Titanic tourist sub goes missing in Atlantic Ocean, June 2023

[Nova]

I also believe, based on the numerous other articles upthread, that the noises/banging would not be audible if they were stuck all the way down in the wreckage. I could definitely be wrong, but it seems that being stuck may be the ultimate worst possible place to be lost, because of the incredibly limited resources able to travel that far down, even with the capabilities of multiple militaries.

You may well be right: this is VERY FAR from any expertise of mine. But I saw a documentary on whales recently and it was said that sounds travel farther through water, which is how some species of whale are able to communicate with one another from miles away.

Whether that would still be true at a depth of 12,500' may be another matter entirely.

 

[Nova]

You are correct: there’s one toilet on board but the hope is that they won’t have to use it.

"Toilet", in this case, is a generous descriptor.

They have a small curtain for privacy and zip-lock bags in which to urinate and take the fluid back to the surface with them. Anything else seems to be discouraged, hence the caution not to eat too much before entering the submersible.

The above is my understanding based on previous links in this thread.

 

[crhedBngr]

Remember the Chilian Miners?

Yes, absolutely.

JMVHO.

 

[Nova]

Could they be floating on the surface of the ocean and that's what the white rectangular object is that was spotted by the Canadian plane? Hopefully it is and they're still alive.

It's odd to me that "a white rectangle" was reported with no apparent mention of the size of the object...

I mean, was it the size of a laptop or the size of the submersible?

 

[Emi]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1671347591622057986

 

[gitana1]

The NY Times reports that a lot of people in the industry were very concerned about the sub's design.

OceanGate Was Warned of Potential for ‘Catastrophic’ Problems With Titanic Mission (Published 2023)

Experts inside and outside the company warned of potential dangers and urged the company to undergo a certification process.

www.nytimes.com

Leaders in the submersible craft industry were so worried about what they called the “experimental” approach of OceanGate, the company whose craft has gone missing, that they wrote a letter in 2018 warning of possible “catastrophic” problems with the submersible’s development and its planned mission to tour the Titanic wreckage.
...
The signatories — more than three dozen people, including oceanographers, submersible company executives and deep-sea explorers — warned that they had “unanimous concern” about OceanGate’s development of the Titan submersible, the same craft that is now missing in the North Atlantic with five people on board.


Edit - Here's a link to the actual letter: https://int.nyt.com/data/documentto...etter-to-ocean-gate/eddb63615a7b3764/full.pdf

Wow. Geez there are going to be some crazy, business-ending lawsuits. Even without them, there will be no more funding and no more rich people paying to be “crew” on anything created by this company. They’re done, even if the people survive this. IMO.

 

[gitana1]

Soon after, details emerged about the sub's non-standard design that did not meet regulations, including steering apparently handled by a $30 Logitech F710 wireless PC game controller from 2010.

As the potential disaster gripped social media, details about OceanGate's historyof avoiding or complaining about safety regulations emerged. In particular, people began sharing a CBS Sunday Morning segment broadcast in November 2022 that shows reporter David Pogue visiting the Titan, which he later boarded for an expedition to the Titanic.

During the CBS clip, Rush gives Pogue a tour of the sub, noting the presence of "only one button" in the entire vessel and saying that a sub "should be like an elevator." Pogue also mentions how many pieces of the sub seem improvised, including off-the-shelf computer displays, a lighted overhead grab bar "from Camper World," and using construction pipes as ballast. During that segment, Rush holds up a Logitech F710 Wireless controller that appears to have 3D-printed thumb-stick extensions and says, "We run the whole thing with this game controller."
View attachment 430137
The Logitech F710 controller, introduced in 2010, is a wireless dual-thumbstick gamepad for PCs that uses 2.4 GHz communications to a USB receiver. While its chunky design appears outdated by today's standards, it has been in continuous production for 13 years, and it usually sells for about $29.99 on Amazon.

Shortly after news of the Logitech controller aboard the Titan spread on Tuesday morning, the Cheap *advertiser censored* Gamer Twitter account, which regularly posts video game deals, posted an Amazon link to the Logitech F710 controller on Twitter, and the item quickly sold out.

Submarine missing near Titanic used a $30 Logitech gamepad for steering

While rescuers fear for OceanGate crew, Logitech F710 PC gamepad sells out within minutes.

arstechnica.com

What’s crazy is that CEO and founder knew everything about the vessel and the concerns voiced by many, and went on excursions in it anyhow. Including this ill-fated one. Absolute confidence, apparently. Hubris?

 

[Kemug]

Re the banging heard, I don't think that's necessarily good news - I have very little hope that they will be rescued alive, in which case the sooner they succumb the better.

 

[Charlot123]

I guess they were their risks to take, their money to waste and their lives to gamble with, I'm guessing they must have understood the risks and if 3 waivers and more than one mention of possible death didn't dissuade them from taking those risks, then we have to assume they were OK with them.

It's their families I feel for, the ones who didn't make that choice but will still have to live with the consequences of it, and I do wonder if their estates will be required to cover the cost of the vast amount of resources being used just now i byhto try and recover them, what's money after all?.

It is their risk to take, but not quite. There is always the question of being fully aware of the risks. I can imagine that a 59-year-old billionaire or a French diver might have accepted the possibility of a catastrophe. (Some people are simply not made to die in own beds.) But for Mr. Dawood to knowingly risk the life of his 19-year-old son, his heir, possibly… this is strange, and I wonder if he was fully aware. JMO - it was all about the wish to show such unique shots and videos to their friends. And - it was just the third dive of the Titan. The “never before” effect, wow! (How many people have been on the Everest? Over 6000. How many have seen the Titanic wreckage since the catastrophe? 140. Let us choose the Titanic, it is new and cool.)

However; specifically because of a very young man on board, I doubt that all were fully cognizant of the risks. Chris Brown, the friend of Hamish Harding, asked for his deposit back on realizing that the enterprise was neither safe nor serious. Mr. Harding did not. To me, when the information is processed very differently by two successful, adventurous, smart friends, it might imply certain vagueness allowing for misinterpretation. Or, indeed, the captain in his heart of hearts, did not believe the risks, and sounded convincing. Ultimately, the risks were viewed as acceptable by the four passengers. JMO.

 

[Kaykedi]

It is their risk to take, but not quite. There is always the question of being fully aware of the risks. I can imagine that a 59-year-old billionaire or a French diver might have accepted the possibility of a catastrophe. (Some people are simply not made to die in own beds.) But for Mr. Dawood to knowingly risk the life of his 19-year-old son, his heir, possibly… this is strange, and I wonder if he was fully aware. JMO - it was all about the wish to show such unique shots and videos to their friends. And - it was just the third dive of the Titan. The “never before” effect, wow! (How many people have been on the Everest? Over 6000. How many have seen the Titanic wreckage since the catastrophe? 140. Let us choose the Titanic, it is new and cool.)

However; specifically because of a very young man on board, I doubt that all were fully cognizant of the risks. Chris Brown, the friend of Hamish Harding, asked for his deposit back on realizing that the enterprise was neither safe nor serious. Mr. Harding did not. To me, when the information is processed very differently by two successful, adventurous, smart friends, it might imply certain vagueness allowing for misinterpretation. Or, indeed, the captain in his heart of hearts, did not believe the risks, and sounded convincing. Ultimately, the risks were viewed as acceptable by the four passengers. JMO.

Absolutely spot on

 

[Dhighsmith]

Re the banging heard, I don't think that's necessarily good news - I have very little hope that they will be rescued alive, in which case the sooner they succumb the better.

From MSM description there seems to be pattern, not random like a whale diving deep, knocking sounds detected into early evening.

 

[Charlot123]

What’s crazy is that CEO and founder knew everything about the vessel and the concerns voiced by many, and went on excursions in it anyhow. Including this ill-fated one. Absolute confidence, apparently. Hubris?

Hubris, partially. There are people obsessed with flying to the degree that they disregard obvious warning signs; probably the same applies to deep sea divers who read Jules Verne as kids. I am trying to imagine the business side of it. Ocean Gates might have planned to start sooner, but suddenly, the world was put on hold for two years. It was their third trip only, and I can imagine the need in passengers, submerges and a lot of positive advertising. Also, the passengers made their deposits a long time ago and hence, were eager. Probably all of it contributed. All in all, horribly sad.

 

[Cool Cats]

OceanGate Was Warned of Potential for ‘Catastrophic’ Problems With Titanic Mission (Published 2023)

Experts inside and outside the company warned of potential dangers and urged the company to undergo a certification process.

www.nytimes.com

Marine Technology Society Letter of Warning:
https://int.nyt.com/data/documentto...etter-to-ocean-gate/eddb63615a7b3764/full.pdf

 

[AliceInPain]

sbm from tweet above and my question: why would there be debris floating around on the surface of the ocean if something had happened down there?, they were nearly at the wreck site. What went down there 110+ years ago stayed down there.
"The really good news that we have is that we haven’t heard bad news — they haven’t found a wreckage, they haven’t found debris floating..."
(nbc news)

 

[Mandalas]

Not looking promising

Investigation of underwater noises in search for missing Titan submersible are 'negative', says US Coast Guard

Regular banging sounds were picked up by a Canadian plane with underwater sonar capabilities after it was deployed in the search for the missing vessel.

The banging sounds were detected every 30 minutes on Tuesday - and were picked up again when search teams deployed more radars in the area.

But the US Coast Guard said on Wednesday an investigation of the noises by specialist underwater equipment had "yielded negative results".

Investigation of underwater noises in search for missing Titan submersible are 'negative', says US Coast Guard

The banging noises - detected every 30 minutes - were picked up by a Canadian plane with underwater sonar capabilities. But the US Coast Guard says an underwater investigation has "yielded negative results".

www.google.com

 

[Kemug]

From MSM description there seems to be pattern, not random like a whale diving deep, knocking sounds detected into early evening.

Oh yes, I'm not disputing it, just giving my opinion about those poor people - that since they are almost certainly doomed, it would be better for them to die sooner rather than later while enduring awful fear and panic, plus other physical symptoms. IMO JMO

 

[Cool Cats]

It is their risk to take, but not quite. There is always the question of being fully aware of the risks. I can imagine that a 59-year-old billionaire or a French diver might have accepted the possibility of a catastrophe. (Some people are simply not made to die in own beds.) But for Mr. Dawood to knowingly risk the life of his 19-year-old son, his heir, possibly… this is strange, and I wonder if he was fully aware. JMO - it was all about the wish to show such unique shots and videos to their friends. And - it was just the third dive of the Titan. The “never before” effect, wow! (How many people have been on the Everest? Over 6000. How many have seen the Titanic wreckage since the catastrophe? 140. Let us choose the Titanic, it is new and cool.)

However; specifically because of a very young man on board, I doubt that all were fully cognizant of the risks. Chris Brown, the friend of Hamish Harding, asked for his deposit back on realizing that the enterprise was neither safe nor serious. Mr. Harding did not. To me, when the information is processed very differently by two successful, adventurous, smart friends, it might imply certain vagueness allowing for misinterpretation. Or, indeed, the captain in his heart of hearts, did not believe the risks, and sounded convincing. Ultimately, the risks were viewed as acceptable by the four passengers. JMO.

Titanic sub company was sued over safety concerns

On Monday, OceanGate Expeditions confirmed that its Titan vessel went missing with five passengers on board.

www.newsweek.com

Yup. Not everyone would know everything of the flaws in this submersible.

In 2018, an employee of OceanGate and pilot of the company's submersibles David Lochridge, filed a lawsuit alleging that the Titan needed additional testing to travel to such deep depths.

The lawsuit filed by Lochridge alleged that there were "visible" flaws with the Titan vessel and presented a danger to passengers when traveling to such deep depths.

The lawsuit also alleged that the passengers who pay around $250,000 for tickets to see the Titanic wreckage, would be unaware of some of the flaws Lochridge brought up.

According to the lawsuit, OceanGate did not look into the concerns brought up by Lochridge and instead fired him.

Passengers on missing Titanic submersible have no way to escape

"Our entire focus is on the wellbeing of the crew...," spokespeople for OceanGate Expeditions told Newsweek.

www.newsweek.com

In 2022, News correspondent David Pogue published a story on CBS News detailing his journey on the OceanGate Expeditions submersible and wrote that tickets for the expedition are around $250,000.

Pogue also spoke with Stockton Rush, the CEO of OceanGate Expeditions who said, "We have clients that are Titanic enthusiasts, which we refer to as Titaniacs."

"We've had people who have mortgaged their home to come and do the trip. And we have people who don't think twice about a trip of this cost. We had one gentleman who had won the lottery," Rush said.

 

[MollyHarps]

Very interesting.. I hope it means people are alive.

I just don’t see how they’ll be rescued if they’re at the sea bed at those depths.

So I honestly think them being alive is the worst case now - I hope what happened to them was quick.

I hope I’m wrong but I just can’t see a positive outcome and the thought of them sitting around for 90 hours waiting for the oxygen to run out and then inevitable death breaks my heart.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Morning! Anyone else hiding behind the sofa with their hands over their eyes?

While the reports of banging are encouraging, it truly is a race against time to get them up and out of there pronto. Dreadful situation. I’ll be peeking through my fingers all day.

 

[LordMo]

yeah, like, if I have to die in an unregulated un-openable undetectable ramshackle deep-sea deathtrap designed by a stubborn maniac who makes me listen to his music, I would much rather get crunched into soup by a simultaneous hull structure failure than many of the other far more horrifying options.