TX - Five Yates children drowned, Houston, 20 June 2001 *Insanity*

[cinsbythesea]

Absoultely, I think we need to give her the exact medications she needs......
Sodium Pentothal, Pavulon, and lastly Potassium chloride. Except I say we reverse them and shout her kid's names over and over while she dies!

I don't care what the pschobabble doctors say about this woman. Regardless of whether she is evil or mentally insane, it doesn't release her from the responsibility of what she did. Assuming she was hearing voices, etc. she should have gotten help and if she felt like harming the kids, she should have checked into a hospital. People don't go from playing Gin with the gals to drowning their kids one by one overnight.

Oh and the husband needs a good swift kick in the a$$ too!

Cal

Did you follow this case or the trial? She has a long history of being on psychiatric medications, and if I'm not mistaken at least one hospitalization for mental issues. She had been going steadily downhill since the birth of Mary-physically and mentally. Rusty's mother was coming by on a daily basis each day a few hours after Rusty left for work to help out with the children-such was the level of concern.

I do agree with you on one point and that is what you said about Rusty. He's complicit in this. He left her every day with the kids, seeing how she had deteriorated. She had made threats before (I believe) about hurting herself or the kids.

You know the old saying "there but for the grace of god"? This level of mental illness could have happened to you or I....perhaps a bit of compassion might be in order for a truly ill person along with gratitude that it's not you or someone you know suffering so.

 

[Only4Justice]

I dont think she will bask in the sunshine..that is incidental/coincidental to the release-sun shines and she cant not have it shine on her..in prison it shines on them if they are in the exercise yeard.
I am not debating your post-I hear the compassion in it-just thinking the sun can shine on us but if youur soul is filled with self recrimination and so on- that sun doesnt feel like a trip to club med would.
again just a comment-not an argument-your post is very well put,

newtv....I agree with your posts about Andrea.

When I saw the photo of her leaving the courthouse, that just bothered me, knowing her children will never again see sunshine. I totally agree with you, that Andrea will live in a hell for this life and the next one for what she has done. Mentally Ill, or Not.

Is it true that she could be free if she chooses?

________________________________________________

The above is only my opinion and I AM entitled to have one!

 

[cinsbythesea]

newtv....I agree with your posts about Andrea.

When I saw the photo of her leaving the courthouse, that just bothered me, knowing her children will never again see sunshine. I totally agree with you, that Andrea will live in a hell for this life and the next one for what she has done. Mentally Ill, or Not.

Is it true that she could be free if she chooses?


The above is only my opinion and I AM entitled to have one!

My impression was that she would be released on the condition that she would be placed in a mental hospital. Once she goes to trial, it's back to jail until the trial is over.

 

[Only4Justice]

Cinsbythesea, I certainly hope so! It's scary to think the State of Texas gave her a free pass...From what I read, the judge said she hoped Andrea would check into the hospital, but she couldn't force it. I read it as she could be free, if she decided to be.....I think she would be in real danger doing that, though, as many are incensed about this particular crime.

IdahoMom, I can't read that about sweet Noah's last moments, it is so horrendous. I had dreams about those children for months after they were killed...wishing I could have saved them somehow myself.

_________________________________________

The above is only my opinion and I AM entitled to have one !

 

[Maybe So]

She was powerless to stop herself. She was completely driven by forces/voices from within her sick mind. She couldn't stop until the deed was done. As I recall, she felt she was saving the children by doing what she did. Once it was done and the children were "saved" then she made the 911 call.

I don't believe she was powerless to stop herself. I don't beleive she thought she was saving the children from anything either. She is an adult...albeit a sick adult but she is not relieved from picking up the phone and looking for help on her own. If she could dial 911 after they were dead she could have dialed it before they were dead and begged someone to come and stop her. She could have called her doctor or a relative and told them that the urges to kill her children and the voices were getting worse. She could have walked out into the street and jumped in front of a car....anything but kill her children. If I had the urge to kill my children I would walk out the door and get as far away from them as possible. No, she waited for an opportunity to be alone with them...and she did it in a hurry....that took conscious thought on her part.

Mental illness or not any person who can calculatingly hold 5 of their own babies under the water and kill them is inconceivable to me. Even if you flipped out I would think that after seeing the first one dead you would snap out of it and try to stop yourself.

 

[NewMom2003]

My impression was that she would be released on the condition that she would be placed in a mental hospital. Once she goes to trial, it's back to jail until the trial is over.

I could be wrong, but that's my impression also. I thought Andrea going in to a mental facility until her trial was a condition of the bond.

Regardless of what happens, she will never be free and I don't think she should be. She'll either go to prison or a facility for the insane and I believe the latter is where she should have always been.

 

[cinsbythesea]

I don't believe she was powerless to stop herself. I don't beleive she thought she was saving the children from anything either. She is an adult...albeit a sick adult but she is not relieved from picking up the phone and looking for help on her own. If she could dial 911 after they were dead she could have dialed it before they were dead and begged someone to come and stop her. She could have called her doctor or a relative and told them that the urges to kill her children and the voices were getting worse. She could have walked out into the street and jumped in front of a car....anything but kill her children. If I had the urge to kill my children I would walk out the door and get as far away from them as possible. No, she waited for an opportunity to be alone with them...and she did it in a hurry....that took conscious thought on her part.

Mental illness or not any person who can calculatingly hold 5 of their own babies under the water and kill them is inconceivable to me. Even if you flipped out I would think that after seeing the first one dead you would snap out of it and try to stop yourself.

She was profoundly deeply disturbed. She was so far into her own sickness that she most likely could not have stopped herself even if part of her was screaming stop. She's as sick as they come. I've no doubt that if you had the same urges you wouldn't walk out the door and get as far away from those you had a desire to hurt. But you're not ill-you're a rational thinking person. She had lost that. That's what mental illness is. She was deeply, deeply depressed. Thankfully most of us never reach the levels of depression and mental illness that Andrea did. Of course not understanding that level of depression often makes for no compassion for those who have experienced it and done unthinkable things while in the throes of it.

 

[bugs]

You know it is hard for anyone to understand why she would do what she did. I do have one question though, have the ones that are harshly critical of Andrea had any dealings with mental illness or the likes? Rusty should have seen what childbirth was doing to Andrea yet he couldn't keep his pants zipped or use birth control. Andrea will forever be in a hospital/prison cell. Bottomline, she is sick.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

I agree-she might be freer in some ways in a mental hospital-i think u might get a bigger room and maybe allowed to participate in a games room type setting-it might be less tightly secured if she is well - they still lockdown people if they go off the rails..yada
But i would be terrified to be around seriously mentally ill people because they are scary.
But it is the right place for the mentally ill is all-prison is filled with untreated mentally ill people..not all or the majority-but it is inhumane to have a mentally ill patient left untreated-thats how she ended up killing those children.
I dont think she will ever come and go in a way that freedom allows..she is shackled ot her murders and she will never have peace.
Its just a differnt place to be incarcerated.

Excellent post!

 

[IdahoMom]

You know it is hard for anyone to understand why she would do what she did. I do have one question though, have the ones that are harshly critical of Andrea had any dealings with mental illness or the likes? Rusty should have seen what childbirth was doing to Andrea yet he couldn't keep his pants zipped or use birth control. Andrea will forever be in a hospital/prison cell. Bottomline, she is sick.

Yes...

 

[calus_3]

You know it is hard for anyone to understand why she would do what she did. I do have one question though, have the ones that are harshly critical of Andrea had any dealings with mental illness or the likes? Rusty should have seen what childbirth was doing to Andrea yet he couldn't keep his pants zipped or use birth control. Andrea will forever be in a hospital/prison cell. Bottomline, she is sick.

Absolutely

As for Rusty, he deserves to hook up with Loreena bobbit!

Cal

 

[Jeana (DP)]

:laugh:
Your killing me Calus.

I agree this woman is out to lunch, But I have one question for those who claim insanity to the point of not knowing what she was doing;IF she had voices in her head so strong that she actually chased down her babies to drown them one by one, HOW in the heck did she suddenly become cognitive enough to now call 911? This was nothing less than premeditated murder but for what it's worth I think any body that could purposely take a life has mental illness.

Whoever said that she was insane to the "point of not knowing what she did"??? She's said FROM DAY ONE that she knew she killed them and WHY. If you read her statements, you'd know that.

The hang up is in the wording my friends. You CAN be insane and still know what you're doing. American justice is hung up on the "knowing the difference between right and wrong." That's ridiculous. You can KNOW something is wrong and STILL IN YOUR SICK MIND think that you're protecting your children. Most people cannot even begin to comprehend the level of psychosis that Andrea is/was in and it prevents people from having the ability to distinguish between an excuse and a reason.

 

[bugs]

Whoever said that she was insane to the "point of not knowing what she did"??? She's said FROM DAY ONE that she knew she killed them and WHY. If you read her statements, you'd know that.

The hang up is in the wording my friends. You CAN be insane and still know what you're doing. American justice is hung up on the "knowing the difference between right and wrong." That's ridiculous. You can KNOW something is wrong and STILL IN YOUR SICK MIND think that you're protecting your children. Most people cannot even begin to comprehend the level of psychosis that Andrea is/was in and it prevents people from having the ability to distinguish between an excuse and a reason.

I totally agree.

Mental illness is the most rejected sickness of all. Folks are quicker to become passionate when they hear cancer, heart disease, etc. However, when people find out someone is mentally ill the majority avoids them, nervous to be around them, and so on. For that person what they feel is real and trying to have them "snap out of it" is impossible. I'm sure Andrea heard this alot and therefore when treatment was really needed it was instead avoided.

 

[newtv]

Just wait and see. After a year or so of being in the mental institution the attorney try to get her out altogether. This is just a step in the direction of her eventual release. They know her crime is too heinous to be overlooked entirely so they are trying to get her into a mental institution first. After that I bet she will eventually try to get herself released to a half way house and then released altogether. Sort of easing her way out slowly....

They have mental facilities in prison...I think that is where she belongs. There are people in prison who have done far less.

i cannot see her being released and staying alive-ever
they will never release her
she will never be well enough and that is what
mental illness is
if they have such facilities in prison she may end up back there if reconvicted
but the point is she is mentally ill
not a ted bundy type

 

[Jules]

I am in the middle of reading a book about her now. I forgot the name, but it's a real eye opener to what she's gone through. I should be done with it in a few days if anyone would like to read it.

Jeana, completely agree with your post. The level of psychosis she was in is awful. She was going weeks without bathing, days without eating, walking in circles for hours on end, not talking - just awful.

I have always said I thought Rusty should be the one in a jail cell - I still feel that way, but her Dr should be in the cell next to him. He bares some responsibility in this as well. He took her off her meds cold turkey shortly before the murders even after being advised that it's best to slowly cut back.

Andrea is a woman who was failed in every aspect of her care - from her husband, to her doctor, even to family and friends. I can GUARANTEE you if my hubby went weeks without showering, I'd be tackling him to get his nasty a$$ in the shower. That should have been a HUGE red flag for Rusty. How the h*ll can you take care of 5 kids daily when you can't take care of yourself???

This case upsets me soooooooo much. The book has been very hard for me to read. The beginning, where they are discussing the murders, was some of the most gut wrenching stuff I have ever read.

 

[close_enough]

Judge sets $200,000 bond for Andrea Yates to leave jail for mental hospital.

http://www.courttv.com/


:clap: :clap:

yep, i heard this while out running errands earlier....a mental hospital is where she should have been all along, imo...

 

[Socks]

To say that I am ignorant of mental illness is quite presumptious. I have witnessed metal illness firsthand.

I do not buy it in this case. Legal insanity is knowing the difference between right and wrong. She knew it was wrong because she waited for the right moment because Rusty or her MIL would have stopped her...her own admission.

She was cognizant of the time frame she had to work with. She was cognizant enough to plan and carry out the horrific murders of five children.

2 years and never a peep. Check her medical records. There is a question that they ask every 302 or self admit about feelings of hurting yourself or others..never once did she mention these thoughts of murdering her children...why...

You can feel sympathy or empathy for this woman all the day long...but for me, I feel nothing for her...sorta the same feeling she felt when she looked in her babies eyes and held them under water.


" I'm sorry, Mommy...I'm sorry, Mommy"....

http://www.yateskids.org/memorials.php

 

[kgeaux]

She was powerless to stop herself. She was completely driven by forces/voices from within her sick mind. She couldn't stop until the deed was done. As I recall, she felt she was saving the children by doing what she did. Once it was done and the children were "saved" then she made the 911 call.

If the law states that the legal definition of insanity is knowing the difference between right and wrong, then Andrea does not fit that definition.

 

[kgeaux]

To say that I am ignorant of mental illness is quite presumptious. I have witnessed metal illness firsthand.

I do not buy it in this case. Legal insanity is knowing the difference between right and wrong. She knew it was wrong because she waited for the right moment because Rusty or her MIL would have stopped her...her own admission.

She was cognizant of the time frame she had to work with. She was cognizant enough to plan and carry out the horrific murders of five children.

2 years and never a peep. Check her medical records. There is a question that they ask every 302 or self admit about feelings of hurting yourself or others..never once did she mention these thoughts of murdering her children...why...

You can feel sympathy or empathy for this woman all the day long...but for me, I feel nothing for her...sorta the same feeling she felt when she looked in her babies eyes and held them under water.


" I'm sorry, Mommy...I'm sorry, Mommy"....

http://www.yateskids.org/memorials.php

EXACTLY.

 

[concernedperson]

For those of you who are worrying about Andrea walking out of the facility, it won't happen. George Parnham put a 72 hour hold on her in the event she wants to walk. If that occurs then the bond will be revoked and she will be sent back to the Harris County Jail. He cares about his client and wants the best for her and society.