Small Details that are interesting in the Cooper Harris case, #1

[LisaB]

Question: How would they know that the adjustment was the tightest one, I mean, know that independent of what Ross told them? It was Ross who undid it and placed him on the pavement. I know zero about child car seats, but I'm sure most posters are familiar with them. TY JMO

There are different slots in the back that the straps can be threaded through. Have you ever gotten in a car and found the prior user had left the lap belt really tight or really loose? It doesn't re-adjust itself any more than a car seat does. The way the police found it is the way it was set.

 

[LisaB]

He actually demonstrated IMO to the court that as he leaned down to the point where his head might get inside the frame of the car, RH turned his head to the left which meant his face and eyes were NOT viewing the interior of the car. So whether his head was below the frame or above the frame of the car makes no difference,his line of sight was not the interior of the car which I think was Stoddard's point in the testimony on that subject.

The subjective point of the "discrepancy" is that Stoddard interprets that head turning just as his head approached the frame of the car as making sure he could not see the son he knew was dead or dying in the car. While the defense wants to claim - see, his eyeline was above the car and so he probably would not have had a chance to see his dead or dying baby. Same point, very different interpretations. ....

BBM


Ross' lunchtime visit to car - Are both state & defense saying based Ross' head position, he could not have seen baby in back seat?

IOW
is state implying Ross made a deliberate head turn, so could not see baby, but poss could still smell odor of baby.

IOW
Is defense implying Ross (w head outside/above car frame)could not see baby
and is leading up to, later, at trial, implying could not have smelled odor of baby.

Anyone?

If it was super hot in the car when I opened the door, the natural reaction would be to turn my face away from the heat blasting out.

 

[LisaB]

Following along the Forgotten Baby Syndrome -
I know a married couple who both forgot their child at the babysitters, even after they got home later on in the evening from work (I was at their house).
It was only a four person business, we worked together - the couple, myself and one other person.
The babysitter was my sister, so I should of been the reminder (all day/evening) of their child.
When I was leaving to go home (from their own house) I asked who's going to be picking up their son?
They both looked dumbfounded and shocked, they both didn't think about him not being there. They both forgot about their son.

Even though they went back to their own home from work, being in an environment of where the child lived, toys all around etc.
Plus I was with them which should of been a reminder that my sister had their son. They still forgot.
They couldn't even use the excuse, I thought you picked him up, because they were together all day.
Would not have believed it if it wasn't for my very own experience.

I may have a little different perspective of someone forgetting their child due to this, but personally, I still don't quite get it.
I know the outcome (Rest in peace Cooper) and circumstances (left in hot car) are different, but the act of forgetting your child was not.
This couple both forgot, not intentionally, and no harm was done. I'm glad their boy was not misplaced elsewhere.

Wow. I would have never thought this could happen, but your story seems like something that really could happen to anyone... in spite of a lot of reminders of the child. Luckily he was in a safe place!

 

[LisaB]

Alrighty then. I unexpectedly spit a little java on the screen when chuckling this morning.

Cooper's seat's straps were already adjusted/readjusted when Cooper was placed into the infant seat of the Hyundai while at his home. JHR was home alone with Cooper from 7:15a until they departed at 9ish. I truly hope Cooper watched cheerful videos that morning. AMOHOpinion

The other HD guys did not work at the same bldg as JRH. JRH worked in the annex. I thought he walked to meet the guys to go for lunch at Publix, iirc.

What was the crucial reason about dropping off the HD vanity light bulbs? Let's think about why JRH thought it important to drop off a box of lightweight, non-cumbersome, non-perishable vanity lightbulbs at his vehicle instead of taking the bag to his cubicle/desk and grabbing them, along w/his laptop, when leaving work to go to the movie?

moo

Why... I'd imagine it was so he would not FORGET THEM!!!!

 

[gngr~snap]

There are different slots in the back that the straps can be threaded through. Have you ever gotten in a car and found the prior user had left the lap belt really tight or really loose? It doesn't re-adjust itself any more than a car seat does. The way the police found it is the way it was set.

http://carseatblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/KF

All posts are MOO

 

[osu]

Baby dies after being left in hot car in Kansas
Posted: Jul 25, 2014 12:02 PM EDT
Updated: Jul 25, 2014 12:02 PM EDT
By Associated Press

Police say a 10-month-old girl has died after being left in a hot car outside a house in south Wichita.

Officers found the girl unresponsive inside the car Thursday evening. She was pronounced dead a short time later.

Police say the child was in the car for about two hours. She was the foster child of two men. The car was parked outside their home. Police took the men in for questioning.

The National Weather Service says the high temperature was 90 degrees on Thursday.

Police were expected to release more information on the case at a briefing Friday morning.

http://www.wfla.com/story/26113510/baby-dies-after-being-left-in-hot-car-in-kansas

 

[Kadoober]

"When I got closer, I thought it was a doll. And about three or four feet away, I noticed it was the body of a toddler. Right then my heart dropped because I saw this precious boy laying there lifeless," Madden said. "The father, Mr. Ross, had just given his child CPR and about two other people came near to assist. As I got closer, you could just hear his cries and his desperate for his son to be revived. He was saying, 'Oh my god, oh my god. My son is dead. Oh my god, my son is dead.' It sounded as if he was saying it out of hurt and disappointment, desperation. He was yelling, he was hollering, he was screaming."

BBM.

This is the only person to have stated that RH gave Cooper CPR, correct?
If he is noting his approach to the scene, how can he speak to something that has ended? KWIM?

 

[UESwifey]

I'm so in and out of this thread, but thank you so much for those of you taking the time to make everything easier to understand! I'm just glad that somebody is actually saying that the length of time this baby was left in the car is unusual and suspicious. I was literally at a loss when I first read about this story and it said RH was mentioning little Cooper in text messages and returning to the car to throw the light bulbs in. All those small things should have reminded a rational, non-criminal person that their baby was in the car. Come on.

‘What Made It Unusual Is The Length Of Time That He Was Left In The Car’: Mental Health Pro Analyzes Aspects Of Ross Harris’ Conduct In Hot Car Death
http://popfix.net/what-made-it-unus...ects-of-ross-harris-conduct-in-hot-car-death/

 

[Cinnamon]

"When I got closer, I thought it was a doll. And about three or four feet away, I noticed it was the body of a toddler. Right then my heart dropped because I saw this precious boy laying there lifeless," Madden said. "The father, Mr. Ross, had just given his child CPR and about two other people came near to assist. As I got closer, you could just hear his cries and his desperate for his son to be revived. He was saying, 'Oh my god, oh my god. My son is dead. Oh my god, my son is dead.' It sounded as if he was saying it out of hurt and disappointment, desperation. He was yelling, he was hollering, he was screaming."

BBM.

This is the only person to have stated that RH gave Cooper CPR, correct?
If he is noting his approach to the scene, how can he speak to something that has ended? KWIM?

BBM2. IIRC, yes, he is the only one who stated that RH gave CPR. IIRC, it was the first witness (AG, not sure of spelling of last name, but first name starts with "A") on the scene who gave CPR, and while witness was giving CPR, RH walked to the other side of the vehicle to make phone calls. My notes/links are on my home computer, will verify/provide links later when I get home.

Oh, and welcome, Kadoober!!! :wave:

 

[PaperDoll]

For the posters who are wondering if RH forgot to buckle Cooper in his car seat; RH told LE he strapped him in tight. Also, RH told LE he discovered Cooper when he was going to make a right turn (he turned his head to the right), so if Cooper wasn't strapped in his seat, where was he when RH discovered him?

 

[tlcya]

another poster suggested that maybe the parents were strapping him in the car itself with a seatbelt and not the car seat. I do not think that is the case.

 

[LisaB]

Was your child laying on the ground dead? And instead of trying to render aid to him/her you were on the phone. And when the LEO wanted to ask you questions about how your child died, did you tell them to shut the fu** up?

NO! My point was only that the police understood my need to make a call even in the case of a minor accident. I would be surprised that they did not think he might need to notify someone of what had happened.

 

[CHERIE.T]

The little thing fo me that can't be disputed is jh forgetting his son in the very few seconds it took to drive from CFA. No way he forgot Cooper in that short a drive.

 

[CCmakes3]

For the posters who are wondering if RH forgot to buckle Cooper in his car seat; RH told LE he strapped him in tight. Also, RH told LE he discovered Cooper when he was going to make a right turn (he turned his head to the right), so if Cooper wasn't strapped in his seat, where was he when RH discovered him?

Those who think Cooper wasn't buckled in seem to acknowledge that Ross TOLD the police this, but for some reason they think Ross was either mistaken, lying or that Cooper unbuckled himself. It is my understanding they also believe that although Cooper was not buckled in, he remained in the seat voluntarily. I'm not sure why, or why it matters, but it is a big issue for some posters.

Eta: Or perhaps they think LE is lying about Ross telling them that he strapped Cooper in.

 

[EvilSoup]

The only thing that would make this helpful to Ross is if he THOUGHT he buckled the baby in but forgot to do so, then the child slid out of the seat before they got to HD, and thus was not IN the car seat when Ross looked back to be sure he had dropped him off. But even Ross didn't think fast enough to come up with that one..

Now see, THAT would be a believable lie. Except for the rigor in seated position.

I really feel Ross was waving a hinky banner to the cops with his over-the-top screaming, yet leaving his baby on the concrete and talking on the phone. Then all those details about snuggling watching cartoons, strapping in tight, kissing in case he dies (seriously, WTF with THAT? )---they were all just a big "I'm such an awesome dad! Please send donations to .....".

Ross thought he had the cops snowed. His act certainly worked on his many supporters those first couple of weeks. And my gut feeling is that if Ross hadn't acted like such a horse's butt, LE might have believed the grieving father act, too. I think maybe even the sexting, while embarrassing, wouldn't have appeared as nefarious if the rest of the story and Ross' behavior seemed more real. No offense to LE, but Ross certainly had precedent on his side. Maybe I'm wrong and the cops would have seen through even a good act, but I think Ross screwed himself.

And.....on another note, I ashamed to say, one time, when driving to my in-laws a few blocks over, I did not buckle in my newborn.

It was a super cold day and I had bundled her up, then lay a blanket over her in the carseat.( I knew the car wouldn't warm up enough during such a short trip.) My MIL called again to ask where I was, so in a hurry, I went out to the car, clicked the seat into the base, and drove over.

Once I got to my MIL's and brought the baby inside, I took off her blanket and realized she was only SITTING in the seat, and not buckled in! I like to have died on the spot!

After that, I kept a blanky in the car and only covered her once I had her buckled in and snapped into the base.

 

[LisaB]

Babies who are not potty trained cannot get in any water activity on a Carnival Cruise.

I am well aware of that. I do not know if Ross knew or not. But supposedly Ross wanted to choose a kid-friendly cruise and the waterslide was the feature that made him consider this cruise to be such. Obviously he was wrong or planned to bail out on the plans (he could not really afford anyway) at the last minute when he found the baby could not use the facilities. Maybe he figured he'd get them all on the ship and leave Leanna with Cooper when they "found out" Cooper could not use the pool, and be free to do what he wanted.

 

[Inthedetails]

Those who think Cooper wasn't buckled in seem to acknowledge that Ross TOLD the police this, but for some reason they think Ross was either mistaken, lying or that Cooper unbuckled himself. It is my understanding they also believe that although Cooper was not buckled in, he remained in the seat voluntarily. I'm not sure why, or why it matters, but it is a big issue for some posters.

One reason posters may be questioning it because not being buckled in could indicate the baby was killed elsewhere and then placed in the car. I do not believe this is what happened for one second, but confirming the buckle helps confirm the baby was alive when put in the car seat.

While I don't think the baby died anywhere but in that car, I do appreciate it when assumptions are questioned.

 

[EvilSoup]

http://carseatblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/KF

All posts are MOO

Ahhh, yes! That looks like a perfectly fine setting for a 22-month-old........

If he weighed 6 lbs. and was 18 inches long. :facepalm:

Poor baby.

 

[CHERIE.T]

If it was super hot in the car when I opened the door, the natural reaction would be to turn my face away from the heat blasting out.

IMO, the smell from inside of the car made him not look inside.

 

[Ruby]

For the posters who are wondering if RH forgot to buckle Cooper in his car seat; RH told LE he strapped him in tight. Also, RH told LE he discovered Cooper when he was going to make a right turn (he turned his head to the right), so if Cooper wasn't strapped in his seat, where was he when RH discovered him?

I was under the impression RH noticed Cooper when he was switching lanes, not making a right turn?
To me, this is a small detail that does interest me - IMO there's a difference in body movement to switch to right lane, than there is to just turn right.

:couch: