Trial Discussion Thread #34 - 14.05.06 Day 27

[Val1]

Are they? Then why are a lot of the "innocent" dressed in orange jumpsuits, traipsed around in handcuffs, and held behind bars?

Obviously because they aren't the "golden boy" of the country with family money and power up the yingyang.. and can't afford to buy their way out of "holding" with a high powered legal team that somehow managed to get pretty much all his bail conditions waived to boot.

 

[JudgeJudi]

... and claims to leaving Reeva alone in pitch black darkness without a word of explanation other than "Get down" and "Call police".

OP says he's used this expression numerous times on the night, but we know that he didn't ask her "Did you hear that?" He never told her why to ring and she never asked? "Hello, my bf just asked me to ring you. Have a nice night".

 

[Greater Than]

Substituting our judgement safe behind our keyboards is in my mind terribly irresponsible. Of course there were other options that would have been better in retrospect. But if his story is true he feared an intruder in his EN SUITE BATHROOM. In his mind time was of the essence and and he had split seconds to make a decision. It makes perfect sense to me that he would not use two minutes to put on his legs when the 'intruder' was 10 seconds down a hallway. If he instinctively preferred confronting the intruder in the bathroom rather than having the intruder confront both he AND Reeva in the bedroom, well that makes split second sense to me too. He did what he did and while the outcome was horrible and heartbreaking and unnecessary people should really check their "it makes no sense!" thinking. Seen in the context of the circumstances, which were his circumstances and not ours, it had a certain tragic logic.

Explain the logic in assuming the person he heard in the toilet was an intruder who crawled up a ladder rather than his girlfriend, whom he knew was awake.

Explain the logic in not getting any verbal confirmation from his girlfriend at all while he bent down to get his gun and remove the holster -- not if she heard the noise, not where she was, not if she acknowledged his instructions to get down or call the police...

Explain the logic in assuming the intruder was armed and dangerous, yet was hiding behind a locked toilet door.

Explain the logic of an experienced gun owner in shooting at an unidentified target.

Logic cannot explain illogical actions because "it makes no sense!"

 

[TorisMom003]

Are they? Then why are a lot of the "innocent" dressed in orange jumpsuits, traipsed around in handcuffs, and held behind bars?

The answer depends on further explanation as to who the "innocent" ones are. Are they the ones that have gone through a trial and been found guilty by either a judge or a jury? Or are they the ones that are waiting their trial behind bars to determine if they are guilty or not guilty?

 

[katydid23]

There was testimony already, that on the tragic day she died, Reeva came and went from OP's home by herself. She arrived before he did that day. Then went to market and returned. So she obviously knew how to use the alarm remote.

And if she was spending time alone there, she would have been told how to hit PANIC button A beautiful young lady knows things like that because she is always aware of safety precautions.

I think that was another falsehood set forth by OP. And the assessor caught him out. anic:

 

[Cymbaline]

Good point. I was wondering about that too. Why didnt she do what OP supposedly asked her to do? She never called cops with her cell, and was, according to DT theory, supposedly hiding in the toilet and not answering,because she was afraid of the intruders that OP was shouting at. So why didn't she call the cops or security from her hiding place?

For that matter, why didnt OP push his alarm panic button.

All he said in that long dialogue with Nel, was that he did not know for sure if it worked, for the pst several months after house was painted or something. So why not push it anyway?

OP didn't push the alarm panic button because he didn't accidentally shoot Reeva. He executed her in a fit of rage.



JMO :seeya:

 

[lithgow1]

I would love hard science.

Would love to hear how hard science works for OP's story. Right now, I don't see hard science being argued at all for OP's version other than emotive arguments (e.g. you aren't in his shoes, he is scared coz SA is paranoid of intruders, he's on stumps and vulnerable, he loved Reeva and Reeva loved him too, it's Nel's question that made OP write different versions of events, hear how he cries - he is so genuine, he screams like a woman, etc).

In fact, if we look at the hard science of this case, it looks like all the "hard science" experts agree with PT case. What experts have DT come up with?! Dixon?

Well look at you - you go and accuse wagesofsin of using common sense and you are just as guilty of it!

 

[Harmony 2]

I just removed about 15 posts that belong in the 'political pavilion' forum. The link is below if you wish to continue that discussion. This thread should stay on topic. thanks

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

 

[jilly]

I heard something interesting re the assessor's questions today on the radio - they seemed to think that the questioning doesn't relate so much to could RS have gone down and eaten (as many of us presumed) but more did she know how to work it, the panic button on it etc and if so why would she have not used it to get help, escape etc. Basically they seemed to think its relevance is more ominous for OP than it may have seemed. Dunno if that is right at all but that's what they were saying.

I really think the question (2 of them now) is irrelevant for the following:

I believe that Reeva did not think in a million years that Oscar was going to get his gun and kill her. Imo, she ran into the cubicle to put a barrier between her and Oscar. Yes, she was no doubt scared - she even said in one of her texts that he scares hers sometimes. I've maintained from the beginning, if she was scared for her life, she would have run down the stairs and out the door - not cornered herself in a cubicle.

 

[crasshopper]

So sorry I'm so late getting back to you, crasshopper, but I see TorisMom003 kindly posted the only way I know how to do it.

Tnx and hi

 

[TorisMom003]

I really think the question (2 of them now) is irrelevant for the following:

I believe that Reeva did not think in a million years that Oscar was going to get his gun and kill her. Imo, she ran into the cubicle to put a barrier between her and Oscar. Yes, she was no doubt scared - she even said in one of her texts that he scares hers sometimes. I've maintained from the beginning, if she was scared for her life, she would have run down the stairs and out the door - not cornered herself in a cubicle.

BBM

Unless she couldn't because OP was blocking her way. I tend to agree with Val that this argument started downstairs. I think that Reeva ran upstairs for two reasons....1 to get away from OP and 2 to get her things so she could leave. I think that is why the bedroom door is as damaged as it is. Reeva locked OP out of the bedroom and he broke through the door.

MOO

 

[crasshopper]

rbsm

No doubt scared - she even said in one of her texts that he scares hers sometimes. I've maintained from the beginning, if she was scared for her life, she would have run down the stairs and out the door - not cornered herself in a cubicle.

Unless he was in her way, holding a bat...

 

[crasshopper]

BBM

Unless she couldn't because OP was blocking her way. I tend to agree with Val that this argument started downstairs. I think that Reeva ran upstairs for two reasons....1 to get away from OP and 2 to get her things so she could leave. I think that is why the bedroom door is as damaged as it is. Reeva locked OP out of the bedroom and he broke through the door.

MOO

It's like we had ESP

 

[lithgow1]

I just removed about 15 posts that belong in the 'political pavilion' forum. The link is below if you wish to continue that discussion. This thread should stay on topic. thanks

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

I 'started that' so apologies - will stick to crimes and killers from now on!

 

[TorisMom003]

I 'started that' so apologies - will stick to crimes and killers from now on!

Bad Lithgow!! Bad, bad!!

lol

 

[ColonelMustard]

It would make sense for him to refer to her that way to a close by neighbor and family man with children since Reeva apparently was spending nights there. I've heard that done before to put some legitimacy to the relationship.

jmo

That makes sense. I really couldn't figure it out, either.

 

[JudgeJudi]

BBM - see, that's where I start to lose the plot. If he's convicted of murder, he should stay the hell behind bars and not be released unless his appeal is successful. He's already had over a year's freedom, so why should he be allowed a single extra day if he's convicted? Appeals can go on forever. How the hell are Reeva's family supposed to move on with their tattered lives knowing he's living his life out there in the open as a convicted murderer! And don't other women have the right to be kept safe from him? The law is ridiculous sometimes.

Can you get bail after a murder conviction?

 

[crasshopper]

Are they? Then why are a lot of the "innocent" dressed in orange jumpsuits, traipsed around in handcuffs, and held behind bars?

I don't dispute that fact or that the principle is always applied, I was clarifying the statute.


"Although the Constitution of the United States does not cite it explicitly, presumption of innocence is widely held to follow from the 5th, 6th, and 14th amendments."

 

[ColonelMustard]

I agree. Any thoughts as to who did it? To me it seems as though it may have been the phone in the kitchen OR the phone in the garage (unless they were one in the same).

The likely list is Oscar's Brother, Oscar's Sister, Carise herself (though it was she who let slip the existence of both phones - so probably not), I don't think the Attorney "Oldbu**er" would risk doing it but might he suggest it would be a good idea for it to go missing? Nooo! It would too big a risk if it ever became public. (Just thinking aloud). Divaris? Did Frankie get a look in at any time? Now there is a trusty if ever there was one - his livelihood depended on OP but he doesn't seem to have figured in the house, just at the front door. Oh no! I have got it! It was one of OP's 'currupt policemen' :floorlaugh: but this time working for rather than against him. Who have I missed off?

Couldn't resist a bit of levity here. Hope nobody is offended.

Actually, it was pretty funny. What I really like is the little smilie guy you picked to go with it!!

 

[Val1]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karmady View Post
It would make sense for him to refer to her that way to a close by neighbor and family man with children since Reeva apparently was spending nights there. I've heard that done before to put some legitimacy to the relationship.

jmo

That makes sense. I really couldn't figure it out, either.

I wonder if he ever introduced ST or the previous gf's that way...