SC - Paul Murdaugh & mom Margaret Found Shot To Death - Alex Murdaugh Accused - Islandton #32

[Chelly]

Edited due to finding answer to my earlier question about What happens to AM after trial

from link
.....Murdaugh is charged with about 100 other crimes, ranging from stealing from clients to tax evasion. He is being held without bail on those charges, so even if he is found not guilty of the killings, he will not walk out of court a free man. If convicted of most or all of those financial crimes, Murdaugh would likely spend decades in prison.

Prosecutor: Alex Murdaugh 'fuzzy' about new details of case

Disgraced South Carolina attorney Alex Murdaugh is testifying he cooperated with police investigating the killings of his wife and son in every way except mentioning the last time he saw them alive

abcnews.go.com

 

[JerseyWasHome2]

I imagine when John Marvin broke down on the road headed to the emergency at Moselle (in PM's truck), he called somebody to collect him and take him to the property where he reclaimed his own truck.

I wonder why they were playing musical trucks that day.

 

[Rivkah11]

If you have a "Living Trust" most will also have a "pour-over Will" which is very popular for privacy reasons.

Essentially, with a Trust, the personal rep or executor of a decedent's estate does not have to file an estate inventory with the probate court (i.e., a list of the estate assets), a public document, because all of the decedent's assets not already titled in the name of the Living Trust, pour over to the Trust which is deemed private and not subject to public disclosure at death.

I'd like to think every WS member, young or old, has a Living Trust-- not only to avoid probate but for privacy reasons alone!

You can bet MM wished she had a Living Trust so that her probate inventory, disclosing she only owned an interest in two leveraged properties, a Mercedes SUV, and $56 at the time of her death would not have been public information. JMO

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Take the advice….it’s worth far more than you’ll know. But if you don’t, you’ll be acquainted with the court system, lawyers and expenses, all while grieving or maybe even losing your home and car!

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

WOW! Great Post. Thanks so much!

Yes, this FITS News analysis was superb. Quite interesting assessment.

I am not an attorney, yet have to wonder if it be the case that defendant’s defense counsel did try to prevent his testifying, and if evidence later surfaces of that….. then perhaps the defendant has ‘cooked the goose’ for possible ineffective counsel claim? MO.

And this FITS News synopsis was splendid recap. Prosecution ‘according to your new story’…. ‘did you have those guns’… ‘your new version’.

Also marveled at the handling of the defense objection on possible 5th amendment grounds when being pressed about financial admissions vs. kennel admissions I believe. Which after minimal clarification was shot down by the judge. And with defense counsel continued pressing - judge I believe says ‘please sit down’. I was so waiting for a Paul Newman / Frank Galvin moment of “exception”…. and the judge perhaps “noted”. But no….. (from that great Sidney Lumet film The Verdict’.

Will be interesting to see where this goes. And still believe as did the FITs News analysis that Mr. Waters close and “nothing further” was splendid. MOO.

I think the only thing possibly overlooked was defense counsel apparently attempting to interrupt cross by asking could some other individuals testify….. trying to perhaps put a pin in a balloon? IMO.

 

[Gardenista]

Where I live, many people were unfamiliar with this case and only became aware of it through media attention. Those newly acquainted with the Murdaugh murders, are the people who tell me they think AM is innocent of the murder charges or believe there will be a mistrial.
moo

This happens in so many high profile trials. The media has an agenda and tilts their reporting viewpoint to that agenda. Most people only watch these shorter reports and then they are outraged when a trial doesn't go the way their fave media outlet has reported on it. It's nuts.

 

[Love Never Fails]

Edited due to finding answer to my earlier question about What happens to AM after trial

from link
.....Murdaugh is charged with about 100 other crimes, ranging from stealing from clients to tax evasion. He is being held without bail on those charges, so even if he is found not guilty of the killings, he will not walk out of court a free man. If convicted of most or all of those financial crimes, Murdaugh would likely spend decades in prison.

Prosecutor: Alex Murdaugh 'fuzzy' about new details of case

Disgraced South Carolina attorney Alex Murdaugh is testifying he cooperated with police investigating the killings of his wife and son in every way except mentioning the last time he saw them alive

abcnews.go.com

Assuming he doesn’t pay off the LE, SLED, family members, lawyers and judges. That is his history. Money talks. He just inherited a ton of it. He also stole PMs and MMS portion by murdering them.

IMO, if he walks on the murder charges, he will skate on the thefts.

 

[LavenderGooms]

I’m not sure how I feel about the pill situation. If they were so on his case about them, he didn’t have to invite either one there to enjoy his fix in peace. Plus for someone who squirreled away his clothes all over the place, why wouldn’t he do the same with his pills esp since having them already found a few times.

I also feel that MM was the target if not both equally targeted because if it was just PM causing the issue then the vigilante story still fits, if it was only MM well that looks more like the spouse, vigilantes wouldn’t just go after her. Moo

 

[Love Never Fails]

Take the advice….it’s worth far more than you’ll know. But if you don’t, you’ll be acquainted with the court system, lawyers and expenses, all while grieving or maybe even losing your home and car!

We have a will but would love to know more about a living trust. Where do we find out more? We live in Indiana. Thanks!

 

[mickey2942]

In the Netflix special about "Murdaugh" they mentioned an airstrip and private plane at the Moselle property. Does AM have a pilots license? I wonder who flew the plane. Sounds like quite a set up for drug smuggling.

 

[justtrish]

My husband cannot wrap his head around AM killing PM. He gets the concept of killing the wife (hello??? should I be offended?? LOL) but not the son. He understands all the circumstantial evidence and the lies and all the "facts" of the case, but without the "smoking gun" he still sees reasonable doubt. If he was on the jury, he would probably be the reason for a hung jury. As much as I want AM to be found guilty, and I definitely think he IS guilty, I think this may be the outcome. I hope I'm wrong (although it is better than not guilty). IMO

Side note: I find myself suddenly in the market for a divorce attorney. Recommendations?? LOL

I think sometimes when a person hears about the evidence second hand it is harder to get the full effect. If he watched the witnesses and how believable they are (like Blanca, Libby's caregiver, Maggie's sister, Alex's coworker that confronted him that day) They have no reason to like and actually probably feel a bit intimidated by the Murdaugh family to say the truth. Then we have Alex on the stand acting a fool being a lawyer and not just a defendant answering the questions. He does not have a good reason for lying and those that were scared, but telling the truth, he says were just mistaken. It isn't how they remember it. So do we believe the admitted drug addict that he wasn't trying to coerce witnesses and that he wasn't really confronted that day with financials.. He lied about when he went to work, he lied about when he got home from work, he lied about where he was and what he did just before they died. He also would have no idea when they were shot (if he didn't do it) so how did he even know he needed to lie about what he did. He didn't know when they were killed, but somehow he did? Maybe if your husband watched these witnesses and how genuine they were. They even all loved Alex and didn't want to say the things that make him look guilty, but it is what it is and he said and do things that made them feel uncomfortable. Anyway just reminding you that the jury sees it all. His reactions to each witness, his looks and his emotion or non emotion, his demeanor and they see the entire picture. I hope they get it right.

 

[aafromaa]

Forgive me everyone if anything I say or ask has been posted about previously. I am struggling to keep up with the trial because of my work schedule and do not get to read all of the posts. I have some time today and some questions I’m hoping you can help me understand. I’ll post them separately just to help keep any replies easy for me to find. I’ll include my first question here..

Did the DNA evidence help either side? And if so, how? To me there was nothing in that testimony that proved anything for the prosecution or suggested any reasonable doubt for the defense.

 

[CityKid]

There seems to be a lot of people coming out lately that are willing to ignore overwhelming circumstantial evidence that AM is guilty by simply saying, they just can’t understand why AM would kill his family. It just would never happen. They think the motive put forth by the state is weak.
Those people need to look up family annihilators. There’s a long list, and not one decent motive for any of them.

Yep. I mean, I can't think of a reason that would make sense to me that would make me kill a loved one. But I certainly think someone else could have a reason that makes sense to them. To not understand that concept, to deny stories in the news, to deny statistics, really does take willful ignorance.

 

[Incomprehensible]

I've heard much criticism about A/G Waters' examination of AM by other attorneys but I think it's because he did not do what attorneys are taught in law school and allowed AM to control his own story (testimony) instead of controlling AM and the prosecutor making himself the star.

IMO, I agree that AM is/was not the textbook defendant, and looking back, I think A/G Waters had two choices:

First, if Waters acted to control AM's response to his questions, he risked alienating the jurors that might like AM more than they like Waters.

Defendants like AM are very dangerous because they are masters at presenting themselves as both likable, and sympathetic. His financial crimes demonstrate this perfectly!

Second, Waters could give AM a long rope, and just let him ramble, and AM's own arrogance will soon tighten the grip. I think allowing AM to talk and talk resulted in AM no longer appearing so likable -- especially when you remember he's been charged with double homicide and he's using the folksy story and tone to manipulate you!

Ultimately, specific to AM's personality, I think Waters took the right approach here. MOO

I agree. I think it was masterful.

I’m on the same page as you, I would not want to be friends with or be hanging out, living with anyone accused of this.
Especially a sibling that committe murder.
…

There is a relative on hubby side that is in prison for life he has absolutely nothing to do with him, received letter and threw it away unopened. He’s as good as dead.

Jmo

I think reality is a hard pill to swallow.
I feel so bad for BM

 

[Pruddennce]

I tend to see that his dependency on MM and his reputation drove him. I think he believes he loved her but his definition of love is skewed.

With his father dying, the father's trust will kick in for all of the Murdaugh siblings. AM wanted cash more than anything. With the law firm on to him, cash was going to get tight and he was going to have to fork over everything he had with little hopes that the law firm would not report him to LE. MM had to have known they were in financial trouble. And, there were the financials that would need to be filed in the boat case. He can say what he wants but his crimes coming to light must have been terrifying for him. For a lawyer who had not committed crimes, it might have been a nothing burger but not a man who had stolen millions.

During the direct examination of him, AM says he was not worried about the theft discovery nor the financial materials needed for the civil case. Other lawyers confirm that the financial declaration was not a big thing. True. But, if you are AM, the financials and the other thefts of money you have done are putting you on a path to being discovered right quick because the lawyers for the plaintiffs are not going to accept that you have nothing and forensic accountants are going to be up in your business. IF PM is dead, so is the criminal case. IF PM is dead, it will be hard to get a judgment against AM because there is no interview/interrogatories/depositions of PM. IF MM is dead, he does not have to face the humiliation of being broke in front of her. IF MM is dead, she won't be able to have any interviews/interrogatories/depositions either. She can't answer what he did or PM did or if she had a call about him. The only way to stop the PM boat accident stuff is to kill them off. He will still have one son, his money, and his trust fund, even if his other financial crimes come to light. And, I think he believed the law firm would just let him pay everything back without going to LE.

Put that with the drug discoveries by PM and MM. The family annihilator him was bound to show up. JMHO.

great post. IMO it wasnt skewed love, it was narcissism. she fed him. narcissists will not and cannot be challenged. once that happens, well...this is what happened. IMO she remained with him up to this point, IMO, because she didnt want to give up her society life, appearances, etc. and somewhat tolerated his pill popping. that all changed with the boat crash which in turn affected her standing in the community, she just couldnt go out and buy another home, finances were compromised as well as her social life. the boat incident changed everything for her. N's, once they realize they cannot control their source anymore, they discard them and move on. murder is the extreme, but it does happen. IMO

 

[aafromaa]

At one point during AM’s testimony he said something along the lines of ”when Maggie asked me to leave” - he quickly corrected himself and said I mean when she asked me to come down there or something like that. I think it was in the 2nd day cross examination but am not positive.

Did anyone else hear this and if so do you recall where it was? And did it make you wonder whether she may have asked him to leave because of the pills? He said the pills make him aggitated and maybe he just couldn’t take it after also being confronted about his thefts earlier that day.

 

[aafromaa]

Did they determine any of the guns in the home had been fired recently? (As in did they smell the barrels or anything?)

I know the ammo matched what was in the house but I keep hearing about missing guns. If the guns used in the shootings weren’t found in the home or on the grounds, what happened to them? Does the timeline from his phone and vehicle allow for him to have gotten rid of them?

 

[Seattle1]

I wonder why they were playing musical trucks that day.

Allegedly, it had to do with John Marvin transporting his dad to the hospital that day. JMO

 

[aafromaa]

Does anyone have any insight on the tire mark on Maggie’s leg from the ATV? It seem I recall the testimony being “at some point she came in contact with it but no evidence she was run over by it” but I didn’t quite catch if her leg was bruised or had an abrasion as if she was hit or if it was just an imprint on her pants like she may have leaned against it.

 

[Not a Belle]

Did anyone else hear this and if so do you recall where it was? And did it make you wonder whether she may have asked him to leave because of the pills? He said the pills make him aggitated and maybe he just couldn’t take it after also being confronted about his thefts earlier that day.

I wonder about this statement too. What if Maggie asked him—a Murdaugh!—to leave, and pointed out that he was on what was legally her property? Obviously just my thought, but I could imagine his fury if that were the case. MOO.

 

[Skigirl]

At one point during AM’s testimony he said something along the lines of ”when Maggie asked me to leave” - he quickly corrected himself and said I mean when she asked me to come down there or something like that. I think it was in the 2nd day cross examination but am not positive.

Did anyone else hear this and if so do you recall where it was? And did it make you wonder whether she may have asked him to leave because of the pills? He said the pills make him aggitated and maybe he just couldn’t take it after also being confronted about his thefts earlier that day.

BBM I caught that too -- it was in the second day of AM on the stand but I don't know the timestamp.

I've said this before, but with each example, I'm more convinced that if you listen to AM and keep him talking, he eventually tells on himself.

- First description of Paul: "he was an intuitive little dude, like a little detective" (the murders have something to do with Paul's "detective work" in continually finding and tossing and hassling him about his pills)
- First descriptor of his relationship with Maggie: "She didn't work" (and they were having money problems -- a point of frustration for Alex as he became more desperate for money and she kept spending?)
- "When Maggie asked me to leave," (I bet that some of their confrontations involved asking him to leave, perhaps until he could agree to go to rehab - perhaps there was a version of that conversation that morning, or that night?)
- "Whoever did this had been thinking of it for a long time," (hmmmmm... how did he know that?)
- "There was no one else there, because if there had been, the dogs would have gone crazy" (paraphrase, but he said something along those lines on Friday... and of course they didn't go crazy because they knew everyone there)

And I couldn't help but wonder if he identified with Bubba... the one Maggie loved the most... the dog who didn't really mean to kill the chicken.

All MOO