Steven Avery: Guilty of Teresa Halbach's Murder?

[texxas]

I think the State's concern about TH's family and what they have gone through and what they are still going through with MaM2 is understandable, there is no doubt that TH and family are a victim, but they are sooo close minded that can't fathom that SA and BD may be a victim, which is really outrageous and unbelievable considering that SA was already a victim of similar circumstances....I would think they would want to absolutely make sure they are getting it right this time....just retry the case. I be more concerned about TH's family if there is a REAL killer that's been out there since....and LE's pride/process/coverup got in the way.

I definitely agree w/ you on this. IMO, the current prosecutor comes off just as slimy as KK during his press conferences. I don’t feel like he sounds sincere at all when he repeatedly says he’s doing all of this fighting & filing of appeals in support of TH’s family. It sounds much more like the politically correct thing for him to say when his real motivation is to keep SA & BD in prison at all cost, whether they did it or not.

 

[proudfootz]

Sounds like he wanted to verify that he had the correct license plate number written down in his notebook and not that he was looking at the actual plate.

I often double check my own handwriting at work when I'm not sure if I got it right. JMO

It's just my opinion, but I have a different take on the call.

There's nothing here that suggests to me the conversation would be any different if he was looking at the RAV4 before its license plate was removed.

 

[guruagain]

RSBM

Also, with his knowledge of Salvage yard duties and lack of knowledge in MURDER, the scene is cleaned rather well but the car is not crushed, melted, disposed of in some other way? Instead its just hidden with branches?

Which just makes it stand out more! It couldn't have been hidden in a more inept way!

 

[Lass from Yorkshire]

He also is the one to clarify the make and model of the car - so by looking at a license plate number alone he would know that? He would have to be looking at it to know.

 

[RANCH]

He also is the one to clarify the make and model of the car - so by looking at a license plate number alone he would know that? He would have to be looking at it to know.

So he is an expert on Toyota RAV4's and can tell the difference between 1998 and 1999 models just by looking at it?

Sounds more like he was verifying the model year along with the plate number to me. JMO

 

[evenstar68]

I really don't believe he did it, plus I don't believe that there is enough evidence found that says where she died, how she died, if she died. I think that the Netflix show is so slanted as to what it tells us, its like a Michael Moore movie! I can't even find how they determined the bone fragments were hers? or if they are even human? and I think that they should investigate the ex-boyfriend and roommate more! its always the boyfriend or husband..

 

[Lass from Yorkshire]

So he is an expert on Toyota RAV4's and can tell the difference between 1998 and 1999 models just by looking at it?

Sounds more like he was verifying the model year along with the plate number to me. JMO

Yes but the point is he shouldn't have been looking at the car, because according to the State the car wasn't found until later. So when he put that call in, he only knew the plate number which had been given to him by civilian who reported it to him (which he didn't report).

 

[guruagain]

So he is an expert on Toyota RAV4's and can tell the difference between 1998 and 1999 models just by looking at it?

Sounds more like he was verifying the model year along with the plate number to me. JMO

But he would know it was a "99 Toyota" if he was looking at the VIN plate in the door, Or the rear light clusters.

 

[RANCH]

But he would know it was a "99 Toyota" if he was looking at the VIN plate in the door, Or the rear light clusters.

Or he could have read it on the vehicle registration which would have Teresa's name on it. No need to call in and leave a record of finding the car.

Or he was looking at his notebook and called in to verify the information so he would know it was for the missing person. JMO

 

[LongTallTexan]

Yea but it was handwritten

It was hand written, but what I'm thinking is that it was hand written on a electronic PDA with a stylus, it synced with MS outlook on the PC, then RH was able to print it out with the updates. If that is not correct, we have an issue with how RH got that information on a printout.

 

[Lass from Yorkshire]

It was hand written, but what I'm thinking is that it was hand written on a electronic PDA with a stylus, it synced with MS outlook on the PC, then RH was able to print it out with the updates. If that is not correct, we have an issue with how RH got that information on a printout.

But it’s confirmed there was a conversation on the phone where she says she’s driving and needs to pull over to write down that appointment.

 

[SavageMarkIII]

The 3 things for me, which tell me Steven Avery didn't do it:

1) everybody take your keys out of your pocket....how many of you carry around a keychain with just 1 key on it, your car key? Nobody. Everybody has at a minimum a car key and a key to where they live. If she never left the salvage property, why would there be this "valet key" (2nd key or whatever you want to call it) with nothing on it and not the keychain with multiple keys on it, she always carried?

2) Bullet that supposedly went through her head has no bone on it, but there is wood on it.

3) the property the "pelvic bones" were found on is Manitowoc County property and not the property of the neighbor, as it was stated by the prosecution in the 1st trial

 

[Lass from Yorkshire]

The 3 things for me, which tell me Steven Avery didn't do it:

1) everybody take your keys out of your pocket....how many of you carry around a keychain with just 1 key on it, your car key? Nobody. Everybody has at a minimum a car key and a key to where they live. If she never left the salvage property, why would there be this "valet key" (2nd key or whatever you want to call it) with nothing on it and not the keychain with multiple keys on it, she always carried?

2) Bullet that supposedly went through her head has no bone on it, but there is wood on it.

3) the property the "pelvic bones" were found on is Manitowoc County property and not the property of the neighbor, as it was stated by the prosecution in the 1st trial

Yes yes and yes. And many more points

 

[LongTallTexan]

But it’s confirmed there was a conversation on the phone where she says she’s driving and needs to pull over to write down that appointment.

Yes, I read that to mean she wrote it on her PDA.

 

[texxas]

The only thing I can think of here is that RH didn't really have her actual electronic PDA device, but was able to access her computer (I think I read MS Outlook) and printed the dayplanner page for that day. The PDA may sync with the computer in real time or on a schedule (every hour,day, etc) and therefore the appts that were made on 10/31 later showed up on the computer program. Otherwise, if RH actually had the PDA device....huge issue for him!

In 2005 would those types of electronic PDA’s have had the capability of remotely syncing to a computer or whatever platform she was using for email/work, either in real time or w/ a pre-determined schedule of data pushes? If they could, it seems like any cell service or internet access needed for that would have been spotty at best in that rural area.

I’m definitely not knowledgeable on how those types of PDA devices worked back then. I remember having a Palm Pilot at one time that I had to plug into my computer.

 

[proudfootz]

Yes but the point is he shouldn't have been looking at the car, because according to the State the car wasn't found until later. So when he put that call in, he only knew the plate number which had been given to him by civilian who reported it to him (which he didn't report).

IIRC Colborn's testimony was that he jotted down information about the missing/endangered Teresa's vehicle given to him earlier (not by the civilian witness at the Cenex station but from a fellow employee in law enforcement) and that he later thought to call and read back to the dispatcher what he thought he wrote to confirm he wrote it correctly in the first place.

 

[proudfootz]

It was hand written, but what I'm thinking is that it was hand written on a electronic PDA with a stylus, it synced with MS outlook on the PC, then RH was able to print it out with the updates. If that is not correct, we have an issue with how RH got that information on a printout.

I'm having difficulty finding any description of this spreadsheet other than saying it has 'handwritten' notes on it. Thus far I've come up dry as to whether they were entered into some computer program with a stylus or directly on the printout in pencil or ink.

 

[Karinna]

(quote)
The day planner. Teresa spoke with two people on the day of her disappearance to set up appointments, which she wrote down in her planner while she was out driving. Zellner calculated that Teresa would not have had enough time between appointments to drop her planner off at her house, and yet Hillegas provided the page from her day planner as evidence. Zellner argues that since Teresa couldn't have dropped the planner off at home, it must have been in her car when she was killed, and the only way Ryan Hillegas would have had it was if he'd had access to the car before it was found on the Avery property.
Making a Murderer: 8 New Pieces of Evidence We Learned in Season 2 | TV Guide

 

[Miamama]

A report about what?

Lol. A report about anything. When it happened, not months or years later.

 

[Miamama]

I really don't believe he did it, plus I don't believe that there is enough evidence found that says where she died, how she died, if she died. I think that the Netflix show is so slanted as to what it tells us, its like a Michael Moore movie! I can't even find how they determined the bone fragments were hers? or if they are even human? and I think that they should investigate the ex-boyfriend and roommate more! its always the boyfriend or husband..

Yes on the boyfriend... and the brother seems to know something. Brother talked about grieving before the car was even found. When ex boyfriend was talking to press, brother looked like he was going to have an aneurysm worrying about what ex boyfriend might say. And when ex boyfriend was on the stand, brother was literally chewing his fingernails, and practically falling off the bench he was leaning forward so far.