Trial Discussion Thread #5 - 14.03.11-12, Day 7-8

[Madeleine74]

IF Oscar knew that was Reeva behind that loo door and he decided to shoot her anyway (or regardless), that meets a premeditated murder charge. Thus, I do not think he was overcharged. It remains to be seen if the state can prove premeditated murder.

I believe OP *did* know it was Reeva there. I believe Reeva did scream, based on witness testimony in which women's screams were heard. We know there was no "intruder." We also know OP's story doesn't exactly match the scene and there is some "creative interpretation" by the defense.

 

[soozieqtips]

But the way things are going right now, I doubt that Roux would put OP on the stand.
Why take the hot seat when you are winning the case?

BBM - because we need to see him sobbing and bent over double in pain with a bit of puking thrown in so that the judge feels sorry for him and realises how much he truly 'loved' Reeva.

 

[minor4th]

But the way things are going right now, I doubt that Roux would put OP on the stand. Why take the hot seat when you are winning the case?

Well that's a point - I always assumed Oscar would take the stand, but perhaps not.

 

[Carol70]

Wow. That is hard to grasp - especially killing a police officer!

Well, in all fairness, it was speculated that the policeman was robbing him( soliciting a bribe from him), he thought his life was in danger (haha..have you seen the size of this man) but anyhow...that was the ruling.

 

[minor4th]

I have no idea what to say about today's events..going to catch up quick.

 

[james83]

I was actually quite shocked at how low they were, for some odd reason I was expecting them to be higher. It's actually so hard to tell...but yep, you are probably right. Considering her shorts were up at that point. I imagine she was finished on the loo, or stood up when she heard OP shouting but I can't imagine where she could have been standing at this point.

Agree i thought they would have been higher.
I suppose it depends on your opinion of Oscar's guilt, personally i don't believe a word of Oscar's story so would suspect she was in a panic and therefore not stationary from the beginning.
Either way i find it difficult to look at the bullet hole's and come to a conclusion.

 

[AlwaysShocked]

I think it's a bit premature to say that Roux is "winning the case". The State has 107 witnesses listed.

Looking at the overall, what was established today? That OP did NOT have his prostheses on when he beat the door. Which is in direct contradiction to his statement(s).

 

[minor4th]

Very quiet here this afternoon

 

[FrancesB]

Given Ms Steenkamp was fairly low as per bullet holes in door, and that she was shot around her right ear with exit wound at back leftish of head (to give pool of blood at side of toilet), maybe she was holding the door shut in a crouching position?

 

[minor4th]

I think it's a bit premature to say that Roux is "winning the case". The State has 107 witnesses listed.

Looking at the overall, what was established today? That OP did NOT have his prostheses on when he beat the door. Which is in direct contradiction to his statement(s).

I don't believe that was established. Did you hear Roux say they had forensics with the prosthetic material enmeshed in the door at the marks that the Col did not test? He also demonstrated that the bat could hit the door from a standing position as well.

And if it is the case that Oscar was on his stumps while breaking the door, other that to be a variance with Oscar's statement? What does it suggest about premeditation or other issues?

 

[turaj]

just been popping in and out but is anyone else finding the testimony as boring as I do. I sure hope OP takes the stand. Also I can't find a March 12 session three. I watched what they have for today and it is not even 3 hours. What kind of trial day is that? Is there more from today?

 

[james83]

I'm still intrigued by something Gerrie Nel said back on day 4(thursday 7th)

"It is the State’s case that the deceased screamed. Our case will become clear later".

“I say the shots fired at 3.17 caused her death. She was screaming before the shots fired at 3.17. We will (later) come to the total of shots fired, but our case is that the shots fired at 3.17 killed her.

“We are not saying there were more than four shots, but for now we say it was these shots which killed her. Nothing else,” Nel said.

Not sure what he's getting at?.

 

[shane13]

just been popping in and out but is anyone else finding the testimony as boring as I do. I sure hope OP takes the stand. Also I can't find a March 12 session three. I watched what they have for today and it is not even 3 hours. What kind of trial day is that? Is there more from today?

here you go

[video=youtube;tXoq6o_tH_8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXoq6o_tH_8[/video]

 

[Carol70]

Agree i thought they would have been higher.
I suppose it depends on your opinion of Oscar's guilt, personally i don't believe a word of Oscar's story so would suspect she was in a panic and therefore not stationary from the beginning.
Either way i find it difficult to look at the bullet hole's and come to a conclusion.

I don't really have an opinion on OP guilt, I'm interested in the evidence and what it tells us. I'm of the opinion that his story is a possibility but am open minded enough to know it can swing either way.

Truth be told,I've been surprised that everyone has been so adament of his guilt without giving him the benefit of the doubt, we have had similar shootings in SA (have posted the links) when the gunmen were treated with caution, sympathy and cases dismissed as tragic. I can't fathom what's so different in this case. Yes, he is an idiot, egomanic, reckless and thinks he is a cowboy but doesn't make him a cold blooded killer. In fact, most who have met him have said he is a "all round nice guy". And if there was indeed an intruder in his bathroom, he would have been hailed a hero.

I guess I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt until the evidence proves otherwise. Ps: nice to "meet" you James

 

[loohoo]

Very quiet here this afternoon

Not sure about anyone else, but I'm finding the slow pace of the trial and questionable witness testimony to be exhausting, and thus haven't been checking the forum as much today. I just hope that Nel is indeed building up to revealing a solid case for the State as others have suggested rather than just lazily sending one unprepared/unsure witness after another up to the stand to be destroyed by Roux and leave everyone to figure out what he's trying to get at. :banghead:

 

[east2west]

just been popping in and out but is anyone else finding the testimony as boring as I do. I sure hope OP takes the stand. Also I can't find a March 12 session three. I watched what they have for today and it is not even 3 hours. What kind of trial day is that? Is there more from today?

It's the duration of a trial day in Arizona as well. Mind boggling. :sly:

 

[Niner]

This is not correct. Only TWO phones were found in the bathroom.

http://gragrah.blogspot.com.au/2013/02/four-phones-found-in-house-of-pistorius.html

Quote:
On the shower mat in the en-suite bathroom lay a firearm and an iPhone 4 and iPhone - there were blood spatters on one of the phones.

Quote:
Mr Botha said four phones in total were found in the athlete's home and none of them had been used to call emergency services.

Question - do we know "whose" phone had the blood spatter on it?? I would think it would be Reeva's, since I've read that she had it with her in the toilet room, but "how" did it end up in the bath room?

And... why would Oscar's phone be in the bath room?

And... Why so many phones? Three for Oscar? Correct?

TIA!

now back to reading... :seeya:

 

[Carol70]

I'm still intrigued by something Gerrie Nel said back on day 4(thursday 7th)

"It is the State’s case that the deceased screamed. Our case will become clear later".

“I say the shots fired at 3.17 caused her death. She was screaming before the shots fired at 3.17. We will (later) come to the total of shots fired, but our case is that the shots fired at 3.17 killed her.

“We are not saying there were more than four shots, but for now we say it was these shots which killed her. Nothing else,” Nel said.

Not sure what he's getting at?.

I think this is still under debate since the doctor heard gun shots BEFORE 3.15?? We know there were only 4 shots fired!

 

[TorisMom003]

Let's see, OP claims that he has trouble getting around without his "legs" yet he had no problem moving one/two fans from outside on the patio to in the house without his "legs" on. OP claims that he thought Reeva was in the bed but wasn't sure because of how dark it was, yet he had no trouble getting his gun from under the bed in the dark and didn't "disturb" Reeva while doing so. OP was concerned for his safety and thought that an intruder was in his bathroom/toilet area, yet he didn't check on Reeva to make sure that she was safe as well. OP has a history of using guns in situations when they (guns) are not called for. OP has lied during his tellings of what happened that night, the story is not the same each time.

Is it any wonder why some people really think that he is in fact guilty?!?

MOO

 

[MURDERER_SERVANT]

Perhaps when he bashed the door it only broke that small piece that is missing, and he had to pull at the panel with his hands to remove it? Just because the bat broke the panel, doesn't mean the panel fell out from the bat hits. If it's the case that the panel was only partially damaged and did not fall out, it may have given Pistorius a chance to see where Ms Steenkamp was, fire through the door at her, and once she was mortally wounded/unable to defend herself, then pull the broken panel off.

Well said and highly realistic imo but nothing as realistic as a woman's terrific screams that night , being OP's screams LOL.. inocchio: