TX - Former Dallas Police Officer Amber Guyger, indicted for Murder of Botham Shem Jean #5

[gitana1]

I hope she gets convicted of manslaughter

I don't think I'd be able to convict on murder. But I'm worried about the manslaughter charge somehow.

This just in:

Judge is extremely upset that prosecutor broke a gag order by giving interviews regarding the trial:
Judge in disbelief after DA breaks rule in Amber Guyger trial - CNN Video

I don't have audio on my computer. Her physical reaction, however, is very telling. I don't know if a mis-trial situation is possible..... .

She denied a mistrial.

I hope the DA faces sanctions for that.

 

[gitana1]

She'll be able to possess a gun at her residence or property only after conditions are met. Contrary to Federal Law, but that's Texas

once someone has been convicted of a felony, they must wait until the fifth anniversary of their release from jail, parole, or probation (again, whichever end date is later) before they can legally possess a firearm at his/her residence only.


Texas Penal Code § 46.04. Unlawful Possession of Firearm

WOW! I didn't know that.

 

[Mickey Mouse]

<snip>

Here's the thing though: If I text and drive and plow into a couple of kids on a sidewalk and kill them, am I less culpable based on the level of horror and remorse I show?

<Snip>

Another analogy: So if someone is exhausted from working a 48 hour shift and gets in their car and drives home and in their sheer exhaustion gets confused and drives the wrong way up a freeway off ramp and kills a couple of people in a head on collision, the law is going to find that they were reckless in driving in that condition. The law is going to find them culpable no matter how much they cry or how sorry they are. As it should! Cars are deadly!

Why on earth should a gun be different?

Snipped for focus

Cars are a good analogy, but what she did was really exponentially worse... it's like she was texting while driving, mistook a driveway for a road and turned into the driveway, saw children playing in the driveway, and intentionally ran them down thinking they were animals.

 

[Mickey Mouse]

She didn't plan to murder him ahead of time, sure. But she certainly did intend to kill him when she unholstered, aimed, and fired her gun.

TWICE!

 

[mickey2942]

It's called the The blue wall of silence, the informal rule that purportedly exists among police officers not to report on a colleague's errors, misconducts, or crimes, including police brutality. If questioned about an incident of alleged misconduct involving another officer (e.g., during the course of an official inquiry), while following the code, the officer being questioned would claim ignorance of another officer's wrongdoing or claim to have not seen anything.

This is very true. And if someone actually believes in ethics, telling the truth, and breaks the "Blue Wall", that person is obviously "NOT" part of the "TEAM", and eventually is bullied until they quit.

So, honest officers have to go along or lose their entire career, pension, and everything else.

 

[Wishbone]

WOW! I didn't know that.

I live in Texas but was born and lived in California for over 35 years. So now I have lived in Texas longer than I lived in California. Took some getting used to but I would never move back. The main things I have learned are that Texans are proud of their guns and flags. Oh, and bluebonnets too, and blue bell ice cream.

 

[mickey2942]

So sad.

Botham Jean remembered for singing talents by university

The world lost a very bright light.

AG should be convicted. I would feel this way no matter who the victim was, but it is especially poignant in this case.

Seriously, listening to this brought tears to my eyes. His family must be devastated.

 

[gitana1]

I live in Texas but was born and lived in California for over 35 years. So now I have lived in Texas longer than I lived in California. Took some getting used to but I would never move back. The main things I have learned are that Texans are proud of their guns and flags. Oh, and bluebonnets too, and blue bell ice cream.

Bluebonnets are gorgeous. Allowing felons to own guns, not so great.

 

[10ofRods]

It's called the The blue wall of silence, the informal rule that purportedly exists among police officers not to report on a colleague's errors, misconducts, or crimes, including police brutality. If questioned about an incident of alleged misconduct involving another officer (e.g., during the course of an official inquiry), while following the code, the officer being questioned would claim ignorance of another officer's wrongdoing or claim to have not seen anything.

So they have an "informal" rule inside a very formal organization...to lie if need be.

 

[BeachSky]

She’s been prancing in& out of court surrounded by her tribe for months..
I’m not moved that she’s grabbing a tissue or all sad face when doing the private exit.
Going to be very difficult for Bo’s family when she’s on the stand.

MOO

 

[Wishbone]

Bluebonnets are gorgeous. Allowing felons to own guns, not so great.

Was a surprise to me to find that little tidbit. Especially since it goes against Federal law.

 

[Wishbone]

So they have an "informal" rule inside a very formal organization...to lie if need be.

It's either that or your coworkers won't cover your back.

 

[Jax49]

So they have an "informal" rule inside a very formal organization...to lie if need be.

Interesting opinion piece by an ex-FBI agent.

Why an ex-FBI agent decided to break through the blue wall of silence

Like most people in law enforcement, I was once a brick in the blue wall of silence.

You’ve probably heard about the thin blue line — the idea that police officers and the laws they’re sworn to uphold are all that stand between order and chaos.

The blue wall of silence is different.

It refers to the unofficial oath of silence within departments. Cops don’t rat on cops. That blue wall is one of many factors that further pushes the widening divide between the world as seen by law enforcement and the world experienced by the citizens whom officers are sworn to protect.

 

[mickey2942]

Interesting opinion piece by an ex-FBI agent.

Why an ex-FBI agent decided to break through the blue wall of silence

I noticed in the article that he was no longer working for the FBI when he decided to switch.

Of course.

 

[Jax49]

I noticed in the article that he was no longer working for the FBI when he decided to switch.

Of course.

Looks like he retired before he changed.

Even after I retired as a special agent for the FBI and became a court-certified expert witness, I declined to take on cases in which I would be required to testify in court or give a sworn deposition against fellow law enforcement officers. My dedication to the wall ran just that deep.

It didn’t start to crumble for me until about 2003, about five years after I left the bureau. I was talking over breakfast with an old friend who still worked at the FBI. He wanted to know why I had refused to work with prosecutors investigating law enforcement personnel who were being sued or charged with a crime.

 

[Jax49]

Apologies if already shared.

What we've learned in the Amber Guyger murder trial

There was a bright red doormat outside Jean's apartment. His apartment was the only one with such a noticeable doormat on the third or fourth floor.

Jean's apartment was more cluttered than Guyger's, which was sparsely furnished. Guyger's apartment had a half-circle entry table with a vase of flowers toward the living room of her apartment.

She did not have a rug, nor a coffee table. Jean had a large round ottoman in front of his couch. Guyger did not have any artwork behind her couch, unlike Jean.

Jean's TV, which was on when he was shot, was much larger than Guyger's, the crime scene photos showed.

bbm

 

[10ofRods]

Are you in the NorthEast perchance? I live in the NY tri-state area and it takes between 10-12 months to get a handgun license. Maybe a month if you want a long gun. I don't mind because I don't have a firearm and have no desire to have one.

I live in a semi-urban area and like you I too(10ofRods) - have designated areas of the house that we can retreat to in - case of a home invasion. My local police station is about a mile away and response time is about 4 minutes. My neighbor - a few doors down - is a police officer. I would rather - NO KILL - than kill someone.

SoCal. We can get guns, just not permits to carry concealed (in my county). L.A. County is easier. You pretty much have to know someone in the Sheriff's dept to get one, where I live. I don't think there's any difference in time for long gun vs hand gun here. It takes about 10 days to get the actual gun and its permit.

We're semi-urban too and I was brought up in a semi-rural area.

We can't open carry either (permits to do that are even more restrictive, even if gun is unloaded).

 

[YESorNO]

The Daily Debrief: Should The State Have Even Brought This As A Murder Case?

Sep 26, 2019

 

[Falcon500]

So they have an "informal" rule inside a very formal organization...to lie if need be.

That is a tired old claim that is false and about 40 years outdated.

 

[rosesfromangels]

Can you say why the civil case is more interesting? It'll be against Dallas PD, right? I don't think remorse enters into this, exactly. I think it's about her intention. As a regular citizen, I think I have a duty not to kill people and that my own fear is only one factor. My ability to properly judge a situation is part of what I think gun use is about. If I can't properly regulate my use of a weapon and someone is injured or killed and I intentionally pulled the trigger...that's pretty serious. More than 2 years serious. But I hear you. Are you thinking that Ms Guyger shouldn't bear the main brunt of the punishment - but instead, City of Dallas?

Agree with the above.
No, she should pay reparation to the family, although they will likely go after the PD as well. If they can prove the Officer was not handled correctly after her first shooting incident, they may have something, IMO. Time will tell.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[Reasonable & Just]

That is a tired old claim that is false and about 40 years outdated.

I honestly did not know this, but I appreciate your expertise.
So this protective behavior simply does not happen, in any jurisdiction? Was there legislation or an administrative move 40 years ago to change behaviors that might be described this way?

Do you have insight as to why it seems (to the public) to be the case on occasion? Is it a lack of understanding on the public's part of procedures?