GUILTY UK - Tia Sharp, 12, New Addington, London, 3 Aug 2012 #3

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Quite possibly, but I'm trying to work out what grounds for suspicion the Police had if G'ma was working until 2pm.....

Maybe that's the only way they could get G'ma out of the house and away from SH and ask her all the things they needed to ask her without arousing his suspicions? They may also still be using this situation whilst questioning SH to get more info out of him.

Or it's standard process when your grand-daughter's dead body is found rotting in your loft?
 
Maybe that's the only way they could get G'ma out of the house and away from SH and ask her all the things they needed to ask her without arousing his suspicions? They may also still be using this situation whilst questioning SH to get more info out of him.

CS left the house before the search with the Liaison officer, but not under arrest so she was already away from SH. She was arrested after SH, later on Friday evening I believe. I guess it's possible that she was arrested after a blabbing drunken SH tried to frame her upon his arrest - and they therefore had no choice?

How about this then. SH & CS are completely innocent of murder. Tia left, was lured into a neighbours house, eventually murdered and wrapped. When they were all out hunting this neighbour (who had a spare key) put the body in the loft and left?

;-)
 
CS left the house before the search with the Liaison officer, but not under arrest so she was already away from SH. She was arrested after SH, later on Friday evening I believe. I guess it's possible that she was arrested after a blabbing drunken SH tried to frame her upon his arrest - and they therefore had no choice?

How about this then. SH & CS are completely innocent of murder. Tia left, was lured into a neighbours house, eventually murdered and wrapped. When they were all out hunting this neighbour (who had a spare key) put the body in the loft and left?

;-)

Like it! Don't think it's true but it's definitely got something!
 
G'morning all!

Just caught up on all the posts since last night and having gone to bed with a million thoughts about this going around in my head, have woken up with just one main thought, which is that I think we are possibly being too clever. I think that the most obvious answers are most likely the right answers as the people involved appear not to be the smartest of people and are possibly used to behaving dishonestly as a matter of course.

Fr'instance: an incident occurs in which Tia Sharp dies (not sure that I think it was premeditated), so perhaps she was introduced to drugs by SH and had a very bad reaction. If he was also using at the same time, maybe his thought processes would be addled (if they weren't already) and he did the first thing that came to mind, not necessarily the cleverest: he wrapped her up and put her in the loft. Who knows - perhaps the neighbour was also part of this 'party?' and saw what happened and helped put Tia up in the loft?

G'ma comes home and SH tells her Tia is out shopping - the first thing that comes to mind that removes her from the estate and allows for the possibility that she will later go 'missing.'

Supper time comes and goes - no sign of Tia.

Not sure I was convinced from the interview that a fair was ever visited, but if it was, G'ma may have gone along in good faith looking out for Tia.

No sign of Tia, so they go home to check once more before heading to NS and then have put themselves in a situation where they have to call (and most likely want to - apart from SH) the authorities as by now it's after 9pm (or at least that's what I gathered from the interview).

Body still in loft.

At what point now that the house is constantly inhabited by G'ma and other members of the family plus police/ press can SH do anything about removing the body?

I think he was surviving on hope rather than any thought out process and was just fortunate in the first few days that nothing was discovered. Also, if he was drugged at the time of the 'incident,' it may somehow have become a dream-like memory for him, where he was dissociated from the part he played, which also lessened the guilt, so that he was able to some extent, play the role he had carved out for himself. (Never taken a drug so have no idea what they do...all guess work).

If a visit was not made to the fair, then we have NO proof that G'ma colluded. I think at this point she may have begun to realise more about the situation and spoke with someone about her concerns. Maybe she and DS together said something. Plus, as people have mentioned, there must have been a stench in the air, hence the final search which was brought forward.

I don't think it was any more complicated than that.

Now I am exhausted and need to put the kettle on.

I think this is probably pretty much what must have happened.

The puzzling thing is the fair. The only thing that makes sense to me is that, for whatever reason, they did visit the fair together on the Friday evening.

Maybe it was CS who suggested that TS might have gone there, who knows? In this case, one presumes that the police were aware of the fairground visit at the start of their investigation, but it was never mentioned publically that TS might have gone there.

Now that may be because examination of CCTV showed TS never got as far the bus stop to go into Croydon, let alone to the fair on the way back from Croydon. But collecting and analysing CCTV takes time, so why wasn't it mentioned as a possible place she might have gone?

As I said in an earlier post, if SH/CS did go to the fair, the police may have interviewed the staff early on. Having been told by the staff that SH/CS didn't ask about TS they might, at that point, have had suspicions as to who their prime suspect(s) was/were. Perhaps they didn't get around to interviewing the fairground staff until after the 2 hour Sunday morning search where they missed finding the body. Was it questioning of the fairground staff that led to SH/CS being taken in for re-questioning on the Wedneday perhaps.

Because I am stuggling to comprehend why, if they didn't visit the fair on Friday evening, SH would say they did. He had to know that CS would know it was a lie! The key thing we don't know in all of this of course is when a) the police and b) CS first knew about the fairground "story"
 
Because I am stuggling to comprehend why, if they didn't visit the fair on Friday evening, SH would say they did. He had to know that CS would know it was a lie! The key thing we don't know in all of this of course is when a) the police and b) CS first knew about the fairground "story"

Morning Clio,

As I said earlier, I think this comment was his undoing and was the moment when the case turned around. He screwed up in mentioning the fair and did so whilst he was on a high (possibly in more ways than one) from being the centre of attention and on TV - that added to the adrenalin already in his system from living the biggest lie of his life was the moment he pretty much hung himself. I just don't 'feel' that they went anywhere near a fair. It was one lie too far and exactly the reason the police put him in front of the cameras - so that they could watch him give himself away.
 
Just got back from a break and I am confused. Why is Ashburton park being mentioned when the fair there was on June 2 and also called off because of rain? Why on earth would SH mention it as it would be a dead give away that he did NOT go to any fair and it is in LOWER Addiscombe. The 130 goes along the UPPER Addiscombe bus route and is a fair way away. Also that particular fair associated itself with the Jubilee, and was called off because of the torrential rain. Which fair denied seeing SH and CS? I can't find a fair on any date that fits.

This deserves more investigation.....Are we absolutely sure there wasn't another fair after June 2nd, also held at Ashburton Park, around this time.

There was a different funfair:
26 Jul - Ashburton Park, Lower Addiscombe Road, Croydon London - Honorary Lion ... Croydon Lions Annual Summer Funfair ...
 
This deserves more investigation.....Are we absolutely sure there wasn't another fair after June 2nd, also held at Ashburton Park, around this time.

Looks like there was one on July 26th. The details have been archived on the page I found.

Also, just checked for fairs in Orpington, just in case, and nothing.
 
Just got back from a break and I am confused. Why is Ashburton park being mentioned when the fair there was on June 2 and also called off because of rain? Why on earth would SH mention it as it would be a dead give away that he did NOT go to any fair and it is in LOWER Addiscombe. The 130 goes along the UPPER Addiscombe bus route and is a fair way away. Also that particular fair associated itself with the Jubilee, and was called off because of the torrential rain. Which fair denied seeing SH and CS? I can't find a fair on any date that fits.

This is interesting. BIB is what's puzzling me. At the very least CS would know it was a lie. In the video interview SH did on Thursday 9th Aug, he clearly states the he and CS went to search for TS at a fair. He said "Orpington wasn't it" and DS, sitting next to him, corrects him and says "er no Ashburton". Following the interview, a reporter went and interviewed the fairground owners who said SH/CS didn't visit and ask about TS.

I did think of something. The type of place CS worked in - sometimes in those sort of jobs you cannot leave till the next person arrives and can end up doing a double shift as they do not. You can be very late if you are the only person on that night (a relative used to work in similar and end up in this situation often.) However, there woud be work records to prove the hours CS worked and it would be unlikely she could leave that sort of job to nip home. Surely the police will have checked that?

That is a possibility. I'm pretty sure that the police will have verified CS's movements one way or another.

Also I am fairly sure you can date the date of a death from the degree of decomposition/ tell what the last meal was from stomach contents etc.

Yes I think so, although the conditions in which the body was found might complicate that somewhat.
 
This is interesting. BIB is what's puzzling me. At the very least CS would know it was a lie. In the video interview SH did on Thursday 9th Aug, he clearly states the he and CS went to search for TS at a fair. He said "Orpington wasn't it" and DS, sitting next to him, corrects him and says "er no Ashburton". Following the interview, a reporter went and interviewed the fairground owners who said SH/CS didn't visit and ask about TS.

I agree, it is very confusing. What if....DS's response about Ashburton wasn't one of collusion but instead he was purely naming the closest fairground that he thought SH must be referring to?

I think it's as much of a lie as Tia going to Croydon, him giving her money etc. SH is a liar and we should possibly assume that everything he said was a lie, maybe some things were lies based on facts but nevertheless, lies.
 
Maybe that's the only way they could get G'ma out of the house and away from SH and ask her all the things they needed to ask her without arousing his suspicions?

Don't think this is it. CS was interviewed by the press early on Friday 10th and said that she didn't know where SH and NS were so SH had already gone "walkabout". CS then left the house mid morning on the same day accompanied by police in order that the "pre-arranged" search could take place. She was arrested later that day sometime after the body was found at around 17:00 along with the neighbour but we do not know exact times as it was only reported the next day.

They may also still be using this situation whilst questioning SH to get more info out of him.

Don't understand this. They are allowed to question him until such point as he is charged. After that I don't think they can unless he confesses or something.

Or it's standard process when your grand-daughter's dead body is found rotting in your loft?

Very probably.
 
I agree, it is very confusing. What if....DS's response about Ashburton wasn't one of collusion but instead he was purely naming the closest fairground that he thought SH must be referring to?

That's interesting, hadn't thought of that. Might have to go and rewatch the video although I think I've had enough of looking at that.

I think it's as much of a lie as Tia going to Croydon, him giving her money etc. SH is a liar and we should possibly assume that everything he said was a lie, maybe some things were lies based on facts but nevertheless, lies.

Yes you're probably right. However, I have been trying to think about how complicit CS may or may not have been. I know she has been released on bail and that means that she will either be released from bail in due course or she may be charged with something at some point, even if it is a lesser charge than murder.
 
While Mr Hazell was with police, Tia’s uncle David Sharp posted a message of support for him on the Facebook page Help Find Tia.
Mr Sharp wrote: ‘Stuart has done nothing wrong the police are doing their job he has got to make a formal statement that’s all so stop pointing your fingers we are not the sick family you are trying to make out so if you are not willing to help find Tia LEAVE THIS SITE.’


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...tectives-potential-witness.html#ixzz23srTvWD0


David Sharp appears to have no suspicions about SH ,surely if the family were completely unaware of what happened they would by day 6 be having some doubts about SH particularly as they know his previous form.
 
Where was DS on Thursday?
How friendly were he and SH?
Was this more than casual acquaintance or were they involved in some sort of dealings together?
How did Tia get up into the loft?
Who were the family members alluded to in respect of Class A drugs that were not SH?

every little piece of info seems to make me have more questions
 
Looks like there was one on July 26th. The details have been archived on the page I found.

Also, just checked for fairs in Orpington, just in case, and nothing.

The thing is that it would not be Mitcham fair if there was one because Tia would have gone there from her mum's house. EVERYONE knows of the main Ashburton fair as it is usually accompanied by a parade and has been going for years ( I am 56 and it was in existence before I was born and i used to go to it as a child.)

The Lions funfair was on 26th July. It would have been a day affair and there are not that many ways into the park though the likelihood is that they would not be charging an entrance fee and you would just walk in and pay at the various stalls.

Orpington is nowhere near Addiscombe relatively speaking. Tia was reported missing on ?3rd August. I just cannot find a logical funfair for SH and CS to search: so given the fairground workers denied seeing them, where on earth was it and why forget an important detail like where it was?

Why correct it to a funfair that was over? Oh dear...

"er no Ashburton". DS said that?
 
Niles said: "The last time I saw her was on Thursday morning before going to work [at the family home in Mitcham]. She had a friend stay over. She was good as gold.

Considering Tia slept on the sofa in the sitting room ,with her possessions in carrier bags it seems strange that she would have a friend staying the night.

Did something else happen in Tia's home that morning ?
There has never been any comment from Tia's mother about the last time she saw Tia which I find slightly strange.
 
While Mr Hazell was with police, Tia’s uncle David Sharp posted a message of support for him on the Facebook page Help Find Tia.
Mr Sharp wrote: ‘Stuart has done nothing wrong the police are doing their job he has got to make a formal statement that’s all so stop pointing your fingers we are not the sick family you are trying to make out so if you are not willing to help find Tia LEAVE THIS SITE.’

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...tectives-potential-witness.html#ixzz23srTvWD0

David Sharp appears to have no suspicions about SH ,surely if the family were completely unaware of what happened they would by day 6 be having some doubts about SH particularly as they know his previous form.

Hmm....my theory about this (type of behaviour) is that in acknowledging SH's guilt, one has to then accept responsibility for your own lack of judgement and deal with the shock that someone you trusted could do such a thing. It doesn't make SH innocent.

I posted a while back on this thread that I was sexually abused for 15 years - it was by my mother's husband. She is still with him many years later. Although she has enough proof to know that he is guilty she refuses to 'believe' it because she would then have to deal with the emotional fallout that would inevitably follow. I think this situation could be much the same.

IMO DS posting that doesn't = that he has no suspicions. To me it = that he doesn't like anyone else having them.
 
Where was DS on Thursday?
How friendly were he and SH?
Was this more than casual acquaintance or were they involved in some sort of dealings together?
How did Tia get up into the loft?
Who were the family members alluded to in respect of Class A drugs that were not SH?

every little piece of info seems to make me have more questions

I think the family members could include Tia's mother and stepfather as it was reported it occured in Merton .

SH and DS both lived in Grannys house for some time so I would think they knew each other pretty well.
 
The thing is that it would not be Mitcham fair if there was one because Tia would have gone there from her mum's house. EVERYONE knows of the main Ashburton fair as it is usually accompanied by a parade and has been going for years ( I am 56 and it was in existence before I was born and i used to go to it as a child.)

The Lions funfair was on 26th July. It would have been a day affair and there are not that many ways into the park though the likelihood is that they would not be charging an entrance fee and you would just walk in and pay at the various stalls.

Orpington is nowhere near Addiscombe relatively speaking. Tia was reported missing on ?3rd August. I just cannot find a logical funfair for SH and CS to search: so given the fairground workers denied seeing them, where on earth was it and why forget an important detail like where it was?

Why correct it to a funfair that was over? Oh dear...

"er no Ashburton". DS said that?

Are we sure the funfair wasn't there or a week or two?
 
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