Trial - Ross Harris #3

[arkansasmimi]

This couple is weird. jmo Ross stumbled when attempting to explain to Stoddard how he knew so early in the morning that he was going to be late for work that day.

Re Leeanna, it was always my impression that she was the type who would pledge to remain a virgin until marriage.

After watching, several times, as she visited with her husband, without one tear, she assures Ross that she knows it was an accident and that he did not do it on purpose. There is only one reason I can think of as for why she behaved as she did during that meeting. She had already detached herself from Cooper.

"Did you say too much?"

RH explains why he thought he would be late. If he didn't have xx done by xx time he would be late getting Cooper to Daycare by 8:30 breakfast cut off. Ross Told Stoddard that he had no clock in by time /clock out leave by time. He was salary, as was LH, she had a schedule that depending on what time client appointments. So the only "late" was actually going to be if past the 8:30 -8:45 a.m. breakfast cut off. (I include 8:45 because there were some testimony from LAA teachers that stated that time too) IF RH was going to be few min within that cut off time and wanted to see if they would hold Cooper something back, he would call and say going to be late and make that request. Per testimony.

"did you say too much" Means totally different thing if you take it only as those words and not in the context of the conversation at the time that was made.
JMHO from listening to the video more than once.

 

[GA_Peach]

Why would he check the carseat if he thought Cooper was already at daycare?

I promise that I am not trying to be snarky. The whole point of the Look Again campaign is to check the backseat just to be sure that your child is not back there. Taking a second look only applies when the parent believes a child is not the in car; otherwise; the baby would be removed from the car on the first look. If Ross double checked on June 18, Cooper would still be here... assuming that it was not premeditated.

I am interested in tomorrow's testimony. This should be an interesting week!

RH explains why he thought he would be late. If he didn't have xx done by xx time he would be late getting Cooper to Daycare by 8:30 breakfast cut off. Ross Told Stoddard that he had no clock in by time /clock out leave by time. He was salary, as was LH, she had a schedule that depending on what time client appointments. So the only "late" was actually going to be if past the 8:30 -8:45 a.m. breakfast cut off. (I include 8:45 because there were some testimony from LAA teachers that stated that time too) IF RH was going to be few min within that cut off time and wanted to see if they would hold Cooper something back, he would call and say going to be late and make that request. Per testimony.

"did you say too much" Means totally different thing if you take it only as those words and not in the context of the conversation at the time that was made.
JMHO from listening to the video more than once.

The "did you say too much?" didn't sound malicious in context IMO. I have so many thoughts on LH and RH's interaction, but sleep is calling my name.

 

[arkansasmimi]

I used to own that vehicle and the radio does not play once the car is turned off. My current vehicle the radio continues to play until you either turn it off or you open the door. OT but I find that annoying to have it stay on after I turn the car off.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks for the info on if stayed on or off. We will never know for sure exactly when he turned off car prior to exiting using the parking lot video but that does answer a question of that.

 

[Hope4More]

At the scene Ross did say to Piper "I swore I took him to day care. I thought I did."

Which is why later on with Stoddard he says, as if he still can't believe he made that mistake, (paraphrasing) "... and then I went straight, just drove to work. (...), and why later on with Leanna he is still trying to figure out how it was possible to think that he had.

IMO, it's another indication he's telling the truth that he can't seem to understand how he could have thought he'd dropped Cooper off.

 

[Hope4More]

I promise that I am not trying to be snarky. The whole point of the Look Again campaign is to check the backseat just to be sure that your child is not back there. Taking a second look only applies when the parent believes a child is not the in car; otherwise; the baby would be removed from the car on the first look. If Ross double checked on June 18, Cooper would still be here... assuming that it was not premeditated.

I am interested in tomorrow's testimony. This should be an interesting week!



The "did you say too much?" didn't sound malicious in context IMO. I have so many thoughts on LH and RH's interaction, but sleep is calling my name.

Thanks for that info. Not being snarky either, but I had no idea that the problem of forgetting children is seemingly so common there is a campaign to have parents check carseats when they think their kids are NOT in the car. Actually, I can't even wrap my brain around that. If one is forgetful enough to not remember whether or not their child is in the car, how the heck are they supposed to remember to look to be sure?

(DH just told me I'm missing the point. Sorry if I'm being obtuse..I really do find that campaign counter intuitive).

 

[arkansasmimi]

I believe a detective (Stoddard?) testified that she asked to see Ross instead of Cooper. Twice while Ross was talking with Leanna he described how Cooper looked ("peaceful"), once at about 8:30 in the video and again at about 21:25. The second time he starts by saying he just wants Leanna to know that Cooper looked so peaceful. His mouth was closed, his eyes were closed, he did not look bad, I was dreading he was going to look terrible...

Based on those comments I'd say that Leanna went straight to Ross. Around 29:00 Leanna talks about going to the Treehouse looking for Ross - no mention of Cooper.

Interestingly, in his discussion with Leanna about what happened Ross never says anything about thinking he had dropped Cooper off at daycare. What he said was that he left CFA and headed to work and that Cooper never made a sound. To me anyway, it's more like he forgot Cooper was in the car rather than thinking he had dropped him off to daycare. The distinction is that Ross doesn't have a memory, albeit a false one, of taking Cooper to daycare. That's very different than what Dr. Diamond claims happens when a parent forgets their child. The crux of his argument is that the parent absolutely believes the child is somewhere else and continues to believe that until something causes the brain to reset - such as hearing the child's name.

Ross talks and talks about how he didn't do it on purpose but not once does he say he thought Cooper was at daycare. I find that concerning.

[video=youtube;lwbQuyHUx-A]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwbQuyHUx-A[/video]

JMHO, after thinking about the comment RH made about how was afraid how Cooper would look, JMHO I think it was because of seeing or a mental vison of what it would look like (graphic stuff vs how he looked) He said he looked like Cooper and was thankful for that. JMHO I think his thoughts of what Cooper was going to look like are no different than most who have read prior, watch videos or own thoughts hearing about this first and some of the snippets. IF you looked while some photos were shown you could get some pictures where actually saw the child. One was posted here, there is another point where could see more of his whole body. It wasn't what I thought would be either. Does not mean it was not gut wrenching knowing it was a deceased little boy. He told LH his eyes were closed and his mouth was closed. ME said were partially open, NOT wide open or NOT completely closed. Mouth was closed. Multiple people testified to that. It is not like in the movies where people die and their eyes immediately close.

I saw through the projection screen one autopsy photo of Beverly Carter. I will never forget that. Her eyes were wide open. **Side note, CSI Grimstead voice, when he was testifying I kept thinking "that voice, he sounds so familiar" When looking for those ss few ago it hit me. His voice sound like Arron Lewis. One of the 2 convicted in Murder of Beverly Carter**

 

[arkansasmimi]

Quote Originally Posted by RANCH View Post
I always thought that a jury is to only use the evidence given to them in court. Sure they can use their life experiences to decide if the evidence shows guilt or not.

I do believe that sometimes jurors do things that their not supposed to in deciding a defendants guilt. I'm not sure what your husbands profession has to do with this. He's not the one posting. LOL. JMO.

I think her husbands job has to do with her experience with juries. My father was a trial attorney and so is my brother. I worked in their firm and saw very closely what happens with juries and their decision making processes.

Being married to a trial lawyer brings one up close and personal to the way juries think and respond. I am sure she has heard her husband discuss what he did or didn't do and how it turned it because of that.

My Dad always spoke to as many of the jurors as he could after a big trial. He always wanted to know what went wrong or right with his decisions in the case. He and my brother both tried out some of their opening/closing statements on their wives and family. Like a captive audience. lol

Great Post Katydid! I have been wondering which of the individuals behind the State are Jury Consultants? Either from the State or the Defense. I know when I went to the Arron Lewis trial, the State placed theirs over near the jury. Since Kilgore was a DA prior to being a Def attorney, I feel pretty much he has one there too. JMHO and the other Def lawyers are taking notes of things too (some are of witness testimony too and possible how the jury reacted at certain points of questioning * you can notice this during Cross when Def goes over to the Def table and speaks and/or gets a sticky note)

 

[PaperDoll]

Okay. It is my BIRTHDAY---and I will take this moment to be grateful that both my kids are alive and well, and I have a beautiful baby grand daughter, and they are all meeting hubby and I at a sports bar to watch the SeaHawks game. I will be drinking margaritas very soon. :toast:

OT: What a GREAT game that was uh? Ended in a overtime tie..

 

[JudyBolton]

I understand that posters relatives who are lawyers can help them in understanding how the judicial system works.

I don't think that it gives them any superiority in their posts vs other members of Websleuths.

WHOA!! When did I ever claim any superiority over any other members here??? That is certainly not true. I said " jurors bring their own personal life experiences into the jury room, whether we like it or not. (I was specifically thinking of parents thinking back to when their own children were 2 and whether they would have fallen asleep in those couple of minutes.) You said "I do believe that sometimes jurors do things that their not supposed to in deciding a defendants guilt." Then you said (I thought in jest because you used LOL) "I'm not sure what your husbands profession has to do with this. He's not the one posting. LOL.
I answered back with a funny comment and emoticons!

I have NO IDEA where your comment came from and I think you need to scroll back and re-read our posts to one another. :gaah:

 

[justkk]

JMHO from reading posts/comments as the trial started until now. We are starting the LAST week of the State's case in chief. Tons of evidence photos admitted into the record/authenticated. Almost 50 witnesses testimony (if not to 50 near haven't looked at my notes on number since Friday) ..

Yet there are so many comments, and opinions that are the very same as prior to beginning of trial. Some still using that PreTrial incorrect info as their belief facts to form their opinions, and post their comments towards comments about trial testimony. Sometimes I get the feeling some are not watching any of the trial testimony. I get that, very time consuming. But when links are given to where said, still same unfactual comments vs what proven not so in witness testimony. JMHO some have guilty prior to trial and bedamned nothing is going to change their minds. Their choice and right. I agree and respect that. Just don't understand following trial if don't want to look at all the testimony on Direct and on Cross. :thinking: Isn't that the point of a trial? As a U.S. Citizen we all have the Constitutional Right as each other. Innocent until PROVEN Guilty. Hope none of us ever have to be in that position, need a Defense attorney to fight for us. LEO to get SW that are sworn to be the facts as they know them at the time of their Probable Cause Affidavit, State to present info that may or may not be factual. JMHO

Also, if going strictly by MSM reporting or some tweets (I know it very different when only have tweets, have to go with what you have) But when a trial is live streamed and the video is archived, you can go to that portion and listen for yourself. Just as an article misstated, that RH said he looked in his rear view mirror and that when he saw Cooper That is FALSE! Twice RH made comment, 1 to Det Stoddard & other Det, and 2. When he was speaking with LH in the 2nd video. BOTH times he said he turned his head to change lanes and when he did he caught a glimps from corner of his eye and thought he saw Cooper, then pulled over little bit later. NEVER did RH say rear view mirror.

Personally, I have no issues with RH being found guilty or not guilty as charged. All depends on what the State proves to the Jury, beyond a reasonable doubt. Trial still going, again this starts what the State indicated to Judge as probably their last week of calling Jurors. **and the State can and will bring back Rebuttal witnesses after the Defense presents their case. JMHO

I disagree. I think that the last 2 threads here, most people are discussing what has been introduced to evidence and the testimony. I haven't seen much reference to the MSM stuff from when this first happened (I wasn't exposed to much of that on the west coast - but I have read what many have written about it).

It seems like most of the discussion here recently has been around the short drive from CFA, the close proximity to Cooper in the vehicle, the sexting with many different women leading up to the death of Cooper and now the videos of his questioning and time in PD with LH. The internet searches were discussed early on but it doesn't seem like that is what most people who see RH as negligent or even having planned it are focused on.

It will be interesting to see how the defense portion goes.

But I think it is insulting to insinuate that those who believe RH should be held accountable are basing that on incorrect info or are not watching trial testimony. Why would you assume that if their opinions differ from yours that they must not be paying close enough attention or watching the testimony?

JMO

ETA - I have seen some incorrect comments here and there (ex - the rear view mirror vs. looking to the side, or the talking on Bluetooth stuff) but that is just a few comments here and there. The vast majority seem crystal clear with what has been presented and have their own opinions on it - and that's ok.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[PaperDoll]

But he also claims that his GREATEST FEAR in life is leaving his son in a hot car. If it really was his greatest fear, wouldn't he look 2 inches to the right and check the car seat?

Correct, and since his greatest fear was leaving Cooper in a hot car one would think they would ALWAYS take extra steps to make sure that didn't happen. NOT ROSS!!! People say Ross was a great dad, even Ross mentioned that to LE, but was he a great dad when no one was around?

 

[RANCH]

WHOA!! When did I ever claim any superiority over any other members here??? That is certainly not true. I said " jurors bring their own personal life experiences into the jury room, whether we like it or not. (I was specifically thinking of parents thinking back to when their own children were 2 and whether they would have fallen asleep in those couple of minutes.) You said "I do believe that sometimes jurors do things that their not supposed to in deciding a defendants guilt." Then you said (I thought in jest because you used LOL) "I'm not sure what your husbands profession has to do with this. He's not the one posting. LOL.
I answered back with a funny comment and emoticons!

I have NO IDEA where your comment came from and I think you need to scroll back and re-read our posts to one another. :gaah:

Looks like we are in agreement.

 

[Jinkasaurus]

Its sometimes confusing to figure out what folks are actually disagreeing about here, or if they are.

There are so many aspects to this case-

1. did RH forget CH was in the car, or did he think he took him to daycare;

2. did he leave him in the car on purpose or not;

3. does it matter what caused him to be distracted - ie, because he was sexting (what if he had been obsessed with fly fishing, instead)

4. did the sexting, etc even cause him to be distracted at the moment he left CH in the car (or was his mind on something else)

5. could he possibly love CH when he was sexting all these women, hooking up etc.

There are probably more. I think many people who disagree on some of these points actually agree with each other on the other ones.

I wonder how the jury will keep it all straight

 

[PaperDoll]

Which is why later on with Stoddard he says, as if he still can't believe he made that mistake, (paraphrasing) "... and then I went straight, just drove to work. (...), and why later on with Leanna he is still trying to figure out how it was possible to think that he had.

IMO, it's another indication he's telling the truth that he can't seem to understand how he could have thought he'd dropped Cooper off.

MOO but I don't think Ross is going to tell anyone he "planned" this. He told the truth, yes, but I don't believe he's telling all like his intent. I think once Leanna entered the room Ross broke down because he is now being charged and was in shock, reality is setting in. He really tried to convince Stoddard, IMO, that he was wrong in charging him. I believe Ross thought he would get away with it and claim "accident" and get a slap on the wrist. JMO!

 

[minor4th]

But he also claims that his GREATEST FEAR in life is leaving his son in a hot car. If it really was his greatest fear, wouldn't he look 2 inches to the right and check the car seat?

Right and as he was driving to work he obviously didn't think he had forgotten his son

 

[RANCH]

Thanks for that info. Not being snarky either, but I had no idea that the problem of forgetting children is seemingly so common there is a campaign to have parents check carseats when they think their kids are NOT in the car. Actually, I can't even wrap my brain around that. If one is forgetful enough to not remember whether or not their child is in the car, how the heck are they supposed to remember to look to be sure?

(DH just told me I'm missing the point. Sorry if I'm being obtuse..I really do find that campaign counter intuitive).

I find it interesting that there's all sorts of tips for parents to not leave their children in cars and at the same time I see people saying that it's impossible for a caring parent to make that kind of mistake.

JMO

 

[arkansasmimi]

Quote Originally Posted by Hope4More View Post
RH doesn't say explicitly he thought he dropped Cooper off, but he definitely alludes to that, it's just very difficult to hear. Start listening around 12:00.

No - he does not "allude" to it, not starting at 12:00 or any other time during that video. Go ahead and transcribe what Ross said - please! - there was no - zero - mention of him saying he believed he had dropped Cooper off at daycare.

I stand by my original statement that Ross did not say during his discussion with Leanna that he believed he had already dropped Cooper off at daycare, You are incorrect.

Respectfully not trying to snippy or sarcastic but what do you think RH was telling LH? RH tells her in so many different times and ways, how sorry and how it was an accident, how its not like he left him in the car to go in and get groceries and thought he would be ok. How he has NEVER left him in the car, or even close to it.. LH tells him they asked her the same thing. How are the whole video which ever portion you choose, RH while you may be right about not alluding to dropping him, off he clearly alludes multiple of times of forgetting Cooper in the car. He never took him to daycare so that is a fact LH knows after going there at 5:41. This video was at about 8:15pm approx 2 1/2 hrs later for LH finding out. We have not seen any video of her at the Treehouse yet (there is because when State showed a portion to the Treehouse Security Guard, the Def didn't object to part actually shown, but Kilgore made sure that part was not shown yet of LH being there) Nor have we seen any video of LH with LEO. We do not know what she was told about what happen by LEO

 

[justkk]

I find it interesting that there's all sorts of tips for parents to not leave their children in cars and at the same time I see people saying that it's impossible for a caring parent to make that kind of mistake.

JMO

I personally don't think it is impossible
for a caring parent - or an uncaring parent to make that kind of mistake.

I just feel that in THIS case based on everything that has been presented thus far - it was not a mistake. Won't go into all the reasons I feel that way, but it has been based upon what has been presented so far. I am a big proponent of what is "logical" in a given situation.

I am still waiting to see what is to come.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[RANCH]

Its sometimes confusing to figure out what folks are actually disagreeing about here, or if they are.

There are so many aspects to this case-

1. did RH forget CH was in the car, or did he think he took him to daycare;

2. did he leave him in the car on purpose or not;

3. does it matter what caused him to be distracted - ie, because he was sexting (what if he had been obsessed with fly fishing, instead)

4. did the sexting, etc even cause him to be distracted at the moment he left CH in the car (or was his mind on something else)

5. could he possibly love CH when he was sexting all these women, hooking up etc.

There are probably more. I think many people who disagree on some of these points actually agree with each other on the other ones.

I wonder how the jury will keep it all straight

BBM

The jury will have to decide on the charges and not whether RH could possibly love Cooper when he was doing all sorts of bad things. JMO

 

[RANCH]

I personally don't think it is impossible
for a caring parent - or an uncaring parent to make that kind of mistake.

I just feel that in THIS case based on everything that has been presented thus far - it was not a mistake. Won't go into all the reasons I feel that way, but it has been based upon what has been presented so far. I am a big proponent of what is "logical" in a given situation.

I am still waiting to see what is to come.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If you feel that RH premeditated the murder of Cooper then any kind of tips to prevent the accidental leaving of kids in a car don't apply to this case at all. JMO