The Crown v Gerard Baden-Clay, 30th June - Trial Day 12, Week 3

[Amee]

Baden-Clay said he was still having an “on again, off again” affair with Toni McHugh at the time.

He said he attended a conference in Sydney when he had a liaison with another woman, Jacqui Crane.

“I was going to a conference in Sydney for the weekend and the relationship that I’d had with another woman previously, who was also attending that conference, we got together for a physical relationship on that weekend,” he said.

“That was the only time, we actually, we actually had sex.”

Baden-Clay said his partners became aware of his relationship with Ms McHugh.

“I think it was Jocelyn (Frost) initially who suspected something and she spoke to Toni who denied it. I think she spoke to Phil as well and at some point it was acknowledged,” he said.

The accused said his partners relayed a conversation he had with them about Ms McHugh, back to her.

“During that conversation the issue of Toni was raised and the relationship we had had and, I admitted to them that there were occasions when I was effectively sleeping with Toni for the sake of the business which I didn’t want her to leave the business and I didn’t want her to cause any dramas should the relationship end,” he said.

He said it got back to Ms McHugh.

“She was quite justifiably very unhappy about that and I think at that time we were, the affair, was in some sort of a hiatus, but we got back together because, for the sake of the business,” he said.

Baden-Clay said not long after he received a phone call from his wife, asking to meet him.

“I was at the office and Al called on the mobile,” he said, his voice breaking.

“She just said `we’ve got to talk’ and I sensed straight away what it was about. So I suggested that we meet at the Indooroopilly McDonalds which was just not far from our office.”

Baden-Clay said he met his wife in the car park.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-allison-in-2012/story-fnihsrf2-1226971633938

 

[DrWatson]

ARE you ok Doc?

Boo Hoo... (sniff)

 

[drsleuth]

Kate Kyriacou @KateKyriacou · 20s

Gerard says he was a little taken aback when he first went in, but then relaxed a lot. #badenclay

Gerard says Carmel then brought up the affair. Gerard says he told her he would do anything possible to help Allison. #badenclay

Gerard says Carmel said Allison needed to ask him any questions about the affair. #badenclay

Gerard says he was a bit resistant at first. Didn't think it was helpful to "have all these issues running round and round" #badenclay

Gerard says Carmel explained that they structure and formalise it to 15 minutes every second night. #badenclay

 

[drsleuth]

Kate Kyriacou @KateKyriacou · 20s

Gerard says his job was to answer questions and listen to any feelings she might express. #badenclay

Gerard says he felt "acceptance and relief" at that. #badenclay

 

[Amee]

I got out of my car and um, sat in the passenger seat of her car, which was Snowy… the Prado. She just came straight out and asked me if I was having an affair with Toni and I said `yes, I was’. Or `I had been’,” he said.

The accused sobbed into a hankerchief and said his wife reacted with disbelief.

“When I’d acknowledged it she was just in shock,” he said.

“She didn’t yell or shout or scream or anything, that’s just not Al. It’s just not her. She got out of the car. She was just shaking her head, saying I can’t believe this and she got out of the car and she sat on the little concrete curb thing next to the gardens there and I got up and came around and sat next to her.

“There wasn’t much said, she was just shaking her head, had her head in her hands, dhe might have been feeling physically ill, she didn’t vomit, that’s why she got out of the car.”

He said after a little while his wife asked “do you love her?” and he replied he did not.

Baden-Clay said his wife told him he had a choice to make.

“It was just an absolute a no-brainer for me. I think I may have said there is not choice, I want to be with you and the girls,” he said.

He said when he went to put his arm around his wife’s shoulders she shrugged him away.

Baden-Clay wiped his face with the hanky and took a sip of water.

“I think she went home,” he said.

He said he called Ms McHugh and met her at her St Lucia unit

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-allison-in-2012/story-fnihsrf2-1226971633938

 

[Minerva]

Don't make fun of him crying folks. There's a hole in the story, there! Right there! He was feeling the pressure.

See - I'm not a Baden-Clay in disguise!

 

[drsleuth]

Boo Hoo... (sniff)

Doc have some prn zoloft :floorlaugh:

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Minerva, with all due respect, how do you reconcile all this stuff with so many of the known facts and other evidence that GBC's testimony directly contradicts?

I'm trying to keep my mind open, but with each passing hour of this drivel, that job becomes more and more difficult to do.

I'm waiting for the cross-examination, and to see how he deals with that. At the moment he is being led by his defence barrister. Let's see how he fairs when being put under a bit of pressure by the other side.

Very true. I'm really interested in his memory performance when it comes to the 'important matters' of this trial.

I'm not sure what you mean. I just mean that it all sounds perfectly plausible. Morally bankrupt in numerous places, yes. But I'm not seeing the "holes" that other people seem to see. I'm allowing him to paint his picture and it so happens that much of it gels with my own life experience and certain principles I hold to be true.

That said, we aren't yet up to the part that matters - 19 April 2012.

I mean how does this serve a purpose to this trial? He could have given a quick run down on his marriage and business, he chose to paint a perfect picture of himself, that Allison drove him to the affairs being the big one. He's shifting all the blame of his business and marriage failure onto others. Everyone was a slacker! His wife, his business associates except for Toni, she comes out with 'business woman of the year' award. No wonder he had to sleep with her!

But I'm not trying to sway you, it's good to keep an open mind. Mine is pretty much biased at this stage. :twocents:

 

[Neuromancer]

Kate Kyriacou @KateKyriacou · 11s

Gerard says Allison handled all their "personal stuff". He's learned she made investigations into her life insurance and super. #badenclay

make up your mind G-Bad - she failed at life but still handled all that for you?

 

[Amee]

“And I just told her that Al had found out and that I didn’t want to be with her, I wanted to be with Allison and the girls,” he said.

“She was very angry. She said she couldn’t believe it, she called me all sorts of names. Said I was the scum of the earth, that I ruined three years of her life.

“She yelled at me and screamed at me and threw things at me.”

He said Ms McHugh told him she would never return to work at the business.

Baden-Clay said he tried to calm her down but she yelled at him and said: “Get out, I never want to see you again”.

“I went back to the office,” he said.

He said he told his work colleagues about the affair, that it had ended and Ms McHugh would no longer work there.

“I wanted them, the staff, to know the facts from me rather than getting a grape-vine version,” he said.

The accused said he spoke to the school principal and told him about the affair.

“I didn’t want him hearing through the tuckshop rumour mill, which is how it happened in the first place… to give him a heads-up if there were any issues with the children we could be made aware of it straight away,” he said.

Baden-Clay said it was very uncomfortable between him and his wife after that.

“Al at that stage said if I was committed to her and our relationship, that in light of my breach of trust, I needed to submit to some conditions she had and I agreed to do that, whatever she wanted, because I was committed,” he said.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-allison-in-2012/story-fnihsrf2-1226971633938

 

[PrimeSuspect]

David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 11m
One was a past client from Pullenvale, retired, wealthy, doesn't name #badenclay


David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 10m
It was during the election campaign, March 2012, Dr Flegg got his friend Sue Heath to call #badenclay

 

[FirstTimer]

Could someone please post the link to that blog of GBC's, from the last thread, where he wrote all that stuff about how hard it was to look after everything when Allison was away, or sick?

Much appreciated

http://expertrealestate.blogspot.com.au/2008/11/mr-mum.html

There you go.........................

 

[Amee]

He said those conditions included no night time appointments, unless his wife approved and access to his phone, including passwords, that she would check and take control of each night.

Baden-Clay said Ben Bassingthwaighte left the business and his wife came on board to take over the property management side of the business.

He said she was given the title of general manager.

“I think that was probably partly, from her perspective, a trust thing so she knew what was going on,” he said.

The accused said it started within three weeks of the his wife finding out about the affair.

He said she was nervous about coming into the office as the woman whose husband had cheated on her.

“I actually spoke to the staff, as well, and… just asked them to be mindful of Allison’s situation and they were all very lovely,” he said.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-allison-in-2012/story-fnihsrf2-1226971633938

 

[drsleuth]

Kate Kyriacou @KateKyriacou · 49s

Gerard says Allison came into the room for the last little bit, they confirmed the arrangements. #badenclay

Gerard says Allison asked him if he was happy with Carmel and he said "yes, she's the one". #badenclay

Gerard says that discussion formed most of their 15 minute session that night.

 

[Amee]

12:51pm: On April 16, 2012, Mr Baden-Clay said he and Allison sought the help of relationships counsellor Carmel Ritchie.

He said Ms Ritchie recommended he and Allison discuss the affair for 15 to 20 minutes every second night.

"My job was to answer any question Allison had and listen to any feelings she might express. Certainly, I felt a sense of acceptance and relief ... that there was that formalised structure. For me, it would be easier to deal with," Mr Baden-Clay said.

Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...y-12-week-4-20140630-3b2vi.html#ixzz365TYFhfJ

 

[BJsleuth]

Boo Hoo... (sniff)

*Passes Doc the Kleenex and a drink*

 

[drsleuth]

Kate Kyriacou @KateKyriacou · 19s

Gerard says at that point he was doing his best to distance himself from Toni. Wasn't seeing or calling her. #badenclay

Gerard says he was responding to her emails and answering her calls. #badenclay

Gerard says Toni was wanting to reconnect and for him to leave Allison. #badenclay

 

[MsAnais]

I got out of my car and um, sat in the passenger seat of her car, which was Snowy… the Prado. She just came straight out and asked me if I was having an affair with Toni and I said `yes, I was’. Or `I had been’,” he said.

The accused sobbed into a hankerchief and said his wife reacted with disbelief.

“When I’d acknowledged it she was just in shock,” he said.

“She didn’t yell or shout or scream or anything, that’s just not Al. It’s just not her. She got out of the car. She was just shaking her head, saying I can’t believe this and she got out of the car and she sat on the little concrete curb thing next to the gardens there and I got up and came around and sat next to her.

“There wasn’t much said, she was just shaking her head, had her head in her hands, dhe might have been feeling physically ill, she didn’t vomit, that’s why she got out of the car.”

He said after a little while his wife asked “do you love her?” and he replied he did not.

Baden-Clay said his wife told him he had a choice to make.

“It was just an absolute a no-brainer for me. I think I may have said there is not choice, I want to be with you and the girls,” he said.

He said when he went to put his arm around his wife’s shoulders she shrugged him away.

Baden-Clay wiped his face with the hanky and took a sip of water.

“I think she went home,” he said.

He said he called Ms McHugh and met her at her St Lucia unit

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-allison-in-2012/story-fnihsrf2-1226971633938

bbm. I'm sorry because I know most of you will know this already (but I didn't!!:blushing - but can I just confirm that this means he was having sex with his mistress regularly in his wife's car???!!

Or have I misunderstood that? TIA :seeya:

 

[Anonthemouse]

Don't make fun of him crying folks. There's a hole in the story, there! Right there! He was feeling the pressure.

See - I'm not a Baden-Clay in disguise!

Lol never thought you were and I reckon it's good to hear another voice outside the 'group think'.

Big hole though. Things were better financially by end 2011 so why were credit cards not paid and only 20 bucks to your name eh?

 

[zoran]

Monday, Jun 30, 2014
'I just wanted sex ... it's not an excuse, it's why'

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/2014/06/30/06/28/baden-clay-back-on-stand-in-murder-trial

"I told her categorically that I would not do that, that my loyalty - it doesn't feel right saying that word - but my loyalty was to Allison and my children," Baden-Clay told the Supreme Court in Brisbane on Monday "

what planet is he from, loyalty? Im sure there will be plenty of available liaisons for him in jail if he is convicted and no loyalty to worry about, win win..