Spain Spain - Ana Knezevich, 40, from Florida, going through divorce, missing under suspicious circumstances on trip to Madrid, 5 Feb 2024 *Arrest*

[indicolite22]

New to the case -- were the English and Spanish messages both sent to the same person 2 hours apart? Were the messages sent to one specific person in Ana's phone? Were they sent to multiple people? What is her closeness/relationship with the people who did receive her text and would a stranger be able to determine who to text and about what?

The messages were sent to Ana's two close friends, the first message in English to a friend in Sweden and the Spanish version to a friend in Madrid.

 

[kaya3627]

The messages were sent to Ana's two close friends, the first message in English to a friend in Sweden and the Spanish version to a friend in Madrid.

They were sent using Whats App.... can anyone here test the Whats App translation feature?

 

[Charlot123]

Ana was using What's App to communicate. Anyone can login from anywhere w/ username + password.

Yes, and Ana’s friend, sadly, mentioned Ana not being seen on WhatsApp since that day. WhatsApp is considered safe. I checked mine - let me put it so, if someone sends me the message from Europe, it will show the time it was sent as PT, not the time where it was sent from. But intuitively, i feel that the messages were sent from Ana's phone, as whoever took her probably had access to her phone.

brother + friend Sanna

Ana had just spent two weeks with Sanna in Austria. I assume Sanna is still there. She stated she was a very close friend to Ana, that they communicated daily, and that the message (sent in English) immediately made Sanna worry. So much, in fact, that she called Madrid police on Sunday, but they said they had to wait till Monday. Ana was a reasonable, cautious woman and it would be out of her style for her just to take off with a barely known guy, Sanna said.

Two things are concerning. I can imagine a person being so lovestruck that she does something out of her usual style, but if Ana, indeed, was reasonable and cautious, she'd probably, still, leave some information about the person.

Second message was sent in Spanish to Ana's brother. If understand correctly, it did not look as if sent by Ana at all to him.

Upon reflection, what really surprises me is the fact that the messages are, essentially, identical! What bilingual person does it?? Languages exist to express yourself differently, especially if you are in love.

Think of it. You are sending a message to your GF. She knows you started dating - and this new guy is so cool that he deserves two exclamation marks. Won't you add something hinting at his looks? Absolutely, we are curious! "Cool" is not enough. Either "he looks like (*add some celebrity*), or "you know my taste", or some other details. And also you'd add some information about the place you are going to, given that the connection is spotty.

Now, sending a message to your brother. This is where you might say less about the looks but add more details about the direction, "south of Madrid", or "they water ski there", or "he drives your favorite car", or some details that a guy might be interested in. Now, there are guys who understand a lot and like to talk, my uncle was like this, but I'd still add, "smart and funny, like you." (You might have been dating Mr. Muy Chevere for a month without telling anyone, but now you have to explain why you decided to escape for the weekend.) You never send dry bones to people who are dear to you, be it English or Spanish. The gist of Ana's message is, "don't worry if I don't show up till Tuesday, the connection there is bad."

You will never copy/paste two similar messages in different languages. Sadly, now I am inclined to think both were sent by someone else.

I think they were both sent from her phone. Now, if the person who ordered the disappearance signs into WhatsApp, all that he sees is that 1) the work has started and 2) in two hours, it has been done. The customer doesn't need to know where she is.

 

[LadyL]

Oh it’s nothing major. “I’ll” is a word Spanish people struggle with when speaking English. “I will” far easier for them. I’ve seen this my whole life with my Spanish family, the famous example of Arnie in the Terminator preferring “I will be back” vs “I’ll be back.”

The fact that whoever wrote this uses both versions close together just seems a little odd to me. You would think a native English speaker would be consistently using “I’ll”.

interesting observation but the Arnie example confused me since he does say 'I'll be back' in the movie? (I'll be back - Wikipedia)

you made me curious so I checked back in texts between my husband and I - I found several texts with both versions used in the same text - I'm native English

 

[kaya3627]

Yes, and Ana’s friend, sadly, mentioned Ana not being seen on WhatsApp since that day. WhatsApp is considered safe. I checked mine - let me put it so, if someone sends me the message from Europe, it will show the time it was sent as PT, not the time where it was sent from. But intuitively, i feel that the messages were sent from Ana's phone, as whoever took her probably had access to her phone.



Ana had just spent two weeks with Sanna in Austria. I assume Sanna is still there. She stated she was a very close friend to Ana, that they communicated daily, and that the message (sent in English) immediately made Sanna worry. So much, in fact, that she called Madrid police on Sunday, but they said they had to wait till Monday. Ana was a reasonable, cautious woman and it would be out of her style for her just to take off with a barely known guy, Sanna said.

Two things are concerning. I can imagine a person being so lovestruck that she does something out of her usual style, but if Ana, indeed, was reasonable and cautious, she'd probably, still, leave some information about the person.

Second message was sent in Spanish to Ana's brother. If understand correctly, it did not look as if sent by Ana at all to him.

Upon reflection, what really surprises me is the fact that the messages are, essentially, identical! What bilingual person does it?? Languages exist to express yourself differently, especially if you are in love.

Think of it. You are sending a message to your GF. She knows you started dating - and this new guy is so cool that he deserves two exclamation marks. Won't you add something hinting at his looks? Absolutely, we are curious! "Cool" is not enough. Either "he looks like (*add some celebrity*), or "you know my taste", or some other details. And also you'd add some information about the place you are going to, given that the connection is spotty.

Now, sending a message to your brother. This is where you might say less about the looks but add more details about the direction, "south of Madrid", or "they water ski there", or "he drives your favorite car", or some details that a guy might be interested in. Now, there are guys who understand a lot and like to talk, my uncle was like this, but I'd still add, "smart and funny, like you." You might have been dating him for a month without telling anyone, but now you have to explain to people why you decided to escape for the weekend. You never send dry bones to people who are dear to you, be it English or Spanish. The gist of Ana's message is, "don't worry if I don't show up till Tuesday, the connection there is bad."

You will never copy/paste two similar messages in different languages. Sadly, now I am inclined to think both were sent by someone else.

I think they were both sent from her phone. Now, if the person who ordered the disappearance signs into WhatsApp, all that he sees is that 1) the work has started and 2) in two hours, it has been done. The customes doesn't need to know where she is.

Well stated! Hopefully the detectives look into if her Whats App account has been logged into since going missing.

 

[kaya3627]

interesting observation but the Arnie example confused me since he does say 'I'll be back' in the movie? (I'll be back - Wikipedia)

you made me curious so I checked back in texts between my husband and I - I found several texts with both versions used in the same text - I'm native English

English has a wide variety of grammar rules that are difficult for those learning it as another language. Just think of how many Americans don't even know the difference between their, there, and they're!

 

[ZaZara]

A Florida woman who went missing in Spain two weeks ago had started using dating app Bumble in the months before she vanished, DailyMail.com can exclusively reveal.

Investigators have tracked down at least two men that Ana Knezevich, 40, was chatting with before she was last seen outside her rented Madrid apartment on February 2.

Missing Florida woman was using Bumble before she disappeared in Spain

Sanna Rameau told DailyMail.com her best friend Ana Knezevich was ready to move on and was using Bumble, after making several attempts to reconcile with her now estranged husband David.

www.dailymail.co.uk

ETA: Some signs of trouble surfacing:

The couple had been embroiled in a number of recent lawsuits, including a bank taking them to court last year for allegedly defaulting on a $399,000 mortgage.

David was sued again last October for falling behind on a second, $435,000 mortgage, but both cases were dismissed.

DailyMail.com can also reveal that David sought restraining orders against two men in 2018 claiming that they had stalked and threatened to murder him.

BBM

A Florida woman who went missing in Spain two weeks ago had started using dating app Bumble in the months before she vanished


Also, Ana did most likely not stumble upon someone in the park last minute, IMO she bumbled upon him. On Bumble. (Where the term chévere may have been used.) Hence the need of the perp to deflect the attention from the app to a walk in the park after therapy, and this was done in the messages on Whatsapp.

Mr Bumble could well be the man with the casket who covered the security cameras with black paint. Would this have been the first time that he visited the premises and the street?

 

[FacelessPodcast]

interesting observation but the Arnie example confused me since he does say 'I'll be back' in the movie? (I'll be back - Wikipedia)

you made me curious so I checked back in texts between my husband and I - I found several texts with both versions used in the same text - I'm native English

Oh the story is that Schwarzenegger and James Cameron argued over the famous line. Arnie said that a robot would sound more robotic, lobbying for “I will be back” (though it’s suspected he stumbled on the “I’ll”. Cameron pointedly put him in his place and thus was born the famous catchphrase.

 

[kaya3627]

BBM

A Florida woman who went missing in Spain two weeks ago had started using dating app Bumble in the months before she vanished


Also, Ana did most likely not stumble upon someone in the park last minute, IMO she bumbled upon him. On Bumble. (Where the term chévere may have been used.) Hence the need of the perp to deflect the attention from the app to a walk in the park after therapy, and this was done in the messages on Whatsapp.

Mr Bumble could well be the man with the casket who covered the security cameras with black paint. Would this have been the first time that he visited the premises and the street?

An alternate headline could read:

A Florida woman who went missing in Spain two weeks ago is going through a Rough Divorce involving MILLIONS of Dollars - Husband refuses to cooperate + Fled to Serbia!

 

[kaya3627]

Oh the story is that Schwarzenegger and James Cameron argued over the famous line. Arnie said that a robot would sound more robotic, lobbying for “I will be back” (though it’s suspected he stumbled on the “I’ll”. Cameron pointedly put him in his place and thus was born the famous catchphrase.

Very interesting! How Arnold Schwarzenegger Almost Ruined His Signature Catchphrase

 

[LadyL]

New to the case -- were the English and Spanish messages both sent to the same person 2 hours apart? Were the messages sent to one specific person in Ana's phone? Were they sent to multiple people? What is her closeness/relationship with the people who did receive her text and would a stranger be able to determine who to text and about what?

[bbm]

that's a good point - she texted her brother (I think?) and her good friend, one to each
may be just the two top people showing in her message queue
or someone who knew her also knew who would be expecting to receive a text from her

 

[Seni]

Colombia not Columbia.pf

 

[Denise884]

interesting observation but the Arnie example confused me since he does say 'I'll be back' in the movie? (I'll be back - Wikipedia)

you made me curious so I checked back in texts between my husband and I - I found several texts with both versions used in the same text - I'm native English

I'm a non native English speaker and use both, i'll and i will. Same with would've and would have, wouldn't and would not. Thinking about it, i use i will when i'm on my phone and mostly i'll when i'm on my laptop. I don't really think it means something in this case.

 

[Charlot123]

It's an extremely common word in Colombia and a few other Spanish-speaking countries. What I found strange here is that the brother would say she never uses this word.

This is like someone saying their English sister never used the word "great". I'm also puzzled by her not having a Spanish keyboard activated on her phone. Unless she speaks only with her family in English and has severed all ties with Colombia?

Sadly, I find it more likely someone would simply use her phone posing as her (though this assumes she had no pin code on her phone? Or the pin code was demanded?). What would be gained in forcing her to send the text versus someone simply posing as her? As I said above, whoever did this almost certainly knew the ruse wouldn't stand up to much scrutiny over days and weeks. Sooner or later, it's obvious she would have come back from this supposedly town outside Madrid. More likely it was designed to buy a few hours in the event that someone realised she was missing too early?

Also, I'm not sure the apartment would have actual 'security cameras'. I think it's more likely it's simply an intercom video, much like the one I have in my apartment and countless other Madrileños.

I would be very much surprised if Ana severed all the ties with her mother tongue.
Had I stayed on the East Coast, I'd definitely take Spanish classes. Spanish is not merely "good to know", it is needed in the US. Where I live, rather close to the Canadian border, maybe less so, but in general, job-wise, fluency in Spanish is a huge plus. Especially given that Ana was a real estate agent. I can imagine her severing all ties with her country of origin, it happens, given that she was rather young when she moved to the US, but with the language? It would make zero sense.

 

[indicolite22]

The husband's attorney claims he's been cooperative with the authorities:

 

[Charlot123]

An alternate headline could read:

A Florida woman who went missing in Spain two weeks ago is going through a Rough Divorce involving MILLIONS of Dollars - Husband refuses to cooperate + Fled to Serbia!

Are we sure it will end up being "millions of dollars"? We had cases here that started with "millions" or "she could retire today if she wanted to", and ended up being sand castles.

What I would really like to know is whether Ana had life insurance.

On the other hand, I am inclined to give David/Dushan the benefit of the doubt. He is 35, that is, born shortly before Yugoslavia ceased to exist; he and Ana were married for 12+ years, meaning, he has been in US since very early adulthood if not late teenage years. There is an incredible gap between young Serbians and their parents. He may not have any "poor connections" inside his country of birth. His behavior might be easily explained by the same reasons that prompted his divorce. I don't think he is choosing the right approach, and he probably should be more compassionate towards Ana's family, but in itself, it doesn't yet make him guilty.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

The missing woman’s brother, Felipe Henao, said in an interview with W Radio that the family became concerned after receiving “a series of messages” from Ana Maria’s mobile phone that “did not seem to be written by her”.

“We believe they were translated from Google into Spanish,” he said. “We are concerned that it was planned, so time is of the essence.”

The SOS Desaparecidos association for missing people in Spain explained that Ana Maria had moved to Madrid from Florida a few months ago due to her divorce from a Serbian man.

US citizen missing in Spain

Us Citizen Missing In Spain Keep up with the Latest News In English Murcia Costa Calida Spain

murciatoday.com

*eta:
The president of the National Centre for Missing Persons (CNDES), Joaquin Amills, said he has only seen a few similar cases during his 14 years on the job.

He told news agency EFE: “We are very used to receiving calls and sifting through information, and it is curious that in this case, in which we have reached around three million people, we have not received any calls.”

Ana is the owner of a successful business in the US and settled in the upmarket neighbourhood of Salamanca in Madrid last December.

The ‘barrio’ is among the most exclusive not only in Madrid, but the whole of Spain – with Penelope Cruz, Javier Bardem and a host of La Liga football players calling the luxury area home.

What happened to missing US expat Ana Knezevich? Timeline of disappearance of businesswoman, 40, who vanished from a luxury 'barrio' in Spain two WEEKS ago - Olive Press News Spain

MYSTERY surrounds the disappearance of a US expat who vanished from Spain without a trace two weeks ago. Ana Maria Knezevich, 40, moved to Madrid several

www.theolivepress.es

Missing

Ana María Knezevich in an image from SOS DisappearedSOS Missing

The authorities, who keep the investigation under summary secrecy , maintain that the key could be in the geolocation of his mobile phone , so they would be working on it, as well as recovering data from the SIM card and obtaining information about his inner circle. nearby.

Aumentan las incógnitas sobre la desaparición de una mujer estadounidense en Madrid

Tras 18 días desaparecida, no se ha conseguido esclarecer ningún detalle sobre el caso.

www-antena3-com.translate.goog

 

[imstilla.grandma]

“My mother is devastated. I wish I had something new, I wish Ana was back already,” Knezevich’s brother, Felipe Henao, told the Daily Mail in a report Monday. “I just hope someone with information comes forward to tell us what they know.”

The stunning realtor — who owned a tech-support company with her estranged husband — had started using Bumble in the months leading up to her disappearance, the outlet said, citing her best friend, Sanna Rameau.

At least two men with whom Knezevich chatted on the dating app before she was last seen outside her rented apartment Feb. 2 have been tracked down by Spanish authorities, according to the outlet.

Fla. realtor who went missing in Spain during bitter divorce was using dating app Bumble

Troubling signs in the disappearance of the stunning Fort Lauderdale woman include her telling pals the day after she was last seen that she had just met a man and felt an “instant” con…

nypost.com

 

[FacelessPodcast]

I would be very much surprised if Ana severed all the ties with her mother tongue.
Had I stayed on the East Coast, I'd definitely take Spanish classes. Spanish is not merely "good to know", it is needed in the US. Where I live, rather close to the Canadian border, maybe less so, but in general, job-wise, fluency in Spanish is a huge plus. Especially given that Ana was a real estate agent. I can imagine her severing all ties with her country of origin, it happens, given that she was rather young when she moved to the US, but with the language? It would make zero sense.

Not speaking Spanish in Florida, particularly when you have family fluent in Spanish / Colombian background, would be strange to me. I'm almost certain she would speak Spanish. What I'm saying is that, as a result, if you're bilingual, to NOT have both keyboards activated is odd. Particularly if you're then moving to Spain and have friends in Spain. For your family to notice *your use* of accents / tildes, not their absence, that too is strange. These are not complicated grammatical foibles to Spanish-speakers. They're the fundamentals you learn early on in school. It would be like if I never used commas in my text messages and then suddenly I did, my family saying 'that's odd, Nic never used commas.'

I'm not critiquing the logic here or criticising the family in any way. But I just wonder if, given the extremely distressing nature of the situation, they're reaching for things to seem strange that aren't necessarily strange. Again, if the messages don't sound like her, they're probably not from her. I just don't really understand why she wouldn't be using accents/tildes.

 

[AlatzuMeizzaja]

Ana was using What's App to communicate. Anyone can login from anywhere w/ username + password.

Nope, that's not how WhatsApp works -- there is no such thing as a "password", the phone number is the "username", and it is not possible to log in without having one of the following:

• ability to receive an SMS OTP on the registered number
• physical access to the master device that is already logged in.

It's happened a few times that I've been stuck without WhatsApp after being logged out on a non-master device while outside the house, and it's quite a pain, because only when I return home and regain physical access to the primary phone can I log in on other devices.