South Africa - Anni Dewani, 28, shot to death, Gugulethu, 13 Nov 2010 #1

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“The Internet and Shrien's tortured inner world”

“Perhaps the most startling and perplexing admission in the Cape High Court murder trial of Shrien Dewani this week was that he visited gay dating and fetish websites a day after his bride Anni had been murdered. What are we to make of Dewani’s behaviour? Did he, either driven by guilt or anxiety, return to the one place he felt the safest and entirely able to be his true self, the Internet?”

http://ewn.co.za/2014/10/10/OPINION...al&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer
He was surfing gay websites just before the honeymoon as well. If he'd planned Anni's murder, I don't see that 'guilt' or 'anxiety' would have been the motivation to revisit those websites, but rather a feeling that he'd done what 'needed' to be done, and could carry on as normal, like OP.
 
He was surfing gay websites just before the honeymoon as well. If he'd planned Anni's murder, I don't see that 'guilt' or 'anxiety' would have been the motivation to revisit those websites, but rather a feeling that he'd done what 'needed' to be done, and could carry on as normal, like OP.

I agree, he and OP just carry on as normal, they get what they want when they want it, a 'little' hiccup like a murder is not going to stop them.


Dewani uses the internet to supplement his desires when he can't get the real deal, he watches *advertiser censored* and arranges meet-ups. He was cruising on his phone while sitting with Anni at the airport on the way to South Africa! :mad:
 
“The Internet and Shrien's tortured inner world”

“Perhaps the most startling and perplexing admission in the Cape High Court murder trial of Shrien Dewani this week was that he visited gay dating and fetish websites a day after his bride Anni had been murdered. What are we to make of Dewani’s behaviour? Did he, either driven by guilt or anxiety, return to the one place he felt the safest and entirely able to be his true self, the Internet?”

http://ewn.co.za/2014/10/10/OPINION...al&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

"Earlier in the week Dewani had told the court that he is bisexual and that his “relations” with men “were mostly physical experiences or email chats with people I met online or in clubs, including prostitutes such as Leopold Leisser. My sexual interactions with females were usually during the course of a relationship which consisted of other activities and emotional attachment.”

He says his relations with men were physical. What does he mean then that his "sexual relations" with females consisted of "other activities". Sexual relations have to be physical. Until the DT bring forward a woman who will admit to having sexual intercourse as opposed to "other activities", I won't believe that he's ever engaged in sex with a woman. If this is the case, it's totally unbelievable that, according to Anni's message to Sneha, they "did it" five times in one night, unless of course they were one minute wonders. Even then, being gay, not bisexual, I would have thought the mere thought of it would have repulsed him and he'd be totally incapable of doing it more than once, if at all.
 
"Earlier in the week Dewani had told the court that he is bisexual and that his “relations” with men “were mostly physical experiences or email chats with people I met online or in clubs, including prostitutes such as Leopold Leisser. My sexual interactions with females were usually during the course of a relationship which consisted of other activities and emotional attachment.”

He says his relations with men were physical. What does he mean then that his "sexual relations" with females consisted of "other activities". Sexual relations have to be physical. Until the DT bring forward a woman who will admit to having sexual intercourse as opposed to "other activities", I won't believe that he's ever engaged in sex with a woman. If this is the case, it's totally unbelievable that, according to Anni's message to Sneha, they "did it" five times in one night, unless of course they were one minute wonders. Even then, being gay, not bisexual, I would have thought the mere thought of it would have repulsed him and he'd be totally incapable of doing it more than once, if at all.

I have never seen that in writing. Do you have a link please?

I found a link.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/shrien-dewani-murdered-bride-anni-3407022

I think Anni could have been so frustrated with the situation that she could have been sarcastic and exaggerated. Maybe it was supposed to be a joke!
 
"Earlier in the week Dewani had told the court that he is bisexual and that his “relations” with men “were mostly physical experiences or email chats with people I met online or in clubs, including prostitutes such as Leopold Leisser. My sexual interactions with females were usually during the course of a relationship which consisted of other activities and emotional attachment.”

He says his relations with men were physical. What does he mean then that his "sexual relations" with females consisted of "other activities". Sexual relations have to be physical. Until the DT bring forward a woman who will admit to having sexual intercourse as opposed to "other activities", I won't believe that he's ever engaged in sex with a woman. If this is the case, it's totally unbelievable that, according to Anni's message to Sneha, they "did it" five times in one night, unless of course they were one minute wonders. Even then, being gay, not bisexual, I would have thought the mere thought of it would have repulsed him and he'd be totally incapable of doing it more than once, if at all.

You are probably right, but his statement can be interpreted in a way that makes sense.

his relations with men were mostly physical experiences or email chats with people he met online or in clubs
= When he says physical, he means in contrast to the email chats which are not physical.

sexual interactions with females were usually during the course of a relationship which consisted of other activities and emotional attachment
= Other activities meaning going out together, spending time together, all the non-sexual things couples do in a relationship; whereas the contacts with men were solely sexual and did not involve any friendly or emotional relationships.
 
You are probably right, but his statement can be interpreted in a way that makes sense.

his relations with men were mostly physical experiences or email chats with people he met online or in clubs
= When he says physical, he means in contrast to the email chats which are not physical.

sexual interactions with females were usually during the course of a relationship which consisted of other activities and emotional attachment
= Other activities meaning going out together, spending time together, all the non-sexual things couples do in a relationship; whereas the contacts with men were solely sexual and did not involve any friendly or emotional relationships.

I don't see how they can be misinterpreted. The other activities, as you say, are non-sexual, but he said his "sexual interactions". To me this doesn't imply simply meeting women and doing things couples do. If that is what he meant, he should have said "my interactions ..." JMO
 
I don't see how they can be misinterpreted. The other activities, as you say, are non-sexual, but he said his "sexual interactions". To me this doesn't imply simply meeting women and doing things couples do. If that is what he meant, he should have said "my interactions ..." JMO

No, I read it as sexual interactions AND other activities AND emotional attachment - all of those elements.

I think he meant to say "sexual interactions with females were usually during the course of a relationship which also included other activities and emotional attachment". In other words, a normal loving relationship.

Let me be clear, I don't necessarily believe him. It's just that I think I understand what he is trying to convey. That for him, sex with a woman is part of a genuine relationship, but sexual shenanigans with men is just for thrills.




(sorry, but I can't help but giggle when I have to press "submit") :floorlaugh:
 
"Earlier in the week Dewani had told the court that he is bisexual and that his “relations” with men “were mostly physical experiences or email chats with people I met online or in clubs, including prostitutes such as Leopold Leisser. My sexual interactions with females were usually during the course of a relationship which consisted of other activities and emotional attachment.”

<respectfully snipped>

it's totally unbelievable that, according to Anni's message to Sneha, they "did it" five times in one night, unless of course they were one minute wonders. Even then, being gay, not bisexual, I would have thought the mere thought of it would have repulsed him and he'd be totally incapable of doing it more than once, if at all.

BIB Is it possible that Dewani sent that message on Anni's phone? Hypothetically sent to create the veneer of heterosexuality? Depending upon dates, post mortem examination of Anni may be able to establish this fact or not IMO.
 
BIB Is it possible that Dewani sent that message on Anni's phone? Hypothetically sent to create the veneer of heterosexuality? Depending upon dates, post mortem examination of Anni may be able to establish this fact or not IMO.

That is my opinion too, and if it was him who sent it, he positively knew Anni would not be coming back to the hotel alive. I hope we get to find out what time that message was sent.
 
The lurid details of Dewani’s alleged double life are set out in a statement by Leopold Leisser, a British resident also known as “the German Master”, who claimed in his statement that Dewani had told him during one of their alleged sessions that he felt forced into marriage.

A third and last session with Dewani took place on April 17, 2010, in London at the Presidential Kensington Apartments in Earl’s Court, the man claimed.

“Dewani looked different this time,” Leisser told detectives about the last time he met Dewani, an occasion which he said involved “no limits” humiliation and drug taking.

Leisser said he noticed Dewani “was not 100 percent okay”, and asked if everything was in order. “He said it was all fine. He then said that he had to tell me something. He either told me that he was engaged or was about to become engaged and that he has to get married. I said that was fine, that a lot of my clients are married, which isn’t a problem. I said if he felt comfortable, he could have a double life, maybe see me a couple of times a year.

“He said that she was a nice, lovely girl and that he liked her, but that he could not break out of it in any way because he would be disowned by the family. He also said that he needs to find a way out of it. He also told me that he had met another guy previously, that he could have fallen for him and he came close to telling his family about it, but didn’t.”

The following morning Leisser gathered his gear and said goodbye.

“He was different in the morning. Very grumpy, rude even, and hardly spoke to me, which was unusual. Normally I get that from clients who are married, as they feel guilty after the session. I took the £400 which was left on the table the previous evening and left.”

This third visit with LL was very revealing imo, SD opens up about his impending marriage and that if he calls it off, will be disowned by his family.
LL suggests living a double life like his other married clients but this doesn't go over too well with SD, imo.

SD confides in LL that he met 'the one', a guy who he obviously loved so much, he was nearly prepared to tell his family about it. To me this reveals he wants to live with and have sex with a man, he never wants to live with a woman and could never have a 'double life'. I think he hates women. There are many gay guys who like women's company, there are some who don't, and SD is one of them.

LL says that in the morning, after the night SD had bared his soul, he was grumpy and rude. LL says some married clients can be like this, they feel guilt.
Imo, SD was this way because LL didn't offer any better alternatives than to live a 'double life' . I think SD was devastated by this response, as it is what his parents want him to do also. He obviously wanted to hear something else. SD, somewhere between then and the honeymoon, concocted the solution that would appease his parents and enable him to live with a man he fancied.

jmo

http://www.iol.co.za/news/crime-courts/dewani-rent-boy-tells-all-1.1759985#.VDs3GmeSyfU
 
RAHIMA ESSOP@rahimaessop#DewaniTrial

VZ: at 20:04 that Saturday evening, Mblombo again called you for 31 sec. Why? And why did you call him? Qwabe: Don't recall.

VZ: at 21:10 for 46 sec, again he called you. What did you talk about? Qwabe: I don't recall.

VZ: why did you call him at 21:15? Qwabe: don't recall exactly what was said.


Qwabe holding long white scroll of paper,a timeline of sorts,in witness box as VZ goes through records of calls between him&middle man Monde
 
RAHIMA ESSOP@rahimaessop#DewaniTrial

VZ: why were there all these calls. Can you explain? Qwabe: NO.

VZ: at 21:50 Mbolombo calls you for 88sec. I presume you don't know what this call was about? Qwabe: Don't know.

VZ: so the 88 second call was just before you stopped the vehicle (hijacking).

Mbolombo contacted Qwabe on Sunday morning too.

VZ at 11:58 Sunday he (Mbolombo) calls you for 11 sec, at 13:41 you call him.

VZ: there were calls between Mbolombo and Qwabe on Monday too.

Z: did you make any demands from Prosecution about your sentence if you give evidence?Qwabe: i asked what's in it for me.

Qwabe: this case is causing a lot of stress to me and my family.

Qwabe's legal aid wrote to Prosecution asking for parole after half his sentence served.

Qwabe used fact that he would give evidence as a mitigating factor, to get early parole.
 
Aislinn Laing @Simmoa

VZ raises the fact that during his evidence last week,Qwabe contacted the prosec to ask what his evidence was worth,poss earlier parole?

VZ says prosecutor Mr Mopp "quite correctly" supplied a letter he had his lawyer write to him asking for parole after half his sentence.

VZ says Mr Mopp also supplied his reply, saying his evidence would be taken into account, no more than that.

Qwabe says the fact that his giving evidence is putting him and his family under stress. Byword for witness intimidation?


RAHIMA ESSOP@rahimaessop#DewaniTrial

VZ: you asked for a reduction, which means you want parole after 12 years. Qwabe: that's what I asked.

VZ: your parole may to a degree depend on your cooperation and compliance with obligation associated with plea bargain.

VZ: accused will testify, the man with the gun was seated in the passenger seat. They were told to look down, lie down.

VZ: the man with gun at some point shouted, "phone" and "money". Qwabe: it's possible.

Dewani wiping away teas from his eyes, gulps. eyes red.

Dewani now really struggling in the dock. His brother gets a tissue ready,
 
RAHIMA ESSOP@rahimaessop#DewaniTrial

Shrien touches his ear, drops his head, still gulping, still crying.

Dewani very emotional as Mr Van Zyl questions Qwabe re moment he was forced out of the car, tears running down his face, gulping for air.

Shrien's lips twitching, eyes red, gulps as he stares at Qwabe talking about the night of the hijacking.


Shrien takes a sip of water, seems to be trying to compose himself.

Dewani takes several deep breaths



Aislinn Laing @Simmoa

Van Zyl: "Did you see where he was as you drove off?" Qwabe says no. Dewani's lips quiver, he's taking deep breaths and drinking water.

VZ of Dewani: "He never instructed Tongo or anyone else to kill his wife, that those who are testifying are not telling the truth."

Qwabe: "I cannot comment about what he and Zola were speaking about. Zola told us what he said, that he wanted the wife killed."

Mr Van Zyl has finished and Mr Mopp back up. Mr Mopp asks Qwabe about Van Zyl's theory that Anni might have been kidnapped "for ransom".

Mr Mopp: "You concede that there was poor planning, but was the objective achieved?" Qwabe: "Yes sir."

Mopp: "Mr VZ is saying you shot her by mistake, by accident. Was it an accident?" Qwabe: "There was never anything about a ransom."
 
Aislinn Laing@Simmoa

Mr Mopp asks for early lunch adjournment.The judge says she;ll be lenient this time but that the court is expensive, they need to crack on

(Judge wants to get this moving, wonderful engagement with proceedings, what a difference it can make.)

That's Qwabe done. Early lunch break then the next witness will be called.


I spy a bit of a clash approaching: van Zyl, the barrister in the Dewani trial, goes head to head on timelines with Van Zyl Pistorius agent. LOL



RAHIMA ESSOP@rahimaessop

Judging by his line of questioning earlier,Shrien's lawyer is hinting that the hijackers wanted to kidnap Anni for ransom money

Next witness called. Simon Johnson.

Witness 3: Simon Johnson is from the UK.
 
RAHIMA ESSOP@rahimaessop

Witness was previously employed at Gaydar, a dating website for adults. Sexually charged environment.

Witness says Gaydar is targeted at gay and bisexual men. Offers "all manner of services" including chat rooms.

Johnson, a digital product manager for Gaydar.

Prosecutor asks witness if he gave police information about the profile of Asiansubguy.

Dewani joined Gaydar in 2004 as ASIANSUBGUY. Judge asks "Asian what?!" LOL, oh no, hope she won't be offended :p

Last log in on that profile was 21 November 2010.

On that day (21 Nov 2010) that profile was removed by the customer.
Johnson: when i checked if any emails were sent by the customer, not the case, suggesting customer removed profile.

So basically Dewani closed his own account.

Johnson explaining how a customer would remove the account.
Johnson: profile not accessible after removed.

Johnson: Dewani's profile selected "single gay man" to describe himself.



Aislinn Laing @Simmoa

Our next witness is Simon Johnson, a British man and IT expert who worked for Gaydar for "gay, bisexual men"
 
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