Theories On What Happened to Caylee Part #9

[Justiceseeker35]

What if she duct tapes her somewhere near gentiva? wow
So I think when the going gets tough she does these morbid searches. Anyhow she supposedly gets choked by Cindy during the arguement the night before. Maybe she suffocates her because she's the stand in for Cindy, would hands around the neck feel a little like duct tape over the mouth, only lazier? Because you can duct tape someone, throw them in the trunk and forget about it for the night. But both methods are preventing breathing

 

[Roxy Dog]

I remember reading long ago that FCA would sometimes drive to Gentiva and pass Caylee off to CA at her work so that FCA could go to her "job". FCA's cell was pinging in the area of Gentiva during the attmpts to call CA at both her work and cell numbers. I think she had planned to hand Caylee over to CA at Gentiva. This might explain why Caylee wasn't wearing shoes. If she had been running around the home barefoot she wouldn't really need to put on shoes just to travel by car to Gentiva with FCA and then return home in a car with CA. If she wasn't going to be doing any walking around, no need for shoes. But when CA didn't answer FCA's calls and FCA was in a hurry to have her night with TL, FCA did the unthinkable, put her in the trunk and left her there at least overnight. June in Florida is HOT. Even overnight. In that kind of heat, in a closed trunk, even if Caylee was only in there until the following day before FCA could go back to the house and try to dispose of her, bag her, etc., I think that would be long enough for the decomposition to be at a point where there would be odor and fluids from the body onto the trunk liner. I think she put Caylee in bags because of the condition FCA found her in when she opened the trunk the following day (or whichever day it was that she borrowed the shovel and backed into the garage - 18th?). She bagged her to stop the fluids from escaping into the car but still kept her in the trunk even longer until she decided where to put her. I don't think she ever came up with a "plan" on where to place her, but instead placed her someplace when the odor became overbearing and it was hastily done without forethought, just to be rid of the smell. She picked the closest wooded area to the house and placed her barely out of view of passing traffic. She didn't put any thought, plan or effort into it at all.

 

[mattfz]

Couldn't be fully sleuthed out to smoking gun status, is the short answer...another circumstantial item that lead us in a certain direction, but never to a certain conclusion.

I liked what Dr. Vass had to say, although his science was very new. We also know that the FBI were not ready to state that there were abnormally high levels of chloroform in the trunk, at least not to the level Dr. Vass testified to. So, there was question about the quantity (in terms of detection) of chloroform to begin with, so much so that the state never did fully commit to it as they did the duct tape.

Go back and listen to Jeff Ashton's argument before Judge Strickland as to why Casey should receive the death penalty (as an answer to a ridiculous motion filed by Andrea Lyon). It's a freakin classic video. Or notorious, depending on your stance. But he clearly skirts talking about chloroform as the weapon, instead he very loosely suggests it in conjunction with the duct tape as the more definitive weapon.

The defense tried to float a theory about the chloroform levels that had nothing to do with nothing, IMO. Very weak area for JB, the vocabulary about sent him over the edge, and me off of my chair, laughing at him. So, he took the step of attempting to seperate chloroform from Casey entirely, by implementing Operation Rosebud-Cindy's testimony re: chlorophyll-and making the state look like they were hanging on to a weak theory.

Don't know if that's whatcha meant, but now that I have typed all of this, I am hitting "Submit Reply," darnit

Do you have a link to this video?

 

[Gnatcatcher]

Do you have a link to this video?

I'm looking for it, I know what video the poster means. It was the first time it was said openly in a hearing what approach the prosecutors were taking, and it was shocking to me, because it was the first time I remember the prosecutors taking what seemed to me a very personal approach to the situation. it was less paperwork and more human. I am thinking it was some time in early to mid 2009. I hope somebody finds and posts it quickly while I'm looking, because I sure do want to see that again right now. It was the moment I fell hard. It was the moment it all became real for me. It was the moment for me that this all went from some weird horrible woman killed her baby, to = oh my god.. that ... was ... a ... baby ....

for real.

found this so far...
“As the killer looked into her face, maybe her killer even saw her eyes as the tape was applied,” prosecutor Jeff Aston said during the hearing, which ended at 11:45 a.m. “First one piece, then two, then three so no breath was possible.Could Caylee have understood what was happening to her? Did she try to resist? Could her killer see the fear in her eyes as the tape was applied? These are questions only the jurors will be able to answer in this case. One thing we do know this is this. If we have gotten to this stage, those same jurors have already decided that the face that Caylee Anthony saw in those final moments of her mother — of her life was her mother`s face. “

 

[Gnatcatcher]

checking around Oct 09 hearings

 

[Gnatcatcher]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rAV535Cgi8

Here's a news report on that piece of Ashton speaking at the hearing. How could I have forgotten it was the day of the matching shirts, the "make him stop... I can't ..." I always thought I'd never forget any detail, but things are starting to fade for me.

 

[Intermezzo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rAV535Cgi8

Here's a news report on that piece of Ashton speaking at the hearing. How could I have forgotten it was the day of the matching shirts, the "make him stop... I can't ..." I always thought I'd never forget any detail, but things are starting to fade for me.

Date of that Death Penalty Hearing was December 11, 2009

Updated

2009.12.11 Today's Current News -*
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=92639&highlight=2009.12.11


Links for the Death Penalty motion/news articles etc... are in this thread...

 

[Intermezzo]

Jeff Ashton went on to give the following "summation" of his case if she was deemed guilty. It was brilliant, and it was moving.

http://sprocket-trials.blogspot.ca/2009/12/casey-anthony-hearing-december-11-2009.html


Caylee was almost three when she died, with duct tape over her nose and her mouth. Any child of that age should have had the physical ability to remove the duct tape covering her airway and preventing her from breathing. And the evidence in this case would indicate that Caylee was, if not average, above average in that regard.

A juror might conclude, then, that she must have been restrained, either chemically or physically.
If chemically restrained, her killer prepared some substance in advance that would render her physically unable to resist, administered the substance, awaited its effect, and then methodically applied three pieces of duct tape to completely cut off the flow of air to her mouth or her nose and let nature take its course. At least, Caylee wouldn't have had any fear.

How would jurors apply those facts to the law the court would give them?
If she was physically restrained, her killer would have had to restrain her arms by some means, applying tape while she was conscious. As the killer looked into her face, maybe her killer even saw her eyes as the tape was applied, first one piece, then two, then three, so that no breath was possible. Could Caylee have understood what was happening to her? Did she try to resist? Could her killer see the fear in her eyes as the tape was applied?

These are questions only the jurors will be able to answer in this case.

One thing we do know is this: if we have gotten to this stage, those same jurors have already decided that the face that Caylee Anthony saw in those final moments of her life was her mother’s face. Anyone who contends that no juror could find that these conclusions call for a sentence of death is only fooling themselves. Thank you.

 

[rose222]

Casey's reaction to Jeff Ashton was telling. It creeped me out when she clutched her wrist at one point. I think she did duct-tape Caylee's hands just to make it all 'fool-proof'. Sick.

(At one point during the trial when KC got real mad at Baez and showed her true demon face she put her hand on her neck. Lucky for Baez he is still safe and sound.)

 

[Baznme]

I haven't posted much since the verdict was read 1.5 yrs. ago now but I always check in to see what's new or new theories on what actually happened. I believe Jeff Ashton had it right in the courtroom when he said those three pieces of duct tape went across Caylee's face to suffocate her but, he didn't have the evidence then that's out there now to back it up. The trial of this girl, (Casey, as I can't call her a woman since I don't think she's done anything as a responsible adult in her entire life) was a travesty from the start. The verdict may be wrong but, the rest of her life will be nothing but misery, mistrust, and the general public dogging her steps every inch of the way. OJ had the audacity to put out a book called "If I did it" expecting to make money off it because his resources for income had about dried up. His eventual desperation to consifcate artifacts of his past fame became his detriment. Casey lied, cheated, stole and put her child last just to get by one day at a time, so her eventual desperation to get through will also become her own doom. I have to believe she will pay the piper, it's just a matter of "when". What must it be like to be so despised by so many?

 

[ZsaZsa]

As long as you have people like Dr Phil around, willing to pay her and her family $600K for a bunch of lies, she will live in comfort...:waitasec:

 

[ghostrighter]

This is my first post ever. I followed this case closely but have not read all the posts. The following is my theory and opinion:

Caylee was put to sleep in the back seat. Perhaps with zanex. Since the car had fold down back seats, the baby would be placed in the trunk so passerbys wouldn't see the child left alone. Casey may have left the car running and went about visiting or partying etc, and the car ran out of gas. The Baby died of heat frustration. It was not intended and Casey could not admit the mistake. Thus the subsequent cover up story about running out of gas and the gas gage being broken, thereby shifting blame to George who should have fixed the gas gage. Not KC's fault. Remember ...There is always some truth in her lies. KC really did run out of gas and she really did leave the child with Zanny/Zanex.

 

[ghostrighter]

This is my first post ever. I followed this case closely but have not read all the posts. The following is my theory and opinion:

Caylee was put to sleep in the back seat. Perhaps with zanex. Since the car had fold down back seats, the baby would be placed in the trunk so passerbys wouldn't see the child left alone. Casey may have left the car running and went about visiting or partying etc, and the car ran out of gas. The Baby died of heat frustration. It was not intended and Casey could not admit the mistake. Thus the subsequent cover up story about running out of gas and the gas gage being broken, thereby shifting blame to George who should have fixed the gas gage. Not KC's fault. Remember ...There is always some truth in her lies. KC really did run out of gas and she really did leave the child with Zanny/Zanex.

I should have clarified that I believe the rear seat was a split fold down seat. Making it possible to leave the child car seat in place and taking the sleeping child from the car seat and moving her to the trunk without anyone seeing.

 

[ZsaZsa]

This is my first post ever. I followed this case closely but have not read all the posts. The following is my theory and opinion:

Caylee was put to sleep in the back seat. Perhaps with zanex. Since the car had fold down back seats, the baby would be placed in the trunk so passerbys wouldn't see the child left alone. Casey may have left the car running and went about visiting or partying etc, and the car ran out of gas. The Baby died of heat frustration. It was not intended and Casey could not admit the mistake. Thus the subsequent cover up story about running out of gas and the gas gage being broken, thereby shifting blame to George who should have fixed the gas gage. Not KC's fault. Remember ...There is always some truth in her lies. KC really did run out of gas and she really did leave the child with Zanny/Zanex.

Caylee's hair was tested for sedatives, tranquillizers. No trace was found.
She was found however with three pieces of heavy duty duct tape still across her nose and mouth....

 

[krkrjx]

I do not think Casey ever wanted a child. The act of giving birth does not necessarily a mother make. I believe Casey resented Caylee because she thought her parents loved the little girl too much. But reality is, I do not think her parents know how to love; they bought Caylee all kinds of cute clothes and toys, but love is not about material possessions. It is about nurturing and taking care for one's health and welfare. Casey's parents tried to force her to be a Mom, but you can't force that on a person.

It is entirely possible that Casey wished her child dead from the beginning. What finally pushed her to act toward this end was, IMO, Casey wanted Tony and Tony did not want Caylee. Casey probably believed Tony would have found her totally irresistable if there was no "little snothead" in the way. The child had to disappear so that Casey could live happily ever after with Tony. But Casey could not just hand Caylee over to her parents. She hated her parents. Especially Cindy, IMO. She was not about to let Cindy be happy with little Caylee because in Casey's warped mind Cindy's job was to dote on her and no one else.

The heightened animosity that Casey was feeling toward Cindy at that period in time led Casey to lash out at Cindy through Caylee. IOW, Casey wanted her child to be gone and it was not lost on her that with that came an added bonus of sticking it to Cindy. Caylee's physical resemblance to Cindy probably played a part in the brutality involved in the crime. That duct tape was plastered on good and tight and it stayed on good and tight until full decomposition when it no longer had tissue to adhere to. It remained stuck to what did not decompose--Caylee's hair.

It is sickening that Caylee's killer is free. And sickening that her grandparents are elated about that. That poor child was a possession, a pawn in that family's sick games. Sadly, even after death she still is.

 

[Eidetic]

Casey's reaction to Jeff Ashton was telling. It creeped me out when she clutched her wrist at one point. I think she did duct-tape Caylee's hands just to make it all 'fool-proof'. Sick.

(At one point during the trial when KC got real mad at Baez and showed her true demon face she put her hand on her neck. Lucky for Baez he is still safe and sound.)

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQLrXJ9BdlI"]Casey Anthony "angry eyes" WFTV - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Tulessa]

Here it is...
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rAV535Cgi8"]WESH 2's Bob Kealing On Casey Anthony's Court Day - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Justiceseeker35]

April 9th 2009 Cindy Anthony gave a deposition which gave important clues as to the goings on of June 16th The Q is the examiners and the A is Cindy
8 Q Now, so during this time period -- and we're
9 going to go on forward a little bit here in the March
10 time period because we're already into 2008, March
11 through May of 2008. It's your understanding that Zanny
12 is a baby-sitter for Caylee, is that correct, or a nanny,
13 baby-sitter, whatever you want to use?
14 A Yes.
15 Q And that's all, again, based upon what Casey
16 has told you, essentially, that she's the one watching
17 her; is that right?
18 A Right.
19 Q All right.
20 A And that wouldn't be very often.
21 Q How often would it be?
22 A You know, just -- most of the time Casey was
23 gone in the evenings so I would watch Caylee.
24 Q So when you said that there were times where
25 she would stay over at Zanny's house, that would be how
1 many times would you estimate?
2 A I said once or twice a month.
3 Q Once or twice a month. We're starting at what
4 time period of once or twice a month she stayed over
5 there?
6 A It would have had to have been when -- she had
7 to have gone when I was at work because if I had been
8 home, she wouldn't have needed to take her.
9 Q How about with the staying over part because
10 you would be home every night, wouldn't you?
11 A Right. But if she was already gone and I was
12 at work --
13 Q So once or two times a month?
14 A Yes.
15 Q Okay. And it's your understanding that the
16 Zanny --
17 ******A Most of the time Caylee -- Casey brought
18 Caylee up to my office and dropped her off and then I
19 took her home.******

Q Now, when Casey would stay over at the
6 baby-sitter's, over at Zanny's, would they pack a bag for
7 Caylee?
8 A Casey always packed a bag for Caylee.
9 Q So she had a understanding or knowledge when
10 she was going to be staying over and she would take
11 clothes from the house?
12 A Casey always had a bag for Caylee no matter
13 where she went. If Caylee and I went to the store, we
14 always had a bag for Caylee with extra clothes and
15 diapers and things in it.
16 Q How many days worth of clothes would have been
17 in the bag?
18 A Probably two, as a normal thing. I used to do
19 that for my kids. Even if I just went to my mom's for
20 the day, I'd pack two outfits because you never know what
21 kids are going to get into.

1 And I also gave them Caylee's airbed at that
2 time that Casey bought specifically for Zanny's apartment
3 if she ever had to stay overnight there.
4 Q Okay. So she would bring the airbag with her
5 to stay over --
6 A Casey had the airbag in her car so if she ever
7 needed it.
Q Oh, I'm sorry, ma'am. June 16th, moving
9 forward, was this airbag, this air mattress that you're
10 telling me about, was that in Casey's possession or your
11 possession?
12 A That was at the house at that time.
13 Q The house meaning your house?
14 A Yes.
15 Q Okay. So this wasn't a trip where, as you
16 said before, that there would be times where she slept
17 over and that the air mattress would have gone with her.
18 This wasn't one of them; is that right?
19 A ****No. From my understanding, on June 16th,
20 Casey was going to pick Caylee back up at 4:00 in the
21 afternoon or whatever time it was.****

It's in Cindy's half truths that we can find out the truth. I believe now for sure that some time between 2:30-3:00 Casey snapped and google searched for suffocation because she was up against the wall. No where to live and no one to take her in other then TL who didn't want a kid living with him. And then it became an either or scenario. She didn't pack Caylee a bag, she dress her in shoes, she didn't get the air matress, she was spending the night with Grandma or in the trunk. Cindy believed that KC was going to drop Caylee off but did not answer her phone and stonewalled KC because of the arguement on the 15th for stealing and because Cindy asked KC to move out.

 

[eve80]

Why would she call to make sure no one is coming home, though, when she'd already left the house?



George's testimony about Casey and Caylee leaving at 12:50 pm is, IMO, more likely to have been a mistake rather than perjury (perhaps brought about by feeling like, as former LE, he OUGHT to be able to provide details). He also insisted that a certain TV show was on that wasn't showing at that time on that date.

I think that George's story goes nicely with the first missing person's report Casey wrote up in July. Maybe at first he couldn't remember that day exactly, Casey had a story, so he decided to go with it. After that he didn't want to change it because it would look suspicious. Even the clothing that George remembers goes nicely with the first police report. I don't know why George did that but this is my theory. In reality he knew Casey never left the house because he called the home phone looking for Caylee.

 

[krkrjx]

I think that George's story goes nicely with the first missing person's report Casey wrote up in July. Maybe at first he couldn't remember that day exactly, Casey had a story, so he decided to go with it. After that he didn't want to change it because it would look suspicious. Even the clothing that George remembers goes nicely with the first police report. I don't know why George did that but this is my theory. In reality he knew Casey never left the house because he called the home phone looking for Caylee.

There was some confusion in the beginning over the date. They were going with June 9, IIRC, for awhile. George might have been thinking back to that incorrect date and recalled correctly what Caylee was wearing that day. I think it made George look shifty, like he was hiding something, when in reality it could have just been an honest mistake with the date.

But only he knows for sure, I guess.