SIDEBAR #57 - Travis Alexander forum

[Wagara]

HAPPY BIRTHDAY WAGARA! I think of you often when I recall driving in that snowstorm earlier this year. Next time I am down that way, I am stopping by!

Thank you and do drop by! I'd love to say I'll have you some cake but I'm afraid the homemade chocolate and strawberry cake my best friend just sent me will be long gone!

 

[DEPUTYDAWG]

Zuri,

First, THANK YOU for taking the time to recap the Hughes' book! A lot of time, and I for one appreciated it!

Horse colic - oh boy, been there. I had a gelding colic back in 1982, and he had surgery (didn't know if he would survive long enough to make it to UC Davis) and had a long life afterwards. We were back showing him 5 months later.

My most favorite horse ever (I have had 8 in my life) was a mare I showed on a national level and then sold to Australia...she was there for 5 years, then had an impacted/twisted colon two months before she was scheduled to deliver a foal, and she died in the back on the trailer as they were trying to get her to the vets. Both she and the foal were not able to be saved.

I have also had to make the decision to euthanize a gelding that had navicular, I got him when he was a yearling, he was my baby.

Having gone through those emotions...I think you, fundamentally, know and "feel" when you have done all you can and the time comes. Do what you can do to help your guy be happy and living well...and when the time comes that he's in too much pain or in frequent pain with bouts, I think you'll know.

Hugs to you...there really is no easy answer. Hopefully he will improve and get over this current/recent bout and will settle in on a more "back to normal" routine and health, even if it means with other feed or medication options? I've had friends who have had colic-sensitive horses that have had many attacks but led long lives.

Just hugs and hope for you,

DD

 

[Caylee Advocate]

Thank you and do drop by! I'd love to say I'll have you some cake but I'm afraid the homemade chocolate and strawberry cake my best friend just sent me will be long gone!

What a beautiful cake, and if you notice that small indentation on the side, don't worry it is just from where I couldn't resist running my finger across it to get a taste. LOL. Happy Birthday and I hope it is a special one for you Wagara. :bdscroll:

 

[Zuri]

Points from "Picture Perfect" by Shanna Hogan

Shanna started following this crime from the onset, before it became national news. IIRC, she was one of the first to speak with the Alexander family and got a lot of the background and info that has been widely disseminated.

NB: Alot of the info in the beginning of the book has been covered in Sky's book, the trial and many other sources as well. I will try hopefully to just make points that might not be common knowledge.

Taylor Searle and Travis started an online clothing line while Taylor was a student at Arizona State. Taylor had the idea that women should wear clothing that wasn't mini skirts and belly shirts. Travis handled most of it as his PPL business was on auto pilot. They sold 500 shirts a month at their peak.

Travis refinanced his house in 2006, taking the $75K in equity and furnished and decorated his house, make some investments, travel and finance his lifestyle. (Travis had a Rolex too btw)

Travis was into athletics and ran on the treadmill, biked, hiked, lifted weights and did yoga. He didn't like to watch TV.

CMJA was disobedient as a child and often ran away from home, refusing to follow household rules. In her teens, things got worse and she became emotionally unstable. She rebelled, had mood swings of extreme anger and uncontrollable sadness and crying, threatening suicide many times. Her mother knew CMJA was dysfunctional, but not the extent until later. After her parents found her growing marajuana in Tupperware at age 14, Bill Arias called the cops and the cops searched her room. After that CMJA was wary of her parents and became closed off and secretive. When she was grounded, she would sneak out of the house. When she was caught, her parents disciplined her out of concern and CMJA interpreted the discipline as abuse.

As CMJA started dating at 15, she picked the "bad boys" that were controlling according to a friend. CMJA seemed to need a male to complete her (Jerry Maguire? Lol) and was rarely without a man. She first met Bobby Suarez at a State Fair and they rode a ride together. She ran into him again when she was a freshman in high school and he was a senior. She left school property everyday at lunch and met up with Bobby at the USA Gasoline station where Bobby would play video games and they would hold hands. Bobby was into Goth and vampires. Bobby got serious with CMJA very quickly according to CMJA and she loved him but didn't want to get that serious, so in early 1996, she broke up with him over the phone. She said he didn't take it well and tried to kill himself by slitting both wrists. He was institutionalized and they did not see each other for several years.

Summer of 1997- October 1997 she had a "relationship" with Victor Arias. It ended because he was the jealous type. Her "feelings" for Bobby returned and she reached out to him for "spiritual reasons" i.e. The rapture. He hung up on her twice and then talked to her. Their relationship became "romantic" in early 1998.

In early April 1998, Bill Arias got a call that CMJA skipped school. He went looking for her, found her and grounded her for 3 months. She moved out the next day. In the following years, CMJA became more erratic and her parents grew increasingly concerned. Bill confronted CMJA about her mental problems after one conversation and asked her if she thought she could be bipolar. She got really upset with him, so he hung up. She called back over and over until he finally answered and he told her he was kidding.

 

[Zuri]

Thank you and do drop by! I'd love to say I'll have you some cake but I'm afraid the homemade chocolate and strawberry cake my best friend just sent me will be long gone!

Well, I will just have to call ahead of time so she can make another one lol. Would love to meet her too!!! My DH and I were just talking about being in your are as we were in bumper to bumper traffic going to and from the Philly airport, dropping our DD#1 off. It was one of the first times I had seen a lot of cars and trucks slipping and sliding in the snow and ice in real time and careening into the sides and medians of I95.

I hope you have a wonderful day!

 

[MistyM]

Jodi Arias is not a mass murderer, but she shows characteristics of a wound collector or injustice collector. She has a lot of deep seated resentment and pent up anger. She could not let go about Travis Alexander, which happened on June 29, 2007. To her it was a crime on her ego. That gave her a sense of rejection and abandonment that burned for a year. Than on June 4, 2008, she kills Travis Alexander. It happened one year after the break up. Arias shows narcissistic, paranoid, passionate hatred, wound collector, violence as magic, lethal cocktail, and acting out. I do not know if Arias had any history of isolation. It is probable she did.

i was discussing this just a day ago, i love the term 'wound collector'. i completely think her 'fans' that are female really probably most likely don't believe her story but secretly 'worship' her for ridding the world of a man who fits some sort of archetype of a man who hurt them in the past. i suppose some of them do belive the pedophilia and abuse, as they experienced that behaviour from that jerk they wanted dead but didn't have the guts to kill, while others were cheated on, dumped because the men they dated recognized their little games, etc etc, et al.

jodi died for their sins! all hail mighty jodi.. the patron saint collector of male to female injustice!

(awesome posts, you guys!

:loveyou:


eta: the reason that injustice collector post blew me away is i've used the term 'karma redistribution specialist' when i've not done something good for someone who doesn't deserve it because they are *advertiser censored**wipes.

and omg zuri thanks for the summaries... very awesome!

 

[Zuri]

Picture Perfect Post #2 (PPP2)

It was important to CMJA to keep her public persona calm and collected, not full of low self esteem and depression that started in her teen years. She would "vent" her anger by yelling and as she claimed, could be very "destructive".

After Bobby's grandparents went to a nursing home, they lived in their home alone. She supported both of them by working 2 jobs, including the night shift. Bobby became addicted to those 900 number chat line calls (remember seeing the ads for them? Lol) and would stay up all night talking to a woman in Louisiana. CMJA thought Bobby and the LA woman were "just friends", but became suspicious and started reading his emails to investigate... She confronted Bobby with copies of the romantic emails and he apologized, but then things turned violent between them. CMJA was advised to leave him, but her heart still cared. In early 1999, they broke up. (And of course) CMJA continued to talk after she moved into her grandparents' home and she gave him another chance. Bobby moved to Oregon in with Matt McCartney and CMJA became close with him and his family. Once she and Bobby broke up, she started up with Matt. Dating Matt was one of the happiest experiences of her life CMJA claimed...

Lest we forget, in September 2001, CMJA was informed by some people in the restaurant she was working in that Matt was cheating on her with Bianca from Romania. She drove to Crater Lake to confront Bianca, then back to see Matt and confront him. She decided to move to Big Sur and work at the Ventana Inn as the memories of Medford, Oregon were just too painful a reminder of Matt. Yet she told Matt about a job opening there which he applied for and got. Both lived in staff housing.

After some time that She began working there and met Darryl... she grew to really be interested in him. Since they couldn't fraternize because he was a manager, Darryl resigned his position in 2002 and they began dating. (Most of this is being paraphrased from direct quotes from CMJA)

The book goes on to describe the beginning of their relationship, their first time sex after a ball game, and how she saved up $10K and was interested in investing in real estate. She took courses at the community college (Was this proven to be untrue?) in real estate and she and Darryl bought a house in Palm Desert where they both co-signed the mortgage. Her relationship with Darryl began to deteriorate when she decided she really wanted to get married and have kids. While working in a restaurant, a man gave here the PPL video which she watched some months later. She called Michelle Hagan and signed up for PPL.

 

[Zuri]

PP P3

The book describes CMJA and DB going their separate ways after CMJA met Travis, became more involved with PPL and Mormonism, CMJA defaulting on the mortgage. The most CMJA ever made was $1000 thru PPL. She attended all the PPL meetings and briefings and visited the Hughes with Travis.

Soon after Travis started his blog, she started hers and used many of the quotes Travis did. She started emulating his way of speaking and mannerisms. She mimicked Travis to come across as a go getter and successful professional. She stated that she and Travis were drawn to each other because they were "inspired visionaries". She transformed herself into someone she thought Travis would want to be with. As no one knew her before, no one was the wiser. People just thought they were a lot alike in their drive to succeed. (Ugh)

Before Darryl moved back to be closer to his son, he saw a lot of changes in CMJA. She had become more religious and wanted separate bedrooms as she was saving herself for her future husband. CMJA stopped paying bills and her half of the mortgage. Darryl never knew about Travis.

By late November 2006, CMJA perceived Travis becoming distant so she decided to convert to Mormonism. After she was baptized by him, Travis became more attentive. However, if he didn't call for several days she would panic. The Hughes started observing her bizarre, obsessive behavior and would witness her all over him. They thought she was using religion as a "perverse form of courtship".

The Hughes thought she was a chameleon and 100% fake. She wanted Travis to commit and ask her to move to AZ so they could take their relationship to the next level. Travis had told her he wasn't ready to be in a committed relationship and the Hughes knew this as well.

Her co-workers in Palm Desert noticed how consumed CMJA was with Travis. She would be out in the parking lot on the phone all the time, basically refusing to do her job. They said all she talked about was her new boyfriend and she was beyond infatuated, more obsessed. She told all the customers about Travis; consumed with him. Prior to meeting Travis she never knew what she was going to do or where she was going. After meeting him, she knew she wanted him and what he had.

When PPL was having an executive meeting in December 2006 in AZ, Travis invited a lot of people from Utah and California to stay at his home. When CMJA learned of this, she told Travis she wanted to come. He told her his house was full and she would have to stay elsewhere. She arrived at his door the night before and walked in and introduced herself as Travis' girlfriend. Travis quickly said she wasn't his girlfriend, but that they were just dating. As the night wore on, CMJA followed Travis from room to room. Travis slept in his office that night and CMJA never left, but slept under the Christams tree.

Travis reminded CMJA that they weren't exclusive so she tried to make Travis jealous by going out with other guys, Like Abe for example with the Magic in the Underwear story. CMJA made up stories about being persued constantly by men, when in fact it was CMJA that did the persuing, including married men.

CMJA would call Travis and tell him all about these guys wanting her and he was initially non plussed . She then escalated the stories. The Hughes observed that when Travis wasn't around, she would have a flat affect and was unemotional.

Clancy Talbot related that CMJA never talked about her past and would just morph into whoever was present and take on their personality. Travis' friends tolerated CMJA for his sake, but most didn't like her. An acquaintance of Travis's told him that she was going to ruin his life and business. Hmm ...

NEED ASSISTANCE!

I need help grammatically. Is it Travis' or Travis's? Hughes' or Hughes's? Any grammar nazis out there willing to help me? I don't want to look de-edifiedumacted.

 

[ICit]

de-edifiedumacted lol lol lol! Zuri made up a wonderful new word!

 

[Zuri]

de-edifiedumacted lol lol lol! Zuri made up a wonderful new word!

ICit, you are no help lol.

I am amazed auto correct didn't correct it. Maybe it did and I over rided it, Overrode it, done did that there.

 

[Tiger09]

It would be Travis's and the Hughes'. Unless it Chris (singular) or Sky (singular) . Then it's Chris Hughes's.

Plural (ends with s) , apostrophe after s and you're good. Singular and ends with s, apostrophe s.



Sent from my SM-T310 using Tapatalk

 

[GigiG]

How kind of you to ask. I dozed most of the night, expecting to get THAT dreaded phone call. Apparently, he was very uncomfortable and they had to start him on a lidocaine drip. Around 3 am, he passed a large amount of manure and all the gas was gone. He is as happy as a clam and was trailered back to the barn a short time ago.

I got a call from Dr. Southwood, the pre- eminent scholar on colic. She wanted to reassure me that any time was the right time to put him down; that I had gone above and beyond to treat this horse; there was nothing to lose at this point so to try some other things to see if we can get his colon calmed down.

Knox basically has Irritable Bowel Disease and Crohns. Not good in horses. Some horses will colic once and be done. Not mine. I realized some things had fallen through the cracks since 10/31/15 when he colicked and we were up all night with him at the barn. I need to be much more vigilant and make sure the changes are implemented and there is follow through. There was a miscommunication and I didn't realize that he had not resumed his normal schedule. I have left a lot of his care up to my daughter, but I realized yesterday that it was unfair to do so. I have a much better understanding of his condition than she does as it is not that far off from people medicine. I didn't ask her enough questions. My brain and memory has been so off as I come down off of the prednisone, that I forget then remember and then forget again.

It would be so much easier to put him down if he had a surgical condition. Each time he has colicked, he seems to come out of it so I haven't hesitated in treating it. This is the problem for me. If he has a chance, I take it. And yes, it costs me a lot of money over the long run, but he is happy when the colic is gone and he feels better.

What would you all do? Would you continue to treat him? I keep trying to find a solution to keep him from getting these bad episodes, but I can't control the weather which has a profound effect and causes many horses to colic. There were 4 other horses that were admitted to New Bolton after Knox. The weather has been warm and cool and very unseasonable.

I have been waiting to put him down until he gets a really bad colic episode and nothing works. I don't know if this is the right thing to do anymore. How can I put down a horse that is happy except when he colics?

Can you tell I am exhausted lol? Thank you for your jingles and hugs. They mean so very much. Sorry for the long post too.

BBM

I am of the school of thought that says we should treat our animals just as well as we do our children. Once we "adopt" them, we basically commit to taking care of them for the rest of their lives. For better or worse.

I know all too well that the costs can be exorbitant, but I believe animals have a great sense of gratitude to those who provide for them. Both of you have come through this so many times and he must know -- on some level -- that he owes his life and well-being to you.

I think that if he could speak he would thank you for being such a constant comfort to him in his times of need. I also think you should continue to do what you can as the financial situation allows.

That said, I think you will know -- deep in your heart -- when/if the time comes that it's more that he should be asked to endure...

JMO

 

[GigiG]

It would be Travis's and the Hughes'. Unless it Chris (singular) or Sky (singular) . Then it's Chris Hughes's.

Plural (ends with s) , apostrophe after s and you're good. Singular and ends with s, apostrophe s.



Sent from my SM-T310 using Tapatalk

It seems to me that the jury is out on this one. Having worked many years at a major newspaper, as well as at several magazines, I have always followed whatever stylebook a particular publication uses, but they differ wildly. It seems to me that the current trend is to use an apostrophe after the "s" without adding another "s."

For historical reference: We don't say, "In Jesus's name, amen;" we say, "In Jesus' name, amen."

http://www.dailywritingtips.com/possessive-of-proper-names-ending-in-s/

However, sometimes it seems better to write the way you would speak, so if you don't feel comfortable saying "Travis'" (journals or whatever), and feel more comfortable saying "Travis's," you should go with that.

 

[Tiger09]

Eh I asked a friend who's a teacher and went with that

Sent from my SM-T310 using Tapatalk

 

[Niner]

It would be Travis's and the Hughes'. Unless it Chris (singular) or Sky (singular) . Then it's Chris Hughes's.

Plural (ends with s) , apostrophe after s and you're good. Singular and ends with s, apostrophe s.

Okay - I'm only up to this post, and someone else might have mentioned this..

but the way I learned it. If a name/noun ends in "s" and is possessive than only an apostrophe after the "s". I went to school from 1954 to 1965, so what do I know...

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

Just one more thing: :stormingmad:

I had some comments on Lawrence's following statements:


"...what Ms. Hall had to say solidified my opinion that Ms. Hall was the kind of girl that Mr. Alexander could be a gentlemen with because he had Ms. Arias to handle those things that a proper Mormon girl would never do. In my mind this served as pretty clear evidence that Mr. Alexander was living a double life, he was telling people that Ms. Arias was a stalker while she was serving as his sexual outlet, an outlet to satiate him while he sought our a proper wife. Just my opinion of course, but please tell me how I am wrong. 'Facts are stubborn things'. " (pg. 133)


I haven't commented too much on Lawrence's words so far in his book because I was waiting to read the complete book, I know these are his thoughts, and he has a right to his thoughts, but this paragraph has made me very angry and I'm telling him he was/is wrong.

I think that Travis would have considered marrying the murderer if she hadn't thrown "it" at him and had behaved "like a proper Mormon girl". Blaming Travis is so wrong, IMO. The murderer knew what "a proper Mormon girl" should act like, but she thought she could keep Travis tied to her by "throwing 'it' at him every chance she got. Well she was wrong. She acted just like a prostitute because in the Morman faith, women did not act the way she did and she knew the rules. Of course when Travis found out what the murderer really was, he knew she was not marrying material for him and continued to look for a Mormon wife who followed the rules and was more in line with the Mormon faith.

Where was there "evidence" that Travis was living a double life? Because he didn't broadcast his sex life with his Mormon friends? That's not evidence, IMO.

Travis was duped by the murderer and she wouldn't stay away from him. She. was. his. stalker. and the worst thing that ever happened to him (may he rest in peace). :candle:

Lawrence's "facts" are skewed in this instance, IMO.

Just saying

Nurmi didn't like JM taking his time in interviews because he'd catch the defense witnesses in a lie ? Seems like Juan was and doing his job.

He had no reason to put DeAnna or the bishop through what he did. He can talk and write till the cows come home, but he and mdlr will always b known as Jodi's toadie

toad·y tōdē

noun

plural noun: toadies
1.
a person who behaves obsequiously to someone important.
synonyms: sycophant, brown-noser, lickspittle, flatterer, flunky, lackey, trained seal, doormat, stooge, cringer; informalbootlicker, suck-up, yes-man; vulgar slangkiss-*advertiser censored*, *advertiser censored*-kisser "a conniving little toady"


There is a world of difference between Lisa, Mimi , the other women, and Jodi and how she was treated. Jodi and Jodi alone was responsible for that.

 

[YESorNO]

Just found this on Twitter, if anyone is interested:


Nancy GraceVerified account ‏@NancyGraceHLN 3h3 hours ago
EXCLUSIVE: Kirk Nurmi says #JodiArias tried to manipulate him! More tonight at 8 p.m. ET! http://bit.ly/1LJt2bh


Be afraid Lawrence- be very afraid :whip:


:floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

 

[GigiG]

Points from "Picture Perfect" by Shanna Hogan

Shanna started following this crime from the onset, before it became national news. IIRC, she was one of the first to speak with the Alexander family and got a lot of the background and info that has been widely disseminated.

NB: Alot of the info in the beginning of the book has been covered in Sky's book, the trial and many other sources as well. I will try hopefully to just make points that might not be common knowledge.

Taylor Searle and Travis started an online clothing line while Taylor was a student at Arizona State. Taylor had the idea that women should wear clothing that wasn't mini skirts and belly shirts. Travis handled most of it as his PPL business was on auto pilot. They sold 500 shirts a month at their peak.

Travis refinanced his house in 2006, taking the $75K in equity and furnished and decorated his house, make some investments, travel and finance his lifestyle. (Travis had a Rolex too btw)

Travis was into athletics and ran on the treadmill, biked, hiked, lifted weights and did yoga. He didn't like to watch TV.

CMJA was disobedient as a child and often ran away from home, refusing to follow household rules. In her teens, things got worse and she became emotionally unstable. She rebelled, had mood swings of extreme anger and uncontrollable sadness and crying, threatening suicide many times. Her mother knew CMJA was dysfunctional, but not the extent until later. After her parents found her growing marajuana in Tupperware at age 14, Bill Arias called the cops and the cops searched her room. After that CMJA was wary of her parents and became closed off and secretive. When she was grounded, she would sneak out of the house. When she was caught, her parents disciplined her out of concern and CMJA interpreted the discipline as abuse.

As CMJA started dating at 15, she picked the "bad boys" that were controlling according to a friend. CMJA seemed to need a male to complete her (Jerry Maguire? Lol) and was rarely without a man. She first met Bobby Suarez at a State Fair and they rode a ride together. She ran into him again when she was a freshman in high school and he was a senior. She left school property everyday at lunch and met up with Bobby at the USA Gasoline station where Bobby would play video games and they would hold hands. Bobby was into Goth and vampires. Bobby got serious with CMJA very quickly according to CMJA and she loved him but didn't want to get that serious, so in early 1996, she broke up with him over the phone. She said he didn't take it well and tried to kill himself by slitting both wrists. He was institutionalized and they did not see each other for several years.

Summer of 1997- October 1997 she had a "relationship" with Victor Arias. It ended because he was the jealous type. Her "feelings" for Bobby returned and she reached out to him for "spiritual reasons" i.e. The rapture. He hung up on her twice and then talked to her. Their relationship became "romantic" in early 1998.

In early April 1998, Bill Arias got a call that CMJA skipped school. He went looking for her, found her and grounded her for 3 months. She moved out the next day. In the following years, CMJA became more erratic and her parents grew increasingly concerned. Bill confronted CMJA about her mental problems after one conversation and asked her if she thought she could be bipolar. She got really upset with him, so he hung up. She called back over and over until he finally answered and he told her he was kidding.

BBM 1: I question her assertion that she broke up with Bobby. I don't question that he tried to commit suicide, but would tend to think it was more due to her behavior as it affected him...

BBM 2: Likewise, I question this assertion. Somehow, she was the one to break off every relationship? Don't think so.

I haven't read this book, but from what I've read about it, I do fault the author for taking many of JA's statements as true. From a purely logical point of view, the odds are very much against it...

 

[YESorNO]

And this is about JM's book:

Juror fell in love with Jodi Arias: prosecutor

"A juror in the Jodi Arias murder trial fell head-over-heels in love with the convicted killer during the proceedings, according to a new book by one of the prosecutors in the sensational case.

Prosecutor Juan Martinez does not name the lovesick juror in his book, “Conviction: The Untold Story of Putting Jodi Arias Behind Bars,” which is due out in January.

But an alternate juror who also served on the case fingered foreman Bill Zervakos, 71, one of the holdouts who voted against the death penalty for Arias...."

http://nypost.com/2015/11/30/juror-fell-in-love-with-jodi-arias-during-her-trial-prosecutor-says/

 

[YESorNO]

BBM 1:

I question her assertion that she broke up with Bobby. I don't question that he tried to commit suicide, but would tend to think it was more due to her behavior as it affected him...

BBM 2: Likewise, I question this assertion. Somehow, she was the one to break off every relationship? Don't think so.

I haven't read this book, but from what I've read about it, I do fault the author for taking many of JA's statements as true. From a purely logical point of view, the odds are very much against it...

BBM I read somewhere, when her book 1st came out, that she did write her book with the murderer's statements. I didn't want to read it- why bother? If anyone watched the trial, they knew all her lies already.