WA - Lindsey Baum, 10, McCleary, 26 June 2009 - #16

[ChuckMaureen]

Ok ... of the missing persons cases I've read about during many years I have never come across something such as this (see the bolded text in the story quote, below):

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/69919097.html

Melissa Baum said her maternal instinct tells her her daughter is somewhere nearby.

On a June night long before the sunset, Lindsey Baum left a friend's house and started a seven-block walk home. Since then, thousands of tips have been called in, but not one solid lead has surfaced.

Months have passed without any news from the missing girl, but her mother has faithfully organized search parties every weekend since.

But interest is dwindling. Last weekend, only a few volunteers joined the desperate mother.

Melissa Baum doesn't believe the $10,000 reward being offered in the case is sufficient to motivate a solid tip.

Donations for the reward fund are being collected at all branches of Sterling Saving Bank.

Has anyone ever read about, heard of or witnessed a parent / guardian / significant other offer such a comment? I have not, that's why I'm asking so please do not infer more in to this.

I have not observed MB at all beyond watching news videos and reading attributable quotes and statements.

Is MB suggesting the someone(s) know(s) the whereabouts of LB and is(are) holding back for "sufficient" kitty? Isn't that refered to as: ransom?

MB is hoping for more donations.

Has MB not yet returned to work? Is MB contributing (if possible) to the fund? These are fair questions if any of the donation money is being spent on non-essentials (listed below) and if MB has not yet returned to work (if possible, re: health, job status, etc.).



I do not know if nor when I would return to work after such a tragedy, but Life goes on regardless of circumstance:

• missing persons search expenses
• rent / mortgage
• water
• electric
• gas
• food
• other child's needs
• court / attorney fees (I expect this item is allowed here if I do not provide specifics ... I'll just note that sometimes people have to deal with the actions of others and sometimes those actions are serious and involve The Law and The Courts)

I'm sorry ... I know the information we gather is filtered through various sources and we have to step back from contradictions on any specific piece of data and realize one or none of what we gather might be accurate or true, but that does not mean we should ignore *fact-based* data.

Publishing some of the fact-based data is not permissible on this board. Ok. But that data must not be ignored. It should be considered along with other verifiable and even some contradicting data, in any case.

McCleary, WA:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCleary,_Washington

The median income for a household in the city was $30,769, and the median income for a family was $36,534. Males had a median income of $33,421 versus $25,417 for females. The per capita income for the city was $14,249. About 12.2% of families and 17.8% of the population were below the poverty line, including 22.9% of those under age 18 and 24.5% of those age 65 or over.

That data is gathered from the 2000 Census. Given the current financial climate of most of the country I expect much has not changed or may have worsened in McCleary.

Adverse circumstances and being cash-strapped causes some people to make drastic and ill-chosen choices ....

I hope and pray that is not applicable to this case.

Given the fact LB's disappearance presumably occurred during a mildly busy evening (at least two witnesses confirmed in the time frame) in a close-knit small town that is McCleary, and no one witnessed anything unusual, and differing stories from principal players makes me wonder, that's all.

If this truly is an abduction, Godspeed to MB and family.

If not, well, the information we have to date does not rule out this scenario.

 

[scandi]

Ok ... of the missing persons cases I've read about during many years I have never come across something such as this (see the bolded text in the story quote, below):

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/69919097.html



Has anyone ever read about, heard of or witnessed a parent / guardian / significant other offer such a comment? I have not, that's why I'm asking so please do not infer more in to this.

I have not observed MB at all beyond watching news videos and reading attributable quotes and statements.

Is MB suggesting the someone(s) know(s) the whereabouts of LB and is(are) holding back for "sufficient" kitty? Isn't that refered to as: ransom?

MB is hoping for more donations.

Has MB not yet returned to work? Is MB contributing (if possible) to the fund? These are fair questions if any of the donation money is being spent on non-essentials (listed below) and if MB has not yet returned to work (if possible, re: health, job status, etc.).



I do not know if nor when I would return to work after such a tragedy, but Life goes on regardless of circumstance:

• missing persons search expenses
• rent / mortgage
• water
• electric
• gas
• food
• other child's needs
• court / attorney fees (I expect this item is allowed here if I do not provide specifics ... I'll just note that sometimes people have to deal with the actions of others and sometimes those actions are serious and involve The Law and The Courts)

I'm sorry ... I know the information we gather is filtered through various sources and we have to step back from contradictions on any specific piece of data and realize one or none of what we gather might be accurate or true, but that does not mean we should ignore *fact-based* data.

Publishing some of the fact-based data is not permissible on this board. Ok. But that data must not be ignored. It should be considered along with other verifiable and even some contradicting data, in any case.

McCleary, WA:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCleary,_Washington



That data is gathered from the 2000 Census. Given the current financial climate of most of the country I expect much has not changed or may have worsened in McCleary.

Adverse circumstances and being cash-strapped causes some people to make drastic and ill-chosen choices ....

I hope and pray that is not applicable to this case.

Given the fact LB's disappearance presumably occurred during a mildly busy evening (at least two witnesses confirmed in the time frame) in a close-knit small town that is McCleary, and no one witnessed anything unusual, and differing stories from principal players makes me wonder, that's all.

If this truly is an abduction, Godspeed to MB and family.

If not, well, the information we have to date does not rule out this scenario.

Hi Chuck, Of the 3 accounts set up for Lindsey's case, two are at Sterling bank for searching and the reward I believe. The 3rd acct is at a different bank and for the benefit of MB and her son's needs. It was opened and is maintained by her friend MM. We don't know if this account specifies what needs can be covered and do know she is faced with some extraordinary financial tasks at present. I would think if there is sufficient money in the account it could be used for whatever needs she has to keep her above board.

I don't know if she is back working but even if she is don't think her income would rise to anything near the data from the 2000 Census just from knowing what jobs she had before Lindsey went missing.

MB certainly has fallen into difficult times and I still view her first as the mother of a missing child. I will say I have noticed more sleuthing interest in the possibilities she should be looked at more seriously, but I haven't seen anything yet that has made me drop my jaw. Yes, she would like to meet a male friend acc to her MS. Making that public might have been bad taste on her part, but who are we to judge. I think she was somewhat an unpolished person before Lindsey disappeared and thru the months of working with experts she has blossomed a bit in her appearance and people skills like presentation, speaking, etc.

Who is ever prepared for something like this to happen to where we are at that point that we would want to project to the world. Life just doesn't work that way as we are what we are and then grow and change with what life puts before us. xox

 

[Knox]

ChuckMaureen you have come up with so many interesting theories and asked questions which make the brain do jumping jacks. But I still feel in my gut this case is much simpler than all of our complicated theories. Keep asking about time lines and statements in that first 24 hours, I think that is the key to this case. It was someone known to her, I believe that. Soulscape or Tuba said very early on in this case " someone chastised Lindsey earlier that day, that person is the perp". What did Lindsey do on June 26th? From the time she woke up to the time she was last seen?

Respectfully Snipped and brought here;
Chance Sighting ?
"Some questions we need to explore in trying to understand how this girl disappeared from the road: was the abductor aware Lindsey would be making for home up Maple Street and if informed, how? Or did he/she notice her by chance?

The Last Seen chart says there had been a problem between the child and the person denoted by Saturn earlier. That was when Mercury made the square to Saturn and was put down for something she was saying or doing. This was not just a disapproving older person, it is the same person who rules this event chart and who is responsible for Lindsey vanishing.

We have a timeline for her activities during that day but not the details. If there was an occurence where she was berated or chastised while at the pool or in the video store or anywhere, we do not know about it. We do know that she and her brother squabbled over his bike and we know that Mercury in II is rightfully two children, not one and that bicycles fall under II. We know this ding dong between the kids was halted and he was sent packing. This glimpse of her day does fit the Mercury Saturn square earlier but we cannot seize on it to the exclusion of other possibilities because we do not have similar glimpses into all of the interactions of June 26, not even those in the living room of the Kampen home. "

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3949758&highlight=chastised#post3949758

 

[coastal]

Ok ... of the missing persons cases I've read about during many years I have never come across something such as this (see the bolded text in the story quote, below):

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/69919097.html



Has anyone ever read about, heard of or witnessed a parent / guardian / significant other offer such a comment? I have not, that's why I'm asking so please do not infer more in to this.

I have not observed MB at all beyond watching news videos and reading attributable quotes and statements.

Is MB suggesting the someone(s) know(s) the whereabouts of LB and is(are) holding back for "sufficient" kitty? Isn't that refered to as: ransom?

MB is hoping for more donations.

Has MB not yet returned to work? Is MB contributing (if possible) to the fund? These are fair questions if any of the donation money is being spent on non-essentials (listed below) and if MB has not yet returned to work (if possible, re: health, job status, etc.).



I do not know if nor when I would return to work after such a tragedy, but Life goes on regardless of circumstance:

• missing persons search expenses
• rent / mortgage
• water
• electric
• gas
• food
• other child's needs
• court / attorney fees (I expect this item is allowed here if I do not provide specifics ... I'll just note that sometimes people have to deal with the actions of others and sometimes those actions are serious and involve The Law and The Courts)

I'm sorry ... I know the information we gather is filtered through various sources and we have to step back from contradictions on any specific piece of data and realize one or none of what we gather might be accurate or true, but that does not mean we should ignore *fact-based* data.

Publishing some of the fact-based data is not permissible on this board. Ok. But that data must not be ignored. It should be considered along with other verifiable and even some contradicting data, in any case.

McCleary, WA:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCleary,_Washington



That data is gathered from the 2000 Census. Given the current financial climate of most of the country I expect much has not changed or may have worsened in McCleary.

Adverse circumstances and being cash-strapped causes some people to make drastic and ill-chosen choices ....

I hope and pray that is not applicable to this case.

Given the fact LB's disappearance presumably occurred during a mildly busy evening (at least two witnesses confirmed in the time frame) in a close-knit small town that is McCleary, and no one witnessed anything unusual, and differing stories from principal players makes me wonder, that's all.

If this truly is an abduction, Godspeed to MB and family.

If not, well, the information we have to date does not rule out this scenario.

I assumed (bad, coastal!) that the comment you quoted from MB must have been an older one, but your link takes me to the new (not-even-for-sale-yet-new) People magazine article. That's a shame. It doesn't make MB sound especially grateful to those who have contributed to a reward fund for Lindsey, or to the dedicated people who have given their time and energy to search for her. I'm going to assume (bad, coastal!) that this comment was either misquoted, or quoted out of context, because I trust the judgement of the people we've come to know here, who know MB, and nothing they've said suggests MB is anything but appreciative of their efforts.

However, it would be a good thing if findlindseybaum.com was updated to reflect any change in the amount of the potential reward resulting from donations made to "Lindsey Baum's Reward Fund":

http://www.findlindseybaum.com/1915.html

THERE IS A $10,000 REWARD BEING OFFERED FOR INFORMATION DIRECTLY LEADING TO LINDSEY BAUM

A reward account has also now been set up for Lindsey Baum. If you are interested in donating to "Lindsey Baum's Reward Fund" you can make a donation at any Sterling Savings Bank location.

If you are not familiar with a reward fund or how it works - it is an account created where all donations go towards a reward for information leading to the safe return of Lindsey Baum or information as to the whereabouts of Lindsey. If the reward does not get used the money is returned to all donors who provide their name and address. So please be sure to include your name and address.

 

[scandi]

ChuckMaureen you have come up with so many interesting theories and asked questions which make the brain do jumping jacks. But I still feel in my gut this case is much simpler than all of our complicated theories. Keep asking about time lines and statements in that first 24 hours, I think that is the key to this case. It was someone known to her, I believe that. Soulscape or Tuba said very early on in this case " someone chastised Lindsey earlier that day, that person is the perp". What did Lindsey do on June 26th? From the time she woke up to the time she was last seen?

Respectfully Snipped and brought here;
Chance Sighting ?
"Some questions we need to explore in trying to understand how this girl disappeared from the road: was the abductor aware Lindsey would be making for home up Maple Street and if informed, how? Or did he/she notice her by chance?

The Last Seen chart says there had been a problem between the child and the person denoted by Saturn earlier. That was when Mercury made the square to Saturn and was put down for something she was saying or doing. This was not just a disapproving older person, it is the same person who rules this event chart and who is responsible for Lindsey vanishing.

We have a timeline for her activities during that day but not the details. If there was an occurence where she was berated or chastised while at the pool or in the video store or anywhere, we do not know about it. We do know that she and her brother squabbled over his bike and we know that Mercury in II is rightfully two children, not one and that bicycles fall under II. We know this ding dong between the kids was halted and he was sent packing. This glimpse of her day does fit the Mercury Saturn square earlier but we cannot seize on it to the exclusion of other possibilities because we do not have similar glimpses into all of the interactions of June 26, not even those in the living room of the Kampen home. "

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3949758&highlight=chastised#post3949758

Hi Knox, that was an eye opener for me due to the word the Astros used, 'chastise'.

It has quite a stiff meaning. to punish especially by beating or to scold or condem sharply. It falls just short of being castigated. So I take this as much more than a simple argument.

Last night I read she had been swimming at Libby's during the day of the 26th as well as the evening. That is a lot of time to look at but would limit the number of people in authority who could have disciplined her in such a way. Then we have the video store, but nothing has been written about an incident like this taking place. It could be someone at either her own home or Kara's or possibly Libby's hubby or his drinking buddy who I read was at the house. Will have to check on that.

Thanks for bringing that to us. It opens up a new window of thought xox

 

[CorallaroC]

Ok, this has been bothering me for a while, so I thought it would be a good idea to share it on the thread.

While I was looking up weather history data for McCleary, I saw a link that said something like "other live cams in washington" - and ended up here:

http://www.camscape.com/new/2004-08-27.html

page says "40 new links for 2004-08-27"

If you scroll down near the bottom of the page it says this:

"McCleary Cam

Various shots from central McCleary, WA updated every few minutes (motion sensitive)
North America/USA/Washington"

But if you click on the link, you will no longer find the live cam in McCleary on the list.

I am curious to know if McCleary residents were aware of the live cams?
Where were these live cams situated?
Who ran these cams and for what purpose?
Were the cams still in operation in June when Lindsey disappeared?
Could Lindsey have shown up on one of the cams at some time or another?
Are these cams still in operation?


dunno, maybe it would be a good idea to report this as a tip to LE...

~~~
(bold print mine for emphasis)
(I also took a screen shot of the page just in case)

 

[Knox]

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ghlight=traffic+cam+rock+mountain#post4306910

We discussed this, see link. Someone had brought up the Rock Candy Mountain area. Good thought Collorac, don't you think LE would have checked out all the traffic cams post haste? Not sure how long the footage would be retained before it loops over, but would imagine it is not long. For example; I have security cameras at work. The HD's are 400 gb, there are four cameras recording 24 hours a day. I have to change HD's roughly every two weeks. I know the State has large servers, but wonder how long they retain footage? Maybe Miss Scandi can call Monday and ask a DOT official?

P.S. We should all kick in and buy Scandi a calling card, lol. Appreciate all you do and thanks Miss Scandi, you rock!!!

 

[CorallaroC]

Somehow I didn't get the impression these were traffic cams though....

 

[ChuckMaureen]

(I've seen two-headed coins)

EDIT: sorry this was a long post that somehow did not 'post' properly, so I will just add the last items:

I believe LE has determined these tow possiblities, with one being more probable than the other:

* Stranger abduction with local collusion for human trafficking
* Stranger abduction (unknown SO in a vehicle in the park n ride lot)

Much of my post involved responding to other posts regarding MB's character and reward fund, and I also berated myself for not including Daddy Baum in my posts, and is he providing any child support and how one answer might lead to motive?

The post was long, I can not and will not attempt to re-capture all the thoughts .. heck, as many of you have come to realize, some of my posts go on and on ...

 

[scandi]

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ghlight=traffic+cam+rock+mountain#post4306910

We discussed this, see link. Someone had brought up the Rock Candy Mountain area. Good thought Collorac, don't you think LE would have checked out all the traffic cams post haste? Not sure how long the footage would be retained before it loops over, but would imagine it is not long. For example; I have security cameras at work. The HD's are 400 gb, there are four cameras recording 24 hours a day. I have to change HD's roughly every two weeks. I know the State has large servers, but wonder how long they retain footage? Maybe Miss Scandi can call Monday and ask a DOT official?

P.S. We should all kick in and buy Scandi a calling card, lol. Appreciate all you do and thanks Miss Scandi, you rock!!!

Hi Knox, LOL I do have free long distance, thank goodness!

I don't know allot about webcams as we don't deal with them. I will call ODOT tho on Mon afternoon and get info about the cams in the McCleary area and their operation.

I thought there was only one webcam in that whole area as the others were either only proposed or were non-functional. I will double check on that. Even tho web cams are digital I don't know if each frame that is caught and displayed for a short amount of time is retained. It depends on how sophisticated their system is.

We are starting to do allot of work for contractors called verified video. There the camera is set for the times when there should be no activity, after working hours, and any motion is caught by the camera, triggers an alarm system which sends that photo to the monitoring center within seconds. The purpose to let authorities know there is activity on the property when there shouldn't be any. It is very successful in catching metal, tool, machinery thefts, etc. It is much more sophisticated than a web cam, almost to the opposite.

 

[ChuckMaureen]

McCleary School Renovation:
http://web.me.com/anthaholt/School_Construction/Tour_-_Jan._15.html

Many pictures at the site:
http://web.me.com/anthaholt/School_Construction/May_7_to_21.html

Was the school contruction areas searched using cadaver dogs?

 

[ChuckMaureen]

June 18, 2009 news item:


http://www.thevidette.com/archives/18jun09/index.html

Partial gym ceiling collapse hurts workers

McCLEARY — Though it was upsetting, there was much to be thankful for when a portion of the McCleary School’s gym ceiling crashed to the floor during lunchtime last week, bringing with it two construction workers who’d been in the attic crawlspace taking measurements.

About 45 kindergarteners and first graders some 50 feet away escaped injury about 11:45 a.m. Wednesday, June 10, though a fire alarm conduit detached from the width of the gym and fell on a table near where the students sat munching ham, egg and cheese “breakfast” sandwiches and fruit.

“They actually saw … falling out of the ceiling … ceiling tile, wood framing and two … construction workers,” said McCleary’s Superintendent/Principal Dan Bolender. “And those two construction workers fell to the gym floor.”

It states the constr. workers were taking measurements while in the gym attic ... my question is, how many times were they in that gym attic and during which classes ... and was LB in one of those classes?

I'm just sayin' ....

 

[ChuckMaureen]

Mayoral malarkey in McCleary
McCLEARY — It was a first for him, said Grays Harbor County Auditor Vern Spatz.

In more ways than one.

The day after Doug Shannon, a McCleary mayoral candidate, faxed a request to the auditor’s office asking to have his name withdrawn from the race, Shannon called and asked to rescind his withdrawal.

Spatz had never experienced that situation before, the auditor said. After receiving the initial withdrawal request, Spatz said, as required by law, he notified the other two candidates — current McCleary city councilman, Ray Boling, and former mayor Donald “Gary” Dent — that there would be no primary election. The primary includes only races with more than two candidates.

Shannon, however, initially told The Vidette he had never contacted the auditor’s office about withdrawing from the race. He later recanted his denial and said he made and revoked a withdrawal. When first asked about his withdrawal and subsequent decision to rescind it, Shannon told The Vidette that Spatz had told him “they were going to, like, lose my paperwork.”[/QUOTE]

The mayoral candidate also is a member of this web site:

http://www.wayn.com/waynprofile.html?member_key=798598

... goes by the alias, 'CaptainCake'.

WAYN is a lifestyle and travel social network ... would he have enough time to do mayor things while lifestyling and traveling?

Odd behavior for a candidate for public office. This occured the week prior to 06/26/2009.

 

[ChuckMaureen]

This *must* be a mistake, right? It is dated as June 25, 2009:

http://www.thevidette.com/archives/25jun09/index.html

???

 

[fleececreations]

hmm tht is weird chuckmaureen! im gonna check into this!

 

[Hairball]

To begin with, I can't believe so many keep bringing up MB and KK. Are you folks insinuating they know more than they claim? I highly doubt it. And for the person who mentioned checking MB's and KK's cell phone records, that's just absurd. If YOU had YOUR child abducted or simply vanish off the street and someone suggested checking YOUR phone records you would probably go ballistic! And the other thing I've been reading that really disturbs me is the thing about the underwear and how MB should have been fully aware of what underwear LB was wearing when she left home that night. OMG!!! Do YOU have a child??? My daughter is now 23 years old, but when she was a kid, we didn't check her underwear every time she was leaving home to spend the night at a friend's house! Do YOU do that? I would think a parent would have "issues" if they checked their child's underwear each time they left the house! And the person that suggested that MB didn't have her laundry chores done that day... what the heck was THAT supposed to prove? Come on, she is a single parent. She has other things to worry about. Cooking, cleaning, dusting, feeding the dog, answering the phone, vacuuming, making beds, and more. Laundry just has to be squeezed in where it can. But to point fingers at MB because she didn't have the laundry done that day is crazy. Heck, when my daughter was LB's age, we just let her wear what she chose to wear. We did laundry when we could. But we certainly didn't stop our daughter at the door to see what she was wearing underneath her clothes!!! I'm not sure what got THAT suggestion started but it really bothered me. If you spend a little time around MB and KK at the search center or on searches, you would quickly get to know them and realize neither one of them had anything to do with LB's vanishing.

Okay, with that off my chest...

What a way to enter this forum. I know. I feel like an idiot. But after reading several negative posts geared toward what LE should have done with or to MB or KK, it just got me steamed. Who cares if LB was wearing a swim suit or regular underwear or nothing under her clothes? What does that have to do with her vanishing, or helping find her? Absolutely nothing. I've seen all the posters and fliers relating to her case and none of them described specific undergarments, so the public or searchers are not even looking for those articles of clothing. We are looking for the outer clothing that any witness may have seen.

My heart goes out to MB and KK. Having been blessed by your friendships, I quickly understood and felt the pain and misery you two are enduring. Having heard the pain in your voices, I fully understand what you're going through. You're all in my prayers daily. MB is such a sweet woman with a heart of gold, and I see the pain and hurt in her eyes each time I show up to assist in searches. I've seen her tears more often than I can count. And KK's too. I can see and sense the pain in their hearts. Both of them are devastated by LB's disappearance. And nobody can say otherwise. Don't worry, I would NEVER suggest you check your child's underwear every time they leave the house or go to a friend's house. And I would never suggest your phone records be checked out. THAT, IMHO is suggesting you both know something about LB that you're not telling. NO WAY!!!

Okay, I'm sorry about this post. It certainly won't earn me any "welcome points", I'm sure. But I'm not here to make friends. I'm here to do my part in helping bring LB home to her loving and caring family who miss her more than words can describe. I've had the honor of meeting LB's brother JB on a few occasions and he truly misses his sister.

God bless you all. My heart goes out to you. And you're in my prayers.

 

[ChuckMaureen]

To begin with, I can't believe so many keep bringing up MB and KK. Are you folks insinuating they know more than they claim? I highly doubt it. And for the person who mentioned checking MB's and KK's cell phone records, that's just absurd. If YOU had YOUR child abducted or simply vanish off the street and someone suggested checking YOUR phone records you would probably go ballistic! And the other thing I've been reading that really disturbs me is the thing about the underwear and how MB should have been fully aware of what underwear LB was wearing when she left home that night. OMG!!! Do YOU have a child??? My daughter is now 23 years old, but when she was a kid, we didn't check her underwear every time she was leaving home to spend the night at a friend's house! Do YOU do that? I would think a parent would have "issues" if they checked their child's underwear each time they left the house! And the person that suggested that MB didn't have her laundry chores done that day... what the heck was THAT supposed to prove? Come on, she is a single parent. She has other things to worry about. Cooking, cleaning, dusting, feeding the dog, answering the phone, vacuuming, making beds, and more. Laundry just has to be squeezed in where it can. But to point fingers at MB because she didn't have the laundry done that day is crazy. Heck, when my daughter was LB's age, we just let her wear what she chose to wear. We did laundry when we could. But we certainly didn't stop our daughter at the door to see what she was wearing underneath her clothes!!! I'm not sure what got THAT suggestion started but it really bothered me. If you spend a little time around MB and KK at the search center or on searches, you would quickly get to know them and realize neither one of them had anything to do with LB's vanishing.

Okay, with that off my chest...

What a way to enter this forum. I know. I feel like an idiot. But after reading several negative posts geared toward what LE should have done with or to MB or KK, it just got me steamed. Who cares if LB was wearing a swim suit or regular underwear or nothing under her clothes? What does that have to do with her vanishing, or helping find her? Absolutely nothing. I've seen all the posters and fliers relating to her case and none of them described specific undergarments, so the public or searchers are not even looking for those articles of clothing. We are looking for the outer clothing that any witness may have seen.

My heart goes out to both LB, MB, and KK. Having been blessed by both of your friendships, I quickly understood and felt the pain and misery you two are enduring. You're all in my prayers daily. MB is such a sweet woman with a heart of gold, and I see the pain and hurt in her eyes each time I show up to assist in searches. I've seen her tears more often than I can count. And KK too. I can see and sense the pain in her heart. Both of them are devastated by LB's disappearance. And nobody can say otherwise. Don't worry, I would NEVER suggest you check your child's underwear every time they leave the house. And I would never suggest your phone records be checked out. THAT, IMHO is suggesting you both know something about LB that you're not telling. BOGUS!!! NO WAY!!!

Okay, I'm sorry about this post. It certainly won't earn me any "welcome points", I'm sure. But I'm not here to make friends. I'm here to do my part in helping bring LB home to her loving and caring family who miss her more than words can describe. I've had the honor of meeting JB on a few occasions and he truly misses his sister.

God bless you all. My heart goes out to you. And you're in my prayers.

Hi, Hairball,

I think I've seen your posts on another forum?

As for checking underwear, I stated that MB probably would not know what LB was wearing underneath her clothes, i.e.: how many near-11 yr olds want to be supervised while bathing and dressing? My point is, how does LE know what LB was wearing under her clothes? Someone already posted that MB *did* know what LB was wearing under her clothes, so that question is answered.

As for MB's, JB's and KK's states of mind at this point, I can only imagine the stress and heartbreak but still, everyone is suspect unless or until leads point in a definitive direction.

I can not imagine the aforementioned being involved in LB's disappearance except to the extent that the 11 yr old was allowed to walk home alone. That is something they possibly might have to live with the rest of their lives, should the outcome of this case not be a happy one.

Certainly, no one needs nor wants to beat them up any more than they have themselves, but it is important this point be reiterated, not to them but to the general community: no child is completely safe, it seems. In fact, not many adults are completely safe.

I live on the east coast and am not in a position to be able to travel to WA and search for LB. I've thought about it but reality dictates that's all I may do. But if I were there searching, I can guarantee I would leave no stone unturned, no bush left unshaken, no valley unswept. I've watched some searchers on TV (news) and I sometimes become disgusted because what I see are people simply walking through the woods, past bush thickets or leaf burms and such. Walk over to the items, feel them, shake them, examine the underbrush. Footprints? Broken stems? Etc.

And, that brings me back to the discrepancies ... it certainly appears that some pieces of the time line and circumstances do not correlate for whatever reason, and that should not be ignored.

 

[Salem]

Thank you ChuckMaureen. Nicely said.

Salem

 

[Knox]

To begin with, I can't believe so many keep bringing up MB and KK. Are you folks insinuating they know more than they claim? I highly doubt it. And forthe person who mentioned checking MB's and KK's cell phone records, that's just absurd. If YOU had YOUR child abducted or simply vanish off the street and someone suggested checking YOUR phone records you would probably go ballistic! And the other thing I've been reading that really disturbs me is the thing about the underwear and how MB should have been fully aware of what underwear LB was wearing when she left home that night. OMG!!! Do YOU have a child??? My daughter is now 23 years old, but when she was a kid, we didn't check her underwear every time she was leaving home to spend the night at a friend's house! Do YOU do that? I would think a parent would have "issues" if they checked their child's underwear each time they left the house! And the person that suggested that MB didn't have her laundry chores done that day... what the heck was THAT supposed to prove? Come on, she is a single parent. She has other things to worry about. Cooking, cleaning, dusting, feeding the dog, answering the phone, vacuuming, making beds, and more. Laundry just has to be squeezed in where it can. But to point fingers at MB because she didn't have the laundry done that day is crazy. Heck, when my daughter was LB's age, we just let her wear what she chose to wear. We did laundry when we could. But we certainly didn't stop our daughter at the door to see what she was wearing underneath her clothes!!! I'm not sure what got THAT suggestion started but it really bothered me. If you spend a little time around MB and KK at the search center or on searches, you would quickly get to know them and realize neither one of them had anything to do with LB's vanishing.

Okay, with that off my chest...

What a way to enter this forum. I know. I feel like an idiot. But after reading several negative posts geared toward what LE should have done with or to MB or KK, it just got me steamed. Who cares if LB was wearing a swim suit or regular underwear or nothing under her clothes? What does that have to do with her vanishing, or helping find her? Absolutely nothing. I've seen all the posters and fliers relating to her case and none of them described specific undergarments, so the public or searchers are not even looking for those articles of clothing. We are looking for the outer clothing that any witness may have seen.

My heart goes out to MB and KK. Having been blessed by your friendships, I quickly understood and felt the pain and misery you two are enduring. Having heard the pain in your voices, I fully understand what you're going through. You're all in my prayers daily. MB is such a sweet woman with a heart of gold, and I see the pain and hurt in her eyes each time I show up to assist in searches. I've seen her tears more often than I can count. And KK's too. I can see and sense the pain in their hearts. Both of them are devastated by LB's disappearance. And nobody can say otherwise. Don't worry, I would NEVER suggest you check your child's underwear every time they leave the house or go to a friend's house. And I would never suggest your phone records be checked out. THAT, IMHO is suggesting you both know something about LB that you're not telling. NO WAY!!!

Okay, I'm sorry about this post. It certainly won't earn me any "welcome points", I'm sure. But I'm not here to make friends. I'm here to do my part in helping bring LB home to her loving and caring family who miss her more than words can describe. I've had the honor of meeting LB's brother JB on a few occasions and he truly misses his sister.

God bless you all. My heart goes out to you. And you're in my prayers.

Welcome Hairball, love your screen name

The affidavit written when the Golder property was searched, specifically mentioned the bathing suit and the fact LE was looking for it. You say the public and searchers are not looking for it along with the outer clothing and shoes?

Not sure exactly who you are referring to when you question what some of the WS'ers are looking at, but be careful there. Jumping on someone for their opinion or asking a question isn't cool. Around here, we agree to disagree, not say someone is absurd.

No need to feel like an idiot, alternative views voiced respectfully are always welcome.

 

[Dog Driver]

I've watched some searchers on TV (news) and I sometimes become disgusted because what I see are people simply walking through the woods, past bush thickets or leaf burms and such. Walk over to the items, feel them, shake them, examine the underbrush. Footprints? Broken stems? Etc.

That's funny......Obviously from some of the posts I've read people not from this area just don't get it. It's a jungle out there, walk 2 ft off the road, any road anywhere within many miles of McCleary and you have a (Darn I can't think of a number large enough) such bush thickets, or leaf berms and broken stems....Oh and there are simply NO footprints....Too much brush, undergrowth, salaal, ferns, blackberries....leaves, fir needles...You could spend every waking moment of what's left of your life examining them and you won't get them all....People these aren't the open forest lands you see back east. These are rain forest... or at least the edge of rain forest.....The undergrowth is tremendously thick.......

Every time my wife and I drive from Elma, past McCleary to Olympia we talk about LB about how enormous the task of searching the whole area is. How she could be 5 feet off the road in either direction and no one might know....and that's just a 25 mile drive on one road....it's enormous.

Off my soap box now...

DD:banghead: