VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #16 *ARREST*

[monkey222]

Do we know what time he arrived back at his apt on Sat? Have his roomates or neighbors provided any info re: his arrival back to apt? Was he back by sunrise? etc.

 

[blefuscu]

Do we know what time he arrived back at his apt on Sat? Have his roomates or neighbors provided any info re: his arrival back to apt? Was he back by sunrise? etc.

I believe Chief Longo was directly asking people to report to LE if they saw JM after the night out up to when he was arrested so they can try and determine a window between Hannah being seen with JM walking away from Tempo and being reported missing. They want to try and shrink the window of time that JM had to, Urgh I hate writing this, dispose of Hannah.

 

[Foxfire]

I've been wondering about that "intent to defile" charge ever since they announced it. I read the legal description and all of that, and then I began trying to figure out how it would apply here. It almost seems like one of those charges they levy "so we can at least get him on something".

Just a shot in the dark here, but I'm thinking maybe he was taking pictures or video clips of her with his cell phone that night, unbeknownst to her. If she accepted a ride with him, maybe he took even more pictures of her after she was in his vehicle, especially if she had passed out or was close to it.

The key here is the word "intent". How would you establish that ? Helping a drunk girl walk along the sidewalk ? Starting up a chat with a tipsy woman that is out partying all night ? Putting your arm around someone that really isn't accepting of it ?

Is flirting with a pretty girl considered "Intent to defile" ?? If that's all it takes, then I would think that charge should be levied on 50 guys per night in those bars.

That charge by itself seems weak to me. However, coupled with additional evidence such as cell phone photos or video clips, it may have some teeth behind it depending what is shown. If there are no photo's or videos, just eye witness statements, then I have no idea how they would make that charge stick.

<BBM for Focus>

Forensics is the voice of the innocent victims of the Silent Epidemic of the missing and murdered..

 

[steelman]

All JM friends and family who say he has got be innocent because he is a nice and gentle guy are naïve. We have learned over and over that anyone is capable of violent crime. He isn't gentle he is aggressive.

I have done a lot bar hopping in my life, at least 10 years worth when I was working in the oilfields in Texas. I have known many, many "nice, gentle, friendly guys"........when SOBER. If you add a 12 pack of beer and a couple shots of Tequila------> Instant *advertiser censored**Hole !!!

I worked with a lot of these guys, and on any average work day they were just hard working, dependable roughnecks and cowboys. Once you get them tanked up on some alcohol though, things changed. Many times they would get bitter, loud, confrontational, intolerant and would start a fight at the drop of a hat for the dumbest reasons you can imagine. They would blow a cork because they thought someone was staring at them, they would flirt with another guys woman and dare him to do something about it, they might challenge a bouncer because they figured they could whip his a$$, and more often than not, they would wind up in jail with no recollection of how they got there. It was a fun time for all----myself included !

The point being, alcohol is a mood and mind altering drug. It will make people do and say things they normally wouldn't do or say. The discrepancy we keep seeing between JM's friends and family, and the people that go out partying with him, are very explainable in that sense. This guy gets very aggressive after he has lost his inhibitions thanks to the booze.

After having read both his family's comments, and the chain of events that night laid out by Coy Barefoot, I would say that Jesse Matthew probably was pretty much an average, easy going guy while sober..........it was the alcohol that ended up getting him in trouble and impairing his judgement. I can't help but wonder if even he himself is having trouble recalling everything that went down that night. The entire thing may just seem like a bad dream to him.

 

[possumheart]

I have done a lot bar hopping in my life, at least 10 years worth when I was working in the oilfields in Texas. I have known many, many "nice, gentle, friendly guys"........when SOBER. If you add a 12 pack of beer and a couple shots of Tequila------> Instant *advertiser censored**Hole !!!

I worked with a lot of these guys, and on any average work day they were just hard working, dependable roughnecks and cowboys. Once you get them tanked up on some alcohol though, things changed. Many times they would get bitter, loud, confrontational, intolerant and would start a fight at the drop of a hat for the dumbest reasons you can imagine. They would blow a cork because they thought someone was staring at them, they would flirt with another guys woman and dare him to do something about it, they might challenge a bouncer because they figured they could whip his a$$, and more often than not, they would wind up in jail with no recollection of how they got there. It was a fun time for all----myself included !

The point being, alcohol is a mood and mind altering drug. It will make people do and say things they normally wouldn't do or say. The discrepancy we keep seeing between JM's friends and family, and the people that go out partying with him, are very explainable in that sense. This guy gets very aggressive after he has lost his inhibitions thanks to the booze.

After having read both his family's comments, and the chain of events that night laid out by Coy Barefoot, I would say that Jesse Matthew probably was pretty much an average, easy going guy while sober..........it was the alcohol that ended up getting him in trouble and impairing his judgement. I can't help but wonder if even he himself is having trouble recalling everything that went down that night. The entire thing may just seem like a bad dream to him.

His body type screams of blood sugar problems. Add liquor and you get Dr Jeckell. But that's just a physical observation

 

[steelman]

<BBM for Focus>

Forensics is the voice of the innocent victims of the Silent Epidemic of the missing and murdered..

Foxfire, you are going to have to enlighten me. What kind of forensics testing is there that tells the cops what is going on in somebodies mind ??

 

[possumheart]

Foxfire, you are going to have to enlighten me. What kind of forensics testing is there that tells the cops what is going on in somebodies mind ??

Forensics are for the interpretation of each side of a legal argument. Only the legal people can breathe life into them. The long and windy road.

 

[Foxfire]

I've been wondering about that "intent to defile" charge ever since they announced it. I read the legal description and all of that, and then I began trying to figure out how it would apply here. It almost seems like one of those charges they levy "so we can at least get him on something".

Just a shot in the dark here, but I'm thinking maybe he was taking pictures or video clips of her with his cell phone that night, unbeknownst to her. If she accepted a ride with him, maybe he took even more pictures of her after she was in his vehicle, especially if she had passed out or was close to it.

The key here is the word "intent". How would you establish that ? Helping a drunk girl walk along the sidewalk ? Starting up a chat with a tipsy woman that is out partying all night ? Putting your arm around someone that really isn't accepting of it ?

Is flirting with a pretty girl considered "Intent to defile" ?? If that's all it takes, then I would think that charge should be levied on 50 guys per night in those bars.

That charge by itself seems weak to me. However, coupled with additional evidence such as cell phone photos or video clips, it may have some teeth behind it depending what is shown. If there are no photo's or videos, just eye witness statements, then I have no idea how they would make that charge stick.

<BBM for Focus>

Forensics is the voice of the innocent victims of the Silent Epidemic of the missing and murdered..

Foxfire, you are going to have to enlighten me. What kind of forensics testing is there that tells the cops what is going on in somebodies mind ??

Cyber forensics, steelman,.. Imo, HG did not send the text at 1:20 a.m. that Saturday, saying that she was lost..
_____________

Charlottesville Police Chief Tim Longo was brief and tight lipped during Tuesday night&#8217;s news conference, not saying if all lab results were back for the evidence or how it could link Matthew to Hannah Graham.

http://wtvr.com/2014/09/24/dont-assume-there-is-irrefutable-dna-evidence-against-jesse-matthew/

However, Longo says they now have probable cause to charge Matthew with abduction with the intent to defile, meaning they believe he took Hannah against her will to commit a sexual act.

Graham was last seen on surveillance camera early Saturday, Sept. 13. Her friends last heard from her around 1:20 a.m. that Saturday, when she sent a text saying she was lost in an area where she could not possibly have been, according to police.

 

[Mica]

Interesting: http://insidecville.com/blog/ljs-timeline/

IMO, based on the Matthew's behaviors described in this article, he was in predator mode. Perhaps his behaviors that night, as described by those who witnessed them, led LE to charge him with "intent to defile."

 

[steelman]

Cyber forensics, steelman,.. Imo, HG did not send the text at 1:20 a.m. that Saturday, saying that she was lost..
_____________

Charlottesville Police Chief Tim Longo was brief and tight lipped during Tuesday night&#8217;s news conference, not saying if all lab results were back for the evidence or how it could link Matthew to Hannah Graham.

http://wtvr.com/2014/09/24/dont-assume-there-is-irrefutable-dna-evidence-against-jesse-matthew/

However, Longo says they now have probable cause to charge Matthew with abduction with the intent to defile, meaning they believe he took Hannah against her will to commit a sexual act.

Graham was last seen on surveillance camera early Saturday, Sept. 13. Her friends last heard from her around 1:20 a.m. that Saturday, when she sent a text saying she was lost in an area where she could not possibly have been, according to police.

Per the article you linked above:

&#8220;There needs to be some evidence,&#8221; Stone said. &#8220;It&#8217;s not at the level needed to prove guilt, but it could be something as simple as some of her clothing being left at that apartment.&#8221;

Stone believes charging Matthew with this felony may be a tactical move to put Matthew behind bars and keep him there during this investigation.

It still sounds like a pretty slippery slope to me. They had better have a lot more than this to go on............or this guy is going to walk.

 

[steelman]

***Sigh.....**** So many threads........so little time............

 

[SouthernMomma]

Also wondering if drugs on his part were involved. His hair needs to be tested, too. That behavior JUST on alcohol on a guy THAT large seems very very very odd! Just my observation/opinion.

 

[steelman]

Also wondering if drugs on his part were involved. His hair needs to be tested, too. That behavior JUST on alcohol on a guy THAT large seems very very very odd! Just my observation/opinion.

Drugs could definitely be involved. Chrystal Meth makes you even more aggressive and fearless than alcohol does. Once you couple the two together, you may well end up with a raging maniac, especially in a covertly aggressive person. And yes, I know from first-hand experience. Been there, done that.

 

[skibaboo]

It's all so sad. But by the grace of God, this could have been my daughter who just started college this year. I just wanted to tell everyone I came across this site when "Googling" 'HG Missing' in the beginning and was lucky to have found it. It's nice to know that folks are trying to help. Everyone has opinions and theories and though you may differ in some, I've seen the best in people. I've seen a group working towards one goal; bringing HG home. You're all to be commended for this. Thanks for letting me "join" your ranks.

I'm afraid the wonderful Det Longo looked too saddened while answering questions. I hope I'm wrong.

:welcome: to WS RollTide!

 

[possumheart]

Drugs could definitely be involved. Chrystal Meth makes you even more aggressive and fearless than alcohol does. Once you couple the two together, you may well end up with a raging maniac, especially in a covertly aggressive person. And yes, I know from first-hand experience. Been there, done that.

Meth made kamikaze pilots who they were.

 

[Perplexed 123]

Also wondering if drugs on his part were involved. His hair needs to be tested, too. That behavior JUST on alcohol on a guy THAT large seems very very very odd! Just my observation/opinion.

bbm - his hair could tell us a lot

 

[sophiebelle]

So did LE go back for the clothes in the last search warrant? They had the pics of a different outfit and wanted to find those as opposed to what he had on during his trek in the mall?

 

[southernmimi]

He won't walk....LE knows what they're doing. There's much, much more involved than a gentle giant being nice to an intoxicated young lady....IMO.

 

[Perplexed 123]

So did LE go back for the clothes in the last search warrant? They had the pics of a different outfit and wanted to find those as opposed to what he had on during his trek in the mall?

I was thinking the same at first but Posters here made good points about that

a)white shirt could be a jacket or
b)the cctv shows most light colours as white

 

[Emaa]

I was thinking the same at first but Posters here made good points about that

a)white shirt could be a jacket or
b)the cctv shows most light colours as white

Everyone in those videos seemed to be wearing black/gray/white.

Of course they weren't.