UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, murder of babies, 7 Guilty of murder verdicts; 7 Guilty of attempted murder; 2 Not Guilty of attempted; 6 hung re attempted #34

[Anxala]

In my experience of workplaces, people do not look kindly on that kind of extra-marital affair, so I'm surprised they carried it on so blatantly - him leaving chocs for her, her messaging friends/colleagues about it. I wonder if he was separated from his wife at the time. There seemed to be no big attempt to cover up their 'flirtation.'

Wasn't there only one message to a colleague re him? The 'commando' one? That's the only one I recall that mentions him, and it was clearly a teasing one and one before anything ever actually (if it did) happened between them. Which kind of suggests the contrary, that it wasn't actually blatant at all.

All the other doc related stuff that emerged from the trial is just private txts between LL and him. Unless I'm missing something, there's no evidence at all to suggest that they were even a known quantity on the unit, let alone blatantly so.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Wasn't there only one message to a colleague re him? The 'commando' one? That's the only one I recall that mentions him, and it was clearly a teasing one and one before anything ever actually (if it did) happened between them. Which kind of suggests the contrary, that it wasn't actually blatant at all.

All the other doc related stuff that emerged from the trial is just private txts between LL and him. Unless I'm missing something, there's no evidence at all to suggest that they were even a known quantity on the unit, let alone blatantly so.

Seems like the messages about going commando were to a colleague

but if I worked somewhere and someone told me that a senior member of staff had texted that to them, I'd be flagging it up as totally inappropriate and sexually violating behaviour. Then again I am a good couple of decades older at least and take these things seriously.

 

[notsure]

Wasn't there only one message to a colleague re him? The 'commando' one? That's the only one I recall that mentions him, and it was clearly a teasing one and one before anything ever actually (if it did) happened between them. Which kind of suggests the contrary, that it wasn't actually blatant at all.

All the other doc related stuff that emerged from the trial is just private txts between LL and him. Unless I'm missing something, there's no evidence at all to suggest that they were even a known quantity on the unit, let alone blatantly so.

I thought there were texts in which she said "He seems to be acting strange" or something like that. And one where she denied flirting with him.

 

[katydid23]

Wasn't there only one message to a colleague re him? The 'commando' one? That's the only one I recall that mentions him, and it was clearly a teasing one and one before anything ever actually (if it did) happened between them. Which kind of suggests the contrary, that it wasn't actually blatant at all.

All the other doc related stuff that emerged from the trial is just private txts between LL and him. Unless I'm missing something, there's no evidence at all to suggest that they were even a known quantity on the unit, let alone blatantly so.

A couple of times he offered her the use of his car, saying he'd pick it up later at her home. That seems like it would get out to coworkers if she was seen driving his car away from the unit. So he wasn't being super careful, imo.

 

[Marantz4250b]

A couple of times he offered her the use of his car, saying he'd pick it up later at her home. That seems like it would get out to coworkers if she was seen driving his car away from the unit. So he wasn't being super careful, imo.

I commented on this way back. My thoughts were that perhaps he was separated from the wife because, as you say, this would be a very obvious way to get caught out.

To be honest, I don't think I gave much thought to the professional side of things but that issue makes it even more surprising and blatant!

 

[squish]

LL created absolute mayhem for these doctors. Nothing yet proven as regards baby J, but as @squish who attended court pointed out, on the night of baby J's two collapses, twins were being admitted as an emergency to nursery one, and staff already had their hands full.

Looking back over Dr Ventress's testimony, she was attending an emergency Caesarean right in the middle of LL's repeated attempts to murder baby G.

"At the time of the 'urgent review' at 2.35am on September 7, she said she would have been at the children's ward.
She said, from her statement to police, she would have gone "straight away" to review Child G.

4:17pm

Mr Myers asks that upon attending the unit, and informing the plan of action for Child G, was Dr Ventress then called away before she could carry out anything herself?
Dr Ventress agrees.
Mr Myers says it was for delivery of another pre-term baby.

4:20pm

Dr Ventress's clinical note says Dr Ventress was called out of theatre to say [Child G] had gone apnoeic and dusky."

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Thursday, December 1


One could say that she was not only mindlessly trying to kill the babies but also sabotaging the care of other babies and giving the doctors nightmare shifts.

I agree with this. The prosecution’s suggestion that with existing chaos, Lucy took the opportunity to attack when all eyes were elsewhere.

But I think she was actively creating and exacerbating chaos, in order to sabotage other babies and sabotage the work of her colleagues. Also to enjoy the drama, and to create a frenetic environment where she could more easily operate unnoticed.

But primarily, I think her motivation was feeling superior and clever for “outsmarting” her colleagues and the parents of babies: she was the source of all the chaos, collapses and deaths, and nobody knew it, even though she was right under their noses. In between kills, I think she got her buzzes from causing chaos, and committing lesser assaults.

Other acts of chaos: the medication cheat sheet conveniently going missing, and Lucy phoning up the parents of babies A and B when Baby D was dying, instead of phoning the consultant.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

I agree with this. The prosecution’s suggestion that with existing chaos, Lucy took the opportunity to attack when all eyes were elsewhere.

But I think she was actively creating and exacerbating chaos, in order to sabotage other babies and sabotage the work of her colleagues. Also to enjoy the drama, and to create a frenetic environment where she could more easily operate unnoticed.

But primarily, I think her motivation was feeling superior and clever for “outsmarting” her colleagues and the parents of babies: she was the source of all the chaos, collapses and deaths, and nobody knew it, even though she was right under their noses. In between kills, I think she got her buzzes from causing chaos, and committing lesser assaults.

Other acts of chaos: the medication cheat sheet conveniently going missing, and Lucy phoning up the parents of babies A and B when Baby D was dying, instead of phoning the consultant.

In my sadly vast experience of observing manipulative people, they rely on creating a huge amount of chaos and discord so that no-one can quite get a grip on what's going on because it's all operating in a dizzying reactive state.

One wonders why people don't group together and say, 'hey have you noticed that X seems to be doing...' and the straightforward answer is because nobody has enough time to get their wits together between incident after incident.

Also they play people who would otherwise communicate off against each other and create doubt, ill-will, hesitancy between people who otherwise may have communicated more smoothly and cohesively.

They feel powerful and in control as they can observe the madness they've created and they can see they're getting away with lies and deception. Even worse in the case of LL she was murdering the most vulnerable beings in existence

 

[Dotta]

"Chester football fans were heard chanting a sick Lucy Letby taunt to rival Hereford supporters at a non-league match.

The club, as well as fellow fans on social media and forums, condemned the

'Lucy Letby, she's one of your own'

chants aired at Tuesday night's National League North fixture at the Deva Stadium.

Chester FC condemned the 'appalling' chanting, which 'demonstrated a deeply concerning lack of compassion, understanding and decency' and are reviewing CCTV footage to identify the culprits."

Chester football fans heard chanting sick Lucy Letby taunt

Letby, who was born in Hereford, was convicted last month of murdering seven babies and attempting to kill six other infants at the Countess of Chester Hospital.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Parker Knoll]

Nottingham maternity deaths: Police announce criminal inquiry Nottingham maternity deaths: Police announce criminal inquiry

Police involved.

 

[Becky53]

Another whistleblowing article not related to Letby - truly disgusting imo. Newspapers have published some of the text messages between those involved.

Patients on a hospital stroke unit were drugged with sleeping pills to "keep them quiet", a jury has heard.

Catherine Hudson, 54, and Charlotte Wilmot, 48, are on trial over the alleged ill-treatment of patients while working as nurses at Blackpool Victoria Hospital between 2017 and 2018.
One of the sedatives allegedly used was Zopiclone, which is potentially life-threatening if given inappropriately.

A whistleblowing student nurse brought events she allegedly witnessed while on work placement at the unit to the attention of the authorities in November 2018, the court heard.

Blackpool hospital nurses drugged stroke unit patients, jury told

The nurses are accused of drugging patients to "make their life easier and their work less onerous".

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Anxala]

I thought there were texts in which she said "He seems to be acting strange" or something like that. And one where she denied flirting with him.

Yes, all part of the same convo with one colleague -

In text messages read to the jury, Letby told a friend she had received a “strange” message from the male colleague, who cannot be named. The friend replied: “Did u? Saying what?” then suggested the doctor had suggested Letby “go commando” along with a crying laughing emoji.

Asked about her relationship with the doctor, who was one of those caring for Child N, Letby denied she “had a crush” on him. In texts read by the prosecutor, the nurse’s friend said “think he likes u too” and that he was “as flirty as u”. Letby replied: “Shut up … I don’t flirt with him!”

She added: “Certainly don’t fancy him haha just nice guy.”

Lucy Letby texted about doctor ‘crush’ hours before attempt on baby boy’s life, court told

Nurse accused of murdering seven babies and attempted murder of 10 more at Chester hospital in 2015-16

www.theguardian.com

 

[notsure]

Yes, all part of the same convo with one colleague -

Lucy Letby texted about doctor ‘crush’ hours before attempt on baby boy’s life, court told

Nurse accused of murdering seven babies and attempted murder of 10 more at Chester hospital in 2015-16

www.theguardian.com

Yes, that tells us at least one colleague had noticed the pair openly flirting.

 

[gc105]

https://x.com/mrdandonoghue/status/1699791287472566474?s=46&t=jKNNPnRnm61gSOdRLmxvPw

“Lucy Letby: On 25 September there will be hearing at Manchester Crown Court where the CPS will announce whether they intend to go for a retrial on the counts on which the jury failed to reach a verdict in the former nurse's 10 month trial”

 

[Parker Knoll]

https://x.com/mrdandonoghue/status/1699791287472566474?s=61

 

[squish]

https://x.com/mrdandonoghue/status/1699791287472566474?s=46&t=jKNNPnRnm61gSOdRLmxvPw

“Lucy Letby: On 25 September there will be hearing at Manchester Crown Court where the CPS will announce whether they intend to go for a retrial on the counts on which the jury failed to reach a verdict in the former nurse's 10 month trial”

I hope they do, the victims and their families deserve it.

I hope they don’t go down the “no chance of a fair trial” route: surely the jury would appreciate that they owe the family the truth, and a false conviction would actually harm them by making them wrongly think their baby was attacked/killed.

 

[notsure]

Sorry, can't open the links right now. Would they appoint a new jury if they do a retrial?

 

[Dotta]

Sorry, can't open the links right now. Would they app hioint a new jury if they do a retrial?

Of course!!!!!!
This poor Jury is free at last.
And will never do this duty again as the Judge said.

 

[Seattle1]

[Body Bags] When Innocence is Betrayed: A Neonatal Ward Nightmare

Thirteen vulnerable babies in the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal ward fell victim to a series of horrifying crimes that shocked the medical community. Subjected to methods as cruel as air injections and insulin poisoning, their lives were put at grave risk. Joseph Scott Morgan and Dave...

www.crimeonline.com

 

[squish]

I think there were defo buzzing moments, after the deaths, she seemed to be ready to 'dust away the day' with salsa dancing etc, plus all the baby box malarkey where she sounded absolutely wired.
But I think she used to take a dip after that and this is where Dr choc would come in to it all.
When I look at the convos between them, it does feel as though LL led them, that she 'coached' him somewhat into the the "reassurance role"
You can see in the texts that if he says the 'right things' she absolutely purs, but if he says the 'wrong thing' she can be quite abrupt. She knew how she wanted him to behave and she knew he would oblige, like a faithful puppy dog!

This was my impression too. She knew he fancied her and played him like a fiddle. I do not believe for one moment Dr Choc’s claims that she had an “unrequited affection” for him.

I do believe that Dr Choc set out to woo her, but he was thinking with his “little brain” and so LL was able to manipulate him rather than the other way round.

I don’t think she fancied him back, but I think as the investigation rumbled on, she leant on him more and more for care and support (and inside information) and may have eventually developed feelings for him.

 

[Marantz4250b]

"Chester football fans were heard chanting a sick Lucy Letby taunt to rival Hereford supporters at a non-league match.

The club, as well as fellow fans on social media and forums, condemned the

'Lucy Letby, she's one of your own'

chants aired at Tuesday night's National League North fixture at the Deva Stadium.

Chester FC condemned the 'appalling' chanting, which 'demonstrated a deeply concerning lack of compassion, understanding and decency' and are reviewing CCTV footage to identify the culprits."

Chester football fans heard chanting sick Lucy Letby taunt

Letby, who was born in Hereford, was convicted last month of murdering seven babies and attempting to kill six other infants at the Countess of Chester Hospital.

www.dailymail.co.uk

And once again I am reminded as to why I absolutely despise professional football! It's mostly a depressing embarrassment, quite honestly.