Titanic tourist sub goes missing in Atlantic Ocean, June 2023 #2

[iamshadow21]

I wonder if whatever caused this new debris field also damaged the Titanic in the process.

I think it probably would depend how close it was, but I imagine there would have been some kind of pulse when the implosion happened.

MOO

 

[CrimeDawg123]

Assuming the debris field is in fact the Titan, then it seems like this is the second best outcome as many have already expressed. It's very sad and my heart breaks for their loved ones.

 

[iamshadow21]

An apparent debris field was found but hasn’t that been a debris field for over 100 years? How do they know it’s from these guys? Guess they’ll let us know. At least they passed away doing something they thought they loved.

Titanium, plastic, and carbon fibre aren't materials that were used at the time the Titanic was built. And the whole wreck and the debris field, as far as I know, has been extensively mapped, both old school and digitally. New debris would stand out.

MOO

 

[abanddb123]

The most disturbing thing to me is the apparent shoddiness of the whole endeavor. From communication ”problems” that occurred so frequently it makes me wonder if it was even seen as a problem, to parts being attached by zip ties. It’s fine to want to explore the mysteries of the ocean floor and the wreck of the Titanic, but why treat it so cavalierly?
Do some people (like the ones heading up OceanGate) take so many risks with their lives and survive that they lose all ability to objectively assess risk?

Where did u see parts were held together by zip ties?

 

[fred&edna]

I'm borrowing this from a comment on a Titanic YT video...

Even after 108 years she is still a titan, her anchor crane still has traces of white paint, the brass still gleams but she slumbers silently in her grave. It’s painful and beautiful at the same time, for me it’s the white paint everywhere you look traces of white paint around window frames, portholes, rivers. This was once a living breathing ocean liner. Now her passengers, crew, the men whom built her are gone and she remains crumbling decaying but still proud and defiant almost as though the ship doesn’t know she’s dead.

 

[Rolypolyoly]

OT: Documentary "Finding Michael" It is about a man that was searching for his brother that was lost on Everest. I watched it on Hulu.

Spencer Matthews? His brother is married to Pippa Middleton. Useless fact for the day lol.

 

[cuffem]

I watched part of a Titanic documentary with video from the wreckage and despite the decay and rusticles there was an intact chandelier still attached to part of a ceiling, a brass bed with some ornate detail... and much more. Is it best to leave it to ruin or do we save these things as many of us preciously save the heirlooms and momentoes of our deceased ancestors? What about other quasi-scientists/bad marine-researchers who ARE definite thieves who might build a mini-sub or marine robotic tools and steal these items?

This isn't directed at you personally @ForensicToxicologist (I'm just jumping off your post).

I do know the RSS Titanic Inc and its' artifacts are vastly popular to many people and many countries. Maybe everyone has a different idea of what is the right/best thing to do (and how to do it).

I am not sure what doc you watched and when it was filmed but much of the grand staircase, chandelier has collapsed since Ballard filmed the Titanic. With others diving the wreck and removing items and it rusting the Titanic is not what it was since 1985.

 

[Gemmie]

The entire wreck site is like an enormous junkyard, with currents swirling through it. Most of it decomposing steel, scattered and balanced and collapsing slowly into itself. Things shift, sway, groan, bang, fall... and they've been doing it by degrees for a century.

I don't think the sound was from the Titan. I think it was from the Titanic itself, all over it. It's been singing itself to sleep in this way since it first settled to the bottom of the ocean.

MOO

While I agree that the Titanic has been singing itself to sleep (what a lovely way of putting it. ), I don't believe the banging sounds are the Titanic in this instance. Not if they are happening in 30 minute intervals. While I could be wrong, I don't think that would happen in nature.

Crews searching for the Titan submersible heard banging sounds every 30 minutes Tuesday, according to an internal government memo update on the search.

Banging sounds heard during Titan search Tuesday, according to internal government memo

A massive search operation is underway in an area twice the size of Connecticut for the submersible that went missing Sunday — as officials fear there's less than a day's worth of oxygen left on board the craft.

www.cnn.com

 

[fred&edna]

I am not sure what doc you watched and when it was filmed but much of the grand staircase, chandelier has collapsed since Ballard filmed the Titanic. With others diving the wreck and removing items and it rusting the Titanic is not what it was since 1985.

I think they were video clips from the Russian MIR I or II submersibles.

It's entirely possible more things are now in ruins/gone.

Oh wait... it maybe from the 2001 James Cameron (movie director and designer of the Sea Challenger sub) in combo with National Geographic!

 

[sds71]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1671926111763152904

A spokesperson for Pelagic Research Services confirmed to CNN that its remotely operated vehicle, which was the first to conduct a search for the missing OceanGate sub on the sea floor, found the debris field.

June 22, 2023 - Missing Titanic sub crew killed after 'catastrophic implosion'

The Titanic-bound submersible that went missing on Sunday with five people on board suffered a "catastrophic implosion," killing everyone on board, officials said Thursday.

www.cnn.com

 

[ArianeEmory]

Where did u see parts were held together by zip ties?

I’m not the person you’re replying to, but here’s some info:

https://www.news.com.au/world/north-america/titan-trip-was-suicide-mission-says-explorer/news-story/f4973cf59fcea37a34f26ac36052e9d0

<modsnip: not an approved source of information>

 

[Interested_But_Confused]

Earlier an interview was posted of a journalist (who is also a scientist) who talked about his own experience on a reseach submersible that explored the Titanic many years ago. On that occasion, they attached items to the outside of their sub in water-proof enclosures to show the impact of the pressure on those items and when they ascended back to their mother ship/research ship, they opened the bags and could see how the pressure had reduced the size of the items considerably, but they were still recognizable.

I don't know if they will find the remains of the Titan passengers, and if they do, will the equipment be able to retrieve them? I hope so. Apparently these ROV's are used to retrieve downed airplanes and other vehicles, so perhaps they are able to retrieve much of the debris field, including the remains of the deceased, if this is in fact what happened.

Experts believe the bow of Titanic is largely intact because it was already full of water when it sank, and as it sank deeper and deeper the water pressure equalized throughout the entire structure. The stern, by contrast, is torn to pieces because it was largely still full of air and imploded as it sank deeper.

When something is constantly exposed to the ever-increasing pressure, it will be crushed, but equally from all sides. Anything compressible will get smaller whilst anything incompressible will remain largely intact.

The reason the water pressure can cause so much damage to a submersible like Titan is that inside the hull the atmosphere is maintained at surface pressure. Any sort of breach in the hull causes the pressure to increase from about 15psi to about 6000psi in a fraction of a second.

It's not just the huge amount of pressure that is deadly and destructive, it's the speed of the change in pressure: like a supersonic jet slamming into a mountain. Sadly, IMO it's unlikely there will be any remains left to recover.

 

[Gemmie]

Expert says debris fields aren't uncommon near Titanic, but officials may have seen something that stood out​

[...]

Cremer would "not be surprised to find a debris field near the wreck of the Titanic," he said in an interview with CNN's Dana Bash.

June 22, 2023 - Missing Titanic sub crew killed after 'catastrophic implosion'

The Titanic-bound submersible that went missing on Sunday with five people on board suffered a "catastrophic implosion," killing everyone on board, officials said Thursday.

www.cnn.com

 

[Maat99]

They might be furious but didn’t stop the men from going. For something like this, the men made the decision to go, even if in hindsight now the blame game begins.

To be fair, there is a difference between an unforeseen problem that occurs during an inherently dangerous activity, and a problem that is utterly foreseeable and ignored. There are so many reports already (and most likely more to come IMO) that place this in the latter category.

Probably anyone with decision making responsibility at OceanGate has or will soon lawyer up, but it would be really nice to hear the rationale for not addressing the known problems and safety issues

 

[gliving]

I understand an implosion likely happened, but is there any chance part of the mechanics of the sub survived and were making a rhythmic knocking sound?

From what I've read, it wouldn't be an implosion like crushing a beer can. Because of its carbon fiber construction, it's more likely to have ruptured. Then again, the Titan was far deeper than the sub in this video.

Sadly, the same outcome.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Live coverage on MSNBC.

 

[Sundog]

Experts believe the bow of Titanic is largely intact because it was already full of water when it sank, and as it sank deeper and deeper the water pressure equalized throughout the entire structure. The stern, by contrast, is torn to pieces because it was largely still full of air and imploded as it sank deeper.

When something is constantly exposed to the ever-increasing pressure, it will be crushed, but equally from all sides. Anything compressible will get smaller whilst anything incompressible will remain largely intact.

The reason the water pressure can cause so much damage to a submersible like Titan is that inside the hull the atmosphere is maintained at surface pressure. Any sort of breach in the hull causes the pressure to increase from about 15psi to about 6000psi in a fraction of a second.

It's not just the huge amount of pressure that is deadly and destructive, it's the speed of the change in pressure: like a supersonic jet slamming into a mountain. Sadly, IMO it's unlikely there will be any remains left to recover.

Yes, the objects that were tied/attached to on the outside of the (non-Titan) submersible that I mentioned in my post would have experienced the pressure gradually as the sub descended. I guess that is why the item showed shrinkage but wasn't totally destroyed. All the air had gone out of it and it had been reduced in size and shape changed, but otherwise still intact.

In any event, I don't want to say more, out of respect for their loved ones.

 

[Warwick1991]

If it does turn out to have been an implosion, I'm wondering whether it was simply a matter of metal fatigue - ie the Titan having gradually weakened over previous trips.

It probably wouldn't be metal fatigue... The hull is constructed of spun carbon fiber, which has different material characteristics than metal. In the past, the hull was found to have had "cyclic damage" and had to be rebuilt. See posts in thread #1.

 

[Maat99]

Where did u see parts were held together by zip ties?

A previous passenger account of his trip on the sub

https://www.news.com.au/world/north-america/titan-trip-was-suicide-mission-says-explorer/news-story/f4973cf59fcea37a34f26ac36052e9d0

 

[bestill]

I’m hesitant to say that it’s inherently disrespectful to simply view the wreckage of the titanic. It would definitely be disrespectful to treat it as a playground because it is a graveyard. But considering there is a Titanic researcher on board, I do think the crew likely has some level of respect for what they are doing. I don’t know, maybe I’m giving too much of the benefit of the doubt, but that’s what my gut tells me

The thing I don’t understand is the recklessness behind all of this and the lack of safety precautions taken by OceanGate. People do visit historic tombs and graveyards all the time simply because we’re curious beings. But the difference with this graveyard is that it’s 12,000 feet deep in the middle of the ocean

MOO

I guess reading the title of this thread "titanic tourist sub..." didn't sit well with me, because that is what it seems this excursion was. I agree about the recklessness and not seriously taking the safety and protocols that we recommended. Sad.