VA - Nicole Lovell, 13, Blacksburg, 27 January 2016 #4 *Arrests*

[Bootsctr]

This reminds me of another horrible murder. Does anyone remember the murder of Elizabeth Olten by Alyssa Bustamante in in Missouri ? In this case the murder by an older teen of a younger neighbor was also premeditated, if I recall. AB said she killed because she wanted to know what it felt like to kill someone. She was also a cutter, had depression and anxiety and suicidal thoughts. She beat her victim and slit her victim's throat before putting her body in a shallow grave.

It does raise a question in my mind if the self hurt that NL was apparently refraining from became more of an obsession than ever and the idea of using a knife to kill another became enticing to her, whether by her own hand or someone else's. Maybe the idea and thought of it was the thrill for her but when it came to the actual act she needed to find someone to actually physically commit the murder itself.

Yes, I remember Elizabeth's case. So tragic! I agree that Bustamante does remind me of Natalie! I cannot remember if she was tried as an adult. It was disturbing because she was so young and soooo dark! Does anyone know what a cutter is called in the medical/psychology field? I guess what I am asking is there a term other than cutter used to describe this "condition"?

 

[sds71]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...slain-teen-talked-running-away-defendant.html

A friend of the 13-year-old Virginia girl who was killed after climbing out of her bedroom window says the seventh-grader talked of running away and starting a family with the man now charged in her slaying.

 

[JohnTate90210]

I have kicked that thought around too. I even wondered if the victim in her desperation to attach herself to DE may have claimed to be pregnant. Even if she wasn't (and this assumption makes a leap and an assumption that there had been a prior physical relationship) that might have been enough to send DE to his friend NK seeking a solution. She could have offered the plan as a way to get him out of the situation while satisfying her own need for a release far beyond self mutilation.

I've thought the exact same thing. Nicole could have made such a claim as either a joke or to attach herself to DE. Being young, he might have panicked a bit too fast depending on the time since their first encounter.

 

[Bootsctr]

Maybe each (DE and NK) were manipulating one another.

Speculation:

Maybe NK was turning up everywhere DE was because she was into him and he was not that into her beyond friends. He thought he was manipulating her and using her affection for him to get her to assist in permanently getting rid of some girl (NL) he described as a stalker or someone who was causing him troubles.

Maybe all the while NK considered herself to be the manipulator, now DE needs her for something exciting and dark and secretive. A secret they will share that will bind them intimately til they go to their graves. Leverage to move the relationship to where it hadn't gone yet.

Who knows.

Will be very interesting to see more info and evidence over time. Right now there is so little to go on many theories are possibles. This one is just one I am kicking around and I am not attached to it per se.

:goodpost: I think this is highly likely! In a sense, they both thought they were getting one over the other one, when in fact they were both using each other as a "means to an end" perhaps?

I keep coming across a reference to an online biography of David Eisenhauer. Wouldn't you know it? I can't find it! I suppose it has been snatched up already by the powers-that-be. I sure did want to read it though. Also, looking for article that described DE as a leader. I may not be remembering correctly and he was talking about himself being a leader...

 

[Betty P]

Okay, I hope I'm not driving everyone crazy...but something else:

Nicole doesn't come across to me as prey for a pedophile, but she does come across as prey for a mean girl. One very obvious reason is she is a blabber mouth. Pedophiles like to keep their victims silent - yet Nicole was showing pictures IRL, sharing pictures online to whomever, talking to friends about her online friends. If she were groomed to be a sexual-assault victim, she would be groomed to be quiet about it. (I'm not buying that DE was afraid of her talking. For one thing, if that were the case, he wouldn't have planned for weeks, but have acted swiftly.) Mean-girls, however, just have more fodder for ridicule with someone who is so open about their lives.

I'm beginning to wonder of all the "older guys" Nicole was chatting with were really NK?! I know that's crazy and I'm not tied to it, but I really think Nicole was played, taunted, and set up for humiliation and murder....but I don't see her set up for sexual assault. And, I think the desire for humiliation and murder stems from NK. (Perhaps it has some dark sexual component too, idk?)

Okay, thanks for indulging me with multiple posts on my theory. At this point, I can't make the story fit with DE as mastermind. But I'm totally willing to admit I'm wrong once we know more. But for now, it all fits with a troubled NK in charge.

JMOpinion, subject to change.

Well, the FBI and local LE have probably already examined these online transactions and knows who was involved. IMO, Nicole was very easy prey for online pedophiles, young, naive, emotionally vulnerable, looking for approval and validation from males.

I'd be willing to guess DE had been coming on to young girls online for some time. It seemed to be a fantasy game for him that escalated from online activities to actually meeting someone in person. As a loner, someone with a "fascination for crime" and a habit of trolling the internet for young girls, he's a fairly classic profile for the type of sociopath who would plan and carry out such a crime.

 

[Haayturtle]

Yes, I remember Elizabeth's case. So tragic! I agree that Bustamante does remind me of Natalie! I cannot remember if she was tried as an adult. It was disturbing because she was so young and soooo dark! Does anyone know what a cutter is called in the medical/psychology field? I guess what I am asking is there a term other than cutter used to describe this "condition"?

Self- Injury or Self- harm

 

[Historydetective63]

Per the prosecutor, he admitted he watched Nicole climb out the window and to giving Nicole a side hug. The article also says police found HIS messages on Nicole's cell phone. I think it's pretty clear this wasn't a catfish situation and he was the one communicating with Nicole.

"The prosecutor said Eisenhauer initially denied his involvement when police found his messages on Nicole's phone, but eventually, he said he drove to the girl's home, watched her climb out of her window and greeted her with a "side hug" before they drove off to pick up Keepers."
http://www.wbaltv.com/news/-va-tech-murder-suspects-left-few-clues-to-possible-motives/37815296

Ok then, according to DE's own statement, he picked Nicole up at her window, gave her a side hug BEFORE THEY DROVE OFF TO PICK UP KEEPERS. So DE is placing NK is the car with them before the child was murdered.

I think both DE and NK were present when the murder happened, what do you other ws's think?

 

[whiskers]

So David stood back and watched Nicole get out of her window? I have to wonder about this because the pictures posted yesterday, certain windows on the ground floor are not exactly super close to the ground.

From what I can tell, it depends on the building. Some of the buildings are on taller slopes, thus making some ground floor windows have a steeper fall than others.

I wonder if she jumped or he helped catch her?

 

[Elainera]

Yes, I remember Elizabeth's case. So tragic! I agree that Bustamante does remind me of Natalie! I cannot remember if she was tried as an adult. It was disturbing because she was so young and soooo dark! Does anyone know what a cutter is called in the medical/psychology field? I guess what I am asking is there a term other than cutter used to describe this "condition"?

Self mutilation?

Yes Alyssa Bustamante was tried as an adult. She got LWOP.

She took Prozac when she committed the murder ... She showed remorse later on.

 

[JohnTate90210]

I'm trying to think of other possible social sites that we may have missed. I know Tumblr is popular. Has anybody found anything there? It would seem a likely place for teens to post.

 

[Bootsctr]

Ok then, according to DE's own statement, he picked Nicole up at her window, gave her a side hug BEFORE THEY DROVE OFF TO PICK UP KEEPERS. So DE is placing NK is the car with them before the child was murdered.

I think both DE and NK were present when the murder happened, what do you other ws's think?

I think we have to decide whose story we are going to believe. Do we believe Keepers or do we believe Eisenhauer? I think they are both lying. There's not really a lesser of the two evils in my opinion, but if we go by LE's charges, Eisenhauer killed Nicole. Keepers knew before, during and after. I think DE stabbed Nicole and Keepers watched. Just my opinion at the moment. I really need to see their hands. Maybe they took turns, but it doesn't look like LE is going in that direction with the charges as of yet. I realize it is still an active investigation.

 

[atm9533]

Keepers was there, I have no doubt.

 

[Bootsctr]

Self mutilation?

Yes Alyssa Bustamante was tried as an adult. She got LWOP.

She took Prozac when she committed the murder ... She showed remorse later on.

Prozac is Keepers' drug too? I'm thinking Phil Hartman's wife was on Prozac when she killed him.

 

[Fireweed]

Prozac is Keepers' drug too? I'm thinking Phil Hartman's wife was on Prozac when she killed him.

I think prozac sometimes gives a depressive the energy they need to finally do something really bad.

 

[DatelineFan]

They PLANNED to slit her throat, but her death was caused by STABBING.....unless throat slitting is considered to be stabbing by the Medical Examiner. jMO

They may not have been able to do it as planned if she fought back. People fight HARD! I know for a fact.

ETA - I know this as the fighter, not attacker

Also, as a mental health professional, I can say that self harm is a personal thing, it does not involve others. NK cutting herself does not necessarily correlate with her cutting someone else. Yes, some people who engage in self harm can be violent, just as people who do not, can. But there are also people who self harm that are gentle and kind towards others. I don't self harm, I just want to inform people, so there aren't false assumptions being made.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Okay, I hope I'm not driving everyone crazy...but something else:

Nicole doesn't come across to me as prey for a pedophile, but she does come across as prey for a mean girl. One very obvious reason is she is a blabber mouth. Pedophiles like to keep their victims silent - yet Nicole was showing pictures IRL, sharing pictures online to whomever, talking to friends about her online friends. If she were groomed to be a sexual-assault victim, she would be groomed to be quiet about it. (I'm not buying that DE was afraid of her talking. For one thing, if that were the case, he wouldn't have planned for weeks, but have acted swiftly.) Mean-girls, however, just have more fodder for ridicule with someone who is so open about their lives.

I'm beginning to wonder of all the "older guys" Nicole was chatting with were really NK?! I know that's crazy and I'm not tied to it, but I really think Nicole was played, taunted, and set up for humiliation and murder....but I don't see her set up for sexual assault. And, I think the desire for humiliation and murder stems from NK. (Perhaps it has some dark sexual component too, idk?)

Okay, thanks for indulging me with multiple posts on my theory. At this point, I can't make the story fit with DE as mastermind. But I'm totally willing to admit I'm wrong once we know more. But for now, it all fits with a troubled NK in charge.

JMOpinion, subject to change.

I would actually think that sexual predators are most likely to target girls who are the most active on social media.

 

[*JMO*]

I found the description of a "side hug" interesting. I am wondering if that description was volunteered or came after further questioning and request for detail from LE. It sounds like what the Dugger family does on their chaperoned dates. The obvious connotation is that it is non-sexual contact. If it was DE's own non-prompted description it sounds like a self-serving defensive comment, which raises my own eyebrows.

 

[Bootsctr]

I found the description of a "side hug" interesting. I am wondering if that description was volunteered or came after further questioning and request for detail from LE. It sounds like what the Dugger family does on their chaperoned dates. The obvious connotation is that it is non-sexual contact. If it was DE's own non-prompted description it sounds like a self-serving defensive comment, which raises my own eyebrows.

BlueberryBird told us it was a cultural thing, which I was glad to hear because my only reference to a "side hug" was the Duggar family. After it came out that the oldest was a molester I thought that is why they did side hugs... :gaah:

 

[Elainera]

I found the description of a "side hug" interesting. I am wondering if that description was volunteered or came after further questioning and request for detail from LE. It sounds like what the Dugger family does on their chaperoned dates. The obvious connotation is that it is non-sexual contact. If it was DE's own non-prompted description it sounds like a self-serving defensive comment, which raises my own eyebrows.

Yes I feel the same. Odd comment to make.

 

[rob]

I'm ready to post my theory now: DE had met NK thru tutoring her in math. NK doesn't really have any friends, so she latches onto DE. He probably is flattered to a degree, even though he is aware she is stalking him. He is having an online relationship with NL, but she is childish and keeps talking and posting, bragging to her friends. DE is not happy with that and wants her to stop, but she wont' and they argue about it. Then the college students go home for x-mas and either DE or NK sees that NL is not posting, and reach out to her other online friends to ask why. they are told her Dad is on to NL's online activites and took her phone and computer privileges away. DE is like, oh no, is he going to get aggressive about this, cause DE has ambitions in life and don't want his activities with minors to mess that up. He contacts NK and asks her to return to school early and tells her that the LG is causing him problems. NK says, oh no, we need to shut her up. I can help you. We can do this and no one will ever know. They cook up this plan, at Cook-out no less, and set it into motion.
DE thinks he will get rid of his young problem, NK thinks this will make her more valuable to her crush, and both are stupid enough to think they will get away with it.

MOO only. Still open to other info, can't wait for next court date.