Trapped with Ms. Arias
Chapter 23
Witness Interviews With the State's Guilt Phase Witnesses
AZ law requires that both parties disclose witnesses- opposing side may interview them before they take stand and must- otherwise, ineffectual
witness may never be called- may be called by either side
State called about 1/2 of their witnesses- just a
"guestimate"- their list lengthy and most lived out of state (L needed to travel to interview them-
"preferred not to" but had to)
L talks about Yreka, Ca. visit:
--
"never had any interest in visiting"
-- called it
"little more than a big truck stop and a sleazy one at that...one of the worst places I have ever been to"- hard to get to, scenic mountain drive
--traveled with investigator and mit. spec.
--complained about hotels
"no tell motels", stayed at Holiday Inn
--trip lasted several days
--
interviews with law enforcement-
"objective fact witnesses", held in manufactured home (what L calls
"portable classrooms")
--during 1 interview , his investigator asked a question, but JM "
advised officer not to answer"- L thought that was because only the atty was allowed to ask- advised JM that she could ask questions- JM argued
"reasonable accommodations" and asked investigator to tell question to L and then have L ask question of officer
-".
.it seemed very juvenile to me and gave me great insight into who he was as a person. It seemed to me that he was the type of person or at least the type of attorney who thought he was in control of the crime case. This was one of the first times that I recall of Mr. Martinez trying to bully me, but it was far from the last." (pg. 124), L claims that JM had no right to control situation- officer did answered his investigator's questions
L talks about Salt Lake City Utah: (where the murderer went to meet Ryan Burns)
--arrived on a Sunday and place deserted - most people Mormons and Sunday is for family; L thought it was beautiful city, better than Yreka
interviewed Officer Galetti who pulled the murderer over for upside down license plate
--
"As I recall Mr Martinez got quite a kick out of the fact that I got lost [trying to find right police station]. Back then we did not despise each other (or so it seemed) so he was laughing with me, not at me."
interviewed Leslie Udy: "a wonderful person", felt her answers were
"honest and forthright and not designed to support either side, only the truth."
interviewed Ryan Burns: he had done interview with media- he was concerned about how he would be portrayed- he had wife, child, and still in PPL, could jeopardize all that; L thought he was
"a great guy, who got caught up in a bad situation"
other interviews: crime scene tech, fingerprint examiners, officers who stood guard at house
interview with Det. Flores- L had heard him on audiotape, videotape interviewing the murderer and other civilians (Chris, Sky Hughes); Det was also interviewed on CBS 48 Hours
- Det F made comments during 48 Hours- there was no evidence that murderer slashed TA's tires, did not know who sent
"ominous" email to Lisa Andrews, and that contact between TA and Murderer was mutual
-L thought Det F was
"a kind mild mannered man...not an agressive cop who got in people's faces...who would simply let a person talk until the person had tied a noose around their own neck...appeared to be very objective...honest when he talked about the evidence related to the crime" (pg. 128)
-when l actually met Det. F, though the was
"very likable and professional"
"...once I started talking about the case and asking questions related to the newly obtained evidence, such as the text messages, it seemed to me that he became very evasive and further seemed suddenly incapable of providing straightforward answers to simple questions" (pg. 128)
interview Det. Melendez: performed forensic analysis of camera, TA's laptop
- found out Det M only took quickie computer course - often given to police officers
-L said he lacked qualifications for expert- only knew how to run "Encase" -
"...he did not seem capable of performing more complex tasks"- wrote a good report, but
"when I interviewed him it seemed to me that, if I was to believe his answers, he could barely turn on the computer or find a web page and that he did not truly inspect what was on the computer, he simply ran the program"(pg. 129)
L states that police officers interviewed were
"not impartial witnesses"- claims police officers rarely are
"In my opinion, these men simply wanted to serve whatever agenda Juan Martinez had at the moment"
L talks about
Dr. Kevin Horn, county medical examiner, interview (after self-defense and shot TA first claim)
-appeared
"very arrogant man who just expected to be believed because he was with the 'good guys' and he was handsome and articulate"- L states- Dr. Horn didn't keep up medical research, knows little about how brain functions
-this was 1st time Dr claimed that gun shot was last
"This had to be a coincidence right?", L thinks JM had something to do with DR's change sequence of events of
"order of wounds"
more interviews with people who had relationships with TA:
Deanna Reid- (July 2011- in Phoenix Public Defender's office with former co-defender)- took long time to get interview
- not 1st time L met with her- early in case (summer 2010?)
-seemed
"mystery" to L-
"played a unique and undefined role to" TA's life
-
"To hear the Hughes talk" she was "love of" TA's
"life but she was not attractive enough" for TA to marry
-she was engaged to TA- went on mission- when she was back, TA engaged to someone else- she remained in TA's life-dated again- still remained friends
-seemed to L that Deanna was TA's
"back-up plan"- didn't know why she was OK with this
- Deanna not interested in talking to defense-
"Looking back we now know that she had something to hide....Knowing that [not interested]...
we simply showed up at her house unannounced" (not uncommon for investigators to do)
-she wasn't home, but father was (L's belief-he seemed not to like TA)- then Deanna came home to L talking to father at dining rm table
-Deanna was very cautious about what she said
-- 2nd interview in office: L had more evidence- text messages, sex tape, had email that TA wrote to Hughes
"in which he talked about ruining her or words to that effect"- L assumed she had sex relations with TA
-Co-counsel asked most of questions
"asked these questions with tact, a tact that would later serve as Ms. Reid's excuse for not admitting that she had sexual relations with Mr. Alexander, but, tact nonetheless" (pg, 132)
"For her part Deanna Reid denied that she knew of anyone else having sex with Mr. Alexander, apart from Ms. Arias at a time when she knew full well that she did in fact have sex with Mr. Alexander"
L thought that they had sex
"at least once, what else could Mr. Alexander have meant when he mentioned ruining her?"- L thought she was lying- at trial she admitted she did have sex with TA
"one time"
L questions if JM told her how important it was to
"cover up" sexual part of relationship?- doesn't know
L states that Deanna told a lot of
"untruths to keep Mr. Aleaxander's secrets during his lifetime and that she certainly was not going to stop doing so now after he was killed"
L states Deanna not only one to cover up secrets for [TA]..
she was longest.. had more to lose.. had most secrets.. needed to keep secrets.. likely harm her reputation and/or status in the Mormon community as well"
talks about
Mimi Hall:
-friend of TA who TA had
"romantic interest in" and who would someday be his wife (according to electronic messages with his friends) -she didn't feel that way about TA- just friends (spring 2008)
-State called Mimi to talk about
"what a gentleman" TA was and that TA spoke about having
"stalker"
"Though he did not name this stalker the State presumably wanted to use this evidence to argue that Ms. Arias was stalking" TA
before L met Mimi, he
"had every reason to believe that she was a proper Mormon girl...followed the rules and presumed that everyone else did as well..shy person"
when he did meet her,
"presumptions that I had about her were confirmed"
"...what Ms. Hall had to say solidified my opinion that Ms. Hall was the kind of girl that Mr. Alexander could be a gentlemen with because he had Ms. Arias to handle those things that a proper Mormon girl would never do. In my mind this served as pretty clear evidence that Mr. Alexander was living a double life, he was telling people that Ms. Arias was a stalker while she was serving as his sexual outlet, an outlet to satiate him while he sought our a proper wife. Just my opinion of course, but please tell me how I am wrong. 'Facts are stubborn things'. " (pg. 133)
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Chapter 24
The State's Interview With Ms. Arias' Actual Guilt Phase Witnesses
Daniel and Desiree Freeman-
"who could speak to the way Mr. Alexander treated" the murderer- had
"opportunity to see this relationship in a different light than most have"
Dr Richard Samuels- "because Ms. Arias was claiming to have some memory issues, related to the few minutes in time during which she killed Mr. Alexander"
Expert on domestic violence- because the murderer was claiming DV
"Combined, these people along with Ms. Arias herself would all be providing pieces of the puzzle that would help Ms. Wilmott and I would make the arguement that Ms. Arias was acting in self-defense" (pg. 135)
State needed to show it wasn't self-defense-
"To some degree...would be attacking the conclusions of our experts"
L thought the tactics used in JM's interviews with these witnesses were designed not only to
"attack" them as experts, but as people too
-- JM, in interviews, was professional, calm, listened to answers, interviews took hours- L claims
"much longer than most prosecutors would take"
L claims JM disguised
"the bombastic nature of the attack to come"
"It appeared to me that he thought he was getting away with something during these interviews. However, the way I saw it, his reputation proceeded him in terms of his demeanor but to his credit over an interview ....., he would manage to trip a person up and use that later. In my mind, not what a prosecutor is suppose to do but this was expected because of who we were dealing with" (pg. 135)
L talks about
"a well-qualified domestic violence expert" with
"a PH.D in psychology"
- expert believed that the murderer was victim of dom. abuse in relationship with TA: reviewed lots of records, used psychological testing: expert did not take stand 1st trial
- L talks about how this expert would not
"give an inch" during JM's interview; made JM angry- she was in court with JM previously
"this expert knew his game": expert wouldn't back down that the murderer was abused by TA
L talks about
Dr. Samuels:
-longest interview that L ever saw; (L makes comment that JM worked many more hours than he did- JM worked non-stop-
"the taxpayers are getting their moneys worth" re: hours JM put in for his salary [
"and only in those terms"])
- L thinks Samuels is a
"learned psychologist...one of the kindest and most empathetic people I know"
- L claims that JM putting words into Samuel's mouth that
"would undermine his position"
-L claims that JM attacked Samuels in trial
"on a personal level"
- L talks about pic that TA took of the murderer's
"anus from a very close range, not her butt, but her anus"- Samuels thought/could have TA had a
"anal fixation" and said to Jm in interview that he couldn't diagnosis TA because he was
"deceased"- this angered JM who argued with Samuels for
"several minutes" (
"meaningless" to L because Samuels wasn't going to
"testify to this belief")
Prior domestic violence expert could not testify- then
ALV replaced her
"I liked Alyce as a person but this was not a good exchange for Ms. Arias"
-JM interviewed her for several hours- more time than with other experts (most of the time used was because of ALV's terrible handwriting- she had not type written a report
"..her conclusions were her beliefs based on what Ms. Arias had told her and we all know Ms. Arias had a history of lying" so they were not "subject to any legitimate challenge" by JM- couldn't prove ALV wrong
"What makes you, the trial watcher, so positive that Ms. LaViolette is wrong? What makes you, the trial watcher, think that you know more about domestic violence than" ALV?
L talks about
the Freemans:
-just because the murderer was calling them as her witnesses, that didn't mean they were for her/against TA
- L though they just wanted to tell what they knew
-interviewed in their parent's home (L always liked going to Freeman's home- whole family kind - had a
"great dog")
- JM asked Daniel about LDS religion and if he had
"any romantic interest" in the murderer
"..seemed to me that Mr. Martinez was convinced that the only people who were willing to testify for Ms. Arias were those who wanted to sleep with her" (pg. 139)
End of Section 3 (pg 139)
=========================
Next:
Section 4
Preparing for the Mitigation
Chapter 25
What is the Point of the Sentencing Phase and Mitigation
Chapter 26
The Mitigation Investigation by Prior Counsel
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