UK UK - Corrie McKeague, 23, Bury St Edmunds, 24 September 2016 #12

[Scottishem1]

Hi guys, been on here as a guest, first post but read most of the posts on all the different threads so far.... I have a few points that I want to get off my chest but one question first that I don't know if it has been asked/answered yet (apologies if it has) ok .. the police know he sent a text message at 3.08 because the phone provider can provide this information and the person who received it came forward. I used to work for a phone company and I know we could see a list of who people had called, when , length and cost of call, how many texts they had sent, and when they had used mobile data, but does anyone know if u send messages on whatsapp or another messaging service if this shows up or would you need the phone ? I'm asking because I know if I was on a night out then ended up out the club for whatever reason my only 2 thoughts would be food and home .. ok corrie does the first then he sits / sleeps in a door (his mum says this is normal so ok no problem) . The things that bother me are - apparently the guy in the kebab shop offers him a lift and he says no - only reason I would do that would be if I had arranged to meet someone.
2: when he wakes up in the door way and sends that picture he doesn't get up and go he hangs about there till almost half past. The time he leaves from the door suggests time for a pee then a meeting for 3:30( which would be his pre arranged meeting time because he wouldn't know before hand he was going to get kicked out the club). Those 2 things make it impossible (almost) for me to believe he didn't have plans. I have a loose theory for after that but that's plenty rambling for a first post . D

Sorry unsure how or if it's possible to bold Writting in the mobile app however your post got me thinking; surely if someone offers you a lift and you say no you would go on to say why me personally definitely would put of politeness 😕


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[Ruthbullock]

I am not sure but I assumed the bin lorry was a rigid lorry, not a van. It's a commercial vehicle so regardless if it was a lorry or a van it should have a tachograph in it, if the vehicle is newer than 2006 it would be a digital tacho and older than 2006 wold have had an analogue tacho. The tacho would show the speed that the vehicle was driven, the time driver started as he would have put his tacho card/chart in, the driving stops and starts, any breaks the driver had and the miles driven. Did the lorry go right to landfill or did it go to a third party site?

It did other pick ups, was sorted and waste that wasn't recyclable was incinerated.

 

[butterstick]

Where is it written that the family said the GPS was disabled on his phone?

My understanding is that if a phone is "pinging" towers then it is location aware.

You can turn off letting apps know location. For example on iPhone you can turn off "location services" for apps. Windows Phone has the same.

But if your phone is turned on, it's location aware, regardless if you allow apps to have access.

I don't understand why anyone would say that the GPS was turned off.... what they even mean by that.... or how they'd even know unless they had access to the phone and looked at the settings...

How many young people do you know let their family look at their phone?

Summary:

• We know the phone was pining cell towers, so it's location aware.
• Nobody can know APPS on the phone were location aware unless they have access to the phone.

 

[butterstick]

The last known phone ping is a huge thing.

I don't buy the idea that he left the phone on top of a bin. It would fall off or be seen when loading into the lorry.

Seems to me we are invested too heavily in the lorry idea.

He was not in the lorry. There would of been DNA evidence. He would of been injured to some extent.

The phone might of been - but if it was more likely put IN the bin for disposal, rather than being left on the bin .... if at all.

But just as likely, it was never in the lorry..... since the final ping from the phone is in a vague location at a vague time that only roughly matches the lorry....

 

[mrseeker]

Where is it written that the family said the GPS was disabled on his phone?

My understanding is that if a phone is "pinging" towers then it is location aware.

You can turn off letting apps know location. For example on iPhone you can turn off "location services" for apps. Windows Phone has the same.

But if your phone is turned on, it's location aware, regardless if you allow apps to have access.

I don't understand why anyone would say that the GPS was turned off.... what they even mean by that.... or how they'd even know unless they had access to the phone and looked at the settings...

How many young people do you know let their family look at their phone?

Summary:

• We know the phone was pining cell towers, so it's location aware.
• Nobody can know APPS on the phone were location aware unless they have access to the phone.

the GPS function pulls from the battery. So unless you are using an app such as where is my car, where is my iphone, or for directions, you might decide to turn it off. It does not change the information gathered by the cell towers.

 

[butterstick]

the GPS function pulls from the battery. So unless you are using an app such as where is my car, where is my iphone, or for directions, you might decide to turn it off. It does not change the information gathered by the cell towers.

So how would anybody know if it was turned on or off then?

 

[JamesKing]

Yes, the 55 minute window. I cannot see an incident occurring in the open, simply because of foot traffic.

And that's the thing when we look at the 55 minute window.

It was the earlier hours of Saturday morning, so the Friday night clubbers are on their weary way home.

We have 30+ people, but no timings given. It is only when we get to the unidentified do we get any timings.

There we have
0319.55, 0321.21, 0321.36, 0326.19, 0335.48, and 0356.59 which is the guy on the bike. The three other CCTV images fall after 0500

I would imagine that he majority of identified people (nearly 30) would also fall within this "55 minute" time frame, based solely on the fact they were "late night revellers making their way home".

It would be a guess to say that from the time Corrie entered the horseshoe at 0325 and the phone moving a 0420+, there was a sufficient footfall in that area to notice a "significant" confrontation.

Of course Corrie "could have" walked from the horseshoe area and into Short Brackland AND be unseen by the Greenwoods camera, which was looking in the other direction....but then "the 55 minute wait in Bury" has to be explained.

One explanation could be "he was meeting someone, he met them and got into their car... and the reason why they moved off was because the bin lorry arrived", but there would be witnesses to this. The bin lorry driver and the three teenagers sighted by the bin lorry driver, to name but a few.

If there was truly no witnesses to Corrie's "last movements" after he entered the horseshoe 0325, then it could be assumed that whatever happened, happened quickly and unseen.
By that I mean, there was no "large struggle" or "ongoing conflict" and no forensic evidence either.

Was it that he "merely entered one of the buildings" to the rear of the horseshoe ?

 

[Miss_French]

Will the police be investigating focus 12?!

In all the time I've lived in BSE I've never heard of Focus 12 until now, ie never read of any links to anything untoward, and neither have I heard of any specific crimes in the horseshoe or that match Corrie's disappearance.

With the local murders that I've read about, and the non-fatal shooting last year, there's been some kind of personal connection between perp and victim.

Not saying they couldn't be related, but back to my opinion that there are things being put out there by the family that change on a regular basis or seem to serve no discernable purpose; he's been hit by a car, he's in a building opposite the horseshoe, he finds himself in people's hearts, he's a social hand grenade and a risk taker, there's rehab accommodation in the horseshoe. I'm kind of, and...???

 

[Miss_French]

I have to disagree with the drugs thing. Not saying it is common in the military but it happens, and certainly more than most people would think. That's not to suggest Corrie was but it can't be discounted.

Agree with you, stepmeek.

I've come across very few instances of drug taking in the RAF, but I think they're either down to naivety or someone doing it deliberately to get thrown out; think the latter is more prevalent in the army, squaddie looking for a quick way out of a life kicking around doing not a lot, joins up, not happy, looks for a quick way out and goes back to kicking around.

 

[Diamba85]

Does anyone think that this could have been a tragic accident. I know the Police apparently ruled out that the lorry was involved but could this have been a tragic accident? Although the drivers are supposed to look inside the bin before emptying them, for whatever reason, is it possible that this was not done on the fateful night in question? Is there any chance that the weight could be wrong of the bin? Could Corrie have opted to sleep in one of the bins (paper/cardboard bins don't smell like normal rubbish bins and would have provided a much warmer option than a doorway. Would the bins have been locked or could they have been accessed by anyone? Was there only one bin lorry and what time did the next one arrive to empty one of the other bins. Could the driver have given Corrie a lift part of the way then dropped him off to walk back to base?

50% of me thinks it's a tragic accident and he's in the buildings they've not been able to search. But then how/why would he end up in an abandoned building by himself and have an accident in there? Got to be someone else involved along the lines somewhere.

I forgot who mentioned it now but the Clown scenario is interesting.. the person could have changed in and out of their clown costume away from CCTV.. (in the horseshoe).

I just can't stop thinking about his mother saying he would totally go off with a stranger.





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[Coach]

In all the time I've lived in BSE I've never heard of Focus 12 until now, ie never read of any links to anything untoward, and neither have I heard of any specific crimes in the horseshoe or that match Corrie's disappearance.

With the local murders that I've read about, and the non-fatal shooting last year, there's been some kind of personal connection between perp and victim.

Not saying they couldn't be related, but back to my opinion that there are things being put out there by the family that change on a regular basis or seem to serve no discernable purpose; he's been hit by a car, he's in a building opposite the horseshoe, he finds himself in people's hearts, he's a social hand grenade and a risk taker, there's rehab accommodation in the horseshoe. I'm kind of, and...???

Focus 12 is located at 82 Risbygate Street, which is not in the HS area. The website is http://www.focus12.co.uk

 

[Diamba85]

If there's a club closing at around 3/3.30 then that easily explains him waiting around for a lift home. Hence why he turns down a lift earlier in the evening. (Although why you'd turn down a lift at 1.30 just to sleep in a doorway to go home at 3.30 is weird).

So what time does Flex close? 3am.

If he was waiting for a lift back to his base with his pals then surely he would have taken any lift available. Unless he felt he needed to bond with the base pals more and a lift home with them wouldn't hurt.

My other thinking is that he met a woman in Flex and she said she would meet him at 3.30 (enough time to get out of Flex and get some food to walk home with) and he either misses her and gets into trouble or runs into trouble going for a wee whilst waiting for her. Or she is the trouble he runs into.


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[suzyjackson]

I asked that very question before. Why would he leave his car, knowing he has to go right back and get it? There is an article that says one of his friends said he told them he was walking back that night. And then there is the quote from the mother. He was in no condition to walk at 1 am. He was not much better at 3:23 am. Are there residences in this horseshoe or just businesses?

BBM I don't suppose you have a link to the article that says one of the friends said that do you? I thought the only mention of the possibility came from a homeless person

TIA

 

[suzyjackson]

Where is it written that the family said the GPS was disabled on his phone?

My understanding is that if a phone is "pinging" towers then it is location aware.

You can turn off letting apps know location. For example on iPhone you can turn off "location services" for apps. Windows Phone has the same.

But if your phone is turned on, it's location aware, regardless if you allow apps to have access.

I don't understand why anyone would say that the GPS was turned off.... what they even mean by that.... or how they'd even know unless they had access to the phone and looked at the settings...

How many young people do you know let their family look at their phone?

Summary:

• We know the phone was pining cell towers, so it's location aware.
• Nobody can know APPS on the phone were location aware unless they have access to the phone.

Nicola has said that the location servcies were turned off, she said that if they were on there'd be much more specifc info on where the phoen went, someone posted it earlier in ths thread I think in the discussion where Grindr was discounted

JMO

 

[suzyjackson]

If there's a club closing at around 3/3.30 then that easily explains him waiting around for a lift home. Hence why he turns down a lift earlier in the evening. (Although why you'd turn down a lift at 1.30 just to sleep in a doorway to go home at 3.30 is weird).

So what time does Flex close? 3am.

If he was waiting for a lift back to his base with his pals then surely he would have taken any lift available. Unless he felt he needed to bond with the base pals more and a lift home with them wouldn't hurt.

My other thinking is that he met a woman in Flex and she said she would meet him at 3.30 (enough time to get out of Flex and get some food to walk home with) and he either misses her and gets into trouble or runs into trouble going for a wee whilst waiting for her. Or she is the trouble he runs into.


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I think this is a possibility but OTOH if he had arranged an innocent meet up with someone in the club why hasn't that person come forward? If they did meet up in the HS and some kind of accident occured afterwards who has the instant resources to move and conceal a dead body so effectively?

So if there was an arrangement I would have to conclude it was made with malice aforethought which suggests to me a male hook up

JMO

 

[Coach]

During the live web cast on Facebook, Corrie's mum said that he believed he could handle himself and he would go off with a stranger. I would have thought that three years (assuming it was three years) in the RAF would have made him more vigilant. He does sound a bit too trusting, reckless even. His mum also mentioned that he wasn't going to go out that night, it was a week before pay day etc. Someone asked during the webcast about his car and where it is now and she said she has it, she also commented that she paid for it so she has it now. It does sound like he very much 'lived for the moment'. The call to his brother that night strikes me as odd, the duration and reason his mum gave was that they were planning the following weekend. Someone posted that there had been four calls to his brother that day, I also read in a post that the brother had mentioned in an interview that he planned to speak to him in the Sunday. All of the footage shows Corrie on his own, very much 'alone'. He was asked to leave the club a mere half hour after going in, was he a nuisance, why did they ask him to leave? It really doesn't sound like his friends were with him at all that night. After they left without him you would have thought the first thing he would have done when he drove to BSE was to catch up with them.

 

[Diamba85]

I think this is a possibility but OTOH if he had arranged an innocent meet up with someone in the club why hasn't that person come forward? If they did meet up in the HS and some kind of accident occured afterwards who has the instant resources to move and conceal a dead body so effectively?

So if there was an arrangement I would have to conclude it was made with malice aforethought which suggests to me a male hook up

JMO

Good point. However, say the woman he planned to meet with was extremely drunk or became extremely drunk throughout the evening and woke up the next morning with zero recollection of the night before? It happens a lot.

Along that same line, that reminds me of something I thought of when I first started reading this thread.

Maybe C himself had "blacked out" and woke at 3am with no memory, or a very faded memory. The only thing that makes me discount this is surely there'd be evidence of him texting people to come and get him. Unless he was much more of a loner than we think and he decided to just wait it out and drive back at 6ish and something happens while he's waiting about.


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[Coach]

Focus 12 is located at 82 Risbygate Street, which is not in the HS area. The website is http://www.focus12.co.uk

I was under the impression that Focus 12 was in the immediate area that Corrie was last seen but it isn't in the HS area, as per link above.

 

[suzyjackson]

A question occurs to me for those who think the phone was deliberately thrown in the bin by someone who knows the bin emptying schedule, and this is a genuine question although it may sound snarky - what kind of person would know the middle of the night arrangements for bins in BSE, someone who knows the whole town's arrangements (and just happens to be next to a particular bin) or someone who knows only the arrangemenst for the HS so engineers to commit a crime there, someone who has planned a crime and spent time watching the late night bin collections just in case?

I really don't see any of this being the slightest bit feasible, IMHO the only person who knows when the bins are going to be collected is the bin man and unless he's pretty stupid he's not going to put a phone in his own lorry

 

[suzyjackson]

I was under the impression that Focus 12 was in the immediate area that Corrie was last seen but it isn't in the HS area, as per link above.

There are two Focus12 locations, one of them has a back gate in the HS