UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, Faces 22 Charges - 7 Murder/15 Attempted Murder of Babies #18

[Anxala]

When she was first charged and appeared at court it was mentioned by the prosecution that she should be denied bail and remanded due, in part, to what they referred to as ".....reasons to believe that the defendant is at significant risk of coming to harm..." or words to that effect. Now, it seemed to me and others on here, that that "harm" was likely to be harm to herself rather than by others.

Both, I'd say. Anyone accused of such a heinous crime would be a target of and at the (merciless and ignorant) mercy of an no-holds-barred, know-all-know-nothing SM.

 

[Dotta]

Does it mean that she is kept in solitary?
Is she in jail or in prison?

Jails are for those awaiting trials, verdicts, with less strict discipline IMO.

 

[Tortoise]

Does it mean that she is kept in solitary?
Is she in jail or in prison?

Jails are for those awaiting trials, verdicts, with less strict discipline IMO.

she was in HMP Bronzefield but I doubt she's being kept there during the trial, the distance would be too far.

 

[Dotta]

she was in HMP Bronzefield but I doubt she's being kept there during the trial, the distance would be too far.

I have to google this Bronzefield place.
Thanks!

 

[Parker Knoll]

She’s in Styal Prison Cheshire.

 

[Dotta]

She’s in Styal Prison Cheshire.

So I will google both!

 

[Dotta]

So I will google both!

Investigation after woman, 18, dies at Styal prison in Cheshire | Prisons and probation | The Guardian

Death of Annelise Sanderson is eighth in a women’s prison this year, reigniting calls for closure of jails

amp.theguardian.com

"HMP Styal: Women Behind Bars - Inside the prison that houses some of the country's worst child-killers."​

Inside HMP Styal the prison that houses some of the UK's worst child-killers

The 'mother of all prisons' will be explored in a new Channel 5 documentary

www.walesonline.co.uk

 

[Marantz4250b]

To be honest I'm a bit fed up that these notes have been published when, apart from being items seized in the search, their relevance hasn't yet been discussed in the prosecution case. That's why everyone is tying themselves in knots trying to determine what they are. Unless we hear more about them I expect that in the judge's instructions he'll say that 'you, the jury might think they point to guilt, or you might feel that they are, as the defence says, just a demonstration of the anguish the defendant was suffering as a result of the investigation process and her grievance matters' and I would expect him to warn the jury that the notes cannot on their own form the basis of their decision, and can only be secondary to the evidence they've heard from the lay and expert witnesses.

I have to say that I tend to agree with this. I fail to see what the relevance of them is to the prosecution's case as they haven't, as far as I can see, said anything about what they actually mean and why they lend weight to their assertion that she's she's guilty of what they allege.

I'm assuming they are going to bring in some context to these and how they relate to the charges at some point.

 

[marynnu]

Does it mean that she is kept in solitary?
Is she in jail or in prison?

Jails are for those awaiting trials, verdicts, with less strict discipline IMO.

Isn't that distinction American? We should say prison here but sadly we seem to have adopted the American term. Strictly speaking the English word is gaol. As far as I know people on remand just go to prison, but have more rights.

 

[Dotta]

Dbm

 

[marynnu]

In my country also there are jails for those not still sentenced.
They go to "real prisons" after trials.

OK! Not sure we do that here, but always willing to learn.

 

[Marantz4250b]

Both, I'd say. Anyone accused of such a heinous crime would be a target of and at the (merciless and ignorant) mercy of an no-holds-barred, know-all-know-nothing SM.

She's already getting uber-hate from the unwashed masses on FB and suchlike. I've never really bought into the idea that someone on remand for serious crimes is at huge risk of being physically attacked. Lots of people like that are given bail and we don't really hear of them being attacked too often.

In her case, even if there was a possibility of her getting bail, I think the danger to her was hugely more likely to come from herself - and, yes, that might have been exacerbated by people hounding her at home and suchlike.

 

[Marantz4250b]

Does it mean that she is kept in solitary?
Is she in jail or in prison?

Jails are for those awaiting trials, verdicts, with less strict discipline IMO.

The USA tends to use those terms but we don't so much. Officially it's "prison" His Majesty's Prison Service" but it gets called jail as well. Police cells are I suppose the equivalent of American jails.

 

[Marantz4250b]

She’s in Styal Prison Cheshire.

I think so. I'm sure she was there orginally when remanded then moved to Bonzefield and is now back at Styal while the trial is going on.

 

[esther43]

Well, she kinda is - under the care of His Majesty, at present!

You're right, though, guilty or innocent she certainly needs some very serious care. When she was first charged and appeared at court it was mentioned by the prosecution that she should be denied bail and remanded due, in part, to what they referred to as ".....reasons to believe that the defendant is at significant risk of coming to harm..." or words to that effect. Now, it seemed to me and others on here, that that "harm" was likely to be harm to herself rather than by others. When that first so called "confession" note was produced in the opening speeches it was pretty much obvious that self harm was indeed what they were referring to, imo.

Not to be callous

Incoherent yes, whether its all meaningless is another question. It'll be interesting to see how she responded when the police asked her what the content of the notes meant.

Surely, if the meaning of the notes were innocent, it would have gone something along the along the lines of 'tbh with you, I was trying to find out what the hell was going on, here I was suspended from work, apparently somehow all the babies were linked to me, I was talking it over with my parents, the notes are a collection of thoughts that represent an investigative process of me trying to establish why I'd been put on admin'

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Investigation after woman, 18, dies at Styal prison in Cheshire | Prisons and probation | The Guardian

Death of Annelise Sanderson is eighth in a women’s prison this year, reigniting calls for closure of jails

amp.theguardian.com

"HMP Styal: Women Behind Bars - Inside the prison that houses some of the country's worst child-killers."​

Inside HMP Styal the prison that houses some of the UK's worst child-killers

The 'mother of all prisons' will be explored in a new Channel 5 documentary

www.walesonline.co.uk

Styal has had the abs worst reputation for decades now and has been subject of documentaries and investigative journalists

 

[Sundial]

Everything about this is just so messed up and strange, fi you ask me. It's on a different scale to anything I've ever heard of before.

For focus; I absolutely agree with this. Whether guilty or not, it’s absolutely bizarre and extremely messy.

IMO

 

[JosieJo]

I have to say that I tend to agree with this. I fail to see what the relevance of them is to the prosecution's case as they haven't, as far as I can see, said anything about what they actually mean and why they lend weight to their assertion that she's she's guilty of what they allege.

I'm assuming they are going to bring in some context to these and how they relate to the charges at some point.

Because of some of the words in each of the notes I'd imagine..not necessarily the entire note would be relevant

Example I am evil ...I killed them on purpose..help ...etc

 

[Becci]

What day's are they in court this wk pls?

 

[marynnu]

What day's are they in court this wk pls?

Tuesday, Thursday & Friday I believe.