VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #16 *ARREST*

[ninij9]

After reading the timeline it's clear that Jesse Matthew was certainly in a state of lonely panic that night, a socially-unaware individual with a noted disregard for personal space.

He didn't fit in at Tempo, because he only went there to follow human interaction. He clearly didn't see or respect that those women were not interested in spending anymore time around him. Maybe they were justified, maybe not--regardless he noticed and acted as he did.

I've met people like him--they do something awkward, or socially inept that instead of toning it down, they turn it up. This led to him being told to "**** off", and having an entire group of people he pathetically followed leave him again.

I believe he was looking to prove something that night. He likely misconstrued Hannah's trust for interest and reacted violently when she turned him down.

I think they're going to be able to, based on this testimony and timeline, make a strong case for what it's looking like took place that night.

This is sad on many levels.

Jesse scares me, but he also invokes my pity because he seems emotionally damaged and he obviously wants so badly to fit in. If he is mentally disturbed then Hannah will be the latest victim if how our society doesn't recognize, diagnose and treat people with these dangerous diseases. OK having said that, he could also be a great sociopathic actor. My pity pendulum swings back and forth. Lol.

 

[Soulmagent]

but wasn't she supposed to be distressed before meeting JM and that's why WG followed her?

Right so if WG saw the arm arround her part after tempo , Then why was he still watching .. because other wise JM and HG walked like that the whole 45 minutes.

 

[rtjedarling]

I'm not sure if this has been discussed, and it may be a longshot, but I came across this tonight and thought of Hannah (or maybe Alexis?)

http://www.claiborneprogress.net/ne.../50762855/Human-remains-found-at-state-border

The second time recently gensing hunters have discovered remains- also in Holly Bobo case.

 

[Jmm124567]

Looks like JM and HG never knew each other. This below plus police saying they have no evidence to believe they knew each other.

I ask LJ’s long-time friend Dave Johnson if he believes LJ knew Hannah before that night. Did he ever mention her? Did he speak of her? Was she a known person among your circle of friends?

“No, not at all, not at all. I don’t know her,” Dave answers. “He never mentioned her. I don’t think he knew her. In fact, I’m fairly certain of it, because he walked up and threw his arm around her. That’s what he did to women when he was hitting on them. If he threw his arm around a woman like that, that was not usually a sign that he knew her. That was a sign that he didn’t. If Hannah knew him, she wouldn’t let him put his arm around her.”

 

[jojo87]

I don't think his behavior at the bar or any other behavior we've heard of so far points to mental illness. It points to him being a creep.
I always get cross when speculation on a suspects mental illness begins without reason. Speaking slowly is not a sign of a low IQ or anti social personality disorder neither is behaving like an *advertiser censored** or working at what some consider an entry level job.
Lets talk about mental illness or low IQ if or when there's a shred of proof.

 

[zapped]

Maybe he was drunk and completely uninhibited.

If he was already lacking the normal filters that most people have, and thats been said by several people....then alcohol would only make this even more pronounced.

 

[Inspector Gidget]

I wonder if Hannah died from an alcohol overdose.

If Hannah was "heavily intoxicated" why wouldn't he just rape her and leave. Hannah wouldn't remember it. No need to kill her.

I wonder if he gave her a drug and she died from that,was scared and then got rid of her body.Don't see how she could go from walking fast in the mall to being heavy intoxicated that quick.

 

[laurash988]

Jesse scares me, but he also invokes my pity because he seems emotionally damaged and he obviously wants so badly to fit in. If he is mentally disturbed then Hannah will be the latest victim if how our society doesn't recognize, diagnose and treat people with these dangerous diseases. OK having said that, he could also be a great sociopathic actor. My pity pendulum swings back and forth. Lol.

I always try to get into the head of people who commit crimes. I think it's my way of trying to understand.

 

[Jmm124567]

JM does seem slow. Did you see him in court. He was asking some weird questions

 

[laurash988]

I wonder if he gave her a drug and she died from that,was scared and then got rid of her body.Don't see how she could go from walking fast in the mall to being heavy intoxicated that quick.

That's what I brought up on a thread yesterday. I think it's a legitimate possibility.

 

[MJPeony]

I'm not buying the mentally slow thing. I think it's really easy to fake. Plus, remember all the times he has gotten away without having to pay the piper. Methinks he has run this game before. JMO.

One can be mentally slow and still be enabled....

 

[hambirg]

Yeesh! I'm sorry that happened to you. I was going to say I guess I've been lucky but for all I know I've been groped and don't remember. :thinking: I've never been in either an OR or recovery room where rape was possible unless several people were in on it. It's always been far too crowded. Not denying your story, just conveying my experience.

OT

The woman that was raped. . .um. . .trying to figure out how to say this. . .wasn't raped in the classical sense. Legally she was raped. He reached under the blanket and penetrated her. They discovered the two men were working together. They were tipping each other off as to when there was a chance to get away with something undetected. Pretty disgusting! I'm glad they were caught and I felt some guilt that I didn't report it. I just kept thinking that no one would believe me since as far as anyone could tell I was still unconscious. Plus the whole self doubt of it. . .I was still pretty heavily sedated. Apparently I wasn't alone in feeling that. Many women ended up coming forward.

 

[Ursus]

Jesse scares me, but he also invokes my pity because he seems emotionally damaged and he obviously wants so badly to fit in. If he is mentally disturbed then Hannah will be the latest victim if how our society doesn't recognize, diagnose and treat people with these dangerous diseases. OK having said that, he could also be a great sociopathic actor. My pity pendulum swings back and forth. Lol.

I agree. It could be just a means of control. By continually acting out, he controls the situation. The spotlight is on him.

One has to wonder how a guy who had apparently been drinking, and likely panicking could hide/dispose of her so effectively.

 

[Quill]

That's not much of a university then. No offense, but a university that accepts people with an IQ in the range of 80 and puts them into their second year of studies has such low standards that it's not a university ... in my opinion.

They consider themselves to be highly academic. They are just wiling to do what it takes to try and win. They have different standards for athletes it seems. They are a rival university to the one I support, so I'm somewhat biased. However I was barraged with the daily news of whether he would or would not be allowed to play in my local news. It basically came down to them saying how awful people were for wanting to deny him an opportunity to go to college. They are very proud of what they did for him.

 

[fhc]

I'm not sure if this has been discussed, and it may be a longshot, but I came across this tonight and thought of Hannah (or maybe Alexis?)

http://www.claiborneprogress.net/ne.../50762855/Human-remains-found-at-state-border

This is possible!!!

Human remains found at state border

 

[zapped]

I wonder if he gave her a drug and she died from that,was scared and then got rid of her body.Don't see how she could go from walking fast in the mall to being heavy intoxicated that quick.

In the Barefoot article linked to elsewhere in this thread, one of the wtinesses JLM harasses notices that hes sweating profusely. IIRC it was enough to make her mention this twice.

Anyone here know if any illegal or prescription drugs that people use to get high can cause these symptoms?

 

[Jmm124567]

I wonder if he gave her a drug and she died from that,was scared and then got rid of her body.Don't see how she could go from walking fast in the mall to being heavy intoxicated that quick.

In the one article it says: When I saw her that night,” Abby says, “I remember thinking, she’s really drunk. She couldn’t walk well. She was slouched into him, leaning against him, like she was having difficulty standing up. He was talking to her, and his right arm was around her, not over her shoulder, not at the waist, but around her back and holding her right arm. He was holding her close, like he was almost holding her up. They walked away together up the street towards the Mall.”

 

[kathryann]

From the very start of this, with all the people in that mall, I would think there would be SO many witnesses. He's a big guy with dreadlocks, she is a very tall girl, dressed in a gold sparkly crop top. I can't believe that more people did not see what happened, and I feel like there are witnesses who haven't come forward. Like someone said, people were outside smoking, she was falling over drunk, he was holding her up, did not ONE person think to help her, or notice her and him together and what was going on. Or even see them leave together? Maybe I'm just more aware of my surroundings, but it seems to me like I would have noticed them. It baffles me. Maybe witnesses are afraid to come forward. Maybe there were a lot of out-of-town people there. Only ONE person saw them leave together? That just seems odd to me. Maybe people are afraid they will have to go to court and testify? I don't know, I'm just rambling.

 

[MrPalomar]

First reports of nurse wrong then orderly. Still no direct evidence to speak of. I want to know why they think he only ATTEMPTED to define her. This charge isn't going to stick.. Unless if course his DNA matches some other cases or to some of Hannah's at his res. and or car.....I'm on the fence. Warrants are sealed. Why? To protect LE witch hunt? If they Hv relevant info release it.

Again the charge is "abduction with intent to defile." Not attempt and there is a big difference.
If you abduct someone - i.e. deprive them of their liberty - with the intent to defile or sexually assault them, that's a crime. You don't even have to actually attempt or succeed to defile them. Abducting them is bad enough.

Let's just say for example, someone abducts someone with intent to defile but they are thwarted before the actual assault takes place. They've still commited a crime, i.e. the crime of abduction.

The reason that they're stopping with "intent" and not an attempted or actual sexual assault, is that they have no idea right now what happened after he abducted her, so they can't charge for either of those things. They have probable cause that he abducted her and that he at a minimum intended to assault her. If and when they get more evidence of what actually happened after the abduction, they can pile on more charges.

Note: all MOO and IANAL.

 

[cville_bob]

Cunningham sounds more concerned about his business than Hannah. He says she wasn't in the restaurant, but why would Hannah wait outside for LJM while he had a few drinks? Makes no sense. PC says witness saw her inside. Did anyone see her waiting outside by herself? What about video camera footage?

He doesn't say "she wasn't in the restaurant" he very carefully (IMHO) and repeatedly says none of us "recall" or "remember" her being in the restaurant. Which seems like the sort of careful statement that would be crafted under the advice of an attorney. Someone mentioned they were unexpectedly closed earlier this week ... hmmm.