VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #16 *ARREST*

[LI-Mom]

I have mixed emotions about this guy.

He reminds me of the mentally challenged cashiers at the Walmart I go to. Smart enough to take care of himself, but not smart enough to be a serial criminal.

People on this forum were saying he hasn't done well for a 32 year old. Others accused those people of being snobs. I think it's possible that his job was an achievement for him. I've watched the videos. He doesn't strike me as a good b.s. artist, a , a Casanova. Almost everyone that knew him said they would be shocked to find out he did something to Hannah. From the little bit that I know I'm not seeing him as a sociopathic serial killer. It seems like every crime against a female in VA is being credited to him, and even some outside of VA!

He could be afraid, and ran, because he did do something to Hannah or because he's afraid of being blamed when all he did was give her a ride and can't prove he didn't do something to Hannah. I don't know if he would even understand that forensics can get people off as well as get people convicted.

It's not fitting together for me with what we know so far.

I know about the accusation of sexual assault at LU, but I also know that just as not all males are angels, not all females are angels either. He wasn't criminally charged with that and I'm not even sure it would be admissible in court.

I really don't know what to think anymore, except that maybe I should go back to lurking and wait and see.

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

Cunningham sounds more concerned about his business than Hannah. He says she wasn't in the restaurant, but why would Hannah wait outside for LJM while he had a few drinks? Makes no sense. PC says witness saw her inside. Did anyone see her waiting outside by herself? What about video camera footage?

If she was outside, someone MUST have seen her. People were out there smoking---that means they were standing around for at least 5 minutes, probably more. You notice things like that.

 

[Bravo]

I'm just trying to figure out where after this thread is closed ����

You can contact a Mod. They are always happy to help. Bessie seems to be looking after us here.

 

[rtjedarling]

in response to the poster about intellectual problems with behavioral problems:

and such a person has special needs which due to lack of understanding this, or denying a problem, is not always addressed by those the person interacts with. The person is often expected to understand and be able to handle circumstances he cannot without help, thus his behavior continues to be inappropriate, his frustration level is high. I have seen this to be the case when a kid has athletic ability and so problems are denied, people tell themselves the guy is just being a guy, to keep him playing ball. We need to open our eyes wider in the family, school systems, LE to intervene before so many lives are ruined. Same with young persons with antisocial disorders where family denies he has a problem and LE barely slaps on the wrist over and over until he has really hurt someone.

 

[zebra]

"I ask LJ’s long-time friend Dave Johnson if he believes LJ knew Hannah before that night. Did he ever mention her? Did he speak of her? Was she a known person among your circle of friends?
“No, not at all, not at all. I don’t know her,” Dave answers. “He never mentioned her. I don’t think he knew her. In fact, I’m fairly certain of it, because he walked up and threw his arm around her. That’s what he did to women when he was hitting on them. If he threw his arm around a woman like that, that was not usually a sign that he knew her. That was a sign that he didn’t. If Hannah knew him, she wouldn’t let him put his arm around her.” http://insidecville.com/blog/ljs-timeline/ BBM

 

[MJPeony]

I have mixed emotions about this guy.

He reminds me of the mentally challenged cashiers at the Walmart I go to. Smart enough to take care of himself, but not smart enough to be a serial criminal.

People on this forum were saying he hasn't done well for a 32 year old. Others accused those people of being snobs. I think it's possible that his job was an achievement for him. I've watched the videos. He doesn't strike me as a good b.s. artist, a , a Casanova. Almost everyone that knew him said they would be shocked to find out he did something to Hannah. From the little bit that I know I'm not seeing him as a sociopathic serial killer. It seems like every crime against a female in VA is being credited to him, and even some outside of VA!

He could be afraid, and ran, because he did do something to Hannah or because he's afraid of being blamed when all he did was give her a ride and can't prove he didn't do something to Hannah. I don't know if he would even understand that forensics can get people off as well as get people convicted.

It's not fitting together for me with what we know so far.

I know about the accusation of sexual assault at LU, but I also know that just as not all males are angels, not all females are angels either. He wasn't criminally charged with that and I'm not even sure it would be admissible in court.

I really don't know what to think anymore, except that maybe I should go back to lurking and wait and see.

Well, I'm the first to say I was super duper slow in wanting to believe JM could be possibly responsible for anything more than immaturity. But wow, the stuff that has come out in the past 24 hrs is shocking me. At this point, even knowing what close friends have said over the past week and 1/2, Coy's story about the things even a friend of NINE YEARS said about JM point to a "not so gentle giant".

This says it all imo- a quote from a friend in that article: "He was a little more aggressive that night than usual. But he’s been aggressive before. Sometimes he doesn’t know when to stop."

http://insidecville.com/blog/ljs-timeline/

Wow, this picture that is coming to light is terrifying.

 

[franco]

in response to the poster about intellectual problems with behavioral problems:

and such a person has special needs which due to lack of understanding this, or denying a problem, is not always addressed by those the person interacts with. The person is often expected to understand and be able to handle circumstances he cannot without help, thus his behavior continues to be inappropriate, his frustration level is high. I have seen this to be the case when a kid has athletic ability and so problems are denied, people tell themselves the guy is just being a guy, to keep him playing ball. We need to open our eyes wider in the family, school systems, LE to intervene before so many lives are ruined. Same with young persons with antisocial disorders where family denies he has a problem and LE barely slaps on the wrist over and over until he has really hurt someone.

young people with anti social disorders do not have a problem, they just have a different type of personality. It is not something that can be fixed or treated.

nor does have an anti social disorder make you a bad person. there are many productive people in this world that have anti social disorder than live crime free lives and even heroic lives. Many people in the military that are in Special Forces , or fire fighters etc do have anti social disorder.

 

[ninij9]

and such a person has special needs which due to lack of understanding this, or denying a problem, is not always addressed by those the person interacts with. The person is often expected to understand and be able to handle circumstances he cannot without help, thus his behavior continues to be inappropriate, his frustration level is high. I have seen this to be the case when a kid has athletic ability and so problems are denied, people tell themselves the guy is just being a guy, to keep him playing ball. We need to open our eyes wider in the family, school systems, LE to intervene before so many lives are ruined. Same with young persons with antisocial disorders where family denies he has a problem and LE barely slaps on the wrist over and over until he has really hurt someone.

And for a person with these kinds of problems, could alcohol cause the type of behavior assigned to Jesse in Tempo? Not respecting boundries and such? Maybe its why we are getting two very distinct pictures of this man. Co-workers see him as polite and helpful. And then you ask those that see him in a bar setting and he is described as aggressive pushy etc?

 

[Bravo]

Just going to throw this out there. Eye witness is one of the least reliable. If only one person believes they saw Hannah inside I do question it. If several people did I would not. It seems the majority of the folks didn't see Hannah inside. For now I will go with that. Especially with folk at a busy establishment. Not saying the person is lying she just may have seen somebody who resembled Hannah.

 

[aa9511]

Yes- it's very interesting,

Unprovoked, he suddenly grabbed a man in the Blue Light Grill and wrenched him into a wrestling hold so forcefully that he pulled the man’s hamstring, leaving this man limping for days. In the first few seconds of meeting two women for the first time, he yanked them up off the ground and threw them over his shoulders and laughed, making them uncomfortable and embarrassed. He continued to follow both these women, at the Blue Light and later at the Tempo restaurant, putting his arm around them, his face uncomfortably close to theirs, touching their backs, their hair, their faces, their legs— until one of them cursed at him to stop. After one of the women slipped off the boots she was wearing, LJ unexpectedly pulled off her socks, saying he wanted to see her toes. A friend of LJ’s for over nine years described him as a “prowler,” clarifying his use of the word by adding, “which is not to say he was looking for a victim, but looking for a girl who’s already compromised a little bit, maybe improve his chances.”

http://insidecville.com/blog/ljs-timeline/

So it sounds like he definately has a social disorder, and maybe a mental disorder as well? There was another article last thread quoting a former football teammate of his who said (paraphrasing) that he was kind of odd and didn't know how to interact with people.

I am still going with my hunch that he took Hannah home with him hoping to score, but then some accident happened and she died. Of course, the "accident" could have been caused by him. Or it could have been some other factor, like maybe she became unconscious and he panicked. I am more thinking that he did something to her while physically assaulting her which killed her.

This is all so tragic. Praying for Hannah and for her family.

 

[franco]

How did HG get drunker as the night went by. Door man said she could not even walk without JLM holding her up as they left. Yet she was walking and running around town ?

 

[yupikgirl]

I thought so too, but NG just had one of his childhood friends on her show, and the spoke exactly like JM. Maybe it's a common thing?

I know it was super annoying...like spit it out LOL


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[MJPeony]

Just going to throw this out there. Eye witness is one of the least reliable. If only one person believes they saw Hannah inside I do question it. If several people did I would not. It seems the majority of the folks didn't see Hannah inside. For now I will go with that. Especially with folk at a busy establishment. Not saying the person is lying she just may have seen somebody who resembled Hannah.

I can respect that position. I would be inclined to think the same, but if HE was inside, why wouldn't she have gone in too? And if it's b/c there was a bouncer and she wasn't old enough, then wouldn't that bouncer have remembered her trying to get in.... ??

 

[trixandhoney]

That's the thing. Most people with borderline IQ can function in certain life skills such as in jobs where the expectations are consistent, but they struggle with other areas (relationships, financial responsibilities, etc.). Some sources say that borderline and intellectually disabled people consist of up to 10% of the prison population. I have no test scores to look at but his behavior, conversations with officers, and demeanor are familiar to me in my work. But this is, again, not excusing his behavior if he has harmed Hannah; it is nothing but a hunch and is only my opinion. Inmate IQ prison stats for those interested: http://www.disabled-world.com/disability/types/cognitive/prison-system.php

And for a person with these kinds of problems, could alcohol cause the type of behavior assigned to Jesse in Tempo? Not respecting boundries and such? Maybe its why we are getting two very distinct pictures of this man. Co-workers see him as polite and helpful. And then you ask those that see him in a bar setting and he is described as aggressive pushy etc?

Absolutely. IMO.

 

[SweetT]

I know, what's up with the clothing change?? Is it possible the surveillance cameras just aren't picking up the shirt checked pattern and making it seem more grey/white?

I think that's exactly the case here

 

[franco]

And for a person with these kinds of problems, could alcohol cause the type of behavior assigned to Jesse in Tempo? Not respecting boundries and such? Maybe its why we are getting two very distinct pictures of this man. Co-workers see him as polite and helpful. And then you ask those that see him in a bar setting and he is described as aggressive pushy etc?

probably the alcohol , seems like he drank a lot

 

[shutterbug22]

This is from 2012 but I found this an interesting read about Sexual Assaults at UVA http://www.c-ville.com/burden-of-proof-uvas-sexual-assault-policy-under-fire/#.VCTNshZ0YS4

 

[Macpad]

Well, I'm the first to say I was super duper slow in wanting to believe JM could be possibly responsible for anything more than immaturity. But wow, the stuff that has come out in the past 24 hrs is shocking me. At this point, even knowing what close friends have said over the past week and 1/2, Coy's story about the things even a friend of NINE YEARS said about JM point to a "not so gentle giant".

This says it all imo- a quote from a friend in that article: "He was a little more aggressive that night than usual. But he’s been aggressive before. Sometimes he doesn’t know when to stop."

http://insidecville.com/blog/ljs-timeline/

Wow, this picture that is coming to light is terrifying.

I would also go to Jesse Matthew Sr.'s criminal record to give a snapshot of the potential environment that JM Jr. was raised in.

 

[ninij9]

I can respect that position. I would be inclined to think the same, but if HE was inside, why wouldn't she have gone in too? And if it's b/c there was a bouncer and she wasn't old enough, then wouldn't that bouncer have remembered her trying to get in.... ??

Wasn't the female carded careful to say she didn't "recall" Hannah entering bar? I'm already confused about everything, asking me to believe Hannah stood outside while JM had two cocktails, then resumed her encounter with him more impaired than before? I don't think so.[emoji53]

 

[Kale]

I can respect that position. I would be inclined to think the same, but if HE was inside, why wouldn't she have gone in too? And if it's b/c there was a bouncer and she wasn't old enough, then wouldn't that bouncer have remembered her trying to get in.... ??

Not to mention her outfit was pretty specific and she's freaking 5'11. Who doesn't notice a girl who's 5'11"? My gosh that's tall.