Found Safe TN - Mary Catherine Elizabeth Thomas, 15, Maury County, 13 March 2017 #12

[Whiteorchids]

The friend that dropped her off knows something. I'm convinced that she led LE to OKC. Why would she not cooperate unless she did something wrong? If all she did was drop her off, what's there to hide?


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Her friendship with ET?

 

[MsMtOlympus]

msmtolympus, did you alert your own post? it will get to the mods quicker...

I can't understand any reason for the motion to be denied...maybe a legal beagle can weigh in once the topic gets approved?

Thanks, white rabbit! Just to clarify, do you mean using the "report" button? I've never done this before, wasn't sure if reporting on your own post was allowed.

 

[white rabbit]

yes. I've done it before (alert my own post for mod approval). I don't believe it's against the rules.

 

[pegs]

Results of this morning's petition were just posted by reporter Burt Scott Staggs on his FB page. Motion was denied. MODS, am I allowed to quote him?

This is incredibly disappointing! I wonder if there is some way the process can be expedited? Surely there is an emergency, or eminent danger clause or way to circumvent this long waiting period?? What about applying time that has already been lost?

I hate to sound like a broken record, but if these people that know they are the subjects of this deposition action fail to act in a responsible manner/moral manner and something happens to Elizabeth then they will live with not only their conscience but hopefully any criminal actions that may result. It is inconceivable to me that under the circumstances anyone would not do whatever they could to help LE. Steaming mad about this new development. :furious:

 

[shifferbrainz]

And then he would be driving around in a stolen car.

The trade car could be perfectly legal. Lots of ugly , yet perfectly good cars get traded in and sent directly to scrap yards for sale. In some cases, as silly as it seems, plates will still be on the car there. The plate may appear to be valid, or not, but is not reported as stolen.

Besides that, everyone is looking for a rogue so a stolen Marquis is better than a Rogue with an amber alert attached to it.

 

[MommyDoll2]

The only scenario I can imagine in which the Rogue could disappear is if it were stolen and sold for parts by the type of professional car thieves that do this.


If he bought a used car for cash, that brings up these questions: How much cash would it take to buy a reliable used car? How much cash did/does TC actually have? What transportation did they use to get to the place where the used car was being sold if they ditched the Rogue (and ET does not drive)? How did TC avoid registering the car in his own name? I am again going with the simplest answer. He still has the Rogue.

Again we are thinking of things in normal legal life. TC's life is no longer legal or normal. Maybe he had someone who he traded the Rogue for another vehicle. There are so many illegal underground networks that most of us never have any knowledge of. Regardless all he needs are fake dealer plates on the newly acquired vehicle. He does not have to register it or do anything legal. He would be in the clear unless he got pulled over. (& depending how good the forgery was- he might still be in the clear -if he has a good fake ID)

 

[1&2&3]

People with narcissistic personalities such as TC tend to be extremely charming. They have two completely different sides to them - the one they show everyone else, and the one they show to those they abuse/'love'. He is probably (and has been) mentally/emotionally abusing ET without her even realizing it. Especially since her mother's abuse was physical and his abuse doesn't leave (physical) scars. She probably doesn't even know how to put her finger on why she was concerned about seeing him at work or leaving with him. Narcissists are very very clever in tearing down what ever amount of self esteem their victim has. He probably has her convinced he is the only one who understands her pain. Her schoolmates (and other teachers ?) shunned/bullied her regarding their relationship/kiss/his being fired, how perfect for him to 'be on her side' and tell her he doesn't blame her.

He probably shows a completely different facade to the other teachers and students and that is one of a great guy, affable, likable, charming, supportive, etc. Probably why people were upset with her and supportive of him. Narcissists are very dangerous, very cunning, have absolutely no empathy, and are completely and solely out for themselves only. I'm betting JC is thrilled he is gone. Their kids probably are too. Although I'm guessing they're sorry for ET getting tangled in his web. They know what she is (or very soon will be) going through with him.

Narcissists are nasty in their home life. Very negative, very pissy, and are only out to make themselves look good to the outside world. Their victims become very focused trying to keep him calm and nice, dreading an outburst and trying to keep the peace. For a narcissist, it's all about the facade they put out there to look as if they are better than everyone else. Look at his 'lifetime achievements': millionaire, CIA, etc. He is probably lieing and telling people (if they meet others along the way) that she is 18 and isn't he the stud (butt-ugly) 50 year old that can get a beautiful '18' year old. Maybe they even got her a fake id (I know many college freshman get these very easily on many campuses, sadly). I know she is only 15 and looks young, but at my age (50s) anyone under 30 looks like a baby to me, especially 18 year olds. I would have trouble telling the difference between a 15 year old and an 18 year old.

The saddest thing about narcissists, is that so many others think they are great people, high achievers, when in actuality, they are miserable trying to take those they 'love' down to their level of misery. Fortunately, most people never experience having a narcissist in their life - they will never comprehend just how bad life is with one and I hope ET isn't experiencing this side of him (it usually takes a while for a narc to let his real self out and show the ugly).

I pray every night that LE finds these two and saves ET from TC's disgusting grip.

Fantastic post! It sounds like you have personal knowledge of living with a narcissist. My heart goes out to you and any one else who has suffered through this nightmare. I have been there too.

ET comes from a very physically abusive home that had to have had mental abuse also. I don't see one occurring without the other due to the charges her mother is facing. TC's sweet charming side would be so appealing to ET.

After three weeks on the run, living a different lifestyle and with each other constantly, I imagine his other side has surfaced. He HAS her, she is his as far as he is concerned, he can't keep up the charade 24/7 for three weeks. IMO.

However, he is able to control how much his other side shows. With what I imagine she has seen and suffered at home, ET may not think TC's bad side is too bad if she is not being abused.

We only know a part of ET's home life which was severe enough for her mother to be charged and loose custody of the children. This is the part I am referring to as we have no idea what the years before were like.

My opinions only.

 

[MsMtOlympus]

This is incredibly disappointing! I wonder if there is some way the process can be expedited? Surely there is an emergency, or eminent danger clause or way to circumvent this long waiting period?? What about applying time that has already been lost?

I hate to sound like a broken record, but if these people that know they are the subjects of this deposition action fail to act in a responsible manner/moral manner and something happens to Elizabeth then they will live with not only their conscience but hopefully any criminal actions that may result. It is inconceivable to me that under the circumstances anyone would not do whatever they could to help LE. Steaming mad about this new development. :furious:

Agreed! It's one thing for a teenager to not "get" the serious implications and potential consequences of this crime (or even realize that's it's a crime in the first place) but it's entirely another for a parent to feel the same way. Are we missing something here? Why is this family still not cooperating?

 

[MsPooh]

I know this has been discussed, but for the life of me I can't remember. .how long has ET's family lived in Columbia after moving from Indiana?

 

[white rabbit]

why would a judge on any court case rule against compelling a witness (es) to assist with an investigation?

 

[debirlfan]

Hey, sorry I'm not caught up. We have had death in the family and then others hospitalized. I don't have the energy or the ability to do much. We are struggling as a family.

Sorry to hear - but I wonder, would putting the news out publicly of the death/illnesses be helpful? If someone ET is close to is in the hospital, might that encourage her to get away/come home?

 

[debirlfan]

My only thoughts on why they wouldn't help LE is if they have some type of knowledge of a very bad home life and seriously believe they are helping her by not revealing what they know.

IMO

I am not agreeing with their actions by any means. Just trying to figure why parents would choose this route and given ET's history of abuse, maybe they really believe they are all doing what is best for her. Maybe they felt ET was unsafe in her home. Not saying her home was unsafe.

We don't know what she told the friend that is making her keep her mouth shut. I can't see her friend helping if she didn't believe Elizabeth needed out of her situation at home.

Hopefully there are some helpful leads for LE soon.

Yeah, that's pretty much my thoughts, as well. Maybe ET's afraid of her mother coming back into her life (impossible to know what TC or the mother told her - maybe the mother threatened to kill her if she testified against the mother?)

If ET feared for her life (especially if she had reason to), I could see friends/friends parents feeling like they had to keep their mouths shut, no matter what.

 

[cady]

OT is there a thread for school shooting in San Bernardino? Just happened. JMO

 

[Kapua]

Again we are thinking of things in normal legal life. TC's life is no longer legal or normal. Maybe he had someone who he traded the Rogue for another vehicle. There are so many illegal underground networks that most of us never have any knowledge of. Regardless all he needs are fake dealer plates on the newly acquired vehicle. He does not have to register it or do anything legal. He would be in the clear unless he got pulled over. (& depending how good the forgery was- he might still be in the clear -if he has a good fake ID)

Yes, but, up until fairly recently, TC led a normal, legal life, too. And what might trip him up is trying to act like a hardened criminal without the knowledge and skills to do so.

 

[Kapua]

OT is there a thread for school shooting in San Bernardino? Just happened. JMO

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?335052-School-Shooting-in-San-Bernardino

 

[Mom24]

Read my post #522. I believe the juvenile witness and her parents may have committed a crime that would allow them to invoke the 5th during a deposition.

They may not have committed any crimes and they would not be able to invoke the 5th. I'm just pointing out possibility's. JMO

But they're answering evidentiary questions (not testimonial) about a crime they didn't commit (abduction).

 

[1&2&3]

Wonder if LE followed up on the friends car that her parents traded?

Could they have given it to TC?

 

[RANCH]

But they're answering evidentiary questions (not testimonial) about a crime they didn't commit (abduction).

If the witness told LE one thing and admits they lied to them by giving a different answer in the deposition that answer could be used as evidence against them for a charge of obstruction of justice. JMO

 

[Mom24]

This is incredibly disappointing! I wonder if there is some way the process can be expedited? Surely there is an emergency, or eminent danger clause or way to circumvent this long waiting period?? What about applying time that has already been lost?

I hate to sound like a broken record, but if these people that know they are the subjects of this deposition action fail to act in a responsible manner/moral manner and something happens to Elizabeth then they will live with not only their conscience but hopefully any criminal actions that may result. It is inconceivable to me that under the circumstances anyone would not do whatever they could to help LE. Steaming mad about this new development. :furious:

Unfortunately it's a processing issue. Look, I've seen a denial based on a staple, no joke. Some courts require that any filings with staples have the staple covered with tape so the raw edge of the staple won't hurt anyone and that there be two sets of staples on the left hand binding edge. There are even requirements on what weight of paper is allowed. So they'll file a motion again after they've followed the proper protocol. Frustrating, but there is a madness to the method.

 

[legalbanter]

Legal people -- any idea what kind of information could justify probable cause for searching the friend's sold vehicle? Would the friend ditching it (well, her parents selling it) soon after ET father's motion be up for consideration when trying to compile evidence equating to probable cause?

I'm sure they could figure out who purchased the vehicle, so I have a hard time believing it was sold/handed off to TC.

I mean, the selling of the car could be coincidental as well.