GUILTY Turkey - Sarai Sierra, 33, NY woman murdered, Istanbul, 21 Jan 2013 - #2

[CMac2]

Here's my best guess. I don't think he s involved but I think his family is wealthy, and I'm pretty sure when they say good family in turkey, that means pretty wealthy, old wealthy, and some ties to a business, good private schooling etc. and I do think these things are protecting him from being exposed in the media, and having the cops treat him from kid gloves. However I don't think if something damning like DNA tied him to this crime, his money would matter.

Cops can be bribed in Istanbul (of course half of them are like 18 and baby faced) but I don't think it would get Taylan out of a murder if they had the evidence to prove it was him.

Unfortunately, these very same facts could be what are covering his guilt too. If he is, in fact guilty, that is.

 

[Yashim]

I think your input has been invaluable (and I know I'm not alone in feeling that way). I love how we have so many people on this thread who are native to Turkey, but are able to look at the facts and analyze the case with honesty while helping us understand the overall culture, what tends fall more on the side of the "norm" in Turkey vs. US. Not just on the translations of the articles either- though that's been awesome too. Just in general, because most of us over here in the states have no idea. Even some of us who have traveled to the area have only experienced the country as tourists- clearly not the same thing as being native to the area.

How often do you estimate a random crime like this one occurs, when it is a druggie (your definition of druggie- teen glue-sniffer) that is the perpetrator? Is this the method (blunt object repeatedly to the back of the head) these druggies prefer?

Random attacks obviously happen in the US all the time, but generally, while violent in their own way, we wouldn't necessarily see the victim's face bashed in to the point of being almost unrecognizable. That, to many of us, is a clear indicator that this is personal. In a random attack in an urban area here in the US we're most likely to see cause of death being a gunshot wound, given the availability of illegal guns on the black market. Apparently in some areas of our nation it's easier to get a handgun with the serial number sawed off than it is to find some asprin to cure a headache.

All that said, however, it doesn't really matter what the typical M.O. would be here in the states. If the typical random crime in Turkey looks a lot like what we're seeing here with SS, that's much more important, since Turkey is clearly where the crime was committed.

At the expense of sounding ridiculous by implying "I know my criminals", repeated strikes could well indicate an overkill due to misinterpretation of post-mortem spams.

Sorry, for being so graphic. I sometimes will awful writing on these. Sarai's dead. And her two small kids lost their mother. This is the only truth we've got.

"Offff", I need to get some fresh air.

 

[ToutCa]

Definitely not saying I'm right here- or even that I'm making any sense to anyone other than myself- but to me, it's possible.

Makes sense to me!

Basically, since the first 22 suspects have supposedly been cleared by DNA (although wouldn't be shocked to find that turn out to be false too!), journalists and sleuthers have got to reconsider all possible scenarios.

It's a frustrating mystery at this point, for sure.

 

[lavy]

I don't see a druggie interested in electronics leaving her jewelry, but taking her coat.

I am too overwhelmed with theories that I have no idea what to say.

So I'll start small.

Why her coat is taken? Possibilities:

1-Peep hurt himself while killing her, his hand started bleeding so he hold it to stop bleeding. Or took it to not to leave his blood in the crime scene.

2-Her wallet and phone was in her pockets he used it to carry them.

3-It wasn't on her for some reason and he throw it somewhere else?

4-Did it to fry our (and LE's) brain cells?

5-It was on the ground and a homeless person picked it up.

6-In the case that they went to the peeps house or a bar it was left there?

 

[bourne]

http://haber.gazetevatan.com/iste-adim-adim-olume-yolculuk/512700/1/Manset

Dealing with google translate on this one. The last paragraph.
"Sierra disappeared from the date of the last person interviewed Taylan K. known as. However, by then Tarkan K. turned out to be. But in a statement yesterday that the lawyer told his client Taylan. Ozkan Attorney Parker, the need to make a statement in accordance with the news about his client that he said: "My client has a friendship with Sierra. Together on the bar is true, but as mentioned there is no emotional convergences. I just drank coffee. Taylan received a good education from a good family, had master's degree abroad, and a citizen who lived abroad for a while. Press was a thinner addicts. 3-4 months before the review is based on a web site made photographs of each other's acquaintance begins. Avoid the killer or killers to the press as soon as possible to know for sure that ispatlanacağından yakalanacağından and he is not guilty. "

I'm not sure how things work in Turkey, but it keeps being mentioned that Tarkan is from a "good family", a "good background". Here (in the US), when it comes to committing crimes, that means little. Lots of people from good families, good back grounds do bad things. What I'm asking is .... could Tarkan be getting a "pass" or even do other things to influence the Turkish LE away from him being a suspect? Influence? Money?

Ironically, I don't feel like he is a suspect, but it keeps coming up. Is his family prominent in Istanbul ?

I guess I'm also asking about the Turkish LE reputation ? Are they on the up and up ? Or are they easily bribed like some foreign LE's (ie; Mexico).

Agree, socioeconomic status is irrelevant when it comes to murder.

I'm still inclined to believe it's Taylan, and he's being in MIT makes it more likely he knows how to manipulate and plant false evidence (e.g., DNA under Sarai's fingernails) to incriminate someone else. He also would possess much more local knowledge about how LE operates and thinks in Turkey, and where the surveillance cameras are located.

 

[ThinkHard]

Google is not great with Turkish suffixes.

Anyway, it says

"Pasaportunu neden odasında bıraktı?"

Meaning "Why did she leave her passport in her room?"

Sorry to bring this up again, but I thought this was weird too, considering Tarlabasi is such a "security-challenged" place. I studied in the US and in the UK for several years, never once carried my passport with me. But when I was a Tourist, my Turkish common sense required me to have it on me. I guess when don't have our department of state to bail us out. .)

But she wasn't an experienced tourist. Not everything she did has to make sense.

To the suffix point and just to add on so English speakers without any knowledge can understand ill use an easy word as an example

Istiyorum means I want

istemiyorum means I don't want

The negative suffix is in the middle of the word.

Translation for google is tough because they can't always pick up these suffixes and it completely changes the meaning of the base verb

That's a simple example...but many Turkish words have a ton of Turkish suffixes and saying something that would take several English words is one word all smooshed together in Turkish, each suffix adding on to the end changing the meaning. So translators like google sometimes can only identify the root word, and can't make sense of the suffixes.

So when you read something translated the meaning could be the polar opposite of what is written. So it's good to keep that in mind.

As for the passport. The US state department encourages tourists to keep a copy only of there passport on them, and leave the original in your room for safety.

However I have found in turkey it is a much better idea to always carry your original.

 

[ThinkHard]

I seriously hope we don't lose power! Ill be totally bummed if I can't keep up with this case!

 

[lavy]

Cops can be bribed in Istanbul (of course half of them are like 18 and baby faced) but I don't think it would get Taylan out of a murder if they had the evidence to prove it was him.

Also to back this up; this is not a case 2 young cops are working on. More than 200 people is involved. Head of the police department is following the case etc.

 

[ToutCa]

I am too overwhelmed with theories that I have no idea what to say.

So I'll start small.

Why her coat is taken? Possibilities:

1-Peep hurt himself while killing her, his hand started bleeding so he hold it to stop bleeding. Or took it to not to leave his blood in the crime scene.

2-Her wallet and phone was in her pockets he used it to carry them.

3-It wasn't on her for some reason and he throw it somewhere else?

4-Did it to fry our (and LE's) brain cells?

5-It was on the ground and a homeless person picked it up.

6-In the case that they went to the peeps house or a bar it was left there?

Some reports, even recent ones, said the coat was found on scene.

Your theories are great though. It could have been to cover injuries inflicted by SS to his hands from prying eyes by a coat casually draped over them...or to wipe blood off himself...or to hold the iPad/phone inside if he had no bag...or some combo of these?

 

[ToutCa]

I seriously hope we don't lose power! Ill be totally bummed if I can't keep up with this case!

ThinkHard you do realize you're mostly just keeping up with our wild theorizing???!!!!

 

[Janeumayer]

"She is then said to have emailed him to say she was coming to Turkey and wanted to meet him. Her body was found beaten to death last Saturday when she failed to make the return flight home.

Tarkan K's lawyer said his client has absolutely nothing to do with the murder and revealed he comes from a 'good family and completed a master's program abroad...He's very demoralized'.

Tarkan told Istanbul police that they had sex in a bar bathroom in Beyoglu on January 20, Hürriyet newspaper reported. Tarkan has denied wrongdoing and had previously denied the two had a relationship."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2275605/Sarai-Sierra-New-York-mother-murdered-Turkey-sex-secret-lover-bar-restroom-day-bludgeoned-death.html#axzz2JfuRYaMM


Attached is pic of Taylan K. supplied by article.

ETA article posted wrong picture. Now has the right one below.

 

[ThinkHard]

Makes sense to me!

Basically, since the first 22 suspects have supposedly been cleared by DNA (although wouldn't be shocked to find that turn out to be false too!), journalists and sleuthers have got to reconsider all possible scenarios.

It's a frustrating mystery at this point, for sure.

Perhaps initial DNA tests proved this, but maybe further testing will prove otherwise

 

[tresptip]

Less violent and quicker way. The longer it takes, the messier it gets, higher will be his chance of getting caught.

If she was killed on site though, there would be only 2 ways that I can think of to kill her and that is by a big rock over the head and strangulation.I would much rather be knocked out by a rock then to be choked to death.Maybe he thought knocking her out with the rock would be easier.There is more risk in my opinion with strangulation as she could scratch him while she is being choked and get his dna under her nails,plus he would have scratches.He can always wipe off blood that splattered on him if he rocked her.

 

[ThinkHard]

Agree, socioeconomic status is irrelevant when it comes to murder.

I'm still inclined to believe it's Taylan, and he's being in MIT makes it more likely he knows how to manipulate and plant false evidence (e.g., DNA under Sarai's fingernails) to incriminate someone else. He also would possess much more local knowledge about how LE operates and thinks in Turkey, and where the surveillance cameras are located.

Apparently his lawyer submitted documentation claiming he has no connection to LE of any kind.

 

[bellyup]

"She is then said to have emailed him to say she was coming to Turkey and wanted to meet him. Her body was found beaten to death last Saturday when she failed to make the return flight home.

Tarkan K's lawyer said his client has absolutely nothing to do with the murder and revealed he comes from a 'good family and completed a master's program abroad...He's very demoralized'.

Tarkan told Istanbul police that they had sex in a bar bathroom in Beyoglu on January 20, Hürriyet newspaper reported. Tarkan has denied wrongdoing and had previously denied the two had a relationship."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2275605/Sarai-Sierra-New-York-mother-murdered-Turkey-sex-secret-lover-bar-restroom-day-bludgeoned-death.html#axzz2JfuRYaMM


Attached is pic of Taylan K. supplied by article.

That photo is NOT of Taylan / Tarkan from what we know / have seen.
That news source seems to be the US equivalent of a rag mag. They don't seem to have any idea what they are talking about.

 

[lavy]

Attached is pic of Taylan K. supplied by article.

Thanks.

Though the photo is her husband's

 

[ToutCa]

That photo is NOT of Taylan / Tarkan from what we know / have seen.

It looks more like Steven Sierra, her husband.

 

[lavy]

Apparently his lower submitted documentation claiming he has no connection to LE of any kind.

Wouldn't LE knew it if he had a connection anyway :waitasec:

 

[ThinkHard]

ThinkHard you do realize you're mostly just keeping up with our wild theorizing???!!!!

Haha yes! But what fun...with no power what would I do with myself?

And apparently our theories are good enough to catch media attention!

 

[Kluver13]

To the suffix point and just to add on so English speakers without any knowledge can understand ill use an easy word as an example

Istiyorum means I want

istemiyorum means I don't want

The negative suffix is in the middle of the word.

Translation for google is tough because they can't always pick up these suffixes and it completely changes the meaning of the base verb

That's a simple example...but many Turkish words have a ton of Turkish suffixes and saying something that would take several English words is one word all smooshed together in Turkish, each suffix adding on to the end changing the meaning. So translators like google sometimes can only identify the root word, and can't make sense of the suffixes.

So when you read something translated the meaning could be the polar opposite of what is written. So it's good to keep that in mind.

As for the passport. The US state department encourages tourists to keep a copy only of there passport on them, and leave the original in your room for safety.

However I have found in turkey it is a much better idea to always carry your original.

As an aside to all of the Turkish speakers translators in this thread, thank you. I am getting a tremendous sense of the nuances and complexity of the language that I find interesting. I'm wondering if you can recommend good english translations of some Turkish poetry?