Sentencing and beyond- Jodi Arias General Discussion #3

[wasnt_me]

Possible BMW related texts :
March 31, 2008
8:51 AM - JA: Call me as soon as u wake up. I've already called Davis Miles.
1:26 PM - JA: Is it OK if I drop off your car now? Is he expecting it?
1:37 PM- JA Are they both Desert Schools? and phn #?
1:38 PM- Travis: It shows you one is wamu, one is desert schools

April 22, 2008
JA: I love my car!!!!!
Travis: Good =)

Did that fool help her get another car? And yes, by fool I do mean Travis!

Desert Schools is a credit union. Financial lending.

Could he have co-signed a car? Was he getting her out of her mess with the car she had to "give" back to the bank?"

Is that what all the praise for his friendship was all about in April? And was that what the "running around doing stuff for her" was about in April? Is this why he was concerned about her getting a job?

Was she supposed to be making BMW payments AND making payments on a new ride? If she didn't make the payments, that'd be a reason he'd feel scammed....

I don't know. But it's interesting that they are talking financial institutions and lawyers.

It was always weird that he'd "give" her the BMW. But she destroyed it and still needed a car. Why did he give it to her in the first place? Was she always supposed to make payments on it? Was it going to be her new car in Yreka? Once it got destroyed, she had to still pay for it AND get another car, yes?

 

[Hope4More]

Did that fool help her get another car? And yes, by fool I do mean Travis!

No.

 

[Val1]

BBM:


It sounds like someone had stolen a magnetic sign he had on his car.


Davis Miles was the firm that represented PPL in the AZ./NM. areas. I took it as his (Travis') credit card or bank card had been stolen since Desert School is a credit card.

Hah! My first thought was someone got the info from his magnetic sign while JA was committing some kind of criminal offense and reported it.

 

[wasnt_me]

No.

I don't know what car she loves and where she got it from or why they are talking about these banks and financial institutions if that's not the case that he helped her do something car related. she had no job to get the car she had in Yreka and no money to buy stamps, according to her. She sure was praising him for some kind of help in April, and it is weird that the car registration in her ninja story has the Yreka address on it.

 

[MistyM]

my brother and i were talking about 'what on earth could have been the switch that turned jodi into a premeditating murderer?' and he said, i don't know but if one of you people figure it out, i'd be worried that person was just as crazy... lol. he was joking of course but i see some truth in that, perhaps we will never know. we search for answers, and in her warped out head she only knows the answer. I STILL WANNA KNOW THOUGH! i don't like to say 'what travis did to make her snap' because he didn't do anything to deserve her wrath. she probably just woke up one day and was like, you know what? i'm gonna kill this guy because i can...

 

[b_lab7410]

my brother and i were talking about 'what on earth could have been the switch that turned jodi into a premeditating murderer?' and he said, i don't know but if one of you people figure it out, i'd be worried that person was just as crazy... lol. he was joking of course but i see some truth in that, perhaps we will never know. we search for answers, and in her warped out head she only knows the answer. I STILL WANNA KNOW THOUGH! i don't like to say 'what travis did to make her snap' because he didn't do anything to deserve her wrath. she probably just woke up one day and was like, you know what? i'm gonna kill this guy because i can...

It's a brush with crazy, alright, hell if somebody figures it out, perhaps that's our way or honoring Travis' life, with the compassion/understanding he needed during this time and for his own reasons, couldn't get while he was still alive.

 

[pocketaccent]

my brother and i were talking about 'what on earth could have been the switch that turned jodi into a premeditating murderer?' and he said, i don't know but if one of you people figure it out, i'd be worried that person was just as crazy... lol. he was joking of course but i see some truth in that, perhaps we will never know. we search for answers, and in her warped out head she only knows the answer. I STILL WANNA KNOW THOUGH! i don't like to say 'what travis did to make her snap' because he didn't do anything to deserve her wrath. she probably just woke up one day and was like, you know what? i'm gonna kill this guy because i can...

I really like what you wrote Misty. I agree with you and your brother. After all these years We still have so many unresolved questions. Perhaps Juan Martinez's book will help us understand truth about the murderer. My fantasy is that he will devote one whole chapter to listing of all excluded evidences on ground of prejudice. LOL.

I have been on a strange mission lately. I wanted to see if I can find compassion for JA, by trying to be in her shoes, imagining and visualizing what her life was like, and I tell you, it is almost an impossible task. However, while I was reading text messages between Travis, JA, Lisa, and other girls, I silently was telling JA 'leave Travis, just leave him and go, He does not love you!'. Maybe that qualifies as compassion.

 

[Hope4More]

Creepy, but evidence that the killer could access T's incoming texts at the very least:

Travis was dead by 5:32pm June 4, she was near the Nevada border by 10:30pm the same night.

Yet.

Incoming texts from Maria and from Chris Hughes were marked "read" on June 5 (marked unread after the 5th), and texts from Deanna were marked "read" as late as June 6th, unread after that.

Only the killer would have read those texts.

 

[Steve44]

This is my own feeling... based on people I have known/met in this city (NY) who seem to internalize their anger until their explosive moment of exasperation kicks in (that stems from bad parenting right there).

I personally get the feeling the Arias' would relish upon the notion of sympathy. It is convenient for them to expect some sympathy yet when I look at every picture of their other children (pre-JA indictment included), I see something bizarre. They are all sullen, inexpressive, (as well as JA sister seems immature and reactionary, JA brother seems withdrawn), and it always comes across as if they lacked a proper nurturing environment. I'm not a fan of Nurmi's but I believe the dirty comment from Sandy towards those she feels inferior to (skinny blonde b*tch or something to that effect, again, sounds like JA's mantra to be more verbally abusive towards women). Sorry but that immaturity, sneaky type of nastiness, I've seen it before. Sandy in the courtroom (whispering into someone's ear during heartfelt Alexander testimony, the constant smirking, so many more times that were inappropriate, etc etc). I'm of the opinion that apple did NOT fall far from that tree.

I'm on some deep thought process here but I asked myself what it could have been like growing up with Arias' parents and suddenly get a feeling of subdued restraint and sense the limitations as to how one could evolve. You would not be allowed* to accelerate your education (did any of them ever want to hold a post-baccalaureate degree in biology, for example?). I doubt they would want a little Einstein with potential 'mouthing off' to them or whatever (I'm sure they would want to show them OFF, however: hypocrisy). Perhaps they felt children are only useful for doing the dishes, taking out the trash, listening to and 'honoring thy parents at all costs,' (reputation is a BIG deal for ALL of the Arias'!) that is what I figure.

I also sense that healthy encouragement or discouraging attitudes and *normal* disagreements regarding ethical behavior towards their child-adolescent behavior were too much for their 'parenting style' as opposed to being a vital component of personality development, a precursor to bonding, and/or normal for conveying clear emotional distress and/or boundaries, or recognizing the value of another person's feelings (ok, you are sensitive about that, why? or no, that is wrong but why do you feel that way? or I see, so this is important because of...etc etc, instead, it's "just do what I say, or else"). That contributes to a narcissistic child's sense of powerlessness and future entitlement/weapon. It's also narcissistically parent-centric. I actually realized they fit the The Narcissistic Family (informative read) that covers this type of parenting environment.

Anyhow, they're older now, so I suspect much of their withdrawn body language is due to blame associated to their guilt (I actually see a manifestation of buried guilt, not weary parents unjustly burdened). I don't buy the Fred and Wilma act with them. Borderlines aren't an independent conception. The only two I met did not come from a responsible household. And often the parents *relate* to them in regards to inappropriate behavior, attitude, self-pity, repression of emotional/sociological/biological expression (just a bad formula). It'd be too convenient for Sandy to not take the credit for her daughter now. She may not have been able to predict someone's homicide, but I think the Arias' definitely fostered unhealthy outbursts and resentment from all of their children. They don't want anyone to know that is all...

I agree there appears to be some abnormal family dynamics, like Mr. Arias' detached police interview, where he seemed in agreement with and resigned to her guilt, Sandy's inappropriate behavior in the courtroom, her brothers failure to appear for deposition, what appeared to be token appearances in the courtroom by each family member in turn, which merely implied support rather than actually showed it (can't blame them, but it's really an either or decision - they made it ambiguous), as well as Nurmi's reported strangeness during his visit.

Arias' psychopathy is not, imo, a result of these dynamics, however. Her personality is not resigned and repressed like that of her siblings appear to be, for example, and she had enough of the dysfunction to leave home at an early age. I believe JA used the family dysfunction to her advantage, however, using guilt and confrontation to manipulate them into supporting her, both before and after the murder.

 

[Hope4More]

May 2. 2008. The day Travis did not send the killer that 10 page tied to a tree rape fantasy.


The one piece of it on her Helio I just saw had a time stamp of 9:20 something AM. The morning of May 2.

From the texts of that day.

Texting begins at 5:49am, Travis initiates. From context, I think he'd been up all night.

T says- you don't care about me. She responds - didn't you see my nice comment on yr blog? (Must be April 22 entry? His next will be on May 5, intro to his book).

From 5:50am to 6:13am they discuss blogs. He's read her entry of April 27 and tells her- a little plagiarism in there. She is very defensive, says she did NOT steal any ideas from Travis, just the idea to post on a blog these thoughts she'd has for oh such a very long time. (scared of power within, etc). She goes on and on about this until Travis finally puts an end to it by telling her- either way, it was a good post.

She does not revel in that compliment, BTW, which was very atypical for her.

At 6:13am T asks her what she is doing, she says looking at her emails. In reply to her he says that he is "catching up to a slow start to an already wasted day."

She asks him how did he waste it, "you overachiever, you."
He says by talking Taylor off the ledge, she says that's what friends are for.

6:18. T says- I don't believe you are checking emails.
6:20. J- "sure am. One from Dr. Hughes, one from Darryl's mom. That was random."

621am. J- would you rather I said that my fingers are in my p-ssy? That I'm a horny little school girl who needs immediate alleviation?

6:22. T: oh my gosh. Are you trying to distract me? Its working. But just the same, email me and say hi.

6:23. J: alrighty.

6:24. J: oh, and I got a call from an officer saying there was a federal warrant out for my arrest! That was crazy! But it was a mistake haha.

6:25. T: saw that.

6:25. T: no email, huh?

6:26. J: just sent it?

6:27. J: Hang on. Trying something else.

6:27. T: uh huh. It's easy to send an email, jodi.

6:28. J: Gmail, dude. Accept my chat request.

6:39. J: maybe there was a delay with hotmail. I went to Gmail.

6:59AM. J: sent you another email.


The next text comes on May 4, the killer telling him to have a good night. He doesn't reply. His first text to her since 6:27am on May 2 isn't until 9am on May 5.

On May 5 the killer sends him many urgent demanding wheedling texts that he drop everything and visit her that weekend in Yreka. He says no.


We know Travis didn't send her that 10 page warped fantasy of her own. She sent it to herself. What I'm curious about, though, is why Travis was pressing her to send him an email. They're texting, he says he wants her to email him just to say hi. That is....odd.

Also odd is the "oh my gosh" by Travis. She says that. He doesn't. I can't remember a single text in which he says anything remotely like that. Curious.

 

[MistyM]

I really like what you wrote Misty. I agree with you and your brother. After all these years We still have so many unresolved questions. Perhaps Juan Martinez's book will help us understand truth about the murderer. My fantasy is that he will devote one whole chapter to listing of all excluded evidences on ground of prejudice. LOL.

I have been on a strange mission lately. I wanted to see if I can find compassion for JA, by trying to be in her shoes, imagining and visualizing what her life was like, and I tell you, it is almost an impossible task. However, while I was reading text messages between Travis, JA, Lisa, and other girls, I silently was telling JA 'leave Travis, just leave him and go, He does not love you!'. Maybe that qualifies as compassion.

i cannot WAIT for juan's book!!

it's weird you mentioned your mission, because i have been kind of doing the same thing. some of the ways she tried to make travis jealous i get, because i have done that before too, when i was much younger. its scary i can relate to her manipulative ways. i sure can't relate to the killing though. i know she was trying reverse psychology on him, basically saying ''oh lets be friends'' because she probably thought he'd realize that they were meant to be together all along, like some kind of romantic movie. the made up guys and oopsie mixed up emails to get him jealous *i am guilty of doing that once or twice to make a certain guy jealous when i was a teen.

the whole deanna thing i can't figure out. was deanna that posessive over travis? or did travis confide in deanna what a stage 4 clinger jodi was and he knew he'd look like a hypocrite if she knew he was talking to her. i think about the cookie story, and deanna coming in there. i wonder if travis called deanna to make sure jodi wasn't cleaning him out (literally stealing things)? my goodness with what we know about jodi, deanna is lucky to be alive!

 

[Tiger09]

Regarding the UHaul, they do not hook the vehicle up for you. I answered phones for a company that rented them. The customer gets the UHaul and must hook everything up themselves. Mostly UHauls are for transportation of your stuff, like when you move. There's no way you could drag a UHaul with a BMW.

Sent from my SM-T310 using Tapatalk

 

[Steve44]

i cannot WAIT for juan's book!!

it's weird you mentioned your mission, because i have been kind of doing the same thing. some of the ways she tried to make travis jealous i get, because i have done that before too, when i was much younger. its scary i can relate to her manipulative ways. i sure can't relate to the killing though. i know she was trying reverse psychology on him, basically saying ''oh lets be friends'' because she probably thought he'd realize that they were meant to be together all along, like some kind of romantic movie. the made up guys and oopsie mixed up emails to get him jealous *i am guilty of doing that once or twice to make a certain guy jealous when i was a teen.

the whole deanna thing i can't figure out. was deanna that posessive over travis? or did travis confide in deanna what a stage 4 clinger jodi was and he knew he'd look like a hypocrite if she knew he was talking to her. i think about the cookie story, and deanna coming in there. i wonder if travis called deanna to make sure jodi wasn't cleaning him out (literally stealing things)? my goodness with what we know about jodi, deanna is lucky to be alive!

I don't know what specifically you're referring to about Deanna, but I think a genuine and deep friendship had developed between them after the initial attempt at romance, and they both accepted and valued that friendship for what it was without further romantic expectations.

Jodi may not have been able to appreciate that, and saw Deanna as just another rival or wedge between her and Travis.

I think if Travis had been more mature and knowledgeable about women, and perhaps, as he seemed to me, less focused on finding a trophy wife, he could have been happy with Deanna as a life partner. Their relationship seemed to have moved to a much deeper level in spite of themselves, and he was not able to develop that kind of connection with any other woman that I can see.

I don't believe Travis knew Jodi was playing Stepford Wife in his house that day. He had asked Deanna to check on Naps because he thought he was alone, even though Jodi claimed he knew she was there, or didn't mind, or whatever.

 

[Steve44]

6:24. J: oh, and I got a call from an officer saying there was a federal warrant out for my arrest! That was crazy! But it was a mistake haha.

Must have been the law of attraction.

 

[Steve44]

It's a brush with crazy, alright, hell if somebody figures it out, perhaps that's our way or honoring Travis' life, with the compassion/understanding he needed during this time and for his own reasons, couldn't get while he was still alive.

I think the only thing we can conclude about her motivation is that she didn't value his life as worth anything outside of what he could do for her, outside or contrary to that, he had no right to live.

 

[Steve44]

We know Travis didn't send her that 10 page warped fantasy of her own. She sent it to herself. What I'm curious about, though, is why Travis was pressing her to send him an email. They're texting, he says he wants her to email him just to say hi. That is....odd.

Also odd is the "oh my gosh" by Travis. She says that. He doesn't. I can't remember a single text in which he says anything remotely like that. Curious.

He seems to be mirroring the nature of her reactions to his advances, conveying approval.

The request to send an email is strange. Perhaps he compartmentalized his life of explicit gmail chats and the more socially acceptable nature of his emails, and wanted to establish a subtle hidden connection between them.

 

[Hope4More]

i cannot WAIT for juan's book!!

it's weird you mentioned your mission, because i have been kind of doing the same thing. some of the ways she tried to make travis jealous i get, because i have done that before too, when i was much younger. its scary i can relate to her manipulative ways. i sure can't relate to the killing though. i know she was trying reverse psychology on him, basically saying ''oh lets be friends'' because she probably thought he'd realize that they were meant to be together all along, like some kind of romantic movie. the made up guys and oopsie mixed up emails to get him jealous *i am guilty of doing that once or twice to make a certain guy jealous when i was a teen.

the whole deanna thing i can't figure out. was deanna that posessive over travis? or did travis confide in deanna what a stage 4 clinger jodi was and he knew he'd look like a hypocrite if she knew he was talking to her. i think about the cookie story, and deanna coming in there. i wonder if travis called deanna to make sure jodi wasn't cleaning him out (literally stealing things)? my goodness with what we know about jodi, deanna is lucky to be alive!

The texts between Deanna and Travis are affectionate, teasing, sweet messages between two people who seem to know each other well and feel at ease with one another.

I can't remember a single text in which the killer is mentioned at all. There were a few texts in which Deanna trying to get him interested in someone she knows. No luck.

 

[Hope4More]

It occurs to me why she was so intent (on May 5) upon Travis visiting her in Yreka immediately.

She was setting him up piece by piece. She'd spliced and diced or hacked the May 2 fantasy into existence, and it would have been even more convincing (and incriminating) if he'd visited and acted out the fantasy she'd surprise him with, especially if she took photos.

Maybe her inability to get him to do that led to plan B...splice a sex call together and set the date for the 10th (a revenge choice, that date).

 

[lewcch3]

I think the only thing we can conclude about her motivation is that she didn't value his life as worth anything outside of what he could do for her, outside or contrary to that, he had no right to live.

I remember Dr DeMarte discussing a "flip" occurred and JA knocked TA off the pedestal causing her to no longer value his life.

I'm wondering at what point and what happened to cause this "flip"? Was it on the way back to Yreka in April? I tend to think it was even before then, perhaps when he was dating Lisa and JA's craziness became full blown: the stalking, slashing of tires, letter to Lisa, lights being turned on, etc.

 

[Steve44]

It occurs to me why she was so intent (on May 5) upon Travis visiting her in Yreka immediately.

She was setting him up piece by piece. She'd spliced and diced or hacked the May 2 fantasy into existence, and it would have been even more convincing (and incriminating) if he'd visited and acted out the fantasy she'd surprise him with, especially if she took photos.

Maybe her inability to get him to do that led to plan B...splice a sex call together and set the date for the 10th (a revenge choice, that date).

Why was the 10th significant?