Ron C. # 11

[texasmommy39]

texasmommy, I see what you mean about me coming here with strong conviction and bias. Kind of like your comment in post #1932 where you state: "Crystal is not a credible witness. IMO."

Whoa there Crystals credibility is questionable only because she has been charged with falsly accusing someone of stealing her car.... she falsly accuses Ron of abusing his child to DCF with the help of an attorny and substantiates that claim with a picture of injuries occured and documented on the school grounds. I am not assuming anything other than stating a fact. Do you think any attorney would put her on a stand to testify with her background?

 

[Malesherbes]

Whoa there Crystals credibility is questionable only because she has been charged with falsly accusing someone of stealing her car.... she falsly accuses Ron of abusing his child to DCF with the help of an attorny and substantiates that claim with a picture of injuries occured and documented on the school grounds. I am not assuming anything other than stating a fact. Do you think any attorney would put her on a stand to testify with her background?

She did not falsely accuse Ron, its just that DCF couldnt prove it, do you even have any idea how bad the Florida DCF is? Wow, she may have lied in her life, she may just be human like every person here- no one is without fault, I would rather be a liar than a person caught with date rape drugs and cocaine, and now being accused of beating up his new family-

Wow, this all makes me sad how she is so brutalized-

 

[atherella]

And courts are wrong sometimes- And if she was unfit, she would have had supervised visits or none at all- I read the papers and Ron got the kids because he had a job, thats about it- no way was he the better parent, just weeks prior to the court date he had just got done with drug therapy after being found with coke and date rape drugs- no way is that the better parent- not in my world-

jmo

BBM

That was not the only reason.

Snipped from the custody docs.

http://www.fox30online.com/media/news/1/3/e/13e1a8a0-e082-477f-9698-11a796f76a10/petineer.pdf

 

[Malesherbes]

BBM

That was not the only reason.

Snipped from the custody docs.

http://www.fox30online.com/media/news/1/3/e/13e1a8a0-e082-477f-9698-11a796f76a10/petineer.pdf

Oh, and he could provide insurance- however, there is no job for Ron from that court date till PDM, so I know he didn't take Crystal to court for support because he wasn't living up to his obligation he was supposed to- imo-

 

[KOOL LOOK]

Sorry to offend you. Not my intentions. Unfit is a term that would justify a father getting custody over the mother and especialy if the two where not married.

it's an appropriate term the courts use in writing custody final orders, it's not derogatory or enflaming. It's what it is.

No need to apologize.
I find that what hasn't been mentioned, is that crystal obviously didn't want custody of the children or she would have been there. Excuses the court doesn't accept, unless it's sickness being in a hospital, or death. Then the courts must be notified that day prior to the hearing.

I've actually unfortunately been through this kind of custody case. Then after the final order, you would have thought things to be settled, but no. Then the real litigation began over the next three years. I encourage anyone I come across considering custody and future court litigation, to try and work things out together and leave the courts out of it. But few ever see the truth in wisdom in this until it's too late and their thousands of dollars broker, :crazy: and a head full of gray hair.

 

[azwriter]

You have said so very well the same things that have bothered me also regarding Ron. I have not ruled out his involvement in any way. JMHO,MOO

Thanks Kateyes for the comment but you know, I still am not convinced Ron is involved in Haleigh's disappearance. I admit it's strickly my feelings about him that makes me feel he's not an honorable person.

 

[KOOL LOOK]

BBM

That was not the only reason.

Snipped from the custody docs.

http://www.fox30online.com/media/news/1/3/e/13e1a8a0-e082-477f-9698-11a796f76a10/petineer.pdf

oh my, i just read this after making my post. I was totally unaware crystal was not seeing her children. Substantiates my thoughts that she didn't want custody to begin with. What more proof than that do you need? The moving away so far from her children is a decision I personally would not have made unless it was too accept a job offer so good I couldn't turn down as it would benefit my children greatly to have the financial security to better their futures.

 

[texasmommy39]

She did not falsely accuse Ron, its just that DCF couldnt prove it, do you even have any idea how bad the Florida DCF is? Wow, she may have lied in her life, she may just be human like every person here- no one is without fault, I would rather be a liar than a person caught with date rape drugs and cocaine, and now being accused of beating up his new family-

Wow, this all makes me sad how she is so brutalized-

Ok so you are telling me that DCF did not find any grounds to prove abuse during a child abduction case involving the family that is under investigation? Have you wrote the LE to report the facts that DCF missed? I have to say I can not stand lying and have taught my children the truth is the only answer no matter what will happen.

 

[KOOL LOOK]

Ok so you are telling me that DCF did not find any grounds to prove abuse during a child abduction case involving the family that is under investigation? Have you wrote the LE to report the facts that DCF missed? I have to say I can not stand lying and have taught my children the truth is the only answer no matter what will happen.

To my understanding the abuse allegations were put to bed quickly by neutral witness like her school, teachers, a neighbor member from here, family. It was proven the pics used to try and claim abuse were time stamped and made known exactly what had happened on Haleighs face that had a scratch and some claim a bruise. I remember seeing the scratch, but haven't viewed the pic in a long time and can't remember honestly the rest. Maybe someone can put up the exhibit.

 

[PorcineGranny]

Ok, I have worked within the court system and I want to clear up a couple of things.
There is not always justice, they are all just people with opinions like you and me.
Sometimes, sadly, it is who plays the game better. Its just the nature of the beast.

It has never been my interpretation that Crystal did not want her children or that she did not express her desire for them. Ron openly manipulated the system with his knowledge and I'm assuming he got it from experience and his mother.

The term unfit is slander in this context because the court would not have held back if that was the reason for denial of custody. DCF is such a public joke and how anyone could cite their findings when we are all here seeing Jr. still in the custody of Ron and Misty, the caregivers that in some not determined way lost Haleigh is laughable.. If DCF was an honorable service in Fla. they would now admit their error and rush to get Jr.out of the dungeon he is currently in.

You see, I can't understand why so many can overlook and support Ron. Why words and decisions are twisted to mean something they don't. I think many don't really understand the world of Ron and thats a good thing. And I don't know the ages of sleuthers, because some could truly be young enough not to see the bigger picture. But, I have seen it and I would not be untruthful in my description. If we just go by the facts each one of us has to ask why Ron is defending Misty. There is only one reason, to protect himself. Logically there is no other answer. A child is missing, a deal was made. People are fearful and no one really knows why. JMO based on my experience

 

[TxLady2]

oh my, i just read this after making my post. I was totally unaware crystal was not seeing her children. Substantiates my thoughts that she didn't want custody to begin with. What more proof than that do you need? The moving away so far from her children is a decision I personally would not have made unless it was too accept a job offer so good I couldn't turn down as it would benefit my children greatly to have the financial security to better their futures.

I just have a strong suspicion that the main reason for the "lack of sustained contact" with the children is: Ron wasn't letting her see them or talk to them until he got his way with the court.
I'm not so ready to put it all off on Crystal.

 

[TxLady2]

If she didn't want custody, she would have just told him to have the papers drawn up and she would sign them, no court hassle, no problem.

 

[KOOL LOOK]

I just have a strong suspicion that the main reason for the "lack of sustained contact" with the children is: Ron wasn't letting her see them or talk to them until he got his way with the court.
I'm not so ready to put it all off on Crystal.

I'm not putting it all off on crystal by no means. Unlike some, I keep my options open. I've not seen anything to corroborate the rumors that crystal was scared of ron and wasn't having contact with the children because of him. She had moved away, met a new man and decided to have another child, which my common sense tells me she had moved on for the most part in her personal life. Even if you don't have contact with your children, and you were scared of Ron, how is that fear stopping you from meeting your obligations as a parent in obeying a court order and paying child support for your minor children? Was she scared to do that too? But I can't see how many of these conjured ideas have anything to do with Haleigh missing.

Some have obvious motives, revenge for losing in the courts and feel spited and wanted to get even, child support arrears has caused many parents to go off the deep end, and I guess fear could be a motive too.

Then what happened to Haleigh could have no motive or premeditation involved at all, like an accident. I am leaning towards a motive driven crime in this case, not accidental cause.

Follow the money or motive is my best guess. What say you?

 

[KOOL LOOK]

If she didn't want custody, she would have just told him to have the papers drawn up and she would sign them, no court hassle, no problem.

Noooooo, I personally can think of two un-fit mothers I know of and they didn't want to raise their kids but they would never admit it. It's always someone elses fault for their detriment, not their own. That would be the ultimate confession in society's eyes for the mother of children. Wish I could agree with you on this one, but I have seen too differently in disputed child cases.

 

[Muffet]

It flies in the face of logic and should be morally inexcusable for anyone to claim any parent as judged to be "unfit" because they did not get custody.

Can anyone look into their heart and say with honesty that they don't realize there are custody battles between two good parents too, and some great parents who didn't win custody?

 

[kiki the parrot]

We seem to be going in circles again, starting from scratch, back to Square One every day, rehashing even the issues a skilled attorney has been generous enough to give her time and experience to go over for which I, for one, am thankful... even my memory isn't this short lol, bumping just a few of boytwnmom's articulate posts for review because I lack the time to keep repeating this, her qualifications, and couldn't interpret it as succinctly if I tried. Then maybe we can all get beyond this to focus on what is pertinent to solving this case instead of striving and contending about the law... about which few of us here have more knowledge or practice.

Actually, you can easily make that legal argument. At the time RC failed to return the children to their mother his paternity had not been established and thus he had NO legal right to those children. CS gave him permission to take the children for a set period of time. He had kept them for three months by the time the hearing occurred. If she had any clue she should have gone to court when he failed to return them.

He did not go to court just seeking custody as there would have been no basis to do so as paternity had not been established. This was the motion he brought "PETITION TO DETERMINE PATERNITY AND RELATED RELIEF". Until paternity was established the mother is the only legal parent of the minor children and the only person who has legal custody.

Of course, IMO the whole "trip" was just a setup concocted by RC & TN to set a pretty stage for custody. Let CS think you're away, move in with Mommy, get a job, and run to court. Not rocket science but good system manipulation.

While many might feel the judge did indeed, "get it wrong" overall, here, the question of his ability to legally have the children was simply not addressed as CS did not raise the issue. If anyone takes someone's child and refuses to return them they must raise that as an issue with a court. Absent a pleading or a motion setting out the allegations regarding the illegal retention of the children the court is unable to address it. It only addresses issues properly before it. I doubt CS would have done this even if she knew she could as she does not seem like that type of person and would not have made trouble for RC, whether out of passivity or fear. Although I might feel she should have raised the issue she did not and thus the court had no reason to address the legality of RC's keeping the children beyond the agreed upon time frame. Remember, he needed to be adjudicated the father of those children-that was in fact before the court. Why, because at that point in time he was not legally the father of the children.

I did an analysis of the custody hearing the other day. I'm an attorney, although a corporate not a domestic relations one, but I do know rules of evidence and standards of proof and so I feel confident in saying that the hearing was handled in an appalling and unfair manner and presents numerous grounds for appeal.

Some of what I said the other day:

"especially as I went back and read the custody rehearing where he made sure every statement he made was spun to make himself look good and Crystal look bad. Anything that had gone wrong was Crystal's fault. Even when asked about day care he said he wanted to get Haleigh in but he left some papers in Crystals car and she didn't give them back so he couldn't get her in day care.

I see a consistent pattern of deflecting any personal responsibility for anything that happens which to me ties in with his every ready response that "I was at work". I also highly doubt he has been truthful about things like his invovlement with drugs unlike Crystal who was, if anything, too truthful about everything. By that I mean she seemed completely unprepared in that custody hearing and Ron was clearly loaded for bear knowing exactly how to spin everything.

He was a great provider even though he had only just gotten a job and was living with his mother. He didn't bring Haleigh back to Crystal after the Mexican vacation but it was Crystal's fault because she had "problems" and a cocaine habit and she never really asked him to. I also saw that Crystal testified that Ron wanted her to quit her job as he didn't want his children left with a babysitter-kind of ironic and also devious as he knew then that would make her look less eligible at the custody hearing. Crystal sure isn't any brain surgeon and I don't know if she is just simple and trusting or beaten down and sort of afraid of Ron or still in love with him or what. I didn't see any evidence of her being less than truthful or else she would have dissembled about obvious negatives the way Ron did.

I noticed that Ron said he passed a drug test but the results were not there or available and the Magistrate simply took his word for it and it wasn't like he later checked because he made the decision immediately. When Ron's criminal history came up Ron immediately changed the subject to Crystals mother's criminal history and his was never discussed or put in the record but the Magistrate did take Crystals mothers records that Ron convieniently brought. This hearing is a textbook example of why someone needs a lawyer as the Magistrate did not follow normal rules of evidence nor apply his rules equally to both sides nor ensure that he had a complete record prior to making his decision."

So, I have to disagree with your comments. I also don't think you should accuse her of cocaine use while pregnant unless you lhave a firm basis to do so. At least she was honest concerning her past transgressions. Given Ron's criminal record I would be more concerned with his history. It is simply not credible that anyone with the number of drug related charges he has has never been invovled in anyw ay with drugs. He is simply not truthful about it.

In any fair hearing the fact that he absconded with the children and refused to return them would have been an extremely important factor but it was completely ignored. HIs representations regarding his living with his mother and her caring for the children soon become him living in a felonious relationship with a minor from whose presence the child was stolen and who can't tell a consistent story as to the timeline leading up to the disappearance of the child.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Crystal S., Haleigh's mother #6

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Ron C. # 10

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Crystal S., Haleigh's mother #2

arrot:

 

[texasmommy39]

Ok, I have worked within the court system and I want to clear up a couple of things.
There is not always justice, they are all just people with opinions like you and me.
Sometimes, sadly, it is who plays the game better. Its just the nature of the beast.

It has never been my interpretation that Crystal did not want her children or that she did not express her desire for them. Ron openly manipulated the system with his knowledge and I'm assuming he got it from experience and his mother.

The term unfit is slander in this context because the court would not have held back if that was the reason for denial of custody. DCF is such a public joke and how anyone could cite their findings when we are all here seeing Jr. still in the custody of Ron and Misty, the caregivers that in some not determined way lost Haleigh is laughable.. If DCF was an honorable service in Fla. they would now admit their error and rush to get Jr.out of the dungeon he is currently in.

You see, I can't understand why so many can overlook and support Ron. Why words and decisions are twisted to mean something they don't. I think many don't really understand the world of Ron and thats a good thing. And I don't know the ages of sleuthers, because some could truly be young enough not to see the bigger picture. But, I have seen it and I would not be untruthful in my description. If we just go by the facts each one of us has to ask why Ron is defending Misty. There is only one reason, to protect himself. Logically there is no other answer. A child is missing, a deal was made. People are fearful and no one really knows why. JMO based on my experience

Respectfully BBM
See that is where it is wrong to assume it is the only possible reason and answer. Misty could very well be innocent and Ron knows this. :grouphug: It is not cut and dried yet and we are needing to get alot more questions answered to be able to assume for sure anything before an arrest is made IMO.

 

[Muffet]

Kiki, I don't think it'll help. When people's bias is so strong and blinding that it feels ok to them to judge a mother as unfit because she didn't win custody, as we have seen in this thread, I'm afraid it's hopeless.

 

[PorcineGranny]

Passing ice cold cokes and tylenol all around.

 

[Muffet]

Passing ice cold cokes and tylenol all around.

Thank you, PC.

I could use something stronger with the news about Annie Le. Totally gutted here.

I hate mean people.