The evidence failed Caylee, not the Jury.

[Velouria]

Thanks for starting this thread! The prosecution’s case fell apart by overcharging Casey Anthony and trying to put her to death. I agree...what they had wasn't enough for Murder or the DP.

The undisputed facts are Caylee was in her mother's care and she ended up dead...Be it Caylee accidently drowned in the pool, suffocated (in the heat of the trunk or due to duct tape over her mouth), was given a lethal dose of chloraform, or was stolen by a babysitter and Casey didn't report it, etc, etc... Any of those scenarios equate to Negligent Homicide

Had Casey been charged with "Negligent Homicide" the jury may have reached a verdict of GUILTY!


JMO...

red text highlighted by me

I'm sorry, but that's incorrect. These scenarios would constitute Felony Murder in the state of Florida, not Negligent Homicide.

 

[Velouria]

I havent gone through this thread buy my husband is LE and he says he was not at all surprised at the verdict. His actual words were: "they picked a wacky subset of no-news watching people who probably have seen too many episodes of CSI and think we can pull DNA and fingerprints off anything and wrap the case up in a neat little bow just like they do on TV."

Hi IRule :seeya: Looks like you and I are neighbors.

And my husband (non LE) agrees with your husband. He blames the extensive media coverage for the necessity of finding jurors who have essentially been living in a cave the past three years. Speaking of which, me thinks even Osama was likely more aware of current events in his Pakistani compound than these folks.

I guess no one on the jury ever heard of "Occams Razor?"

"Occam's Razors? Are they on sale at Publix this week?"

 

[SarahEcho]

Hi IRule :seeya: Looks like you and I are neighbors.

And my husband (non LE) agrees with your husband. He blames the extensive media coverage for the necessity of finding jurors who have essentially been living in a cave the past three years. Speaking of which, me thinks even Osama was likely more aware of current events in his Pakistani compound than these folks.





"Occam's Razors? Are they on sale at Publix this week?"

Some of the jurors were prone to think Casey guilty before the trial and did not live in a cave. Quite a number of the jurors hold very responsible job positions and some are children of attorneys or LE. Quite a few highly intelligent and well informed people I know have very limited, if any, knowledge of this case. A lot of people allow the justice system to work and will assist when, and if, they are called upon as the jurors were.

 

[mollymil23]

I don't think this jury really even considered the evidence. Especially now that they are speaking out. So yeah, I think they did fail. Miserably.

 

[cluciano63]

I really thought the jury would find her guilty of aggravated manslaughter. I'm surprised she got nothing, but I can understand and accept the jury's decision.

I've always been bothered by the lack of suggested motive offered by the prosecution. I understand that they don't NEED to provide it. However, when you're asking 12 people to go with death, that's a tall order whose picture needs to be painted fully.

There was no witness that stated she was even short with Caylee ever, let alone abusive or impatient or annoyed by her. That's a problem. The state was asking these 12 people to go from that to "she killed her because she didn't fit into her lifestyle." It didn't connect.

I wish the prosecution had instead brought up the alleged fight between mother and daughter as the trigger to this crime. Didn't they have a neighbor's testimony of screaming (or was that a previous occasion?). They could have asked Lee, right -- he knew about it. Jesse could also have been confronted about it. Or maybe not, it might not have ever been allowed in based on heresay. Maybe they chose not to go this route because it may have fallen into a murder 2 category. Who knows. But I think Caylee was probably killed because of this altercation btwn Cindy and Casey, and the jurors knew none of it.

It's so sad.

I believe the fight was heresay, because Cindy denied it and Lee was not actually there but heard about it.
Still, why didn't they challenge Cindy? They could have asked her "Isn't is a fact that the night before Caylee vanished you fought with Casey and tried to choke her?" She would have said no, but so what, it would have been out there for the jury to hear, even if sustained...

 

[justthinkin]

Thanks for starting this thread! The prosecution’s case fell apart by overcharging Casey Anthony and trying to put her to death. I agree...what they had wasn't enough for Murder or the DP.

The undisputed facts are Caylee was in her mother's care and she ended up dead...Be it Caylee accidently drowned in the pool, suffocated (in the heat of the trunk or due to duct tape over her mouth), was given a lethal dose of chloraform, or was stolen by a babysitter and Casey didn't report it, etc, etc... Any of those scenarios equate to Negligent Homicide

Had Casey been charged with "Negligent Homicide" the jury may have reached a verdict of GUILTY!


JMO...

No, they wouldn't. They'd have wanted to see a video of them both in the pool.

For whatever reason Florida found 12 jurors who have no idea how to convict on a circumstantial case. There was a mountain of evidence against Casey.

This jury acquitted her on what amounts to unreasonable doubt.

Court is held to find the truth. Plain old common sense dictated the truth in this case or should have.

This is why everyone who is outraged is outraged. They have common sense.

To put reasonable doubt on another foot, is it reasonable to think anyone else besides Casey Anthony committed this murder?

Casey Anthony remains the sole person to directly benefit from Caylee's death.

 

[RR0004]

Boy, aren't we lucky that Caylee was left to decompose. I'll believe what LE said any day over Casey.

 

[Tuffy]

Nah, there was a TON of evidence. The jury failed.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[SarahEcho]

The amount of juror bashing I have seen today does not reflect well on Websleuths.

The jurors are being disparaged outright, personally and in light of legal terms. After weeks of being deprived of their own freedoms without much to do aside from think about this case, this is what they get, libelous rants.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

I don't even know how to reply to threads of this nature. Already my posts are disappearing left and right.

I need a cyber break.

 

[costalpilot]

no
.


no

 

[2goldfish]

I don't even know how to reply to threads of this nature. Already my posts are disappearing left and right.

I need a cyber break.

:grouphug: keep calm & carry on my dearest, it's very hard with having sense this week. it wont be any better for a few weeks IMO.

 

[wyome]

The amount of juror bashing I have seen today does not reflect well on Websleuths.

The jurors are being disparaged outright, personally and in light of legal terms. After weeks of being deprived of their own freedoms without much to do aside from think about this case, this is what they get, libelous rants.

I couldn't agree with you more. I love America and our system of justice. It's not perfect, but it's the best out there.

To be honest, when I first heard the verdict, a couple of "dumbasses" came out of my mouth.

I wish they could have seen fit to charge her at least with aggravated manslaughter.

I think sometimes we forget just how much "outside" information we've retained over the course of three years. We've seen every interview, read all the speculation, all the relative's emails, etc. IN ADDITION to the trial. Jury didn't have all we have.

 

[AZlawyer]

Thanks for starting this thread! The prosecution’s case fell apart by overcharging Casey Anthony and trying to put her to death. I agree...what they had wasn't enough for Murder or the DP.

The undisputed facts are Caylee was in her mother's care and she ended up dead...Be it Caylee accidently drowned in the pool, suffocated (in the heat of the trunk or due to duct tape over her mouth), was given a lethal dose of chloraform, or was stolen by a babysitter and Casey didn't report it, etc, etc... Any of those scenarios equate to Negligent Homicide

Had Casey been charged with "Negligent Homicide" the jury may have reached a verdict of GUILTY!

JMO...

Casey was charged with negligent homicide. It is called "manslaughter" and it was presented as a lesser included offense.

red text highlighted by me

I'm sorry, but that's incorrect. These scenarios would constitute Felony Murder in the state of Florida, not Negligent Homicide.

If Casey had accidentally drowned in the pool, it might or might not have been manslaughter, depending on the circumstances, but it wouldn't have been felony murder.

If she had suffocated in the trunk due to heat or duct tape, or was given a lethal dose of chloroform, it would have been felony murder IMO.

If Caylee had been stolen by the babysitter and Casey didn't report it, it would not have been manslaughter or felony murder.

 

[AZlawyer]

BTW, I completely agree that the ultimate failure in this case was with the evidence, not with the SA or the jury. I blame Officer Cain for this verdict. If he had paid any attention at all to Kronk in early August 2008, there might have been a lot more forensic evidence.

 

[cluciano63]

BTW, I completely agree that the ultimate failure in this case was with the evidence, not with the SA or the jury. I blame Officer Cain for this verdict. If he had paid any attention at all to Kronk in early August 2008, there might have been a lot more forensic evidence.

That is who I blame too...wonder how he is feeling.

 

[jojomonkey]

I just thought of something. I don't watch those CSI shows, but I do know there are WAY too many of them on TV nowadays, and I know a lot of people watch them.

What if that is a problem with the jurors in this case? They've watched far too many of these shows and need that "smoking gun" instead of working to analyze the evidence before them. They were looking for that "AHA" moment that pulled all the pieces together FOR them.

What if people are really becoming that simple, that they need that something shoved in their face that says "this person is 100% guilty" because they can't figure it out on their own. With the mountain of evidence, pointing to Casey - they were still looking for that one thing that brought it all together for them.

Idiocracy.

 

[justanother]

BTW, I completely agree that the ultimate failure in this case was with the evidence, not with the SA or the jury. I blame Officer Cain for this verdict. If he had paid any attention at all to Kronk in early August 2008, there might have been a lot more forensic evidence.

This ^^^^. I keep coming back to him and feeling angry that he didn't take that tip seriously. I don't care how many tips they had to sift through, a little girl was missing, he should have done his job properly.

 

[SmoothOperator]

Something of extreme importance was either lost in translation from officers of the courts mouths to these jurors ears .. OR ... What came out of the mouths of these officer's of the court fell completely on deaf ears..

It is one of the two, for that I am certain..

I will tell you the exact moment in time that my mind went, "uh-oh.. There is something wrong with what is happeni h here.."

That is when after HHJP had went thru each and every step, rule, amd procedure ending with him turning over the case to the jury for deliberations.. HHJP then dismissed the jurors with the task of beginning deliberations...

Did no one else here what happened after the jurors were excused to their deliberations.. Bailiff of the court notified HHJP THAT MANY OF THE JURORS DID NOT EVEN TAKE THEIR NOTEBOOKS CONTAINING THEIR NOTES FROM THE PAST LONG 7 WEEKS OF THE TRIAL..

This disturbed me greatly as IMO it did JP, too.. He didn't know what to say and at first was thinking that it must ONLY be the notebooks from the alternate jurors.. But he was told no, that left, too were the actual juror's notebooks and pens..

This is so very concerning to me.. It was then amd it really was after hearing the verdict..

The jury not only did not ask a single solitary question, clarification, a re-read of a transcript from the court clerk, or how about even looking at the evidence that as one of them said seemed to dispute SA's claim of 84 chloroform searches..

If even one of them thought that would not you want to see did it really dispute or negate SA's findings of 84 searches?

I'll tell you doesn't know the answer to this exact question I just asked and that's every single juror on this case.. The reality is they do not a clue as to whether there were indeed 84 chloroform searches or was there only 1 single solitary chloroform search as Baez claimed..

Not one of them knows the answer.. Becasue along with every other 340+ items evidence that was entered at trial THEY DID NOT EVEN SO MUCH AS GIVE A SONGLE ITEM OR WORD SOME MUCH AS EVEN A GLANCE OVER TO SEE FOR THEMSELVES WHAT THE TRUTH WAS..

SA says 84 chloroform searches with DT claiming there was ONLY 1.. now this very detail is of extreme importance would most not agree as 84 IMO shows a clear interest in How to make chloroform over and over in months preceding Caylee's death.. Now that is called premeditation..

Then Baez stating 1 time searched if infact true would
Be complete opposite and bode quite well for Casey and any premeditation..

Jury in charge of the case doesn't even now til this day were there 84 searches or just1??

That is of extreme concern to me and clearly shows that it can only be one of two things.. The two things at the beginning of the post..

Either way both lead to an injustice on Caylee's behalf.. But one would be an unintentional injustice by things just lost in translation..

The other would be much worse and much more concerning(or should be to us as a nation) and that is an intentional injustice on Caylee's behalf with the courts words falling on the deaf ears of the jury who for any number of various reasons felt they needed no assistance, nor needed to even check to verify exactly which side was being honest in telling how many chloroform searches.. For whatever reason there minds were made up and they didn't want, care, or need to check or verify something as so very minor as what would prove or disprove something so trivial as premeditation..<-oozing sarcasm..

Did anyone else notice this and have issue with it as I did???

 

[AZlawyer]

Something of extreme importance was either lost in translation from officers of the courts mouths to these jurors ears .. OR ... What came out of the mouths of these officer's of the court fell completely on deaf ears..

It is one of the two, for that I am certain..

I will tell you the exact moment in time that my mind went, "uh-oh.. There is something wrong with what is happeni h here.."

That is when after HHJP had went thru each and every step, rule, amd procedure ending with him turning over the case to the jury for deliberations.. HHJP then dismissed the jurors with the task of beginning deliberations...

Did no one else here what happened after the jurors were excused to their deliberations.. Bailiff of the court notified HHJP THAT MANY OF THE JURORS DID NOT EVEN TAKE THEIR NOTEBOOKS CONTAINING THEIR NOTES FROM THE PAST LONG 7 WEEKS OF THE TRIAL..

This disturbed me greatly as IMO it did JP, too.. He didn't know what to say and at first was thinking that it must ONLY be the notebooks from the alternate jurors.. But he was told no, that left, too were the actual juror's notebooks and pens..

This is so very concerning to me.. It was then amd it really was after hearing the verdict..

The jury not only did not ask a single solitary question, clarification, a re-read of a transcript from the court clerk, or how about even looking at the evidence that as one of them said seemed to dispute SA's claim of 84 chloroform searches..

If even one of them thought that would not you want to see did it really dispute or negate SA's findings of 84 searches?

I'll tell you doesn't know the answer to this exact question I just asked and that's every single juror on this case.. The reality is they do not a clue as to whether there were indeed 84 chloroform searches or was there only 1 single solitary chloroform search as Baez claimed..

Not one of them knows the answer.. Becasue along with every other 340+ items evidence that was entered at trial THEY DID NOT EVEN SO MUCH AS GIVE A SONGLE ITEM OR WORD SOME MUCH AS EVEN A GLANCE OVER TO SEE FOR THEMSELVES WHAT THE TRUTH WAS..

SA says 84 chloroform searches with DT claiming there was ONLY 1.. now this very detail is of extreme importance would most not agree as 84 IMO shows a clear interest in How to make chloroform over and over in months preceding Caylee's death.. Now that is called premeditation..

Then Baez stating 1 time searched if infact true would
Be complete opposite and bode quite well for Casey and any premeditation..

Jury in charge of the case doesn't even now til this day were there 84 searches or just1??

That is of extreme concern to me and clearly shows that it can only be one of two things.. The two things at the beginning of the post..

Either way both lead to an injustice on Caylee's behalf.. But one would be an unintentional injustice by things just lost in translation..

The other would be much worse and much more concerning(or should be to us as a nation) and that is an intentional injustice on Caylee's behalf with the courts words falling on the deaf ears of the jury who for any number of various reasons felt they needed no assistance, nor needed to even check to verify exactly which side was being honest in telling how many chloroform searches.. For whatever reason there minds were made up and they didn't want, care, or need to check or verify something as so very minor as what would prove or disprove something so trivial as premeditation..<-oozing sarcasm..

Did anyone else notice this and have issue with it as I did???

The evidence of the 84 searches vs. the one search was presented to the jury during trial. It wasn't just a matter of the attorneys saying how many searches there were--the experts testified and the actual documents were presented on the jurors' screens.