GUILTY UK - Karen Buckley, 24, Glasgow, Scotland, 12 April 2015 - #2

[CoverMeCagney]

Aha, so thanks to Skibs map I have realised that while Kelvin Way (where he killed her) runs through a park, it's not the same park as where he dumped her handbag. Looks like she's agreed to a lift home for whatever reason, he's turned off early to take her somewhere more isolated.

And :laugh: at your comment, alreetlike! He's a rubbish criminal and I'm glad he's stitched himself right up!

 

[CoverMeCagney]

The court heard how Pacteau had met Miss Buckley outside the club in the early hours of the morning and drove with her in his car to nearby Kelvin Way. Here are some of the things he did to unequivocally tie himself to the murder:

• Car seen on street for 12 minutes then caught on CCTV driving towards park
• Bag dumped in park bin and found by member of public
• At 8am he used his mobile phone to look up the properties of caustic soda.
• He then travelled to a B&Q store where he bought six litres of the chemical and masks and gloves, and more at Poundstretcher
• He texted his flatmate to make sure he was out for the day, then returned to the flat and left Miss Buckley's body in the bath.
• Pacteau was found cleaning the hall and stairwell when his flatmate returned home at around 8pm.
• He left his flat at around 5am the following morning and went to a bridge of the nearby Forth and Clyde Canal where he threw the spanner into the water.
• He then drove to a supermarket and bought cleaning products and asked a member of staff to recommend a product for removing blood from a mattress.
• Pacteau made his first journey to High Craigton Farm, stopping off at a supermarket on the way to buy white spirit and a lighter
• He burned some clothing while there before returning to his flat where he used his mobile phone to call a packaging company and ordered a large blue barrel.
• He then took the mattress in his car to the farmland where he burned it along with other items before returning to the flat and taking the barrel to his car.
• He stopped off to buy padlocks at an Asda store then made his way to the farm where he arranged to rent two storage units for a week before moving the barrel into one of the units, covering it with a sheet and placing a bike wheel and paper shredder on top.

Oh man. How to get caught at every step huh?! Mobile phone use, multiple shop visits, suspicious purchases, loads of CCTV. I wonder if he confessed to the spanner bit?

So we can add to this:

* Pacteau visited a car valet on his way home, at around 4pm. While waiting for the Ford Focus to be cleaned, he used his phone to create an advert to sell his car.

Perhaps he'll use his time in jail to write "How not to get away with murder".

 

[blefuscu]

I don't get why she would go with him initially. I don't think we'll ever get the truth about that, but it puzzles me why such a lovely, dependable girl would just go away with a strange man without telling anyone.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

I don't get why she would go with him initially. I don't think we'll ever get the truth about that, but it puzzles me why such a lovely, dependable girl would just go away with a strange man without telling anyone.

I think she must have spoken to him before, perhaps, as someone else suggested, she had chatted to him while out having a cig or come across him on a previous night out. The video showed her leaving willingly with him, I reckon he offered her a lift home.

 

[ChuckieD]

This guy is one sick puppy, it appears he is a psychopath but a rather dumb psychopath and his every action was uncovered by Police. The link I provide has video of the Police interviewing Pacteau and some more pictures which make him look ever creepier than the picture that was in the media at the time of his arrest. How Karen got in a car with him is beyond belief we will never know the true story of how she ended up in this monsters car.

He killed Karen near the park and it appears she was never alive at his flat. She was Murdered on Kelvin Way. What an horrific filthy animal this guy is, he only pleaded guilty because he had no chance of getting off because the Police nailed him on everything. He should never get released considering the appalling nature of this killing and the calculated and evil attempts to cover his tracks after the Murder. What kind of time is he likely to serve, an animal like this should be put down.


http://www.independent.ie/irish-new...ring-karen-buckley-murder-probe-31442608.html

I really think the term 'psychopath' gets bandied around too much nowadays, it's like when suddenly everybody was ADHD, it really annoys me and is beginning, in my opinion, to undermine the crime. We know very, very little about his psych, if anything.

 

[Irishguy]

RSBM

I did some searching to see what sort of sentences get handed out to murderers in Scotland.

Peter Tobin was given a minimum of 21 years for the rape and murder of Angelika Kluk in Glasgow in 2006 (This was later upgraded to a whole life tarrif - no chance for parole, after this discovery of two more bodies in his back garden).

Angus Sinclair was given a minimum of 37 years for the double murder of Christine Eadie and Helen Scott. They were murdered in 1977 but he was convicted and sentenced in 2014.

Both of those men were a lot older than Pacteau when sentenced, I don't know if that is taken into consideration, since both their sentences are likely to take them to the end of their lives, whereas in 21 years Pacteau will only be in his 40s.

I think the fact that this was such a horrific case where he attempted to dispose of the body in the most appalling manner possible. Add to that the lies he fed the Police he lied and lied until the evidence meant he could lie no more. He attempted to tarnish the image of Karen saying they had sex, he said she fell and injured herself in a fall at his flat, he made up a story that she attacked him and slapped him in the face. To this day he still has not given any reason or motive for brutally murdering a young woman who was unknown to him.

He should never again be left out, but failing that anything other than the maximum sentence possible would be a travesty. I think anything other than a minimum of 30 years would not be Justice.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

I think the fact that this was such a horrific case where he attempted to dispose of the body in the most appalling manner possible. Add to that the lies he fed the Police he lied and lied until the evidence meant he could lie no more. He attempted to tarnish the image of Karen saying they had sex, he said she fell and injured herself in a fall at his flat, he made up a story that she attacked him and slapped him in the face. To this day he still has not given any reason or motive for brutally murdering a young woman who was unknown to him.

He should never again be left out, but failing that anything other than the maximum sentence possible would be a travesty. I think anything other than a minimum of 30 years would not be Justice.

Vincent Tabak got life with 20 years minumum for killing Joanna Yeates (the most similar recent case off the top of my head). Slightly different in that he knew Joanna, he had no previous, it wasn't premeditated, and his disposal method was rather less gruesome. But there are many similarities include the age and demographic of those involved, the lies he told, the media coverage.

I am therefore very hopeful Pacteau will get a longer sentence than 20 minimum, based on his previous charges and the fact he was a predator out looking for someone to kill. I'm not sure on my feelings on the death penalty, but if it existed he'd be a prime candidate in my opinion.

 

[Irishguy]

Vincent Tabak got life with 20 years minumum for killing Joanna Yeates (the most similar recent case off the top of my head). Slightly different in that he knew Joanna, he had no previous, it wasn't premeditated, and his disposal method was rather less gruesome. But there are many similarities include the age and demographic of those involved, the lies he told, the media coverage.

I am therefore very hopeful Pacteau will get a longer sentence than 20 minimum, based on his previous charges and the fact he was a predator out looking for someone to kill. I'm not sure on my feelings on the death penalty, but if it existed he'd be a prime candidate in my opinion.

His forging money conviction his bizarre statements during his trial for attempted sexual assault. This gives us an insight into what a downright nasty and despicable individual Pacteau is. It seems he lost it for some reason the night Karen was murdered. No suggestion that there was any sexual element to this case it just appears to be a savage and violent attack.

Its chilling to see the CCTV images of Karen walking alongside Pacteau without a care in the world, to think that her life would be over in 30 minutes or less is mind numbing. The fact that she was murdered in the space of 12 minutes in Kelvin way is beyond comprehension. A beautiful life ended in such a short space of time by this monster and so many others lives destroyed and life sentences of pain inflicted on those who loved Karen. Its so hard to fathom it was such a horrific and senseless murder.

He seems to have had some kind of an episode of the night of Karens murder. He went to the club then left then returned and was pacing up and down across the road from the club, seems as if he was unhinged.

 

[Irishguy]

Even more chilling and disturbing details coming out about this case, also bizarre photos of Pacteau in the media. In this report some chilling and disturbing details are released worst of all were "Pacteau placed Karen's body in his bath and covered it in the corrosive substance before cutting her open "to speed up decomposition". "Pacteau then wraps Karen's head in parcel tape, binds her body with an extension cable, and places her in the barrel".

Does this suggest that she was dismembered, also reports at that time of AP arrest said that Police pulled a knife from the river at the rear of AP apartment. It makes me sick and mad in equal measure.

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/...rse_s_body_in__Breaking_Bad__style_acid_bath/

 

[gregjrichards]

Even more chilling and disturbing details coming out about this case, also bizarre photos of Pacteau in the media. In this report some chilling and disturbing details are released worst of all were "Pacteau placed Karen's body in his bath and covered it in the corrosive substance before cutting her open "to speed up decomposition". "Pacteau then wraps Karen's head in parcel tape, binds her body with an extension cable, and places her in the barrel".

Does this suggest that she was dismembered, also reports at that time of AP arrest said that Police pulled a knife from the river at the rear of AP apartment. It makes me sick and mad in equal measure.

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/...rse_s_body_in__Breaking_Bad__style_acid_bath/

Just unbelievable how individuals can be so evil. I just wish he could be locked up all his life he is a danger to women and will be for the rest of his life.

 

[still-searching]

Does this suggest that she was dismembered, also reports at that time of AP arrest said that Police pulled a knife from the river at the rear of AP apartment. It makes me sick and mad in equal measure.

RSBM

I don't think so. I'm sure that would have been revealed explicitly if she had, as it doesn't seem like they've held back any other details.

As I said at the time of the knife discovery, unfortunately in Glasgow I think you'd be hard pushed to find a square meter of canal that you wouldn't find a knife it. Stab capital of the UK.

 

[YidArmyRach]

Vincent Tabak got life with 20 years minumum for killing Joanna Yeates (the most similar recent case off the top of my head). Slightly different in that he knew Joanna, he had no previous, it wasn't premeditated, and his disposal method was rather less gruesome. But there are many similarities include the age and demographic of those involved, the lies he told, the media coverage.

I am therefore very hopeful Pacteau will get a longer sentence than 20 minimum, based on his previous charges and the fact he was a predator out looking for someone to kill. I'm not sure on my feelings on the death penalty, but if it existed he'd be a prime candidate in my opinion.

I'm exactly the same ... deep down I feel that the death penalty wrong, simply because it doesn't seem right to kill someone in punishment for killing someone. But this case I agree with you. I think I am swayed because of the victim. She was just so lovely and her death was so pointless. She had so much to live for, she seemed such a nice person and she would have give so much to others in her career. To die for absolutely nothing, just a random act of violence, is a terrible waste of a good life.

If he gets anything other than life without parole, it won't be justice in my opinion. I think he will be a risk until he is dead.

 

[YidArmyRach]

Sweet heaven. If he hadn't got away with that, Karen might not have died. I just can't see why the woman who said she was attacked by him wasn't believed - especially as residents heard her terrified screams. She must have been devastated when she saw his name come up in relation to Karen's case.

I read today that a juror in the rape trial had submitted a note saying he/she couldn't hear the evidence of the alleged rape victim (I think problems with microphones in the court). I think there may have been a second concern about not being able to hear the evidence of one of the other witnesses too.

Sounds crazy - why would you come to a decision if you couldn't hear what one of the main witnesses was saying? And why not mention it at the time?

I'll try to find a link and add it when I find it.


Here it is:

But one juror later claimed that some of the alleged victim's testimony had been inaudible.

Court documents show that the juror, who cannot be named for legal reasons, 'experienced very considerable difficulty' hearing the evidence at Paisley Sheriff Court.

The Scottish Conservatives have now called for the Crown Office to look into the revelations, calling them ‘unacceptable’.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ult-2013-walked-free-court.html#ixzz3ibUntW9h
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

and

The juror submitted two notes: one outlining the technical outline and the other a plea for the problem to be addressed in the courtroom.

In his first note, the juror gave a detailed criticism of the poor setup in the court. He then said that the jury had ‘experienced very considerable difficulty’ in hearing the testimony of the witnesses owing to ‘insufficient volume’.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ult-2013-walked-free-court.html#ixzz3ibV8BpC4
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

 

[Alyce]

I don't get why she would go with him initially. I don't think we'll ever get the truth about that, but it puzzles me why such a lovely, dependable girl would just go away with a strange man without telling anyone.

I think we will never know.
Her friends were adamant that she would not have just left the club without telling them, but I wonder ?

Perhaps Karen just felt like going home and didn't want to have to fight her way back through crowds in the Club, simply to tell her friends she was going. She probably thought she would text them when she got home.

My guess is that AP posed as a taxi driver, I really cant see her just accepting a lift from a total stranger.

 

[Alyce]

I sincerely hope that the other rape case is retried... I doubt it will make much difference to the sentencing of AP but it would surely be justice for the other woman

 

[Alyce]

I have been reading re mandatory life sentencing in Scotland - and, I do hope I am wrong, but I have read of instances whereby the sentence was as little as 12 years.
I hope that in this case, it will be a whole of life tariff. Nothing less would be correct imo.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Interesting interview with Kathleen Stewart, Pacteau's ex housemate. I recall us checking her out her right at the beginning.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...Alexander-Pacteau-Walter-Mitty-fantasist.html

 

[Irishguy]

I think we will never know.
Her friends were adamant that she would not have just left the club without telling them, but I wonder ?

Perhaps Karen just felt like going home and didn't want to have to fight her way back through crowds in the Club, simply to tell her friends she was going. She probably thought she would text them when she got home.

My guess is that AP posed as a taxi driver, I really cant see her just accepting a lift from a total stranger.

It all seems out of place, Karen was a well travelled and a sensible girl, Pacteau said he was "extremely intoxicated" on the night he Murdered Karen. If this is true then it seems very odd that a sensible girl would get into a car with a drunk stranger at the wheel.

That is of course if Pacteau was drunk at all, he has lied about everything so far, so no reason to believe that he is telling the truth in this instance. Even now he is more than likely still telling lies about being intoxicated on that night.

 

[Irishguy]

Pacteau is getting special protection in prison after “A number of threats have been levelled against Pacteau from other inmates,” a source told the paper. I don't know which would be better this monster getting a whole life sentence or another inmate taking him out. However this cowardly animal doesnt deserve any protection.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-new...ection-in-tough-scotland-prison-31446653.html

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Pacteau is getting special protection in prison after “A number of threats have been levelled against Pacteau from other inmates,” a source told the paper. I don't know which would be better this monster getting a whole life sentence or another inmate taking him out. However this cowardly animal doesnt deserve any protection.

The latter. I hate that these worthless pieces of crap cost us so much money.