Retrieving wreckage from AirAsia Flight To Singapore- no survivors recovered

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http://www.straitstimes.com/news/as...avy-vessel-mv-swift-rescue-sets-java-sea-2014
 
o/t only in America

29 year old mom and her two year went to some Wal Mart

Momma was packing heat to run her errands

Child reached into mommies purse, and shot mom to death.

I get packing a gun if your gonna do a crack deal but arming yourself to go get some baby formula is obserd, and only in AMerica
 
Divers begin search for AirAsia victims, black boxes after debris found.

No survivors had been found.

Indonesian president Joko Widodo said his priority was getting bodies off the bottom of the Karimata Strait in the Java Sea, where rescuers retrieved a plane door and other debris on Tuesday, so victims could be identified.

Aviation experts believe the fuselage should be easy to find because the aircraft probably only broke up when it hit the water. "The fact that the debris appears fairly contained suggests the aircraft broke up when it hit the water, rather than in the air," said a former pilot Neil Hansford, who leads consultancy firm Strategic Aviation Solutions.

Mr Widodo said AirAsia would pay an immediate advance of money to the families, many of whom collapsed in grief when they saw television footage of the debris.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-12-...-begin-search-for-victims-black-boxes/5994370
 
I hope gitana is right. I've often thought that we humans are different from many species in that we are cursed with the knowledge of the inevitability of our deaths. I could find some comfort in the notion that in this kind of situation, people might be blessed with a sense of calm. I have read that in that kind of severe incident, the body is flooded not only with adrenalin, but some other chemical (which now escapes me), which attaches to the opiate receptors in our bodies, producing similar effects of those drugs.

A close friend of a close friend of mine was stabbed multiple times by a crazed ex of his fiancee. He told my friend that he was so enveloped with a sense of calm, of peace, of pain free euphoria that he actually considered just lying on the floor and enjoying the sensations which were flooding his body. Meanwhile, his assailant was calmly getting cleaned up in his victim's shower! Finally, the friend thought of how upset his fiancee would be if he died, so he dragged himself to the phone and called 911. Fortunately he survived. I had completely forgotten about this guy until I read gitana's post, which I confess at first reading I completely rejected.
Wow.
Thank you.
Thank him.
An insight into what lies ahead IMO.
 
I hope gitana is right. I've often thought that we humans are different from many species in that we are cursed with the knowledge of the inevitability of our deaths. I could find some comfort in the notion that in this kind of situation, people might be blessed with a sense of calm. I have read that in that kind of severe incident, the body is flooded not only with adrenalin, but some other chemical (which now escapes me), which attaches to the opiate receptors in our bodies, producing similar effects of those drugs.

A close friend of a close friend of mine was stabbed multiple times by a crazed ex of his fiancee. He told my friend that he was so enveloped with a sense of calm, of peace, of pain free euphoria that he actually considered just lying on the floor and enjoying the sensations which were flooding his body. Meanwhile, his assailant was calmly getting cleaned up in his victim's shower! Finally, the friend thought of how upset his fiancee would be if he died, so he dragged himself to the phone and called 911. Fortunately he survived. I had completely forgotten about this guy until I read gitana's post, which I confess at first reading I completely rejected.

Thanks for sharing that story and so glad your friend survived.

I suspect different people probably have different reactions to a life threatening event such as this plane experienced. Some are probably blessed with the tranquility and calm as you describe while others probably panic and totally freak out.

I think the reason we feel compelled to talk about it is because we all tend to wonder how it would be for us if we were unfortunate to be in a similar situation. As I was watching the severe turbulance utube video, I first got upset at some of the people for screaming out like they were doing because it was probably making it worse for others. I then quickly realized I probably would be one of the ones screaming out right along with them. :)

Point being, I suspect there would be a whole array of different reactions and perceptions as the plane had its last moments. Its all so very sad for all involved, and especially for the surviving family members as they are asking these same sort of questions.

I think that is one of the reasons why the monetary judgements from lawsuits of this nature tend to be very large sums of money. The jury members also are posed with these same thoughts of what the people went through before their demise.
 
Breaking
CNN International @cnni · 5m: Six bodies from #AirAsia #QZ8501 recovered, including one crew member, Indonesian search official says. http://cnn.it/1tggAba

Where is the 40 coming from?
 
interesting read on AF 447 by Wise:

..... I’ve experience similar moments many times before: the sudden, unanticipated jolt, followed at irregular intervals by more lurches of varying magnitude. I invariably remind myself that turbulence alone has never caused a modern airliner to crash, but it does little to soothe my nerves........ Fears are, after all, irrational, and there is something primally disturbing about being tossed around without any clues as to why, or when the next bump will take place.


The main drama began ....the pilot flying the plane pulled back on the controls, sending into a steep climb. The passengers would have had no explanation for the sudden lurch, nor would it have been easy for them to know in the minutes that followed if they were climbing or descending.

...... the most difficult things about piloting a plane in darkness or clouds is the body’s inability to accurately determine its orientation or whether it’s going up or down;....... Once an aircraft is in a steady descent or ascent, it feels just the same as flying level, just as an ascending elevator feels the same as one at rest......

......even the co-pilots themselves, with their panels full of instruments and indicators, seemed uncertain as to what exactly was happening, several times discussing whether they were actually going up or down. Until the moment AF447 hit the water, none of the passengers could have known what was in store.


..........., though the plane several times achieved an angle of attack exceeding 40 degrees, this does not mean that the passengers would have experienced themselves as tilting steeply backward, like roller-coaster riders climbing the first hill. ...... the reason that the value was so high during AF447’s final minutes was that the aircraft was practically dropping like a brick. Its orientation, however, was only about ten degrees up. It probably didn’t seem that remarkable, or even noticeable given what else was going on at the same time.


What the passengers would certainly have felt............. and been alarmed by, were intense buffeting and turbulence. Remember, the flight was passing through the top of a major thunderstorm. Making matters worse was the fact that when an aircraft wing is on the edge of an aerodynamic stall, it naturally experiences a kind of buffeting, or trembling......add to this the fact that a plane is very difficult to control at stall speeds, so the pilot flying the plane was making big side-to-side movements of the flight controls, causing large-scale lurches to the left and right........


.... the integrity of the Airbus that it withstood the forces it was subjected to; ...... it can’t have been an easy ride for the passengers. I know from experience that in heavy turbulence a moment comes when a particularly violent lurch seems to release the anxiety of the cabin en masse; a gasp seems to erupt from everywhere at once, and a contagion of fear takes over. ......people begin to cry, to pray, to quietly sob. All at once, everyone has entered a new emotional domain.......


........psychologically, though, it must have been a terrifying ordeal — though for none quite as much as for the pilots, who alone knew what was about to happen to them.


http://jeffwise.net/2011/12/09/what-passengers-experienced-during-af447s-final-moments/
 
Breaking
CNN International @cnni · 5m: Six bodies from #AirAsia #QZ8501 recovered, including one crew member, Indonesian search official says. http://cnn.it/1tggAba

Where is the 40 coming from?

The reporting of data has been all over the place since the beginning. I'm not believing anything for certain until the officials announce the info. They finally today acknowledged the plane went missing at 6:18 AM, after days of saying it was 7-something or later, depending on who was reporting.

I can't imagine the horror the passengers felt, and which their loved ones are feeling now. I hope for the passengers and crew, it was fast and they were spared pain and fear.

But I am so glad they found the crash site and can recover the victims' remains. Not knowing has got to be the worst torture...
 
Breaking
CNN International @cnni · 5m: Six bodies from #AirAsia #QZ8501 recovered, including one crew member, Indonesian search official says. http://cnn.it/1tggAba

Where is the 40 coming from?

The 40 bodies story was debunked early this morning in several articles while others persisted in publishing it.

Many if not most news stories are recycled with very little new updated information. This, together with the time zone and date line differences, makes keeping-up with facts a challenge.

~jmo~
 
The detail about three people holding hands made me cry. They held onto each other until the very end, and beyond.

How terrified they must have been.
 
Well that's weird because I am on the Guardian's live feed updates and they are reporting 3.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/li...e-grim-task-of-recovering-bodies-and-wreckage

Yeah, I have seen other news reports too where things are different too. They do have a lot of ships helping with the recovery so I think some of the discrepancy is because many ships are still out helping and different ships are probably picking up people. I dont think they would rush back to shore each time they find someone. They would most likely stay out and keep searching.

We will probably see changes in numbers each day for many days now.

Not sure what news media to believe is the official tally.
 
Yes, it is very confusing. But the Navy are out there, Bambang is back in Surabaya. It may take a while for matters to be officially confirmed and announced. Indonesia are pretty relaxed in relaying critical info at the best of times imo.

You will notice that a lot of info is coming from Singapore and other sources, with irregular press conferences (in Indonesian, with no translators present) by Bambang.

Also, Indonesia said early in the piece that all news releases will be out of Indonesia. So if other nations are retrieving deceased people, Indonesia will not officially recognise that until they have gone through their official channels ... national pride (again, imo).


The navy initially said 40 bodies had been recovered, although other media later quoted the head of the search and rescue agency, Fransiskus Bambang Soelistyo, as saying only three bodies had been retrieved. The plane has yet to be found.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/12/30/us-indonesia-airplane-idUSKBN0K601C20141230
 
interesting bits of coincidence between MH370 & AirAsia

both planes were lost at 40' heading North into the flight
Air Asia wreckage was found 50 miles (5 minutes fly time) from the point where MH370 was last pinged/ringed.

MH was missing 17 minutes before ATC noticed
Air Asia was missing half an hour before Indonesian ATC notified Singaporean counterpart

http://www.slate.com/articles/techn..._it_has_in_common_with_malaysia_airlines.html
 
The reporting of data has been all over the place since the beginning. I'm not believing anything for certain until the officials announce the info. They finally today acknowledged the plane went missing at 6:18 AM, after days of saying it was 7-something or later, depending on who was reporting.

I can't imagine the horror the passengers felt, and which their loved ones are feeling now. I hope for the passengers and crew, it was fast and they were spared pain and fear.

But I am so glad they found the crash site and can recover the victims' remains. Not knowing has got to be the worst torture...

the hour discrepancy is due to dealing with two different time zones Indonesia is ''behind'' Singaporean time by an hour
 
Thanks for sharing that story and so glad your friend survived.

I suspect different people probably have different reactions to a life threatening event such as this plane experienced. Some are probably blessed with the tranquility and calm as you describe while others probably panic and totally freak out.

I think the reason we feel compelled to talk about it is because we all tend to wonder how it would be for us if we were unfortunate to be in a similar situation. As I was watching the severe turbulance utube video, I first got upset at some of the people for screaming out like they were doing because it was probably making it worse for others. I then quickly realized I probably would be one of the ones screaming out right along with them. :)

Point being, I suspect there would be a whole array of different reactions and perceptions as the plane had its last moments. Its all so very sad for all involved, and especially for the surviving family members as they are asking these same sort of questions.

I think that is one of the reasons why the monetary judgements from lawsuits of this nature tend to be very large sums of money. The jury members also are posed with these same thoughts of what the people went through before their demise.

I agree. Different people would react differently. Someone mentioned the 9/11 phone calls earlier. But some of those are heart wrenching with panic and crying. And that's the people who had the composure to ring their loved ones or emergency services. I get that most people would go calm if the plane was free falling out of the sky and the end was imminent. But I don't believe that people wouldn't have been panicking (and all that entails) during the severe turbulence that, surely, had to precede this awful crash. I don't think it's and either/or situation and a sense of calm could well follow sheer terror. Oth, before I fly I often think about what it would be like to be in a plane crash and I visualise myself in a place of calm acceptance of what's happening, and that helps me fly.
 
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