UK - Logan Mwangi, 5, found dead in Wales River, Bridgend, 31 July 2021 *arrests, inc. minor* #4

[Overthinker77]

I would imagine JC and the Youth would only prevent her from leaving *after* an incident where Logan was severely harmed, not before. To my mind, that was the vital pivotal moment where when the Youth stopped her and she returned, they all knew they were all 'in it together' covering up horror from there on in.

I'd be interested to know what this 'leaving' comprised and how determined it was, if at all. Was she carrying her baby? Her handbag?

She could have got away, she could have screamed out to the neighbours, the man in the van, she could have fought the Youth off tooth and nail. She's a very loud mouthy person by all accounts. But instead, she made a choice, a decision right there - a decision to stick with her family at all costs, at Logan's cost. Logan might still have been alive but he was confirmed dead right at that moment.

From seeing it this way, I believe that is the 'X' moment that marks the collaboration and means all three jointly murdered Logan. JMOO

Edit: if she'd tried to leave before the severe assault, they probably would have laughed at her and said 'see you when you get hungry' or some such

great points again..maybe AW was in the bedroom with the baby seeing to him..wouldn’t take long for JC & the youth to badly hurt Logan..she’s come in the hallway & saw Logan badly injured..that’s why she’s made a run for it..adrenaline kicked in she’s gone through the stair gate & got the bruises on her legs.

 

[katydid23]

ETA - The Social worker visit would have been the ideal time to speak up if she'd wanted outside help, like she desperately hoped when she was screaming outside after the stomach punches.
This would have ensured the involvement of the Police straight away and help for her and LM that she said she'd wanted.

"Williamson said: “I thought I had made enough racket for people to come and save Logan, to save all of us. Jay said he was in the SAS, he could have found us anyway….. I couldn’t leave (Logan) in the house on his own so I came back inside.”


Logan Mwangi murder trial latest as mum gives evidence

She says she 'couldn't leave Logan in the house on his own' ---and yet she has no problem taking a sleeping pill and leaving him alone all night?

 

[LucyRocket]

Quick question - It has been mentioned on here a few times that the youth was attacked by his mother and that’s why he was taken into care. Has anyone got the source for this? Reason I’m asking is that people have quoted this has happened but can’t find where it was originally referenced anywhere?

The court hears the teenager was originally taken into care after allegedly suffering a "serious assault" at the hands of his mother.

Prosecution closes cases in Logan Mwangi murder trial

 

[Stumpyaura]

I never touched my son’s dead body apart from when I saw him in hospital' Logan Mwangi murder trial latest as mum gives evidence

If, as she is stating in court, that she woke up to find Logan gone and when she went to sleep he was alive, isn't this a strange sentence to say? It sounds like she's saying a true sentence....she didn't touch him once he was dead at home, the first time was in the hospital. She had a strange response of disgust to the suggestion she'd changed his top once he was dead. I just can't imagine phrasing it like this if the first time she saw him dead was in the hospital.

 

[tedtink]

She says she 'couldn't leave Logan in the house on his own' ---and yet she has no problem taking a sleeping pill and leaving him alone all night?

Yep! And took her 'hearing aids out' and apparently left her phone on charge in the sitting room the night LM perished.
I'd have thought, for someone so scared, who had witnessed such a violent attack on their child the day before and a threat from JC to kill him, that hyper vigilance may have prevailed? Like having phone near and hearing aids in?

 

[Jay_Tec]

great points again..maybe AW was in the bedroom with the baby seeing to him..wouldn’t take long for JC & the youth to badly hurt Logan..she’s come in the hallway & saw Logan badly injured..that’s why she’s made a run for it..adrenaline kicked in she’s gone through the stair gate & got the bruises on her legs.

Oh yup, I reckon she seriously bolted in shock... I dunno what the testimony of the van man was but for that moment, she'd likely have been in terror. Didn't last long.
No doubt the Youth said some smart words to her, bundled her inside pretty quick, and she decided which side she was on.

Is that coercive control of an abusive JC or is that her weighing up the odds and deciding to take her chances with JC instead of saving Logan? Possibly in the delusional idea Logan could magically recover but all the same - to keep her man and baby and the family together. Greed I would call it. Selfish, self-centred, dishonest, greed, bundled with fear. She betrayed Logan at that moment.

 

[katydid23]

I was thinking earlier about the lights, we have Alexa and I can control the lights going on/off via the app on my phone. Wondering if she's going to go down that route as she's already mentioned her phone was on charge (and therefore accessible by JC) . Although presumably that would've shown up on the phone data search?

Completely speculating here, they may not even have such devices!

I think the prosecution already stated that there were no devices or apps that could turn these lights on or off. And there were not any devices that could open and close the curtains. And wasn't her phone being used as well?

 

[Jay_Tec]

I never touched my son’s dead body apart from when I saw him in hospital' Logan Mwangi murder trial latest as mum gives evidence

If, as she is stating in court, that she woke up to find Logan gone and when she went to sleep he was alive, isn't this a strange sentence to say? It sounds like she's saying a true sentence....she didn't touch him once he was dead at home, the first time was in the hospital. She had a strange response of disgust to the suggestion she'd changed his top once he was dead. I just can't imagine phrasing it like this if the first time she saw him dead was in the hospital.

100% this is where her lying denial defences beam out clear.

A grieving mother would say 'the last time I saw my son, he was sleeping soundly, I stroked his hair, gave him a goodnight kiss, that was the last time I touched him, he was alive and well'

Compare and contrast... "I never touched my son's dead body" = absolutely repulsive statement

 

[Cherwell]

But from everything else I have heard from the reported evidence I am slightly less inclined to believe in a level of systematic abuse and am slightly falling on the side of perhaps a heightened covid scenario where they (he, JC?) used the covid isolation to quite literally isolate Logan for a period of time which led to a build up of aggression/abuse/frustration that spilled over into a terrible series of events that led to Logan’s abuse on those few fateful days.

I suppose what I am saying is that do I think were it not for covid/paranoid isolation of Logan would this have happened. I’m not sure. But to give AW the benefit of the doubt maybe this did all come to a head v quickly. Which maybe explains why, even if she had and inkling or more so that Logan was quite unwell on this day, that because this was due to immediate circumstances she is playing down how injured she thought he might be because it really was unusual. And when I say playing it down - that because she thought it wasn’t all that serious she thought if she could “nurse” Logan through for a short period, that once covid isolation was over they could get back to normal. I am not trying to minimise or mitigate what happened.

I think it's important to remember that they didn't all have to be cooped up in that flat. They had two homes at their disposal, and JC could have taken Y and the baby to his own house while Logan had Covid. Leaving AW to look after Logan. It really says something about her if she was more worried about catching the virus than looking after her little boy properly. I'm sure most people whose small children tested positive didn't force them to isolate within the home.

 

[tedtink]

100% this is where her lying denial defences beam out clear.

A grieving mother would say 'the last time I saw my son, he was sleeping soundly, I stroked his hair, gave him a goodnight kiss, that was the last time I touched him, he was alive and well'

Compare and contrast... "I never touched my son's dead body" = absolutely repulsive statement

She was referring to the pyjama top being changed there. As I said earlier, how would she have known he was dead when the top was changed? She was asleep wasn't she?

 

[Jay_Tec]

Yep! And took her 'hearing aids out' and apparently left her phone on charge in the sitting room the night LM perished.
I'd have thought, for someone so scared, who had witnessed such a violent attack on their child the day before and a threat from JC to kill him, that hyper vigilance may have prevailed? Like having phone near and hearing aids in?

She's a walking example of the saying 'it's not the crime, it's the cover up'

 

[Overthinker77]

Oh yup, I reckon she seriously bolted in shock... I dunno what the testimony of the van man was but for that moment, she'd likely have been in terror. Didn't last long.
No doubt the Youth said some smart words to her, bundled her inside pretty quick, and she decided which side she was on.

Is that coercive control of an abusive JC or is that her weighing up the odds and deciding to take her chances with JC instead of saving Logan? Possibly in the delusional idea Logan could magically recover but all the same - to keep her man and baby and the family together. Greed I would call it. Selfish, self-centred, dishonest, greed, bundled with fear. She betrayed Logan at that moment.

Spot on..but her making a run for it leaving her badly injured son & baby..what kind of mother does that..but then again what kind of mother hangs around after Logan had already been assaulted previously by JC & the youth?i hope they all get guilty for murder & the max sentence possible..if anything AW should get longer as she kept Logan in that unsafe environment & she knew he was scarred..she slowly tortured Logan..mentally & physically..I despise AW more than JC & the youth!

 

[katydid23]

"Ms Williamson was said she did not immediately tell the police about the alleged assault on the 29 July because she was "scared and ashamed".

She added that if she believed Cole and the teenager had "done that much damage" she would have taken Logan to hospital, adding: "His injuries were horrific - you do not get that from two punches."

Logan Mwangi: Murder-accused mum too 'vulnerable' to get help

The way she first described the assault, it would have been enough to do internal damage, IMO. She said JC punched her 5 yr old so hard in the stomach that he flew across the hallway. And then he punched him a few more times. This is a very big strong man, punching a tiny 5 yr old in the gut. That could be lethal, IMO>

 

[Jay_Tec]

Poor JC and the Youth, they were going to get away with this perfect murder if it wasn't for that pesky AW being a terrible liar. / sarcasm

I wonder if they were hoping Logan wouldn't be found in the river for quite some time? After there'd been an abduction wild goose chase? Maybe they thought it'd be a few days before he was found? At which point, they could say Logan must have wandered off to the river to skim stones, and he couldn't swim of course, and he'd been rather rambunctious in the house in the last few days so if he was covered in bumps and bruises then that would be it.

 

[Jay_Tec]

The way she first described the assault, it would have been enough to do internal damage, IMO. She said JC punched her 5 yr old so hard in the stomach that he flew across the hallway. And then he punched him a few more times. This is a very big strong man, punching a tiny 5 yr old in the gut. That could be lethal, IMO>

Possibly TMI, but my own father was 6ft 4, military trained (for real) and he didn't even need to lay a finger on us kids for us to know he could kill us any moment.
My dad had a violent angry temper and trust me if the day ever came that he would have punched one of us like that, that would have been him going in for the kill.
We were still terrified of him when we were in our teens, never mind 5 years old. As he would say 'I'll knock you into next week'.

Utterly terrifying and heartbreaking for tiny tiny three stone Logan.
To know this is how he spent his last days on earth

 

[Overthinker77]

Poor JC and the Youth, they were going to get away with this perfect murder if it wasn't for that pesky AW being a terrible liar. / sarcasm

I wonder if they were hoping Logan wouldn't be found in the river for quite some time? After there'd been an abduction wild goose chase? Maybe they thought it'd be a few days before he was found? At which point, they could say Logan must have wandered off to the river to skim stones, and he couldn't swim of course, and he'd been rather rambunctious in the house in the last few days so if he was covered in bumps and bruises then that would be it.

they were probably hoping Logan would get washed away so if he wasn’t found for a while..in polite terms Logan wouldn’t be as recognizable so they were hoping to get away with it all.

 

[tedtink]

One thing that has always struck me as odd is that AW's Mum said that although they hadn't seen each other for months they spoke regularly, they also describe each other as 'best friends' yet AW woke up that morning to find LM allegedly missing, she did not call her or speak to her Mother for 5 hours.

It was the Police who informed her Mother of LM's death, later that morning around 10am.

AW called her shortly after.

 

[BabaVanga]

I’ve seen situations where mother has taken her child with her in a murder-suicide and they are always, understandably, the most hated women. But I considered doing it, in the crazy state that months of psychological abuse put you into, and with the ultimate love for my baby. I couldn’t see any way of escape for us, and wouldn’t have been able to take my own life knowing I was leaving my baby with our abuser. You couldn’t love a child more than I love mine, but I almost did that, out of love. So I know how easy it is to judge, even when the situation seems so cut and dry evil.

<3

 

[katydid23]

I think this is right. I am inclined to believe in most of her “innocence”. But I just don’t think I buy her being asleep all night.

But from everything else I have heard from the reported evidence I am slightly less inclined to believe in a level of systematic abuse and am slightly falling on the side of perhaps a heightened covid scenario where they (he, JC?) used the covid isolation to quite literally isolate Logan for a period of time which led to a build up of aggression/abuse/frustration that spilled over into a terrible series of events that led to Logan’s abuse on those few fateful days.

I suppose what I am saying is that do I think were it not for covid/paranoid isolation of Logan would this have happened. I’m not sure. But to give AW the benefit of the doubt maybe this did all come to a head v quickly. Which maybe explains why, even if she had and inkling or more so that Logan was quite unwell on this day, that because this was due to immediate circumstances she is playing down how injured she thought he might be because it really was unusual. And when I say playing it down - that because she thought it wasn’t all that serious she thought if she could “nurse” Logan through for a short period, that once covid isolation was over they could get back to normal. I am not trying to minimise or mitigate what happened.

I just think her perceived inconsistency in blaming JC - he was strict/he was a good dad etc could all be kind of genuine. And that this situation really was a kind of one off. Now, obviously with horrible hindsight this was not the case. But I don’t get the impression there was some awful inevitability in all this. I think what happened may well have been a serious of horrific events that all compounded each other (like I don’t believe there was some sort of pre-determined murderous intent in anyone involved).

But the key question for me is still how much AW suspected the seriousness or otherwise of Logan’s injuries and therefore how culpable she is in terms of murder. The plans for his body etc all seem rather hastily construed, and all this talk of hours spent concocting a story don’t really sit with me. I don’t think there was much thought etc. i think everything all of them did is quite reactive (stupidly so, clearly). But i also think that explains why stories kept changing in police custody. That none of them really thought they could have been responsible for his actual death and only the slow dawning of realisation later on made them face up to their actions. But even in doing so they are all trying to minimise their potential responsibility because even though they might all be terrible people they maybe do all, on a deep level, recognise their guilt.

I seriously do not envy the jury’s job in all this. And I do think they are all guilty of murder to some degree. But more from and absence of appreciation of their action rather than a deep seated maliciousness in actually wanting Logan dead. Maybe I’m just too kind and always try to see the good in people!

I see deep seated maliciousness in all three defendants. And I think they were all tired of and frustrated with clingy Logan and were thinking they'd have a happier little family without him there. Even AW was frustrated with him and the conflict it created with her fairytale romantic love of her life, perfect father figure and their new baby. JMO

 

[BabaVanga]

Speaking of the mother, she's overly emotional and self serving. Even on the stand she easily is ticked off and takes offense with comments like "you think I'm stupid". Very unwise behavior while testifying if you want to show that you're a mature rational adult. Always looking out for #1 and highly reactive. Not seeing a lot of rational behavior from her. This can't look good to a jury.

If I was being blamed for being part of murdering my kid I wouldn’t be able to help losing my temper towards the lawyer accusing me. I get the vibe she isn’t as guilty as I first thought :/