The elusive "other" cell phone - the Blackjack - REVISITED

[HeSaidSheSaid]

*snipped*

This is the part I have difficulty with. My just-turned-12-year-old knows how to save numbers on his SIM. I cannot believe, for even a moment, that Casey Anthony, who spent more hours on the phone than anyone in human history, couldn't manage to figure out how to save numbers to her phone and SIM card. It just doesn't ring true.

I think it's a story concocted to explain her lack of phone numbers for fictitious characters. What better way than to create a fictitious phone to go along with them and the fictitious job?

Yepperoonie! Exactly. ITA.

 

[Bobo]

*snipped*

I think it's a story concocted to explain her lack of phone numbers for fictitious characters. What better way than to create a fictitious phone to go along with them and the fictitious job?

I just have a nagging in my brain that I have to exhaust before I can agree with you and the others.

How do we explain the existence of the EXTRA SIMM that KC had? That is, if she had only one cell phone?

There are too many allusions to a real Black Jack phone that KC used, IMO. Can't hurt to pursue until we have a definite answer one way or the other.

 

[jandkmom]

I just have a nagging in my brain that I have to exhaust before I can agree with you and the others.

How do we explain the existence of the EXTRA SIMM that KC had? That is, if she had only one cell phone?

There are too many allusions to a real Black Jack phone that KC used, IMO. Can't hurt to pursue until we have a definite answer one way or the other.

I know she kept talking about the extra simm card, but was has LE ever mentioned it? Also, if she had a cell phone with a simm card and then RG gave her a phone, it could have come from that one...maybe an upgrade. KC has lied so much about everything, and I just don't remember her friends or family actually saying that she really had a Black Jack. I know in LA's conversation with her he actually asks her if there is even a 2nd phone, so it sounded as he hadn't seen it.

 

[Recovering-Lurker]

I just have a nagging in my brain that I have to exhaust before I can agree with you and the others.

How do we explain the existence of the EXTRA SIMM that KC had? That is, if she had only one cell phone?

There are too many allusions to a real Black Jack phone that KC used, IMO. Can't hurt to pursue until we have a definite answer one way or the other.

I agree. I have went back and forth on whether or not there really is a BlackJack. Thanks to some great sleuthing, I tend to think there is one. If she had another phone number for it, those phone records have not been released yet. She could've easily had the extra SIMM card with her usual contacts, and then she saved her other "work" contacts directly to the BlackJack.

 

[Noniegrace]

Has anyone figured out where she got the money to make the 574.60 payment on 7/15/08? And WTH it was for, that bill is way high to just be for service. I wonder if this was some of what she stole from Amy.

 

[jandkmom]

If she did have a Black Jack phone, wouldn't one of her friends have an e-mail from her with that Black Jack message at the bottom like was on Tony's. Surely she would have sent someone a message from it.

 

[BetsyB]

Has it been verified that she has another sim card? Or is that just another Casey-ism? I was under the impression it was the latter. But even if there is a sim, it's not necessarily evidentiary. I'm sure there are extra sims floating around in my junk drawer. We have 4 people in the house with mobile phones--we've probably gone through a dozen and a half phones between us, and three or four service providers. Sims have been popped out of and into a whole bunch of phones---or popped out when we donate our used phones to a charity for disadvantaged women entering the job market, and thrown into a drawer.

My only point is that it's not hard to come by an extra sim card.

 

[Bobo]

<snipped>

I know she kept talking about the extra simm card, but was has LE ever mentioned it?

<snipped>

The info about the EXTRA SIMM was from the first big doc dump and was from LE's forensics and downloads from KC's phone.

I regret that I do not have a link -- back then, I was just making notes and did not note the page numbers (it was long).

But there was a list of contacts from her EXTRA SIM contacts, a list of contacts on KC's cell phone itself, and a list of contacts on that cell phone's SIM memory.

Ironically, I made note of it because a Brandon H (NOT Brandon S) was on all three contact lists. I wondered then, as now, who Brandon H is?

 

[Bobo]

FWIW, I think it is highly probable that KC had a Black Jack phone and I think there is a possibility that KC lost the Black Jack (without a SIMM) in Amy's wrecked car. I think Bond & JWG may concur.

 

[HeSaidSheSaid]

I just have a nagging in my brain that I have to exhaust before I can agree with you and the others.

How do we explain the existence of the EXTRA SIMM that KC had? That is, if she had only one cell phone?

There are too many allusions to a real Black Jack phone that KC used, IMO. Can't hurt to pursue until we have a definite answer one way or the other.

I don't recall anything about an "extra" SIM card, just that she kept "switching" her Nokia SIM card back and forth between her blackjack (aka my other phone) phone and her Nokia phone, 'cause her blackjack wouldn't hold a charge, and they she wasn't able to figure out how to save the contacts to the SIM, just how to save them to the phone, and for her it wasn't practical to have to keep trying to use a phone that wouldn't hold a charge and so if we can find that other phone, it will have the numbers of ZFG, Jeff, and Juliet. And when she switched out the SIM from the blackjack to the Nokia the last time, she left the SIMless blackjack, with only numbers for these "mystery" people saved to it, on her desk, in her office, at work, and didn't go into work for 3 or 4 days, and when she did go in after that time, the phone was gone, and she reported it to Universal security "nine days ago."

Makes sense... :crazy:

All of which could be believable, maybe, perhaps, sort of, if, and this is the big if here, she ACTUALLY HAD A JOB. :bang:

 

[jandkmom]

FWIW, I think it is highly probable that KC had a Black Jack phone and I think there is a possibility that KC lost the Black Jack (without a SIMM) in Amy's wrecked car. I think Bond & JWG may concur.

Whose bill do you think that it is on? I haven't had a phone with a simm card in it. When we have upgraded our phones we had to call the phone company and give them information off of the phone to connect the new one. If you have a simm card do you just move that and it activates it? Wouldn't the phone company still be able to tell if the signal comes from a different type of phone. Also wouldn't she have sent an e-mail from somebody from it? I am not saying I don't believe there isn't one, I am just not sure that there is. This all would have been so much easier if they had told the truth from the beginning.

 

[HeSaidSheSaid]

Whose bill do you think that it is on? I haven't had a phone with a simm card in it. When we have upgraded our phones we had to call the phone company and give them information off of the phone to connect the new one. If you have a simm card do you just move that and it activates it? Wouldn't the phone company still be able to tell if the signal comes from a different type of phone. Also wouldn't she have sent an e-mail from somebody from it? I am not saying I don't believe there isn't one, I am just not sure that there is. This all would have been so much easier if they had told the truth from the beginning.

Well in her interview with LE, when asked the telephone number of this elusive "other phone" she stated that it was the same as her current Nokia cell phone number, when questioned that the "other phone" would've had it's own different cell number/SIM, (RuhRo!!! :waitasec she then attempted to explain away the improbability of that scenario by the overly convoluted SIM card switch, telephone theft, report to Universal security, nonsense. :crazy:

 

[Bobo]

The info about the EXTRA SIMM was from the first big doc dump and was from LE's forensics and downloads from KC's phone.

I regret that I do not have a link -- back then, I was just making notes and did not note the page numbers (it was long).

But there was a list of contacts from her EXTRA SIM contacts, a list of contacts on KC's cell phone itself, and a list of contacts on that cell phone's SIM memory.

Ironically, I made note of it because a Brandon H (NOT Brandon S) was on all three contact lists. I wondered then, as now, who Brandon H is?

Hate to quote myself, but I think HeSaidSheSaid may have missed my post.

jandkmom, I really don't have any expertise in knowing how phones work or how billing and other phone records are done. I do acknowledge a knack for picking up discrepancies -- for example, when one set of info does not match info from another set that should match.

All I know is that the discrepancies nag at me and I hope for a final resolution to everyone's questions. I hope that the WSers who have far more expertise in sleuthing are able to put these questions to rest!

 

[jandkmom]

Hate to quote myself, but I think HeSaidSheSaid may have missed my post.

jandkmom, I really don't have any expertise in knowing how phones work or how billing and other phone records are done. I do acknowledge a knack for picking up discrepancies -- for example, when one set of info does not match info from another set that should match.

All I know is that the discrepancies nag at me and I hope for a final resolution to everyone's questions. I hope that the WSers who have far more expertise in sleuthing are able to put these questions to rest!

If you have a knack of picking up discrepancies, you ought to be very busy with this case. It has lots of them.

 

[Bobo]

Well in her interview with LE, when asked the telephone number of this elusive "other phone" she stated that it was the same as her current Nokia cell phone number, when questioned that the "other phone" would've had it's own different cell number/SIM, (RuhRo!!! :waitasec she then attempted to explain away the improbability of that scenario by the overly convoluted SIM card switch, telephone theft, report to Universal security, nonsense. :crazy:

Yes, I remember that as well! When I heard that she stated the "other phone" had the same number as her Nokia cell phone, the hair stood up on the back of my neck. I thought "KC does NOT want LE to know the phone number of that "other phone" -- then all the nonsense between LA and KC during the jail call about the BlackJack.

I can't let it go . . . . sorry. I wish I could!

 

[DotsEyes]

IF she was using another phone, it was stolen by her from someone.

I doubt that she was able to 'drop' it somewhere while she was with LE they really are not as dumb as people suggest. I do not think that she meant LE when she was talking about the mutual friends. They are mutual to her and LA - he 'got it' right away.

How convenient that someone else was using her cell phone on June 17th.

It wasn't me, I didn't do it, you can't prove it. The Bart Simpson defense.

 

[Bobo]

If you have a knack of picking up discrepancies, you ought to be very busy with this case. It has lots of them.

I know -- I'm in agony! LOL

It is painful to have some of this rolling around in my head. Some of what is in my noggin I wouldn't want the defense to find out -- let them find it themselves! LOL:crazy:

 

[TURBOTHINK]

From what I understand KC's phones had a sim card. My cell also runs with a sim card. The phone won't work without a sim in it- thus she couldn't use one phone to call the other, unless she had a second cell phone account. (the account info is stored in the sim card and the phone number stays the same, no matter what phone the sim card is put into.)

That also gives a drawback to the theory that she lost the phone. Presumably if she was carrying the phone, it would have the sim card in it. If she lost the phone (blackjack) she would also lose the sim card. I think you can get replacements for the sim but they are expensive and we haven't seen any indication that she purchased a replacement.

Now she could have mistakenly thought that the phone itself stored her account info like a computer does, and that by getting rid of the phone she could get rid of incriminating evidence. Thus she might have taken out the sim card and thrown it away. But somehow I can't believe that she would be that niave.

Other than that it was a good theory.

I have sims cards for all my phones and cameras. They all work without one, but for additional storage they are nice. I can interchange mine from my camera to my phone to get pictures on my phone and vice versa.

Some phones do not have sims cards, but internal memories (my old ones didn't) but most of the new ones (including my Blackberry) have both. You can save something to the phone or the sims or both.

 

[TURBOTHINK]

I checked the Sprint website for the Orlando area and noted two things. First, Blackjacks are not an available phone. Second, Sprint coverage in the area of the Anthony household is only fair to no-coverage.

Thus, I think we can say that the phone number associated with BJ Jacke is probably not a Blackjack belonging to KC. :banghead:

AT&T (which was her carrier) does have Blackjacks and coverage in that area. All companies use the Blackberry system for those phones.

 

[Bobo]

OK, is this a fair synopsis of what we know thus far?

1. B Jacke (or BJ Jacke?) Listed as a contact
a. #67 on KC's extra SIMM
b. #61 on KC's Nokia cell phone
c. #137 on KC's SIMM on the Nokia

2. (per BondJamesBond) The phone number called the BJ Jacke contact 2 times between 6/15 and 7/16: (both from the area of TL's apt.)
a. Friday 6/20/08 11:38:55 AM (0 seconds)
b. Friday 6/20/08 11:38:57 AM (6 seconds)

3. (per JWG) A reverse phone search of the number associated with the contact BJ Jacke showed it is a cell phone number for the carrier Sprint Spectrum L.P. Sprint in Orlando does not make BlackJacks available and the coverage for Sprint in the area of the Anthony house is fair to none.

4. AT&T (KC's Nokia carrier) does offer a BlackJack phone and some WSers think KC bought one using her Grandma SP's account telling the story KC needed it for "work" and that "Universal" would be reimbursing her. (Note: I can't shake that I read somewhere that LA worked for a "Universal Ventures" or something -- and when KC & LA talk about "Universal," I wonder which entity they are talking about.)

5. (per Turbothink) All companies use the Blackberry system for BlackJacks.

What does this tell us?

JWG concludes that the phone number associated with the contact BJ Jacke is probably not a BlackJack belonging to KC.
So, who is BJ Jacke? Or, who is the person whose number is listed for this contact?

If KC bought or stole a BlackJack phone, it would have had a different phone number than her Nokia. (At least it's been my experience that my carrier will only let a phone number be associated with ONE cell phone.)

OK, I've gotta give up for a little while on this. My brain is mush and I'll give this a rest.