UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, Faces 22 Charges - 7 Murder/15 Attempted Murder of Babies #26

[Tortoise]

Dan O'Donoghue
@MrDanDonoghue
·
45s

Mr Johnson is now turning to Child K. The court has previously heard that Dr Jayaram felt uneasy about Ms Letby being left with the baby as the team were aware "of a number of unexpected and unusual events and we were aware of an association with Lucy Letby".

Dan O'Donoghue
@MrDanDonoghue
·
42s

[D]r Jayaram previously told the court "no cause and effect had been ascribed", but he saw Ms Letby standing by the incubator, noticed the breathing tube was dislodged and saw the nurse do "nothing" to help until he arrived.

 

[GoodDayToYouSir]

IMO it ties in to the need for power and control. Feeling secure in the knowledge that you have the skills to manipulate and can deflect blame in multiple directions when there are multiple colleagues to place in the firing line. If this is possibly a reason she took the stand, I don’t think she was banking on NJ having such an extensive knowledge of the facts of this case and being able to back up his accusations with prior evidence.

It’s kind of delusional IMO I’m glad NJ has drawn attention to it. Also how she seemed so confident when saying to a colleague ‘if they have nothing on me then they’ll look silly - not me’… IMO if guilty, that confidence may have come from believing that even if they had ‘anything on me’ then she’d be able to use her skills of manipulation to deflect blame.
Found it interesting though the use of the word if… if you knew you hadn’t don’t anything wrong then why would you say ‘if they have nothing on me’?
MOO

I interpreted the “if” as LL assuming that she was being taken off because of negligence / poor clinical skills, so was expecting them to have something which pointed to her overlooking something.

Even if guilty, I’m not convinced that she thought they were thinking foul play. And to be fair, I’m not sure whether apart from Dr J anyone else was
On the foul play train at that time.

 

[Tortoise]

3:49pm

Mr Johnson says nurse Joanne Williams said it was "strange" Child K desaturated two further times, and the second and third incidents saw Child K 'well sedated'.
The 6.15am desaturation (the second incident), happened between 6.07am and 23 seconds, and 6.15am, Mr Johnson says.
An x-ray, timestamped at 6.07am and 23 seconds, shows Child K's x-ray, with a report the ET Tube was 'in satisfactory position'.
By 6.15am, Child K was desaturating, Mr Johnson says. The tube had "gone down her throat" then had to be removed.
"How on earth had that happened in a 25-week-old [gestational age] baby who had been on morphine?"
Mr Johnson says Letby had no memory of this. He says Letby had been responsible for the admission process for Child K.
He says the cross-examination at this time was a "somewhat tortuous process". He relays the cross-examination of this, in which he concluded he got told off for saying they 'danced the dance' in arriving at the point.
He says they got there, 'in the end', in that Letby was in room 1 to obtain the medical notes for Child K to input the admission details on the computer, in a record between 6.04am-6.10am on the computer. He says those notes would have to be returned to the cotside in room 1 afterwards.

3:50pm

He says the coincidence between Letby's presence and Child K's desaturation "is not an innocent one".
He says the third event for Child K happened at handover, which Mr Johnson says was not the only occasion.

3:54pm

Mr Johnson says once Child K's ET Tube was moved to the correct position, 'she picked up immediately'.
Mr Johnson says after nearly being caught red-handed, like in Child E, she 'pressed home her advantage' and tried to create more of a problem for Child K which led her to desaturate again, by moving her ET Tube.

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Monday, June 19 - closing speeches

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

Dan O'Donoghue
@MrDanDonoghue
·
3m

In the witness box, Ms Letby said of this alleged incident "I don’t believe it did happen, but I have no direct memory of it."

 

[Tortoise]

Dan O'Donoghue

@MrDanDonoghue
·
1m

Mr Johnson has just taken the jury back over one of his exchanges with the nurse in cross examination, in which he established Ms Letby was in nursery one to obtain the medical notes for Child K. This is logged between 6.04am-6.10am on the computer

Dan O'Donoghue

@MrDanDonoghue
·
57s

Mr Johnson says the coincidence between Ms Letby's presence and Child K's desaturation is not an 'innocent one'. He says she was caught 'red handed' by Dr Jayaram trying to attack Child K

 

[Tortoise]

3:56pm

Mr Johnson refers to police interviews with Letby, in which she said Child K's tube had slipped earlier in the shift.
Mr Johnson says Letby had, in interview, 'created the impression' of 'innocent tube movement' for Child K.

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Monday, June 19 - closing speeches

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

 

[lululolly]

What's the point he's making about the timings of Baby L and M? About the blood samples and M crashing? That she timed it deliberately to avoid blood samples being sent off?

 

[Tortoise]

4:02pm

Mr Johnson says Joanne Williams had left at 3.47am to see Child K's mother, and had left Lucy Letby 'babysitting' room 1, Letby having fed a designated baby.
It had been suggested to Dr Jayaram he was 'inventing' an allegation for Lucy Letby, to cover for shortcomings in Child K.
"What did Dr Jayaram invent? What was it that was so offensive to their case?"
Mr Johnson says Dr Jayaram said Joanne Williams had left and Letby was 'babysitting'. Dr Jayaram was 'suspicious' - "Letby can't say what was on his mind."
Dr Jayaram walked into room 1 and saw Letby by the incubator. NJ: "What was Letby's case here?"
Mr Johnson says he can't help the jury as Letby was saying one thing and then said another.
He says if the jury is confused, then they have to ask why - he says the reason is because Letby won't commit herself. He asks if that is the case, then why?
Dr Jayaram said Child K's observations dropped - there was no dispute about that. The alarm was not on, and that was not disputed.
He said the cause was a displaced tube - that was not disputed.
"Is Dr Jayaram a wicked liar to make up allegations about one of his colleagues?...or is he telling the truth?"
Mr Johnson adds: "What lie did Dr Jayaram tell? We suggest it's all smoke and mirrors, that all these doctors are bad, that they tell lies, that they stitch her up."

4:05pm

Mr Johnson says evidence was heard to say a nurse would not leave a baby unattended without checking the tube was secure. Joanne Williams had checked the equipment and made sure the tube was secure, Mr Johnson said.
A 'big play' was made of the 'high air leak' on the ventilator. It had been accepted the ventilator was sub-optimal, but said the oxygen saturations were 'optimal'. Mr Johnson says the leak was not having any impact on Child K.

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Monday, June 19 - closing speeches

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

Dan O'Donoghue
@MrDanDonoghue
·
2m

Mr Johnson says Ms Letby has been vague in her recollection of this incident as her tactic is 'all smoke and mirrors' to 'give the impression these doctors are bad, they tell lies, they’re stitching her up'

 

[Tortoise]

Dan O'Donoghue

@MrDanDonoghue
·
30s

That concludes proceedings for today, back tomorrow

 

[Tortoise]

4:11pm

A note was made of 'large blood-stained oral secretions' by Joanne Williams, but she could not confirm she had been present to see that.
A doctor had said if he had seen blood stains during reintubation of Child K, he would have noted it and made Dr Jayaram aware of it.
Mr Johnson says that note of 'large blood-stained oral secretions' had 'only come from Lucy Letby', and was "entirely typical behaviour by Lucy Letby".
He says in Child K's remaining days before she passed away, the ET Tube did not dislodge again.
Mr Johnson counts the number of seconds, each one, up to 30, for a 25-week-gestational age baby desaturating, which he says was the sight Letby saw from Child K's cotside.
NJ: "It's uncomfortable isn't it? Even talking about it is uncomfortable.
"That is why it's attempted murder."

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Monday, June 19 - closing speeches

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

 

[Jazmania]

Strong stuff. The fact that twice as much insulin was used for L as was used for F is really strong evidence of intent to kill in my opinion.Like she realised she hadn't used enough before so increased it. Why do this if the intention was not to kill? I didn't know this before, and thought Letby might just be using insulin as a distraction while she attacked the twin sibling (if guilty). Just so awful. How anybody could do this... I fully believe the parents will soon get justice.

 

[MachinaCollecta]

4:11pm

A note was made of 'large blood-stained oral secretions' by Joanne Williams, but she could not confirm she had been present to see that.
A doctor had said if he had seen blood stains during reintubation of Child K, he would have noted it and made Dr Jayaram aware of it.
Mr Johnson says that note of 'large blood-stained oral secretions' had 'only come from Lucy Letby', and was "entirely typical behaviour by Lucy Letby".
He says in Child K's remaining days before she passed away, the ET Tube did not dislodge again.
Mr Johnson counts the number of seconds, each one, up to 30, for a 25-week-gestational age baby desaturating, which he says was the sight Letby saw from Child K's cotside.
NJ: "It's uncomfortable isn't it? Even talking about it is uncomfortable.
"That is why it's attempted murder."

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Monday, June 19 - closing speeches

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

Gosh, the part counting the seconds is such a painful read. To think of that fragility in front of you and how time ticks away like that, guilty or not, it’s devastating.

 

[MachinaCollecta]

IF LL was found guilty, would that not make her one of our (the UK’s) most significant serial killers in overall modern history? Again based entirely on a guilty verdict of course.

 

[Tortoise]

5:02pm

A round-up story from today: Lucy Letby ‘gaslighted’ hospital staff over baby collapses

5:02pm

The Standard will be back in court for further live coverage of the prosecution's closing speech tomorrow (Tuesday).

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Monday, June 19 - closing speeches

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

 

[Tortoise]

The latest podcast

Episode 41, The end of the evidence - The Mail

www.mailplus.co.uk

Episode 41, The end of the evidence​

In this episode Caroline and Liz outline the conclusion of the defence case and the end of the evidence.

They also explain the judge’s directions to the jury and how they should decide whether Lucy Letby is guilty or innocent of the charges she faces.

 

[Dotta]

What a Closing Speech!

I'm so emotional.
The tears are coming freely now

My heart is with the Families.
And the precious Babies.

I was also a tiny NICU girl fighting for my life.

Although I live in a foreign land I feel close to you.

"So close, no matter how far"!

 

[Blondiexoxo]

Dan O'Donoghue
@MrDanDonoghue
·
29s

Mr Johnson references the nursing notes found in Ms Letby's home. Some of which releated to this child. He says Ms Letby has said 'it came home with me'...he dismisses this 'Like a dog following behind, these are inanimate objects'

Has our NJ been reading here? There’s been a few little quotes today that have given me deja vu, this being one of them

 

[ColourPurple]

"We suggest that Lucy Letby was an opportunist - she used their vulnerabilities as camouflage."

Spot on.
If guilty.
Of course.
JMO

 

[ColourPurple]

Big thank you for all the updates today @Tortoise @katydid23

 

[Blondiexoxo]

I interpreted the “if” as LL assuming that she was being taken off because of negligence / poor clinical skills, so was expecting them to have something which pointed to her overlooking something.

Even if guilty, I’m not convinced that she thought they were thinking foul play. And to be fair, I’m not sure whether apart from Dr J anyone else was
On the foul play train at that time.

I agree that IMO LL thought the accusations would be negligence, but still, for someone so self assured that she refused to agree to even the smallest mistake to be so worried and having a ‘meltdown ++’ and saying things like ‘if they have nothing on me they’ll look silly’.. makes me wonder if guilty, did she know she had altered notes, covered tracks in such a way that she thought there wouldn’t be anything pointing to foul play and ‘if’ there was it would be something trivial and not incriminating. I don’t think she realised the accusation was deliberate harm and just how far the investigation would go…

Maybe initially when she had her ‘meltdown’ the thought crossed her mind but then, if guilty, when doc choc reassured her with words of comfort and praise for being such an amazing nurse, I wonder if upon realising that doc choc was ‘on her side’ willing to give a statement, saying how he’d trust his kids with her etc… did that make her think the only accusation was negligence. This is touched on in another layer where she writes ‘I killed them on purpose because I’m not good enough’, almost asif she either believed or wanted to believe that the only worry she had was not being a ‘good enough’ nurse. Note was titled ‘not good enough’…

Plus how she kept the collection of handover sheets and how shocked and traumatised she was by the arrest makes me believe she wasn’t expecting it, atleast not expecting a early morning arrest with search warrant IMO.. if guilty it may have been a sort of coping mechanism to convince herself that negligence was the only concern, maybe believing that was the only reason for her removal from the unit is what made her able to continue to go to work every day up until her arrest. She seems IMO quite melodramatic and had she not convinced herself that they ‘had nothing on her’ then she would have had a complete breakdown and drew even more suspicion. Keeping calm and carrying on could have been how she coped and how she thought an innocent person would act. Only if guilty IMO.

Her behaviour is very conflicting at times, going from meltdown mode to calming brushing it off as ‘they’ll look silly’.
MOO

 

[Blondiexoxo]

NJ is knocking it out the park with this closing! Incredible IMO. Favourite quote from today is ‘how will the defence get her out of this creek’ which is the question on my lips right now!
I think he will connect all the dots for the jury with this. He knows this case well, and you can tell how much work he’s put into it and how passionate he is about getting justice for these babies. Even though we only read the reporting, his words reflect his determination and his emotion IMO. I only hope the reporters don’t decide to give the defense closing a miss and we get to hear what BM has to say….