an exemption because he lives in Houston now, thought still listed as a resident in Montreal. Kind of crazy to think about.

You're both pretty lucky he missed out on that IMO. I swear these poor juries must suffer from some kind of PTSD when dealing with the gore in these murders. Both the crime scene and autopsy photos in this case and the horrific gore film and photos in the Magnotta case. (currently on day three of verdict watch )

Can't stress enough how much I appreciate what the jurors do for justice.

MOO

 

[Val1]

They are using this "doctor" to re-iterate ALL of JA's testimony in the original trial. She just has to get it all back in to this jury. Every lying detail of it.

MOO

It's too bad JM didn't ask Dr.F if she was familiar with the dynamics in the relationships of black widows then just follow up with this witness.

 

[NashBridges2]

I think in a twisted way we are getting as close to the truth as we may ever get when it comes to the murderer. I think there has been pretty solid evidence presented (in both the trial and here) that JAA is personality disordered (BPD) with anti social tendencies along with hints of narcissism. The fact that several people in her inner circle thought she was Bipolar seems close to accurate in light of the fact that Bipolar and BPD can often be misdiagnosed- one for the other- as they have similarities that may overlap (thanks BritsKate).

The fact that she never got help for it seems to go along with her diagnosis, as well, but as we have wonderful posters who have been diagnosed BPD... that doesn't explain everything, especially the murder. Hence the sociopathy/psychopathy aspect.

She did NOT want the diagnosis in the first trial- not even the hint of it- which leads me to believe this is very close to the truth. Also, why the people who knew or cared about her were unable to get her to seek help.

My sister was diagnosed BPD and abruptly halted therapy and she is not a psychopath.

What really could have been done?

Even if Travis had sought a restraining order- we know how that goes- it never really stops anything and almost seems to escalate the violent behavior of perpetrators.

Sadly, I think she would have killed him- no matter what- and no one could have put her away before the fact.

It seems almost inevitable watching her all consuming obsession with Travis and anyone that had anything to do with him- too.

What was so different about Travis?

I think his personality attracted and repelled her all at the same time.

Her empty, false sense of self was magnified next to him- to the highest power imaginable. His joy for life, his magnetism, his determination and drive... his generosity and his humor. I really believe someone like Jodi is not able to find genuine humor- gut wrenching, belly laughing, wet your pants kind of humor- in anything.

Why would someone else's bright light extinguish anothers?

It wouldn't.

It would only make evident the fact that the other had no light within- to begin with.

Why the hell didn't she just kill her own, damn, sorry self? Because she HATED Travis- not because he didn't want her it was because having known him she came to the recognition that she was an empty, dark, black hole of a soul and he had figured it out too. There would be no lingering friendship for her, no well wishes for her future, no future manipulations by her. He was going to tell her secret to everyone- her family included- remember?

To all who would have ears to listen. The moment JAA knew that, her plan went in to action. It was inevitable. She had to snuff that life force out- the one she would never have herself. She didn't want to have Travis, she wanted to BE Travis.

I don't even think Travis would have followed through with his threats, I think he would have moved on and tried to forget her. I have no doubt that he would have been a more cautious person and maybe not so all forgiving.

Who knows what his life may have been. Sadly, I believe the day he crossed paths with her was the day the time started ticking down on the clock of his life.

She will always be the worst thing that ever happened to him... to many more people now, as well.

I look at the picture of her as a darling toddler with pigtails and wonder how does someone like her even come into being?

My dear dear Frigga, how much do I love your posts? So, so much. Every word is SPOT ON.

 

[NashBridges2]

David Wallace from azcentral posted that Juans boss?? was in court speaking with Juan/Det Flores today. Any thoughts on that?

https://twitter.com/davidwallce/status/545334058080018432

I'm hoping it's an extra set of ears, so much BS is spewing that it's hard for JM to keep it all straight and remember it.

 

[Ricki]

So, Gef is back up tomorrow and Juan probably won't get his chance until the 1st week of January. Gef is hard to take and repetitive, trying to ingrain his "findings" in the jury's heads. Heck if we go by what he has said, we are all abused, and what are we to do. I know all of us want this trial to be over with, including myself. I don't believe it will be over until at least February the way it is going. I also believe that even though we are anxiously anticipating Juan's cross of this witness, that having to wait the two weeks is not a bad thing. Juan has plenty of time to get all his ammo nice and shiny for his moment up and we can back off and relax and enjoy the holidays. Jodi, well she will still be confined in her little cement cell with her stumpy pencils. Maybe her next drawing will be of Santa.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

Carolyn Sung ‏@CarolynSungCNN · 3m3 minutes ago
10/27/07: #jodiarias writes she doesn't need to be on suicide watch, but she hasn't felt so broken since 1998.



I guess I could research this myself, but if anyone can recall faster than me looking, what broke her in 1998? TIA

 

[Kamille]

I think in a twisted way we are getting as close to the truth as we may ever get when it comes to the murderer. I think there has been pretty solid evidence presented (in both the trial and here) that JAA is personality disordered (BPD) with anti social tendencies along with hints of narcissism. The fact that several people in her inner circle thought she was Bipolar seems close to accurate in light of the fact that Bipolar and BPD can often be misdiagnosed- one for the other- as they have similarities that may overlap (thanks BritsKate).

The fact that she never got help for it seems to go along with her diagnosis, as well, but as we have wonderful posters who have been diagnosed BPD... that doesn't explain everything, especially the murder. Hence the sociopathy/psychopathy aspect.

She did NOT want the diagnosis in the first trial- not even the hint of it- which leads me to believe this is very close to the truth. Also, why the people who knew or cared about her were unable to get her to seek help.

My sister was diagnosed BPD and abruptly halted therapy and she is not a psychopath.

What really could have been done?

Even if Travis had sought a restraining order- we know how that goes- it never really stops anything and almost seems to escalate the violent behavior of perpetrators.

Sadly, I think she would have killed him- no matter what- and no one could have put her away before the fact.

It seems almost inevitable watching her all consuming obsession with Travis and anyone that had anything to do with him- too.

What was so different about Travis?

I think his personality attracted and repelled her all at the same time.

Her empty, false sense of self was magnified next to him- to the highest power imaginable. His joy for life, his magnetism, his determination and drive... his generosity and his humor. I really believe someone like Jodi is not able to find genuine humor- gut wrenching, belly laughing, wet your pants kind of humor- in anything.

Why would someone else's bright light extinguish anothers?

It wouldn't.

It would only make evident the fact that the other had no light within- to begin with.

Why the hell didn't she just kill her own, damn, sorry self? Because she HATED Travis- not because he didn't want her it was because having known him she came to the recognition that she was an empty, dark, black hole of a soul and he had figured it out too. There would be no lingering friendship for her, no well wishes for her future, no future manipulations by her. He was going to tell her secret to everyone- her family included- remember?

To all who would have ears to listen. The moment JAA knew that, her plan went in to action. It was inevitable. She had to snuff that life force out- the one she would never have herself. She didn't want to have Travis, she wanted to BE Travis.

I don't even think Travis would have followed through with his threats, I think he would have moved on and tried to forget her. I have no doubt that he would have been a more cautious person and maybe not so all forgiving.

Who knows what his life may have been. Sadly, I believe the day he crossed paths with her was the day the time started ticking down on the clock of his life.

She will always be the worst thing that ever happened to him... to many more people now, as well.

I look at the picture of her as a darling toddler with pigtails and wonder how does someone like her even come into being?

It's amazing how all these doctors being paid to defend her actions as perfectly normal don't have that kind of insight. Or do they? :notgood:

MOO

 

[Kamille]

Carolyn Sung ‏@CarolynSungCNN · 3m3 minutes ago
10/27/07: #jodiarias writes she doesn't need to be on suicide watch, but she hasn't felt so broken since 1998.



I guess I could research this myself, but if anyone can recall faster than me looking, what broke her in 1998? TIA

I believe that was the time frame when she left home because of the abuse only to run into the arms of another abuser named Bobby? There's so much abuse it's hard to keep track.

MOO

 

[NashBridges2]

This is honestly the most exhausting trial I've ever followed. I am pretty much ready to call it quits, even though I want to see it finish. I just don't know how much longer I can do it. If I still feel this way after the 2.5 week break, I've promised myself I will walk away and watch facebook for a verdict in 2016.

Is it any wonder why Nurmi stalls and moves at a snails pace? The judge is just as bloody slow releasing the transcript. When our lawyers are telling us here it should have been released immediately but 2 days pass, I just don't get it. What's the hold up?

I'm at the end of my rope patience wise. I'm usually the calm, cool collected one. So if I'm feeling like this, my heart aches so bad at how exhausting this is for his family. I can't imagine. :gaah::tantrum::banghead::tears:

I just want it all over.

 

[Kamille]

I'm hoping it's an extra set of ears, so much BS is spewing that it's hard for JM to keep it all straight and remember it.

Or he had to request an entire team of interns to look stuff up for him and his boss wanted to know why. One hour in that courtroom would do the trick. :floorlaugh:

 

[Caylee Advocate]

I believe that was the time frame when she left home because of the abuse only to run into the arms of another abuser named Bobby? There's so much abuse it's hard to keep track.

MOO

Yes, it came to me after I posted the question but thank you. Oh hell yeah... all of this abuse in such a short time makes my head numb. Possibly the poor innocent little girl should have slowed her life down a bit.

 

[cindymac]

Carolyn Sung ‏@CarolynSungCNN · 3m3 minutes ago
10/27/07: #jodiarias writes she doesn't need to be on suicide watch, but she hasn't felt so broken since 1998.

I guess I could research this myself, but if anyone can recall faster than me looking, what broke her in 1998? TIA

My guess is her break up with Bobby, as per this testimony:

NURMI: OK. What -- tell us about your life after you moved back to your grandparents` home. Are you still working at Denny`s? Do you go back to school? Just kind of describe your life for us.

ARIAS: Yes. After that incident occurred with Bobby -- I had worked at Denny`s for about a year at that point. And if you`re a full-time employee at Denny`s, or I think a minimum of, like, 32 hours a week, you get vacation benefits. And so I decided to use that time to spend away from him, and I flew back to Costa Rica for a week-and-a-half.

NURMI: And am I correct in assuming that was to spend time with Victor?

ARIAS: No. He didn`t live in the house anymore. I stayed with my -- the same family, but he had moved out and moved on.

NURMI: So you spent about a week-and-a-half, it sounds like, with Victor`s family, not with him.

ARIAS: Yes.

NURMI: And kind of assessing your life? Is that fair to say?

ARIAS: Yes, I spent a lot of time just reflecting and healing from that, and I felt in a lot better place by the time I came back.

Victor actually -- I did see Victor three days before I flew back. So he took me out to dinner and that was it, and then drove me to the airport.

NURMI: When you say healing from that, what are you talking about, healing from the relationship with Bobby?

ARIAS: Yes, because we kept going back and I kept hearing about incidents where he was trying to hook up with other girls and -- but then he would deny it. And I didn`t see anything, so I -- there was just a lot of turmoil. We were arguing still, and then the physical incident that happened. And I needed to just remove myself from the situation so that I could allow my heart to move on a little, and so that break from him, I thought, had helped me a lot.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1302/04/ng.01.html

This last paragraph is almost verbatim what she said about Travis, when explaining (to Flores?) why she moved back to Yreka. Rinse. Recycle. Reuse.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

I think Juan's boss has been in the court alot during the sentencing phase... (er redo of whole trial) I recall seeing several pics of him sitting next to him.

 

[Ricki]

My guess is her break up with Bobby, as per this testimony:

NURMI: OK. What -- tell us about your life after you moved back to your grandparents` home. Are you still working at Denny`s? Do you go back to school? Just kind of describe your life for us.

ARIAS: Yes. After that incident occurred with Bobby -- I had worked at Denny`s for about a year at that point. And if you`re a full-time employee at Denny`s, or I think a minimum of, like, 32 hours a week, you get vacation benefits. And so I decided to use that time to spend away from him, and I flew back to Costa Rica for a week-and-a-half.

NURMI: And am I correct in assuming that was to spend time with Victor?

ARIAS: No. He didn`t live in the house anymore. I stayed with my -- the same family, but he had moved out and moved on.

NURMI: So you spent about a week-and-a-half, it sounds like, with Victor`s family, not with him.

ARIAS: Yes.

NURMI: And kind of assessing your life? Is that fair to say?

ARIAS: Yes, I spent a lot of time just reflecting and healing from that, and I felt in a lot better place by the time I came back.

Victor actually -- I did see Victor three days before I flew back. So he took me out to dinner and that was it, and then drove me to the airport.

NURMI: When you say healing from that, what are you talking about, healing from the relationship with Bobby?

ARIAS: Yes, because we kept going back and I kept hearing about incidents where he was trying to hook up with other girls and -- but then he would deny it. And I didn`t see anything, so I -- there was just a lot of turmoil. We were arguing still, and then the physical incident that happened. And I needed to just remove myself from the situation so that I could allow my heart to move on a little, and so that break from him, I thought, had helped me a lot.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1302/04/ng.01.html

This last paragraph is almost verbatim what she said about Travis, when explaining (to Flores?) why she moved back to Yreka. Rinse. Recycle. Reuse.

I know it has been said that Victor Arias is not related to JA, but are we sure of this? The my is making me think. Was this a slip or...

 

[cindymac]

I know it has been said that Victor Arias is not related to JA, but are we sure of this? The my family is making me think. Was this a slip or...

... my thought exactly!

 

[Caylee Advocate]

My guess is her break up with Bobby, as per this testimony:

NURMI: OK. What -- tell us about your life after you moved back to your grandparents` home. Are you still working at Denny`s? Do you go back to school? Just kind of describe your life for us.

ARIAS: Yes. After that incident occurred with Bobby -- I had worked at Denny`s for about a year at that point. And if you`re a full-time employee at Denny`s, or I think a minimum of, like, 32 hours a week, you get vacation benefits. And so I decided to use that time to spend away from him, and I flew back to Costa Rica for a week-and-a-half.

NURMI: And am I correct in assuming that was to spend time with Victor?

ARIAS: No. He didn`t live in the house anymore. I stayed with my -- the same family, but he had moved out and moved on.

NURMI: So you spent about a week-and-a-half, it sounds like, with Victor`s family, not with him.

ARIAS: Yes.

NURMI: And kind of assessing your life? Is that fair to say?

ARIAS: Yes, I spent a lot of time just reflecting and healing from that, and I felt in a lot better place by the time I came back.

Victor actually -- I did see Victor three days before I flew back. So he took me out to dinner and that was it, and then drove me to the airport.

NURMI: When you say healing from that, what are you talking about, healing from the relationship with Bobby?

ARIAS: Yes, because we kept going back and I kept hearing about incidents where he was trying to hook up with other girls and -- but then he would deny it. And I didn`t see anything, so I -- there was just a lot of turmoil. We were arguing still, and then the physical incident that happened. And I needed to just remove myself from the situation so that I could allow my heart to move on a little, and so that break from him, I thought, had helped me a lot.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1302/04/ng.01.html

This last paragraph is almost verbatim what she said about Travis, when explaining (to Flores?) why she moved back to Yreka. Rinse. Recycle. Reuse.

Thank you so much, this is awesome to read again. It pretty much confirms my thoughts as to her lying about having been an exchange student also. She almost slipped about who she stayed with too. I just wonder if she had any family or perhaps a friend living there? However, I doubt she could even pinpoint Costa Rica on a map let alone traveling there. Damn, Denny's must have paid her well. LMAO.

 

[T-4-2]

Sorry if I've said this before. My sense is that Nurmi wanted to go the route of Arias being mentally disturbed, but Arias absolutely would not have it. She has to be the victim and she wants Travis to be seen as a monster. What we are left with is a hybrid.

Can you imagine how Arias would react if her own experts put forth a candid and honest psychological evaluation of her and her history? The stun gun might even have come into play. I just can't imagine her being able to contain her reactions to hearing some very negative, but true things about her as a person.

According to the first 48 Hours episode, Jodi's lawyers were "having her evaluated for a possible insanity defense."

http://youtu.be/IsaBsAMfNgg?t=47m35s

That, of course, was way back when, when Jodi was telling people to mark her words, etc, etc. Plan Z was "mentally ill young girl," and I guess she finally realized that Plans A through Y were spectacular failures. Once Plan Z gets tossed onto the trash heap with everything else, she'll either get the DP (with mandatory state-funded appeals) or she'll get LWOP and a muzzle. Pros and cons either way.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

Whoa, wait a minute. Didn't Deanna Reid testify about going on an LDS mission to Costa Rica? I am sure I remember that, but I am off to see if my hippocampus is okay, or I flooded it again. I have a hunch that lying freak used Costa Rica as another lie to try to embellish her trashy sick *advertiser censored* life.

 

[Kamille]

My guess is her break up with Bobby, as per this testimony:

NURMI: OK. What -- tell us about your life after you moved back to your grandparents` home. Are you still working at Denny`s? Do you go back to school? Just kind of describe your life for us.

ARIAS: Yes. After that incident occurred with Bobby -- I had worked at Denny`s for about a year at that point. And if you`re a full-time employee at Denny`s, or I think a minimum of, like, 32 hours a week, you get vacation benefits. And so I decided to use that time to spend away from him, and I flew back to Costa Rica for a week-and-a-half.

NURMI: And am I correct in assuming that was to spend time with Victor?

ARIAS: No. He didn`t live in the house anymore. I stayed with my -- the same family, but he had moved out and moved on.

NURMI: So you spent about a week-and-a-half, it sounds like, with Victor`s family, not with him.

ARIAS: Yes.

NURMI: And kind of assessing your life? Is that fair to say?

ARIAS: Yes, I spent a lot of time just reflecting and healing from that, and I felt in a lot better place by the time I came back.

Victor actually -- I did see Victor three days before I flew back. So he took me out to dinner and that was it, and then drove me to the airport.

NURMI: When you say healing from that, what are you talking about, healing from the relationship with Bobby?

ARIAS: Yes, because we kept going back and I kept hearing about incidents where he was trying to hook up with other girls and -- but then he would deny it. And I didn`t see anything, so I -- there was just a lot of turmoil. We were arguing still, and then the physical incident that happened. And I needed to just remove myself from the situation so that I could allow my heart to move on a little, and so that break from him, I thought, had helped me a lot.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1302/04/ng.01.html

This last paragraph is almost verbatim what she said about Travis, when explaining (to Flores?) why she moved back to Yreka. Rinse. Recycle. Reuse.

Even in that transcript you can see the lies. She stayed with my...ummm....the same family.

I didn't see Victor. Okay I saw him once for dinner 3 days before I returned.

And oh yeah he drove me to the airport.

Such a bad liar. :notgood:

MOO

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

Carolyn Sung ‏@CarolynSungCNN · 3m3 minutes ago
10/27/07: #jodiarias writes she doesn't need to be on suicide watch, but she hasn't felt so broken since 1998.



I guess I could research this myself, but if anyone can recall faster than me looking, what broke her in 1998? TIA

She was 18? living with Bobby J. Drugs?